No wonder Obama draws large crowds to his rallys

[SUBMAN1]

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&channel=s&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=1RV&q=obama+has+concerts+before+rally&btnG=Search

Just google that.

-S

PS. This means that McCain draws way more people simply wanting to hear his speeches.

[Morts]

heeere we go again....

[Konovalov]

Your ability to extrapolate such a conclusion apparently out of thin air astounds me. :o

Is this such an important electoral issue for you this November? By this I mean, is it important how many people the POTUS can pull at a rally or speech? Are issues such as jobs, retirement pensions, healthcare, security, energy and so on way down the pecking order?

[Jimbuna]

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&channel=s&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=1RV&q=obama+has+concerts+before+rally&btnG=Search

Just google that.

-S

PS. This means that McCain draws way more people simply wanting to hear his speeches.

I give you 10/10 for persistence and tenacity :lol:

[Digital_Trucker]

If you think about it a little bit, this kind of tactic can influence peoples opinions of how popular a candidate is (especially if coverage of the "events" makes no mention of the free concerts). What's really important is, does it influence voters to see thousands of people coming to see the "savior of our nation". Unfortunately, the answer to that is yes, it would influence thousands of ignorant voters into thinking that he must be good since so many people come to see him.

[Konovalov]

Or simply because he is black as evidenced by this persons candid admission in a UK Times piece (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/us_elections/article4887924.ece)today:

Then there is the intractable issue of race. Obama can expect a record black turnout but however bad the economy there is a significant number of white Ohioans, particularly in rural Appalachia, who would never vote for a black candidate. Mr Jacobs, the pawn shop manager, freely admitted he was one of them. “I don’t think the US is ready for a black president,” he said bluntly.

Exactly Mikhayl. :yep:

[Digital_Trucker]

My point wasn't that tactics like this are only used by one side, just that calling the conclusion (and the practice) non-meaningful (i.e. posts 2 and 3) is not valid.

BTW : That voting because of race can be used both ways, both for and against.

[Konovalov]

My point wasn't that tactics like this are only used by one side, just that calling the conclusion (and the practice) non-meaningful (i.e. posts 2 and 3) is not valid.
I was actually questioning Subman's conclusion when he said "PS. This means that McCain draws way more people simply wanting to hear his speeches." I neither said nor implied that the whole crowd thing was non-meaningful.

BTW : That voting because of race can be used both ways, both for and against.
Indeed. :yep: I'm sure that there are some African American voters out there voting for Obama simply because he is black.

[AVGWarhawk]

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&channel=s&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=1RV&q=obama+has+concerts+before+rally&btnG=Search

Just google that.

-S

PS. This means that McCain draws way more people simply wanting to hear his speeches.
I give you 10/10 for persistence and tenacity :lol:

There does seem to be a recurring theme here. I think 10/10 is on the money.

[Digital_Trucker]

@Konavolov My apologies if I misunderstood the intention of your post. It did seem to imply that the concept that Subman espoused was incorrect. Was that not the intention? If one event includes a free concert and another doesn't, is it not reasonable to conclude that at least a percentage (probably a higher percentage than one would assume because of the age of Obamas followers) of the attendance of the event with a concert would be there simply for the free concert? If so, then Subman's conclusion isn't so unreasonable and certainly isn't pulled out of thin air (especially if you interpret "way more people" to mean a higher percentage).

As for whether it's important or not, that's whole different story.

[August]

Reminds me of this saying back in the 60's as to why most anti-war rallies were over by 5pm. Because it gave everyone a chance to get home in time to see themselves on the 6pm news...

[SUBMAN1]

...If one event includes a free concert and another doesn't, is it not reasonable to conclude that at least a percentage (probably a higher percentage than one would assume because of the age of Obamas followers) of the attendance of the event with a concert would be there simply for the free concert? If so, then Subman's conclusion isn't so unreasonable and certainly isn't pulled out of thin air (especially if you interpret "way more people" to mean a higher percentage)....

That sums it up pretty well. We all know that concerts, especially free ones (I might even go myself to see a free concert!) draw in people.

