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View Full Version : [REL] Radar Range Mod v2.05


Nisgeis
10-06-08, 03:04 PM
Well, it's not got all the bells and whistles I had hoped for, but it feels like if I don't get something released soon, I'll just put the whole thing in the bin.

MOD PURPOSE: Digital range readout added to the PPI and 'A' Scope screens.
LANGUAGE: All.
COMPATIBILITY: Stock Only, due to changes to the submarine interiors for calibration work. Also camera file has been changed.
SH4 VERSION: SH4 v1.5 stock and TMO 1.52.

This radar range mod adds a digital readout to both the 'A' Scope and the PPI scope (not quite right, but OK for those who want a quick and easy way to get a range from the PPI screen). The radar range is in metres only. There is also a downloaded conversion table for those that like to plot in imperial using the ingame tools.

The mod also includes a new camera, as the stock one doesn't allow you to look at the wonderful indicator the devs put in. This will break any other camera mod.

Here's what it adds:

http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg307/Nisgeis/SubSim/AScopeRange.jpg

Just to the left of the range selector is the digital readout. I've made it so it only reads off in tens. The spinning hyper accurate 1s dial was just weird, it looked silly spinning away and you'd never have gotten a level of accuracy to the metre.

I have also spent considerable time calibrating the radar train bearing indicator to be accurate. There were a number of minor issues with it before, which meant that it would give readings of up to 2 degrees off. S boats have not been calibrated, only fleet boats. The relative bearing to the target is read from the outer scale, for example, the following picture shows the radar pointing at 320 degrees relative:

http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg307/Nisgeis/SubSim/Bearing320.jpg

The inner scale (True bearing) has NOT been calibrated and is likely to be off by a few degrees... it also too small to be of practical use.

Technical bit: The 'A' Scope radar is set in a 'lobed off' condition. This means that the energy of the radar beam is directed out to one side of the radar antenna. This allows the 'edge' of the radar lobe to be used to detect targets. The edge has a rapid fall off of target detection, so as soon as the pip appears on the 'A' Scope, the edge of the lobe is on the target. this is much easier than using the fat blunt end of the radar lobe and trying to judge when the pip is the highest. For more information on lobes and lobing off, please refer to the radar manual RADTHREE.

You can get accurate bearings from the radar, by sweep over the target (clockwise) and then using the mouse wheel to move the antenna backwards. As the antenna is lobed off to the right, as soon as the edge of the radar beam touches the target, a pip will be displayed and this will be the exact bearing of the target. Only read bearings by sweeping over them and then training anti-clockwise (mouse wheel towards you) back to the edge of the target. It takes a bit of getting used to, but once you have mastered this, you will be able to read exact bearings and ranges of targets in very short time.

I'll stress this again, as it's very important, when you are blind and can only use the radar, you must sweep over the target and then sweep backwards using the mouse wheel to get an accurate bearing.

You can of course get bearings from the periscope or TBT and if you can, you should do, as it's much faster and also easier when you have multiple targets. There are certain operational limitations on the radar that make tracking multiple close formation targets diffcult, but with practice you can do it.

There are a number of radar training missions, set up so you can test your equipment and yourself out. They are a mix of static targets, static targets in the fog, moving targets and moving targets in the fog. I got the following plot whilst using radar in heavy fog, using the radar to get both range and bearing:

http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg307/Nisgeis/SubSim/Plot1.jpg

Here's a close up of the plot points:

http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg307/Nisgeis/SubSim/Plot1Zoom.jpg

Using this plot, I know that the current AoB of the target is 27 degrees to starboard and the speed was measured at... well, you'll have to do a plot yourself won't you :D ? using the anchored protractor tool and ruler (bottom right off screen) i can estimate the range at any bearing along the projected track. I can also move the AoB measure (highlighted in red) up and down the projected target track to estimate an AoB at any bearing or Range. Quite useful really.

