Damage texture Problem!

[Reece]

I hadn't received a direct hit from a deck gun for awhile and although the texture looks ok on the boat there is this cloud that follows just above, & when you dive this cloud floats just above the water but doesn't show above the horizon:
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h244/Reecehk/TextureProblem1.jpg
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h244/Reecehk/TextureProblem2.jpg
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h244/Reecehk/TextureProblem3.jpg
Doesn't happen with ships only U-Boat, probably something to with the fact that the damage can be repaired on U-boats! Could it be the Particles.dat or Particles.dsd file?
Not sure what mod I am looking for, anyone know about this problem and a fix?:-?

[TheDarkWraith]

the .val file for the subs has a controller called 'VisualDamage'. It's responsible for adding and keeping track of the 'dirt' marks on the sub. Maybe you have corrupt .val file? Does this happen on every sub?
Could also be from the effect used when the shell explodes on your sub from the particles.dat file. Do you have modified particles.dat file? Could be an ID conflict also.
Particles.dsd file is responsible for sounds for the effects in particles.dat file.
Actually just taking a look at the shells.sim file to refresh my memory shows that it calls for the effect when the 'explosion' happens. Do you have a modified shells.sim file?

[Reece]

Good grief, that many files!:oops: From what I know after a little checking is that the Particles.dsd file is from the Depthcharge shake mod, the Particles.dat, dated 12/2007 is a total mystery, I actually thought it might have been from one of your early SH4 effects mod, but went through them all & differ, this one is 465,748 bytes.:-?
The Val files are from Rubini's wake fix, Shells.sim is dated 2006, so not likely to be that. I went back in and reloaded the game but the effect and damage is gone, the U-boat is the 7c.:)

Edit: Could this happen using GWX 2.1 U-boats & 1.03 Particles.dat

[TheDarkWraith]

Good grief, that many files!:oops: From what I know after a little checking is that the Particles.dsd file is from the Depthcharge shake mod, the Particles.dat, dated 12/2007 is a total mystery, I actually thought it might have been from one of your early SH4 effects mod, but went through them all & differ, this one is 465,748 bytes.:-?
The Val files are from Rubini's wake fix, Shells.sim is dated 2006, so not likely to be that. I went back in and reloaded the game but the effect and damage is gone, the U-boat is the 7c.:)

Edit: Could this happen using GWX 2.1 U-boats & 1.03 Particles.dat

Could be. Best thing is to roll back all mods and enable one by one and test to see if you still have the problem. Find which one is causing the problem and then investigate why. I would browse through all the mods in the MODS folders and see which ones are modifying the sub's .val files, the particles.dat file, and the shells.sim file (and shells.dat and shells.zon). I would target those first.
Rubini's wake fix, not familiar with.

[Reece]

Rubini's wake fix, not familiar with.
That is the horrible texture that you get mainly in rough sea when you get the lines across the water across the Boats or ships, like water running over a step, thisis an old Stock problem.
Now as far as taking out mods I will just have to suck it and see there, I got to around 150 mods then after so many campaigns & patrols without errors I proclaimed it safe to just install all mods without JSGME to conserve space, This sort of thing always happens to me!:lol:
I will have to find a small mission & try suicide to get some hits for a test!:yep:

[TheDarkWraith]

JSGME is your friend here! I would do this then:

make a folder called damage_texture_testing in the MODS folder. Under this folder create the following heirarchy:

\MODS\damage_texture_testing\data\Library
\MODS\damage_texture_testing\data\Submarine
\MODS\damage_texture_testing\data\Submarine\xxxxx (where xxxxx=sub)

Then take an un-modified particles.dat file and place in the library folder above and enable your new 'mod' to test.
If same problem then take shells.xxx (where xxx=.dat, .sim and .zon) and place in Library folder above (one at a time) and enable 'mod' to test.
If same problem then take xxxx.val (where xxxx=sub) and place in Submarine\xxxx folder above and enable 'mod' to test.
One of those should find the 'bug'.

[von Zelda]

Not sure what mod I am looking for, anyone know about this problem and a fix?

I don't mean to pick on any one person or on any one particular mod, but are you running Thomsen's No instant Death Screen Mod?