What I do find funny is that people here are denying it! I mean seriously! I guess people think the moon is made out of cheese too. :D

-S

[Hylander_1314]

What I do find funny is that people here are denying it! I mean seriously! I guess people think the moon is made out of cheese too. :D

-S

Well where else would blue cheese, and blue cheese dressing come from!!!!!!!!?????????????:lol:

[Kapt Z]

What's really important is, does it influence voters to see thousands of people coming to see the "savior of our nation". Unfortunately, the answer to that is yes, it would influence thousands of ignorant voters into thinking that he must be good since so many people come to see him.

Maybe so....

But, then again we elected W twice....so who are we to judge??

As my momma always says, "ignorant is as ignorant does." :oops:

[Flamingboat]

Obama will be the next president. We are voting anything in office that isn't a republican. Black, Asian, it doesn't matter. We would vote in a cardboard cutout of William Shatner as long as he wasn't a republican.

I think the republicans should be happy about this. They can blame the disastrous Bush policies all on Obama.

[asanovic7]

I am trying to say something in this forums, but alas, I am so much ignored and ridiculed. :doh:
But that doesn't stop me from talking s..t yet again. And yes, my english is bad. I do not care..
I have a question..
Is any american, are they any, that take time to watch and listen to those slimy debates in your "our economy is wrecked, we are into two wars, LOOSING, so let's make this elections mighty important" presidential elections?

It cannot get into my head how come anyone who listened those two guys can even compare them? I mean, do you even listen to Mccain and then count his mentioning of Reagan? How many times he says "I was a soldier in those times"?
Why do you think unconditioned talks with Iran are not possible? What that guy thinks, that americans are some kind of gods or God given country so that ahmadinejad has to obey your laws or else americans will nuke him.
That is why I think Obama is better. He is the only one(not even damn Moore sucker) who mentioned that USA currently holds dictators all over the world by the principle "if he is ours we support him". He tells war against terrorism in Iraq is bollocks. Has any american even listened to the man?
A little detour..
Really funny to me about american elections is to check out how cruel americans can be and to watch their media censorship, :rotfl: AMERICAN freedom of the press.
I mean, talking about the war in Iraq "that failed because it did not stop terrorism, we pay fuel more(!?), over 4000 our brave troopers(those people are payed to die) died there etc." is a great way of talking "if we are loosing that is not good, how can we the great loose a war,let's kill our leader". That's from Moore. On CNN you can watch "war in Afghanistan" broadcast. And there you see a guy talking how american troops help people in Afghanistan and people love them and so on. It is not odd to me. The odd thing is that a guy is standing next to a big cannon contantly fired by american soldier. Very nice help. In other words "let's tear your country down and give you democracy, Madonna and coca cola and then let us rebuild it and take even your soil but sorry we have to take also your gas, oil and whatever money you have". Very nice.
Let's lift censorship and talk about this(I am genuinely interested to hear any american, his opinion on this).. What this? This..
Your brave troopers throw or lay nuclear waste from your nuclear plants on Iraqis and whatever stands in american way, your brave troopers guard opium fields in Afghanistan(it seems to me americans are drug dealing all over the world, your brave troopers guard oil rigs and everything connected to oil, your brave troopers kill people all the time, your brave troopers don't hold more than 1/3 of Afghanistan(I know a guy who was in Afghanistan to add to american s..y cause) ETC. And that is not even mentioning south america or every godamn part of this world where americans are present in any way.
The point is..
American are not God made nation so that they can lay toxic waste on others because you pay 4 dollars for a gallon!?
In other words, Putin maybe is a son of a bitch, but he speaks truth when he talks that americans are hypocrits. How can americans tell russians they cannot invade georgia when they are tearing one half of the world allready.. And they present it "that is the way GOD WANTS"!?!? And after all, when will majority of americans understand that 9/11 was done by american governement?