I can take fog blinded radar only bearings and ranges and plot them fairly easily (after quite a lot of practice) once a minute and i can track accurately three targets on different bearings and courses simultaneously - useful for seeing what alerted nosey escorts are up to in the dead of night. There's a radar mission that you might like to try that yourself in. The above plot was taken at 3m15s intervals as the target was slow moving. For steady targets you can get an accurate track for three and for one manouvering target you can get an accurate zig prediction. There is a zigging target to practicve on in the radar training missions.

Anyway, try it out and let's have some comments or screenshots of radar plots from the missions!

It's available for download here:
Radar Range Mod:
http://files.filefront.com/Radar+Range+Mod+v205zip/;11992869;/fileinfo.html

Radar Range Mod for TMO 1.52 here:
http://files.filefront.com/Radar+Range+for+TMO+152zip/;12011835;/fileinfo.html

Metres to Yards Conversion Table:
http://files.filefront.com/Metres+to+Yards+Conversioepdf/;11998180;/fileinfo.html

Thanks to everyone who contributed to the WIP thread for the previous incarnation (in my sig) and to Hitman and akdavis who helped test.

Oh yes, the mod is best used with a range ring mod that adds range rings to the PPI scope. I have made one and the link is in my sig, there are others, but I don't know if they are calibrated correctly or not - I only know mine is calibrated to the correct ranges. Others may not be, so use at your own risk.

jazman
10-06-08, 03:55 PM
I'm not disputing, I'm just wondering, was the radar that good that you could get that kind of range / bearing info? It looks like the data are pretty sharp.

Quagmire
10-06-08, 04:00 PM
TOTALLY AWESOME!!! :rock:

I have missed this since the SHIII days. One little question though. I guess that the digital display is only good to 9999 meters? Or do I have that wrong.
.

Quagmire
10-06-08, 04:03 PM
I'm not disputing, I'm just wondering, was the radar that good that you could get that kind of range / bearing info? It looks like the data are pretty sharp.

Sure it was. Check this pic. Its the real thing...
http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/1623/rangeunitdd3xg3.jpg

That little red plastic window is the digital readout. Cool huh?!
.

Nisgeis
10-06-08, 04:16 PM
I'm not disputing, I'm just wondering, was the radar that good that you could get that kind of range / bearing info? It looks like the data are pretty sharp.
The exact accuracy is in the radar manual, off the top of my head, the 'A' Scope had a range resolution of 20 yards and the bearing accuracy was within 0.2 or 0.25 degrees. The actual way you read the range was to move the 'step' on the 'A' scope with a knob until the step met the pip - the knob would also change the digital range counter and was mounted on a seperate unit as Quagmire has posted. The large knob is the step adjuster and the small one labelled 'Counter Adj' is the zero for calibrating the range (from an echo from a large target).

Fish40
10-06-08, 08:06 PM
Great job! I'm hopeing this will somehow find it's way into RFB.

peabody
10-06-08, 08:53 PM
Very cool. Nice work, Nisgeis. Can't wait to try it.

Peabody

Dr. Evil
10-06-08, 10:56 PM
Two questions:

Is this and the Range Rings/Bearing mod compatible with 1.5/RFB?

As someone else asked, is 9999 yards the max range?

Vorkapitan
10-06-08, 11:01 PM
VERY INTELLIGENT MODDING.....

Absolutely outstanding!

:up: :up: :up: :up: :up:

Nisgeis
10-07-08, 04:35 AM
Two questions:

Is this and the Range Rings/Bearing mod compatible with 1.5/RFB?


Range rings are OK with RFB, as far as I know. The range dials are for SH4 1.5, but won't work with RFB without overwriting some changes they have made. The interior files for the submarine have been changed and it will destroy anything they have changed in the interiors (which is a lot).


As someone else asked, is 9999 yards the max range?

Yes, but there's a trick to it. The 1000s dial won't go above 9, but the other dials, 100s and 10s will still rotate. If you know the range is between 10,000 and 11,000 km, you can read the range accurately, as 9,850 would mean 10,850 - if that makes sense. As long as you can get the thousands right, you can track with the hundreds and tens.