I took a 1% hull damage from scraping the bottom of my boat. I saved and returned to my game later to find that I now had a smokey, little fire on the conning tower. It looked very similar to your pics. I did a dive and resurfaced to find the problem still persisted. I retunred to base and remove the mod. No problems since but I have not taken any damage yet.

[Reece]

@ von Zelda, No I haven't tried that but I might download it for a hint of the files he used, (found they were u-boat zon files) when you dived did you notice if you had the cloud floating above the U-boat on top of the water, looks funny when you speed it up and turn the U-boat, seeing this little cloud whizzing over the surface of the water!:lol: Also if you exit to menu then reload the game this disappears, as well as the damage texture to the sub, this part may be normal anyway!:yep:
@ Racerboy, I have cut-n-pasted the method you describe, I will give it a go, though it will take awhile to narrow it down, thanks.:up:

[von Zelda]

@ von Zelda, No I haven't tried that but I might download it for a hint of the files he used, (found they were u-boat zon files) when you dived did you notice if you had the cloud floating above the U-boat on top of the water, looks funny when you speed it up and turn the U-boat, seeing this little cloud whizzing over the surface of the water!:lol: Also if you exit to menu then reload the game this disappears, as well as the damage texture to the sub, this part may be normal anyway!:yep:
@ Racerboy, I have cut-n-pasted the method you describe, I will give it a go, though it will take awhile to narrow it down, thanks.:up:

As boat went deeper, smoke above water began to disappear completely.

When I reloaded game, small fire and smoke remained as first described.

When you determine which mod is causing your problem, please post. It is possible that Thomsen's mod, which I removed, is not the culprit after all.

[Reece]

I'll do that, it's not the Particles.dat file! Next is the U-Boat files.:yep:

[von Zelda]

I'll do that, it's not the Particles.dat file! Next is the U-Boat files.:yep:

I checked the files in Thomsen's mod: No Instant Death

It is the only mod that I use that has .zon files! The file that affects me would be his NSS_Uboat7b.zon since I'm using a type 7b boat.

[Reece]

Ok just done a test using standard GWX 2.1 files with VIIC, tested using the following:
data\Submarine\NSS_Uboat7c\ all files
data\Library\ Particles.dat, Particles.dsd, Materials.dat the 3 Shells files
Problem is still there!:cry: The deeper you go the higher that cloud seems to go!:-?

[Anvart]

I have understood nothing in your replies, but ...
i think speech about old graphics engine (particles system) problem ...
in other words water reflection artefacts ...? :hmm:

P.S.
It happens not always (so obviously and brightly), but with all ships, planes and subs ...

[Reece]

I have understood nothing in your replies, but ...
i think speech about old graphics engine (particles system) problem ...
in other words water reflection artefacts ...? :hmm: Sorry I'm really not understanding what you mean Anvart, you mention water reflection artifacts, could you point to a file?:huh:

[Anvart]

I have understood nothing in your replies, but ...
i think speech about old graphics engine (particles system) problem ...
in other words water reflection artefacts ...? :hmm:
Sorry I'm really not understanding what you mean Anvart, you mention water reflection artifacts, could you point to a file, are you referring to the Scene.dat?:huh:
Look abouve (cyan) ...
Maybe i have not correctly understood you ...

P.S.
You can try to reduce water reflection ... maybe only for concrete object (or particles) ...

[Reece]

Well Im not sure which file you mean, but I tried the same test above as in post #12 using GWX 1.03 files instead & the problem is gone! I still get good texture & smoke but disappears after a short period & altogether when I dive, later when I surface only the scortched texture is there.:up: All I have to do now is nail it down to a the actual file causing it!:lol::damn:

Edit: OK, it's the Submarine files, 1.03 run ok, 2.1 have the texture problem, knowing this has anyone any ideas as to the differences between the 2 versions?