That is why Obama is great to us nonamericans because he doesn't speak like "I am God because God is an american". He looks like an almost honest guy. He talks way better than that vietnam soldier(OH kgb and mia together to rule the world) who cannot comprehense or rather admitt that americans sent their loved one to a war in Vietnam to kill people for nothing other than to get rich their s..y governement and army a...s although as it looks to me, he represents great number of americans whose only opinion on vietnam war or any american war is "we are not sorry we invaded vietnam, we are sorry we lost, we should have won". Or better a quote from a movie "when you kill them in accident of however, you say.. Sorry"


I don't care if you ban me, cut me or ridicule me.. Whatever pleases you..

I wanted to say these thing to the americans. On a forum of my favorite game. You are not "Gods" and your governement kills people, but not for you although in your name.
Obama could make it "less worse"..

You should think about that.

Cheers!

[Flamingboat]

I am trying to say something in this forums, but alas, I am so much ignored and ridiculed. :doh:
But that doesn't stop me from talking s..t yet again. And yes, my english is bad. I do not care..
I have a question..
Is any american, are they any, that take time to watch and listen to those slimy debates in your "our economy is wrecked, we are into two wars, LOOSING, so let's make this elections mighty important" presidential elections?

It cannot get into my head how come anyone who listened those two guys can even compare them? I mean, do you even listen to Mccain and then count his mentioning of Reagan? How many times he says "I was a soldier in those times"?
Why do you think unconditioned talks with Iran are not possible? What that guy thinks, that americans are some kind of gods or God given country so that ahmadinejad has to obey your laws or else americans will nuke him.
That is why I think Obama is better. He is the only one(not even damn Moore sucker) who mentioned that USA currently holds dictators all over the world by the principle "if he is ours we support him". He tells war against terrorism in Iraq is bollocks. Has any american even listened to the man?
A little detour..
Really funny to me about american elections is to check out how cruel americans can be and to watch their media censorship, :rotfl: AMERICAN freedom of the press.
I mean, talking about the war in Iraq "that failed because it did not stop terrorism, we pay fuel more(!?), over 4000 our brave troopers(those people are payed to die) died there etc." is a great way of talking "if we are loosing that is not good, how can we the great loose a war,let's kill our leader". That's from Moore. On CNN you can watch "war in Afghanistan" broadcast. And there you see a guy talking how american troops help people in Afghanistan and people love them and so on. It is not odd to me. The odd thing is that a guy is standing next to a big cannon contantly fired by american soldier. Very nice help. In other words "let's tear your country down and give you democracy, Madonna and coca cola and then let us rebuild it and take even your soil but sorry we have to take also your gas, oil and whatever money you have". Very nice.
Let's lift censorship and talk about this(I am genuinely interested to hear any american, his opinion on this).. What this? This..
Your brave troopers throw or lay nuclear waste from your nuclear plants on Iraqis and whatever stands in american way, your brave troopers guard opium fields in Afghanistan(it seems to me americans are drug dealing all over the world, your brave troopers guard oil rigs and everything connected to oil, your brave troopers kill people all the time, your brave troopers don't hold more than 1/3 of Afghanistan(I know a guy who was in Afghanistan to add to american s..y cause) ETC. And that is not even mentioning south america or every godamn part of this world where americans are present in any way.
The point is..
American are not God made nation so that they can lay toxic waste on others because you pay 4 dollars for a gallon!?
In other words, Putin maybe is a son of a bitch, but he speaks truth when he talks that americans are hypocrits. How can americans tell russians they cannot invade georgia when they are tearing one half of the world allready.. And they present it "that is the way GOD WANTS"!?!? And after all, when will majority of americans understand that 9/11 was done by american governement?

That is why Obama is great to us nonamericans because he doesn't speak like "I am God because God is an american". He looks like an almost honest guy. He talks way better than that vietnam soldier(OH kgb and mia together to rule the world) who cannot comprehense or rather admitt that americans sent their loved one to a war in Vietnam to kill people for nothing other than to get rich their s..y governement and army a...s although as it looks to me, he represents great number of americans whose only opinion on vietnam war or any american war is "we are not sorry we invaded vietnam, we are sorry we lost, we should have won". Or better a quote from a movie "when you kill them in accident of however, you say.. Sorry"


I don't care if you ban me, cut me or ridicule me.. Whatever pleases you..