Nisgeis
10-07-08, 05:20 AM
Here's a conversion table for converting the metres from the readout to yards, for those who like to plot in game with imperial.

http://files.filefront.com/Metres+to+Yards+Conversioepdf/;11998180;/fileinfo.html

The first page is in 50 metre increments, but for those who like a bit more precision, there's 5 more pages of 0-10,000m in 10 metre increments, 2,000 metres per page for ease of use.

GOZO
10-07-08, 06:18 AM
Very nice and usable mod indeed. Especially for us who want to play with "map contact" turned off.:up:


Now, when can we have a version compatible with RFB or TMO? (please please.....;) )


/OB

keltos01
10-07-08, 06:22 AM
very very nice mod ! :yep:

Sailor Steve
10-07-08, 09:18 AM
Sure it was. Check this pic. Its the real thing...
http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/1623/rangeunitdd3xg3.jpg

That little red plastic window is the digital readout. Cool huh?!
.
Is there a date listed for that device? I can picture a rotating-drum type reader like the one in the game, but that red window looks an awful lot like an LED readout, and those didn't exist until the 1970s, if I remember rightly.

wetwarev7
10-07-08, 09:43 AM
Good job! I won't be able to use this cause of mod incompatibility (free movement camera), but it looks great, and I think this is the first mod I've seen where someone has actually added a new gauge to a sub interior. :up:

Nisgeis
10-07-08, 10:23 AM
Is there a date listed for that device? I can picture a rotating-drum type reader like the one in the game, but that red window looks an awful lot like an LED readout, and those didn't exist until the 1970s, if I remember rightly.

That pic has two extras that aren't mention in the manual for SJ, so it may be a later version of the range counter. I assumed though, that the red was a filter. The range dials are underneath and are as you might expect them to be. There is a control for the range dial illumination and having the dials enclosed wouldn't be out of the question and as red filters were used on other things... why not.

I've yet to get a good picture of the range dials, as the people who take the pics of the working sets only aim at the pretty glowing bits, not the dull auxilliary units right next to them, just out of shot. I assume they are of the same type as in the TDC range readout, just enclosed.

I'd welcome and pics though.

Hitman
10-07-08, 10:36 AM
I'm very happy that you ended this work and I'm produ of having been able to colaborate a bit. If you need further help to enhance the mod, I'll be ready :up:

A new, higher resolution graphic of the bearing indicator thata lso allows true bearing plotting, and some alternative solution for the 10000+ ranges readout would be the ice for the cake :ping:

P.S.

Can you post here which value you tweaked in the cameras.dat? I asume the tweak is very small, and so I (and others) could easily update our custom cameras.dat

Thank you :rock:

Nisgeis
10-07-08, 02:18 PM
Can you post here which value you tweaked in the cameras.dat? I asume the tweak is very small, and so I (and others) could easily update our custom cameras.dat

From my notes:

Changing the cameras file:
==========================
\library\Cameras.dat
_Dummy_Cam_RadioRoom_Radar.AxisRotation.AxisRotati on.Angles.Max (for X Axis) = 90 (was 20)
Above for X Axis rotation restriction, to enable the player to look at the bearing train indicatior. In stock, you can only see the lower half of the train bearing indicator, which is fine if you only want to plot things you are running away from.

Hitman
10-07-08, 02:29 PM
Cheers!!! :up:

Dr. Evil
10-07-08, 06:13 PM
Two questions:

Is this and the Range Rings/Bearing mod compatible with 1.5/RFB?

Range rings are OK with RFB, as far as I know. The range dials are for SH4 1.5, but won't work with RFB without overwriting some changes they have made. The interior files for the submarine have been changed and it will destroy anything they have changed in the interiors (which is a lot).

Only difference I have noted is that the ObScope constantly rotates, and is thus unusable.

keltos01
10-08-08, 03:24 PM
The Oldest Working Radar (1943) - USS COBIA SJ-1 s/n 37

http://usscobia.com/sj-1.html

Nisgeis
10-08-08, 04:11 PM
Only difference I have noted is that the ObScope constantly rotates, and is thus unusable.

