[WIP] Playable PT-109 Elco MTB

[sqk7744]

http://battleflags.net/images/pt109header.jpg
* DISCLAIMER: For all you fine print readers out there, we thank you for reading this, and admire you're dilligence. Photos are Artist conception's of PT 109 MTB project. Actual unit may not even float or might differ completely. Speeds enhanced to show awesomeness. Professional driver, on a closed harbor, do not attempt. Base Model not available in Grey. Neon Pink or Turquoise schemes only, OnStar and XM/Sirus radio package shown, -not included.

July 14th, 2008

Beta released:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=901819&postcount=89

--
June 18, 2008

Greetings All,

Digital_Trucker and I are working on this unit, and thought it would be fun to try 44 knt attack runs using the TBT. Since this is our first swat at making a playable ship, and we know enough to be dangerous ;) we would appreciate any advice and or assistance (rescue) on the subject.

So Far we have a cloned Porpoise-class called NSS_PT_109 working in the mission builder. Our plan of attack was to then clone/change the /sea/american/3D model of the US Elco 80, but we'll see how that goes.

We still need to figure out:
1. Adding the PT 3D model
2. Crew/camera locations ( or do we need to draw a Bridge/Deck in 3D? )
3. Firing torps and accutrate placement ( if the PT 3D model messes-up the existing Porpoise armaments.
4. Using 1 deck gun as a 40mm and adding 2 AA's as the twin 50's.
5. While we are at the seemingly impossible, let's invent a Segway scooter powered by Fusion too :rotfl:

Many thanks for your suggestions.

Cheers,
-sqk

[ReallyDedPoet]

Sounds good sqk, look forward to it. You may want to check out the one done in SH3 by Mikhayl, there might be some nice ideas there.


RDP

[Xantrokoles]

I do not recommend to clone a whole submarine file.
You should start with the stock NPT_BR.dat and co..

Important for not having a CTD is:
-having diveplanes(i.e. invisible ones)
-using a submarine controller in the *.sim file.
-randomizing the IDs of the Dat and then relinking with the files in the sim, zon, and bla bla files.

this is for having it working.
You should know Mikhayl's tutorial, cause I cant explain with my worse english.

Good Luck with the project!

[AVGWarhawk]

Very nice. Of all the ships being made playable...this is the one I want to play with.

[sqk7744]

Sounds good sqk, look forward to it. You may want to check out the one done in SH3 by Mikhayl, there might be some nice ideas there.


RDP

Thanks RDP, good idea!

[sqk7744]

I do not recommend to clone a whole submarine file.
You should start with the stock NPT_BR.dat and co..

Important for not having a CTD is:
-having diveplanes(i.e. invisible ones)
-using a submarine controller in the *.sim file.
-randomizing the IDs of the Dat and then relinking with the files in the sim, zon, and bla bla files.

this is for having it working.
You should know Mikhayl's tutorial, cause I cant explain with my worse english.

Good Luck with the project!
Many thanks Xantrokoles (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/member.php?u=238297) :up::up::up:

That will be a great start - we are clueless and fearless ;)

[Charlielima]

Don't forget the PTGBs. http://www.ptboatworld.com/photos2.htm I know this is a higgins boat But some elco boats where fitted out with 2x 40 MM bofars and 50 cals as much as there was room for also. One PTGB per 2 or 3 PTs could give the squadron some punch. I'm wandering why They didn't bolt on a Quad 50 mount amidships. Since PT boats and Schnell Bootes operated as squadrons or gruppes, a mod for hunting with a task force, or squadron would be desirable. Since we have playable destroyers this should work for all sorts of folks. I think they had grey float coats in WW2. Good luck with this project. V/R CL

[Fish40]

Very nice. Of all the ships being made playable...this is the one I want to play with.



I feel exactly the same way!:yep: Looking good guys! Good luck with the project:up:

[Sailor Steve]

A note about "44-knot attack runs": in the Pacific at least, parts were hard to come by, and most boats were lucky to make 40 knots on the best of days. Also, they were very susceptible to weather and wave, and from what I remember of reading They Were Expendable and PT-109 the norm was closer to 30 knots most of the time. Hence the song:

Some Pee-Tees do seventy-five, and some do sixty-nine;
If we get ours to run at all we think we're doing fine!