I wanted to say these thing to the americans. On a forum of my favorite game. You are not "Gods" and your governement kills people, but not for you although in your name.
Obama could make it "less worse"..

You should think about that.

Cheers!

What you have to understand about American politics is that they are driven by emotion and not logic. The conservatives who support McCain will always vote against their own economic interest. They instead they vote their morals at the balot box, ie "I'm not gay" or "we love Jesus". Of course the last 8 years would tell anyone god isn't a republican.

All kidding aside, our country is run by corporations, not the government. It matters little who wins, nothing will change.

[Morts]

Putin maybe is a son of a bitch, but he speaks truth when he talks that americans are hypocrits. How can americans tell russians they cannot invade georgia when they are tearing one half of the world allready.. And they present it "that is the way GOD WANTS"!?!? And after all, when will majority of americans understand that 9/11 was done by american governement?
its the American "We can, you can't" mentality

[AVGWarhawk]

That sums it up pretty well. We all know that concerts, especially free ones (I might even go myself to see a free concert!) draw in people.

What I do find funny is that people here are denying it! I mean seriously! I guess people think the moon is made out of cheese too. :D

-S
Let me clear it up for you : nobody denies that free concerts and the like draw in people. What is denied is that seeing thousands of guys at a rally on TV would make much people turn their vote one way or the other.

Maybe so, but why then does the media play off the estimated number of participants in the crowd? Perhaps to spark some interest as to why so many people are listening to the person on the stage? I believe it does spark an interest in why person X has drawn such a crowd. Once the individual investigates they are exposed to what is being said and the possiblity of becoming active is very real. Lemings to the sea effect.

[Digital_Trucker]

That sums it up pretty well. We all know that concerts, especially free ones (I might even go myself to see a free concert!) draw in people.

What I do find funny is that people here are denying it! I mean seriously! I guess people think the moon is made out of cheese too. :D

-S
Let me clear it up for you : nobody denies that free concerts and the like draw in people. What is denied is that seeing thousands of guys at a rally on TV would make much people turn their vote one way or the other.
You give the American voter too much credit in the intelligence department:D

Instead of worrying about who is qualified to do the job and looking into their past actions (i.e. voting records, questionable actions, etc.), the American voter worrites about what is coming out of the politicians mouth (as in what's he gonna do for me). The truth is, what comes out of their mouths is rarely what we get after they're elected.

[Flamingboat]

Stop making excuses right wingers. I assure you the Obama crowds are not just there for the free food. You do realize Bush is the most hated president in modern history, if not the most hated president period. The country and the whole world are foaming at the mouth to put the right out of office.

John McLame is the only one dumb enough to stand in front of the crowd as the democrats storm the whitehouse next month.

[Digital_Trucker]

I assure you the Obama crowds are not just there for the free food.

And how would you go about assuring us of that hypothesis?:hmm:

[AVGWarhawk]

Stop making excuses right wingers. I assure you the Obama crowds are not just there for the free food. You do realize Bush is the most hated president in modern history, if not the most hated president period. The country and the whole world are foaming at the mouth to put the right out of office.

John McLame is the only one dumb enough to stand in front of the crowd as the democrats storm the whitehouse next month.
To be sure, no matter who gets in, we are screwed and the next president is just as screwed cleaning up this mess. Agreed, Bush is not the life of the party. Neither is Pelosi and Barney Frank. Personally, who would want the job anyway? We watched the democrates storm Congress for the past two years. Not much of a winning record going on there either. Everyone on the mall in Washington are to blame for our current ills. If you a pinning it all on Bush, your mistaken at who is to blame. It is not who but what group we as citizens elected to go have fun in Washington. If you think the Democrates will pass a magic wand over this in 28 days and all will be corrected, you are smoking some serious weed. We are looking at years to get this corrected if it is correctable at all. If you think Obama is the win all correct all, you are sorely mistaken. It will be a Joe Biden White House anyway. Obama is wet behind the ears. Come on Flamingboat, what real substance for leading this country has any of the candidate exhibited? Just more speeches from the pulpit for Obama and more mind changing from McCain.