[Reece]

I have finally traced it to the NSS_Uboat7c.dat file, the GWX 2.1 causes the problem, I have probably got a mixup of file versions, does anyone know what other files are attached to this one that may cause the problem?:-?
Thanks.:yep:

[onelifecrisis]

I haven't read the whole thread, but I've seen the same problem on other objects. It happens when the clip setting on the reflection model is set to -20 or similar. It needs to be set to zero.
See if you can find the damage reflection settings and set its clip height to zero.
HTH
OLC

[Reece]

Hi OLC, yes this is most awfull, Rubini's waterstream uses the GWX 2.1 NSS_Uboat7c.dat file so when used in 1.03 this problem occurs!:cry: I tried with a stock 2.1 file and same thing, what I seem to need it the 1.03 version of NSS_Uboat7c.dat (probably all u-boats) file to be edited for the water stream mod.:-?
I haven't read the whole thread, but I've seen the same problem on other objects. It happens when the clip setting on the reflection model is set to -20 or similar. It needs to be set to zero.
See if you can find the damage reflection settings and set its clip height to zero.
HTH
OLC Do you mean in the NSS_Uboat7c.dat file?:) Did you mean water reflection, if so the clip height is set to 0. Must have been what Anvart was talking about.
Also could this be a bug/problem with GWX 2.1 stock, can someone test it please? Cheers.

[Madox58]

All version VII U-Boats were modified in the reflections area by me.
I did not adjust the clip height so I doubt that is the problem.

[von Zelda]

I have finally traced it to the NSS_Uboat7c.dat file, the GWX 2.1 causes the problem,

If you positively know that the NSS_Uboat7c.dat file causes the problem and that there is no way to correct this one file; can you substitute the NSS_Uboat7c41.dat or the 7b.dat file (assuming they are okay) for the problem/corrupted 7c.dat file? I would expect that these U-boats would be very similar in characteristics to the type 7c.

Just a suggestion.

[Reece]

I don't think so, you would be better off substituting it with the 1.03 dats, the main problem for me is that Rubini's mod uses the 2.1 file!:cry:
A horrid thought is that this problem may exist for all GWX 2.1 U-boats!:oops:
I need some one to run a mission, please, & deliberately allow the boat to receive a direct hit, from a deck gun, then dive the boat and see if the cloud stays on the surface following the boat around, also during the course of the mission even if repaired this cloud will remain!:doh:
Thanks.

[Madox58]

Better yet.
Before I Richard around with the VII boats stuff.
Try a different Sub.
Same problem?
Remember, it's not official support!
That ended with the release of 2.1
And you are a maverick modder of sorts.
(You devil you!!)
Regards Mate!

[Koondawg]

A horrid thought is that this problem may exist for all GWX 2.1 U-boats!:oops:
I need some one to run a mission, please, & deliberately allow the boat to receive a direct hit, from a deck gun, then dive the boat and see if the cloud stays on the surface following the boat around
@ Reece...I had several hits on my Uboat during a mission (Q-ship) and never had the same consequenses you posted.

Koon

kinda curious whats causing it myself...

[Reece]

And you are a maverick modder of sorts.
(You devil you!!)
Regards Mate!
Yeh I know!:oops::oops: Call it a weakness!:lol:
@ Koondawg, Well that's totally wierd! I run a verey heavily modded GWX 1.03, with all the things I like, have played a career through with no probs, but not that many patrols since Rubini's Water stream mod, unfortunately the 2.1 dat file he used isn't compatable with 1.03, the obvious side effect!:cry: Changing to 2.1 would be a huge undertaking, I don't really want to go there!:oops:

[Reece]

I just tested the VIIB & the IXC, both are ok!:-? Why only the VIIC?:doh::-?
Have now tried a basic GWX 2.1 install, and it is still there! so it is something to do with 2.1 VIIC only!:dead:

[Koondawg]

Have now tried a basic GWX 2.1 install, and it is still there! so it is something to do with 2.1 VIIC only
I havn't tried the 7c Reece...I will fire it up after I get home from work and see what becomes of t...

[von Zelda]

I just tested the VIIB & the IXC, both are ok! Why only the VIIC?
Have now tried a basic GWX 2.1 install, and it is still there! so it is something to do with 2.1 VIIC only!