[Ramboxxx88]

You have made good work, That Ship looks Cool.

THANK YOU FOR MADE THIS, THIS PT-BOAT IS MY FAVORITE SHIP, & I HAVE WAITING FOR THAT SOMEONE IS GONNA MADE IT, & YOU MADE IT THANK YOU VERY MUTCH.:D :D :D :D :up: :up: :up: :up: :rock: :rock: :rock: :rock:

[sqk7744]

Thanks to all for their kind suggestions, here's an update.

As this is our first attempt at making a ship playable, and we are learning as we go, (inverted learning curve) so far we have been able to clone the US PT Boat as a unit, located in the /submarines folder. The PT boat can be added to a Single player mission and is visiable ( as AI for now ) When set to 'human Playable' via the Mission editor, we still get a CTD loading/playing the mission. :damn:

Is the next step to edit each individual node with-in the followingfiles as Xantrokoles so kindly mentioned?
We are also trying to make sense of what each of the file extensions 'job's' are as well.

.cam (camera file?)
.dat
.dsd (for sounds, yes?)
.eqp
.sim
.sns
.val
.zon (zones ala what you edit in the Tweak files?)


Important for not having a CTD is:
-having diveplanes(i.e. invisible ones)
-using a submarine controller in the *.sim file.
-randomizing the IDs of the Dat and then relinking with the files in the sim, zon, and bla bla files.

[Ramboxxx88]

Thanks to all for their kind suggestions, here's an update.

As this is our first attempt at making a ship playable, and we are learning as we go, (inverted learning curve) so far we have been able to clone the US PT Boat as a unit, located in the /submarines folder. The PT boat can be added to a Single player mission and is visiable ( as AI for now ) When set to 'human Playable' via the Mission editor, we still get a CTD loading/playing the mission. :damn:

Is the next step to edit each individual node with-in the followingfiles as Xantrokoles so kindly mentioned?
We are also trying to make sense of what each of the file extensions 'job's' are as well.

.cam (camera file?)
.dat
.dsd (for sounds, yes?)
.eqp
.sim
.sns
.val
.zon (zones ala what you edit in the Tweak files?)


Important for not having a CTD is:
-having diveplanes(i.e. invisible ones)
-using a submarine controller in the *.sim file.
-randomizing the IDs of the Dat and then relinking with the files in the sim, zon, and bla bla files.


Can we play PT Boat in the Career

[sqk7744]

Hi Ramboxxx88 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/member.php?u=240041),

Thanks for your interest and words of encouragement, but the PT Boat is still very much a Work in Progress, aka WIP and will not be ready for sometime, with lots of work to be done.

Best,
-sqk


Can we play PT Boat in the Career

[sqk7744]

Mikhayl (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/member.php?u=238150) that is wonderful help!

Thank you Cap'n :up::up::up::up:

We've got the cloning a unit down, it's just changing it into another type of unit without CTDs - that the problem.
We think it's just a matter of getting the submarine controller and the dive planes into the .dat correctly???

We got the Subcontroller added ok, but the Invisible Dive planes may not have been added right.

[Digital_Trucker]

Just a little update. Thanks to Mikhayl and Xantrokoles examples to go by, we've now got a player controllable PT Boat:arrgh!:

Only problem at this point (very early in development) is a texturing problem and the fact that the boat won't go anywhere (sure that's a crew problem, gotta look at that now), but we're on the way, anyway.:sunny:


Edit : Texture problem isn't a problem any more and it really does help to have crew on board:damn:. Hopefully, next update will be screenies of the PT flying through the water.

[Digital_Trucker]

Got her moving and responding to commands:up:

Now comes the fun part:

Getting wakes to work.
Adding weapons and crew.
Creating animations for new crewmembers positions that aren't covered by the sub animations.
Modeling the bridge and below decks.
Adding clickable objects to interface with the controls and sensors.
Adjusting dials to allow for faster speeds.
Creating bases.
Adding bikini clad babes and new animations for them.

Creating a campaign and or multiplayer missions.


Anything else we can think of:arrgh!: (open to suggestions:yep:)

[sqk7744]

W:o:oW Nice work DT!