[AVGWarhawk]

I assure you the Obama crowds are not just there for the free food.
And how would you go about assuring us of that hypothesis?:hmm:

Depends on what they are serving up. :D

[Hylander_1314]

Well it doesn't matter who gets elected. You're foolin' yourself if you think either one is going to have a sweeping change in DC. Both of them are not interested in upsetting what got the there; the status quo.

The last decent man in the White House was Woodrow Wilson. At least he had the courage to admit he ruined the nation by signing the Federal Reserve Act into law.

After that, it's been a snowball to "h-e double hockey sticks".

All that's going to happen either way, is our nation that was founded on the principles of personal liberty and property, is going to get nudged even closer to a socialist state.

[Digital_Trucker]

I assure you the Obama crowds are not just there for the free food.
And how would you go about assuring us of that hypothesis?:hmm:
Depends on what they are serving up. :D

Most of what I've heard Obama serving up is BS, IMHO:rotfl:But he serves it well.:up:

[AVGWarhawk]

I assure you the Obama crowds are not just there for the free food.
And how would you go about assuring us of that hypothesis?:hmm:
Depends on what they are serving up. :D
Most of what I've heard Obama serving up is BS, IMHO:rotfl:But he serves it well.:up:

Yes, BS on a silver plater:rotfl: BTW, DT, I do not accept your opinions as humble. I accept them as intelligently thought out! So, henceforth, I will only accept IMO from you. :up:

[asanovic7]

All kidding aside, our country is run by corporations, not the government. It matters little who wins, nothing will change.

Finally someone who speaks the right thing.. :up:

USA is on the downslide and those american elections are a cover up. A stirring.. But, can anyone say for what? Why is there a global crisis almost every month? Is capitalism finished? What's the price of the oil? Who will rule second powerful country in the world? First? Last? Moon? I ate chicken, do I have flu? If we allow gay marriages, will a giant heaven h-bomb destroy us all? Brittain is freezing? Giant comet will hit us?
Or..
Corporations making easy life for their "exceptional few" on histeria.. Very nice..

About the intelligence of us voters. "What's hess gonna do for you" voting is a voting motto all around the world.. And from seeing youtube movies about "americans on the street/France is actually New Zealand" they cannot be smarter than the rest or different. Hence, God is not american.

But, there is something else that can't be ignored.. How will USA get out of Iraq without being defeated? Who is better for it, Obama or John?
:rotfl:
And ofcourse.. How the hell can you in your country watch a man talking how taxes should be handled, how to help poor americans etc. and then he goes on and on speaking of spending another 600 billion on a useless war? :rotfl:

And if it isn't important who gets elected, why are you voting? :88)

[Flamingboat]

It will be a Joe Biden White House anyway. Obama is wet behind the ears. Come on Flamingboat, what real substance for leading this country has any of the candidate exhibited? Just more speeches from the pulpit for Obama and more mind changing from McCain.

Much better than the Dick Cheney whitehouse we have now, so much better. Change from McCain? He is the republican. How stupid would Al Gore have looked if he ran around after 8 years of Clinton and said "we need change". His party is the incumbent. If Bush did his job, which he didn't, McCain would not be trying in vain to rebrand the defunct republican party.

I wanted Ron Paul for president. I was trying to deal with McCain. Then he picks Palin. No way man, I'm not losing sleep everytime McCain gets out of breath with the fear of president palin.

Just imagine president Palin "Oh My God GUYS! Look, I'm on TV! Heeeey, HI MOM!, look I'm on TV"

Yeah, Palin sunk his ship.

[AVGWarhawk]

It will be a Joe Biden White House anyway. Obama is wet behind the ears. Come on Flamingboat, what real substance for leading this country has any of the candidate exhibited? Just more speeches from the pulpit for Obama and more mind changing from McCain.
Much better than the Dick Cheney whitehouse we have now, so much better. Change from McCain? He is the republican. How stupid would Al Gore have looked if he ran around after 8 years of Clinton and said "we need change". His party is the incumbent. If Bush did his job, which he didn't, McCain would not be trying in vain to rebrand the defunct republican party.