I downloaded and installed RFB, then installed the range ring mod, then the range dial mod. The observation periscope was fine. What sub were you using and what other mods? Perhaps you have some corrupted mod configuration?

Nisgeis
10-08-08, 04:13 PM
Here's a version for TMO 1.52:

http://files.filefront.com/Radar+Range+for+TMO+152zip/;12011835;/fileinfo.html

SteveW1
10-09-08, 01:43 AM
Thanks Nisgeis for making a version compatible with Trigger Maru I will have to try this out later tonight.:up:

Steve

cleverusername
11-22-08, 12:46 AM
Great work! But is there any way to get it to display the ten-thousand meter's place? That would definitely help targetting calculations. Radar picks up a target at around 30 km, and until it gets within 10 km, I'm forced to guess the range. It seems to be a whole lot of extra and unnecessary work.

My idea:

Retain the original 4 digits, but have them cover:

[Ten Thousands] [Thousands] [Hundreds] [Tens]

Instead of the current:

[Thousands] [Hundreds] [Tens] [Ones]

Being off by a couple of meters isn't a big deal, being off by a whole mile is.


Idea 2:

Keep the current: [Thousands] [Hundreds] [Tens] [Ones]

But instead of having the [Thousands] dial stop at 9000 m, have it roll over. That is, 12530m would be [2][5][3][0], the same as 2530 m, but it's pretty easy to tell which range it actually is.

Nisgeis
11-22-08, 04:15 PM
Great work! But is there any way to get it to display the ten-thousand meter's place?

Unfortunately, there's no provision for it in the game engine, presumably because the German radar doesn't have great range. There is no way that I know of to get it to display a ten thousand placeholder.

cleverusername
11-22-08, 06:39 PM
Great work! But is there any way to get it to display the ten-thousand meter's place?

Unfortunately, there's no provision for it in the game engine, presumably because the German radar doesn't have great range. There is no way that I know of to get it to display a ten thousand placeholder.

What about having the thousands place roll-over like the hundreds and ten's places do currently.

e.g. Right now, 2340m is displayed as [2][3][4][0], and 22340m is displayed as [9][3][4][0].

Basically the hundred and ten-meter digits keep rolling even after 9999m, while the thousand-meter digit stops at 9.

Could we have the thousand-meter digit behave similarly? That is after it goes to [9], have it roll back to [0] for 10,000 meters, [1] for 11,000 meters, etc?

so basically:

Actual range: 32,320 meters.

Current display: [9][3][2][0]
My idea: [2][3][2][0].

It's easy to tell it's around 30,000 meters from the A-scope or PPI, and now we know it's at 32320m, instead of guessing: is it 30320? 31320? 32320? 33320? 34320? 35320?

With my new system, the possible ranges are 2320m, 12320m, 22320m, 32320m, etc. It's easy to tell which one you're at because there's 10,000m difference in ranges.

Nisgeis
11-23-08, 12:46 PM
I understand what you are asking for, but the game engine does not allow for rolling over of the thousands. It stops at 9. There's nothing I know of that can change it.

Quagmire
11-24-08, 10:48 AM
Totally awesome Nisgeis! Any news on the RFB 1.5.2 version? I cant wait!

Pretty please... :up:
.

Fish40
11-24-08, 02:51 PM
Totally awesome Nisgeis! Any news on the RFB 1.5.2 version? I cant wait!

Pretty please... :up:
.





Waiting for this as well!:yep:

Nisgeis
11-25-08, 04:30 AM
I suppose you'd have to ask in the RFB thread. I think they were considering it for inclusion, but it was released after their freeze on new features so missed 'the boat' :D .

GOZO
11-25-08, 07:08 AM
Fantastic mod.:rock:

No more comments needed;)

Cheers

/OB

LukeFF
11-25-08, 09:30 PM
I suppose you'd have to ask in the RFB thread. I think they were considering it for inclusion, but it was released after their freeze on new features so missed 'the boat' :D .