The rate you are going the PT Boat will be ready for a cruise soon. Keep us posted on the Bikinis' ;)

-Sqk

Got her moving and responding to commands:up:

Now comes the fun part:

Getting wakes to work.
Adding weapons and crew.
Creating animations for new crewmembers positions that aren't covered by the sub animations.
Modeling the bridge and below decks.
Adding clickable objects to interface with the controls and sensors.
Adjusting dials to allow for faster speeds.
Creating bases.
Adding bikini clad babes and new animations for them.

Creating a campaign and or multiplayer missions.


Anything else we can think of:arrgh!: (open to suggestions:yep:)

[Rockin Robbins]

A note about "44-knot attack runs": in the Pacific at least, parts were hard to come by, and most boats were lucky to make 40 knots on the best of days. Also, they were very susceptible to weather and wave, and from what I remember of reading They Were Expendable and PT-109 the norm was closer to 30 knots most of the time.
They Were Expendable is just a PR fluff piece full of fictionalized and oversensationalized claims of PT Boat grandeur. The truth, according to The Mosquito Fleet, by Bern Keating, was much more prosaic. He specifically tears They Were Expendable a new anal orfice.

On July 24, 1941—four and a half months before America entered the war—the Navy held the Plywood Derby, a test speed run of experimental PTs in the open Atlantic off Long Island... Two PTs of the Elco design finished with the best average speeds— 39.72 and 37.01 knots.

On a second Plywood Derby the Elcos raced against the destroyer Wilkes. Seas were running 8 feet high—in one stretch the destroyer skipper reported 15-foot waves— and the little cockleshells took a terrible beating. Most of the time they were out of sight in the trough of the seas or hidden by flying spray. The destroyer won the race, but the Navy board had been impressed by the seaworthiness of the tough little boats...

In action the PT was usually overloaded, was often running on jury-rig repairs and spare parts held together with adhesive and ingenuity. In tropic waters the hull was soon sporting a long green beard of water plants that could cut the PT's speed in half. Many of the PTs that fought the bloody battles that follow in these pages were doing well to hit 29 or even 27 knots.

The American Navy had learned the hard way that any enemy destroyer could make 35 knots and many of them could do considerably better—plenty fast enough to run down a PT boat.
He then goes about dismantling the flimsy and wishful claims of enemy sinkings in They Were Expendable. Suffice it to say that the PT boats were not glamorous and were basically the armpit of the Navy. If you had a death wish, they were a great place to go. You sure couldn't expect to be sinking any enemy DDs. You prayed not to meet anything larger.

The rest of The Mosquito Fleet is a litany of underperformance after underperformance, not the fault of the great men who served on them, but of ill planned and inappropriate boats.

To succeed, they had to outperform the enemy DDs, which had actual firepower. Instead, they were sitting ducks, waiting to be sunk by the rumor of a single 5" shell.

[spike12]

So what's the latest news?:ping:

[Digital_Trucker]

So what's the latest news?:ping:
Funny you should ask. Hopefully we'll have a beta for y'all to play around with soon. It won't be totally ready, but it will be something to "wet your whistle":yep:

We now have all the wakes and sounds back in place, 2 functional AA guns (both mannable by "invisible crew" and one mannable by the player), 1 bridge camera view, 4 functional torpedo tubes (they launch from under the bow for now)and we're working on a deck gun (see pics below, it won't be the one that's on there at the moment:rotfl:) and the TBT and binocular camers and fleshing out the crew assignments and other minor details.

http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/285/20080623173937nm7.jpg

http://img95.imageshack.us/img95/3809/20080623173700tn6.jpg

More news, as it happens:arrgh!:

[spike12]

Sweet, An Elcofark!:rock:

[sqk7744]

SEA TRIALS
Update: June 23rd, 2008
Time: 23:08
Varient: Dv2 and X-1

SITREP X-1 varient:
First attempt: We got her up to 643knts but then she ran outta gas.

Second attempt: Going along fine at 643knts, we turned sharp and barrel rolled 3 times in the air (25 feet agl), nose-dived, and ended-up at a depth of 92 feet. (wait till you see the FRAPs video! )

Will report more tomorrow,
-sqk out!