I wanted Ron Paul for president. I was trying to deal with McCain. Then he picks Palin. No way man, I'm not losing sleep everytime McCain gets out of breath with the fear of president palin.

Just imagine president Palin "Oh My God GUYS! Look, I'm on TV! Heeeey, HI MOM!, look I'm on TV"

Yeah, Palin sunk his ship.
I do not think Palin sunk his ship. If anything, she brings more experience then Obama concerning working a budget. At any rate, we are on the path of Socialism and through the roof taxation under Obama. Lest one forget, the first 6 years under Bush the economy was good. We then have a majority of Democrates in the Capitol for the past two years and everything goes in the crapper. Americans have the shortest memory span in the world. Everyone wants to go to war after 9/11 and now that it is costing billions....Bush sucks. Get real and stand up to our failures and misjudgments. No one on Capitol Hill will...ask Barney Frank. And another thing, everyone has McCain in the grave already. Good Lord, my dad is 74 and the last thing on my mind is if he can make it another day. Me at 43 can die of a heart attack this afternoon. Worrying about McCains health is a cop out. Hell, Obama could take a bullet at any moment and I sure do not want Joe Biden running the place. Flamming...come to grips man, they all suck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ALL OF THEM on the mall in Washington. Obama is not going to do one ioda of crap. McCain is not going to one ioda of crap. However, I would much prefer to look at Palin over the next four years and enjoy the Tina Fey spoofs for the next 4 years. As longs we are getting raped by the thugs on Capitol Hill, we should have a laugh or two.

Look through the smoke and mirrors Flamingboat....Washington screwed the tax payers....we had no say at all. Not even a common courtesy of a reach around as we took it in the shorts. And you think Obama is going to swish his magic wand? McCain has no magic wand. We are toast bro and our votes are meaningless. This was demonstrated when a $700 billion dollar legislations was signed. We are nothing but ATM machines for the government who like to go to bed with big business. Our votes count for nothing...ask Hillary.

[Digital_Trucker]

All kidding aside, our country is run by corporations, not the government. It matters little who wins, nothing will change.

Finally someone who speaks the right thing.. :up:
Until human beings relearn morality, the dollar will always rule.

USA is on the downslide and those american elections are a cover up. A stirring.. But, can anyone say for what? Why is there a global crisis almost every month? Is capitalism finished? What's the price of the oil? Who will rule second powerful country in the world? First? Last? Moon? I ate chicken, do I have flu? If we allow gay marriages, will a giant heaven h-bomb destroy us all? Brittain is freezing? Giant comet will hit us?
Or..
Corporations making easy life for their "exceptional few" on histeria.. Very nice..
There is no answer to such a rambling "question".

About the intelligence of us voters. "What's hess gonna do for you" voting is a voting motto all around the world.. And from seeing youtube movies about "americans on the street/France is actually New Zealand" they cannot be smarter than the rest or different. Hence, God is not american.
Who said God is American and why in the world would you base an opinion of a group of people on youtube videos?:hmm:

But, there is something else that can't be ignored.. How will USA get out of Iraq without being defeated? Who is better for it, Obama or John?
:rotfl:
The answer to that question is so obvious, you should have answered it yourself. Setting a timetable for withdrawal, no matter what the situation is, is a recipe for disaser (anyone remember VietNam?). No brain required to answer that question.

And ofcourse.. How the hell can you in your country watch a man talking how taxes should be handled, how to help poor americans etc. and then he goes on and on speaking of spending another 600 billion on a useless war? :rotfl:
The same way our country can watch a candidate talk of lowering taxes while espousing a proposal (and actually sponsoring a bill in Congress) to increase foreign aid by hundreds of billions of dollars.

And if it isn't important who gets elected, why are you voting? :88)
Because it's our duty, IMO (;) AVG). When we say that nothing will change, it isn't necessarily true. Each candidate has beliefs that we either share or don't share. Each candidate says where they would like to see the country go and we either agree or don't agree. No matter who gets elected, the President can't change everything by himself. Congress and the Senate are where everything happens (other than starting the odd war here or there). Until ALL of our elected officials make doing the right thing for the country (as opposed to themselves) their priority then nothing will change. The only real power the President has is to veto bills that Congress and the Senate have passed besides that whole Supreme Court Justice appointing thing, but then Congress has it's hand in that, too).