Hey Reece, I go back to my earlier suggestion. Please try substituting the 7B.dat file and/or the 7C41.dat file for the corrupt 7C.dat file. See if this corrects the problem and is suitable for SH3 gameplay; there should not be a whole lot of difference in the games 7B, 7C or 7C41 files that anyone would really notice a major difference in game play.

And what happened to your theory that the problem was in the .zon files? I had a similar situation to yours in a 7B while using Thomsen's No Instant Death Mod which had a modified .zon file.

[Reece]

Thanks Koondawg, It's amazing that no one has noticed before! I just went into a mission & selected a VIIC (1942), then went in guns blazing, with my finger poised just above the "C" key till I get a direct hit, generally never to come up again, but that's beside the point, just stay on an external view & you should see this nasty cloud hovering above the boats position, though the further the boat goes down the further the cloud rises!:lol:
@ Von Zelda, I did replace the zon files but still had the problem, have now replaced all files & still there, I will look at the differences between the VIIC & VIIB dats.:yep:

Edit: You can't just rename the files, they make calls to other files, sim, zon, etc with the same name, so renaming to VIIC the dat will still call for VIIB files!

[Reece]

It has something to do with the node change to WaterReflection:
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h244/Reecehk/GWX217cdat.jpg

All of the others are made up like the 1.03 files, you can see the structure is totally different:

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h244/Reecehk/GWX1037cdat.jpg
Why the change I don't know, but funny that the 2.0/2.1 VIIC version is the only one with this change!:-?

[badwolf]

Hi Reece.
I've looked at my 7c.dat file in GWX 2.1 basic no other mods and it's identical to the first diagram. How did you get the second one.

Thought I'd replay as all others are offline.

[Reece]

If you mean the ones above, the second is from GWX 1.03.:)
Thought I'd replay as all others are offline. ???

[Koondawg]

Ok heres an update....

From above the sub...looks normal.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v415/koondawg/pixel%20trbl/above1.jpg
Under water after taking damage (looking away from the sun)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v415/koondawg/pixel%20trbl/above2.jpg
Under water after damage (looking into the sun)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v415/koondawg/pixel%20trbl/above.jpg
And into the sun surfaced....
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v415/koondawg/pixel%20trbl/above3.jpg
My activated mods
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v415/koondawg/pixel%20trbl/modpic.jpg

Now are you running any of these mods? Im gonna jump back in and see if it indeed does the same with a 9

[Koondawg]

Ok with the 9....
After damage (submerged or on top of the water) I couldn't replicate the problem...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v415/koondawg/pixel%20trbl/9pic.jpg
which got me thinking in this way...
I opened up the 9 dat file and found no reflection (168 ) was in it..
Im am gonna try something Ill be right back
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v415/koondawg/pixel%20trbl/9image.jpg

[Koondawg]

Ok here's what I found...I took the reflection image and deleted it from the .dat file on the 7
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v415/koondawg/pixel%20trbl/7datfile.jpg
I took damage all along the boat...submerged no floating reflection
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v415/koondawg/pixel%20trbl/7cwithdamage.jpg
and sufaced into the sun no floating pixels
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v415/koondawg/pixel%20trbl/7creplicate.jpg
My recomendation is to delet the node entry 168 and walla...it had no adverse effects on the game...

Koon :up:

[badwolf]

Sorry Reece had visitors,

Have had a quick look at all subs, my conclusion is:-


7C is missing the 3 nodes:-

166:node- refect_NSS_Uboat7c missing
165: 3D model missing
167: reflect_NSS_Uboat7c missing
168:WaterReflection
169:WaterReflection

First 3 are fictitious node numbers, its just to show an example.

Which is what you discovered.