Correct. We still plan on adding it, but at a later date.

Mav87th
03-07-09, 07:28 PM
LukeFF do you have any idea when that addition will be?

LukeFF
03-08-09, 12:39 AM
LukeFF do you have any idea when that addition will be?

Not sure. We have a lot of other projects that have priority at the moment.

Mav87th
03-08-09, 04:36 AM
Thanks for the fast answer LukeFF. I'll start to make a local implementation (RFB 1.52 + Patch2). If i succeed i will forward that to your team and you can use it at your descretion as long as Nisgeis gives his permit ofcourse.

GOZO
04-02-09, 04:12 PM
Hi.

I have been using this nifty little mod for a while now.:yeah:

I have just installed the new TM1.7 which includes among thing a three step zoom function on the scopes + a two step zoom on "UZO" and binoculars.

Now, if I add the radar mod after TM1.7, the zoom functions reverts to the original version with only two steps for scopes and none at the UZO.:hmmm:

Tried another thing by adding the Radar mod before TM1.7 and it works fine BUT the digital presentation of the range is no longer there...:-?

Any ideas?

Cheers

/OB :salute:

GOZO
04-02-09, 04:29 PM
RESOLVED!!!!!:D

Found the correct order of install:

1) Trigger maru 1.7

2) Nsgeis Radar range mod 2.05 for TMO1.52 (mods the PPI and A-scope)

3) Max optics for TM1.7 (brings back 3 zoom levels of TM1.7)

4) Nsgeis Radar Ring and Bearing Line mod.



Works like a charm again but with TM1.7 as a base. No changes needed!!!!!!:DL:DL:DL


Cheers

/OB :salute:

Nisgeis
04-02-09, 05:33 PM
Hmmm, that will pretty much undo anything added to the interiors of the subs with TMO 1.7. I don't know what that might be, but just be aware that you may be missing something clicky or flashy in the interiors.

GOZO
04-03-09, 04:26 AM
So far I have not seen anything yet.

Fans are rotating...gauges ok...etc etc....Looks fine to me.:03:

jmr
04-09-09, 10:31 PM
Nisgeis, is there anyway to get a closer view of the PPI scope? I know I can use the free view camera to position my viewpoint as I please but I would like to set my view of the PPI scope closer and permanently. Is this possible?

jmr
05-02-09, 12:55 PM
So the radar is calibrated for metric only? No way to change it to Imperial?

Hitman
05-02-09, 03:25 PM
I would like to set my view of the PPI scope closer and permanently. Is this possible?

It is BUT you will need to use Silent 3ditor to change the proper parameters. You must open the file cameras.dat (In the folder "Silent Hunter 4/data/library") and go to:

--->362: Dummycam_Radioroom_Ascope (Yes, no error, it's the A-scope entry!!)
---------->370 Cameraparams
---------------->371 Cameraparams

and change "AngularAngle=75" for a lower vaule, for example "AngularAngle=55"

That will give you a closer view of the PPI :up: (The lower the number, the closer the view, and inversely)

So the radar is calibrated for metric only? No way to change it to Imperial?

Unfortunately, yes :damn:

It is possible to modify the range scales in the PPI and A-Scope screens to be in yards, BUT the digital readout added by Nisgeis is hardcoded to display only in metres. :nope:

I'm goin' down
09-20-09, 01:44 PM
I play TMO 1.7. Links are broken to Nisgeis' mods. Any alternatives?

Bubblehead1980
09-20-09, 05:02 PM
You can find it under the downloads section...top left hand corner of screen...you should see, downloads, then go to SH 4, then gameplay mods, scroll to page 7 or 8 i believe.

I tried using this mod with TMO 1.7 but it broke the free cam, you couldnt roam the sub like before, made you stuck like in stock and hated that, so never used it much.Plus the readout is in meters, which also drove me nuts...so i tossed it out.If the free cam worked with it i would use it though.