[AVGWarhawk]

DT:
Because it's our duty, IMO (;) AVG). When we say that nothing will change, it isn't necessarily true. Each candidate has beliefs that we either share or don't share. Each candidate says where they would like to see the country go and we either agree or don't agree. No matter who gets elected, the President can't change everything by himself. Congress and the Senate are where everything happens (other than starting the odd war here or there). Until ALL of our elected officials make doing the right thing for the country (as opposed to themselves) their priority then nothing will change. The only real power the President has is to veto bills that Congress and the Senate have passed besides that whole Supreme Court Justice appointing thing, but then Congress has it's hand in that, too).

Exactly. ALL of the elected officals have their hands in it but none will raise that hand and say they screwed up. Come on folks, relections are around the corner. Political suicide! WE NEED TERM LIMITS!!!

[asanovic7]

All kidding aside, our country is run by corporations, not the government. It matters little who wins, nothing will change.

Finally someone who speaks the right thing.. :up:
Until human beings relearn morality, the dollar will always rule.

Not neccessarily.. :88) But man is a wolf to another man..

USA is on the downslide and those american elections are a cover up. A stirring.. But, can anyone say for what? Why is there a global crisis almost every month? Is capitalism finished? What's the price of the oil? Who will rule second powerful country in the world? First? Last? Moon? I ate chicken, do I have flu? If we allow gay marriages, will a giant heaven h-bomb destroy us all? Brittain is freezing? Giant comet will hit us?
Or..
Corporations making easy life for their "exceptional few" on histeria.. Very nice..
There is no answer to such a rambling "question".

It's not rambling.. I am just saying the whole world is constantly bombarded with issues of life and death.. I am watching all the time some catastrophic disasters..

About the intelligence of us voters. "What's hess gonna do for you" voting is a voting motto all around the world.. And from seeing youtube movies about "americans on the street/France is actually New Zealand" they cannot be smarter than the rest or different. Hence, God is not american.
Who said God is American and why in the world would you base an opinion of a group of people on youtube videos?:hmm:

:rotfl: If that would be like that.. I base it on a convention of John Mccain, where a guy that leads the ceremony tells the audience about "the God blessed country". And it was not "I love my country" speach.. It was "I am religious nutcase and I think we are all nutcases here and we are better than anyone other in the whole world and we should lead by example and show the whole world the right way and we want our John to show them ignorant Iranian aswipes what is right". Combined with some other words on that convention..
Or when I read about american soldiers who do crimes and then they don't pay for it.. Or american meddling with lots of wars, people, attentations, planting of governments(americas backyard).. Or generally the whole view of american media, views of leaders, movie makers, journalists.. I watch that because I am bombarded with that s..t but I must admitt, got nothing better to do than to read or watch that s..t when I am spending time like now..
How about a movie where a guy thinks should he save a piece of paper or human?
Or where you watch american soldiers killing black guys in their country? All shown like a "mission from God"..
ETC.
And what about celebrating american soldiers as heroes? Can you say you are a hero when you fire froma gun that fires 2000 bullets a minnute, wearing a vest, equipment a+ on a poorly trained, not so well guy in his own land?

But, there is something else that can't be ignored.. How will USA get out of Iraq without being defeated? Who is better for it, Obama or John?
:rotfl:
The answer to that question is so obvious, you should have answered it yourself. Setting a timetable for withdrawal, no matter what the situation is, is a recipe for disaser (anyone remember VietNam?). No brain required to answer that question.

Maybe, maybe, but then again USA is allready loosing that war.. Economically and perhaps military.. It's better to back out than to pursue a lost cause. Is there a law where the mighty on a mission from God cannot loose.. The very minnute last american soldier gets out of Iraq, whole Iraq government falls. Whole lotta killing for whole lotta green. We all know that. What's the point, other than to extract oil from Iraq? That reminds me of some men in the past..