So could delete as Koondawg says, or try a rebuild. (compared 7b vanilla to GWX 7b, they are different. Haven't got GWX 1.3, but if GWX 1.3 and 2.1 - 7b.dat are the same reflect nodes then 7c.dat could also be the same and you could replace missing 3 nodes. I doubt it, but I hope you know what I'm trying to say.
Had another look at the dat files and each have 2 3D model nodes and they appear to be identical, so you could possibly export the 7c.dat 3D model and re-import that and change ID, for the missing node. This would leave the other 2, but they are very small chunks so sorting it out might not be such a big problem.

http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/9945/7cvanillauc3.jpg

Here's the SH3 vanilla 7c.dat

[Reece]

I didn't think it was something I did!:oops: there is a definite bug, I haven't tried exporting/importing chunks before, I did delete the line a couple of days ago and S3D automatically adjusts the nodes, I'll play around a bit but I have informed BBW about this and he said he would look into it, so I won't go overboard just yet, I'll be glad to have it sorted out and fixed!:yep:

[badwolf]

I'm no expert either. But first get your SD3 upgraded to 0.8.2 or later. Exporting nodes with a right click on that node and when importing you can change node number on the top menu bar with up/down arrows. The SD3 is really easy to use due to its hint tips, a credit to skwas for an excellent tool. I Know you'll have no trouble using it.

We'll wait to see what BBW has to say

cheers Reece

[von Zelda]

I did delete the line a couple of days ago and S3D automatically adjusts the nodes, I'll play around a bit but I have informed BBW about this and he said he would look into it

Reece, once you deleted the line, did the game play okay?? Was the cloud/reflection gone?

I downloaded the 3ditor. I copied the 7c.dat files from both GWX2.1 and the Water Streram mod V4 to a separate folder. It was quite easy to delete the 168 node from each and resave to a new name. I then created a mini-mode for each using the path: data/submarine/NSS_Uboat7c which could then be JSGME enabled.

I have not tried these out, I'm just waiting to hear if this will work.

[SquareSteelBar]

Sorry Reece had visitors,

Have had a quick look at all subs, my conclusion is:-


7C is missing the 3 nodes:-

166:node- refect_NSS_Uboat7c missing
165: 3D model missing
167: reflect_NSS_Uboat7c missing
168:WaterReflection
169:WaterReflection

First 3 are fictitious node numbers, its just to show an example.

Which is what you discovered.

So could delete as Koondawg says, or try a rebuild. (compared 7b vanilla to GWX 7b, they are different. Haven't got GWX 1.3, but if GWX 1.3 and 2.1 - 7b.dat are the same reflect nodes then 7c.dat could also be the same and you could replace missing 3 nodes. I doubt it, but I hope you know what I'm trying to say.
Had another look at the dat files and each have 2 3D model nodes and they appear to be identical, so you could possibly export the 7c.dat 3D model and re-import that and change ID, for the missing node. This would leave the other 2, but they are very small chunks so sorting it out might not be such a big problem.

http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/9945/7cvanillauc3.jpg

Here's the SH3 vanilla 7c.dat


I added the three missing nodes into NSS_Uboat7c.dat [GWX 2.1] manually by hex editing. The result was that this file became identical to NSS_Uboat7c.dat [GWX 1.03].

It makes no sense to remove these mentioned three nodes [or does it]?, so I think that file was put into GWX 2.1 by mistake !?

SquareSteelBar

[badwolf]

Hi Reece

Extracted both 7b.dat 3D model nodes and compared them in Winmerge and unfortunately they are different. We therefore can't just extract and re-import the 3D model. But still trying to resolve problem.

[Reece]

Thanks for the support guys, :up: I think Koondawg tried it with deleted WaterStream nodes & although it works I don't think it's advisable to play that way, I will wait for BBW's report, but in the mean time I might play around with S3D (new version) to see how easily I can stuff it up!:lol:

Edit: Sorry SSB, I didn't realize the thread went to page 3 so I didn't see your post, If you don't mind could you please edit Rubini's waterstream 7c dat file, you seem to know a bit about S3D!;) Yes ... That's a hint!:yep:
Also tried to PM BBW but his box is full!! We have to remember that before producing a "Fix", GWX is not our mod & BBW is the new leader, that is why I am waiting for his input! Cheers.

[badwolf]

The replacing of missing nodes is no problem. But GWX 2.1 might have had modifications in this area. I was trying to confirm if this was true by inspecting other subs. That would account why the nodes were perhaps accidently omitted.

[Koondawg]

The 168 node when deleted didn't have any effect on the sub reflections, in or under the water...was a quick fix.
I dont use 7's myself thus never knew of this problem. Make a copy of your 7.dat file and try it...you can always restore it...

Koon