And ofcourse.. How the hell can you in your country watch a man talking how taxes should be handled, how to help poor americans etc. and then he goes on and on speaking of spending another 600 billion on a useless war? :rotfl:
The same way our country can watch a candidate talk of lowering taxes while espousing a proposal (and actually sponsoring a bill in Congress) to increase foreign aid by hundreds of billions of dollars.

I agree.. It's idiotic.. Why is there that darn aid program when those countries could be well on themselves?
IMO it goes like this. You break a man, make him poor, then you make him work for you for low money and in the end you generously help him..

And if it isn't important who gets elected, why are you voting? :88)
Because it's our duty, IMO (;) AVG). When we say that nothing will change, it isn't necessarily true. Each candidate has beliefs that we either share or don't share. Each candidate says where they would like to see the country go and we either agree or don't agree. No matter who gets elected, the President can't change everything by himself. Congress and the Senate are where everything happens (other than starting the odd war here or there). Until ALL of our elected officials make doing the right thing for the country (as opposed to themselves) their priority then nothing will change. The only real power the President has is to veto bills that Congress and the Senate have passed besides that whole Supreme Court Justice appointing thing, but then Congress has it's hand in that, too).

:up: I agree, but duty.. ?
AVG told the only truth, when 9/11 happened americans were all for war, now that is going bad, americans curse bush.. When USA atacked Iraq, whole world hated USA. I saw occasions here where americans here were offended and laughed up..
Presidential elections will change nothing..

Americans have to change their field of view.. They cannot say "Bush is wrong because he lead us into a lost war" after they were for war. What will happen when the Russians do that? Or chinese? Heck, USA is not the most powerful anymore..
And so..
Obama could be a way for that to be..


But it seems to me we are all screwed no matter what.. Everywhere is the same..
I am thirsty..

cheers

[Digital_Trucker]

But it seems to me we are all screwed no matter what.. Everywhere is the same..
I am thirsty..

cheers

On that, I can certainly agree (even the thirsty part:rotfl:)

[SimNut]

PS. This means that McCain draws way more people simply wanting to hear his speeches.Maybe they just needed a good nap, brushing up on old cliches, miss their grandparents, need a lesson on who voted for what 25 years ago, or want to catch a glimpse of the Vice-Milf.

[Sailor Steve]

We watched the democrates storm Congress for the past two years. Not much of a winning record going on there either.
Agreed, especially since the same thing happened fourteen years ago. Tired of having Democrats run both the White House and the Congress, they 'threw the bums out' and installed Gingrich & Company. The result was a huge advancement to more of the same. It happened again with Bush as president, and now we have a Democrat congress giving us a huge change to more of the same. And blaming the other guys.

Everyone on the mall in Washington are to blame for our current ills. If you a pinning it all on Bush, your mistaken at who is to blame.
I'm not much of a Bush fan either, but it's my observation that he has this in common with Obama: the people who hate them do so for personal reasons, and would hate them no matter what they say or do. If Bush had not gone into Iraq you can bet that there would be thousands on the left lambasting him for missing the obvious and not taking out Saddam when he had the chance.

Some people will despise the guy on the other side just because he's the guy on the other side, and don't need - or want - any other reason. But they'll sure come up with a bunch of them, just to make themselves look credible.

[AVGWarhawk]

In short Steve, everyone wants their cake and eat it to.

[Sailor Steve]

I think that's a part of it. Back during WW2 one of Agatha Christie's mysteries involved a discussion about how evil the Germans were...or weren't. Christie had one of her characters say that of course we considered them evil, we had to, or we wouldn't want to fight them.

Some people don't want to resolve the issues, or even really discuss them - some people just want to be right. And to feel superior.

[AVGWarhawk]

I think that's a part of it. Back during WW2 one of Agatha Christie's mysteries involved a discussion about how evil the Germans were...or weren't. Christie had one of her characters say that of course we considered them evil, we had to, or we wouldn't want to fight them.

Some people don't want to resolve the issues, or even really discuss them - some people just want to be right. And to feel superior.

Sure, there is superiority complexs going on. I think Pelosi and Barney Frank just have complexes. :p