* The Dv2 varient is looking sharp and doing 38knts on 3 Packard V12 Marine Engines, 4050hp (1350 each) @ 3000rpm.
Was our guess at PT109's specs. ( any help is welcome! ) based on reading from here http://www.pt-boat.com/packard/packard.html
(http://www.pt-boat.com/packard/packard.html)
and http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/sh-usn/usnsh-p/pt109.htm

Nice Transome DT!
( Now you folks know where all the Torpedo Fuel has been disappearing too ) :arrgh!:

[peabody]

So what's the latest news?:ping:
Funny you should ask. Hopefully we'll have a beta for y'all to play around with soon. It won't be totally ready, but it will be something to "wet your whistle":yep:

We now have all the wakes and sounds back in place, 2 functional AA guns (both mannable by "invisible crew" and one mannable by the player), 1 bridge camera view, 4 functional torpedo tubes (they launch from under the bow for now)and we're working on a deck gun (see pics below, it won't be the one that's on there at the moment:rotfl:) and the TBT and binocular camers and fleshing out the crew assignments and other minor details.

http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/285/20080623173937nm7.jpg

http://img95.imageshack.us/img95/3809/20080623173700tn6.jpg

More news, as it happens:arrgh!:

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:You guys are a riot.

Peabody

[ReallyDedPoet]

http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/285/20080623173937nm7.jpg

:o:o:lol:


RDP

[Charlielima]

http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/285/20080623173937nm7.jpg

:o:o:lol:


RDP

And I sniveled for a PTGB. CL

[Doolan]

That boat is nothing short of awesome

[Hitman]

Here are some gems for reading while we wait, courtesy of the hnsa guys :D :

http://www.hnsa.org/doc/pt/doctrine/index.htm

http://www.hnsa.org/doc/pt/know/index.htm

http://www.hnsa.org/doc/pt/specs/index.htm

[sqk7744]

Wonderful Hitman! :up::up::up::up::up::up::up:

[Charlielima]

Alot of skins for these boats.
http://www.ptboatworld.com/PT-Camouflage.html
CL

[Digital_Trucker]

Thanks for that, Charlielima:up: That'll be a ton of fun, too, trying to skin this thing after we finish building it. So far things are coming along well (excepting a few problems getting functional deck guns working) and we hope to have an early, early, really early, really basic beta to release soon.:arrgh!:

[sqk7744]

Great link, thanks CL!

Alot of skins for these boats.
http://www.ptboatworld.com/PT-Camouflage.html
CL

[Charlielima]

Bitchin! Proud to add to the problem. Damn It, about the deck guns that is. My first snivel for a mod on the PT will be a 40mm Bofars both fore and aft. A 3 x 16 turret fore and aft I believe will really mess with about everything on the boat. Gobs of good work so far. Currently I'm Trying to figure out how to tell my significant other why we need to spend 1K USDs for an RC PT boat. It's only 3 feet, Ok maybe 4 feet long honey. CL

[Xantrokoles]

I heard about invisible gun crew?

You saw the cfg#A01 node.

It has to go this way:

Node-Slot_A01 <- this part is to add with right-click, add new chunk...
-----Label-SlotA01
-----Node-cfg#A01_...
--------Label-cfg#A01... <- this part is already there

In the UPC file you saw the crewmemberslot of the Flak's guy:



[UnitPart 1.Compartment 2.CrewMemberSlot 1]
ID=CrewMemberSlot_FlakL1
NameDisplayable= Port AA Gunner
Type= Crewman
WatchIndex= 0
IDLinkCrewMember= Crew-Jr-NCO-Rank-1-Guns
WatchCrewMemberSlot3D= WM1@slot_A01 <- this is for Slot A01 (later A02 and S01)
BattleStationsCrewMemberSlot3D= WM1@slot_A01
WatchAccessoriesForAdding3DObjects= NULL
WatchAccessoriesForSubtracting3DObjects= NULL
BattleAccessoriesForAdding3DObjects= NULL
BattleAccessoriesForSubtracting3DObjects= NULL

[Doc_uk]

Very nice work, cant wait for you to finnish it:up:
regards
Doc

[cgjimeneza]

Bitchin! Proud to add to the problem. Damn It, about the deck guns that is. My first snivel for a mod on the PT will be a 40mm Bofars both fore and aft. A 3 x 16 turret fore and aft I believe will really mess with about everything on the boat. Gobs of good work so far. Currently I'm Trying to figure out how to tell my significant other why we need to spend 1K USDs for an RC PT boat. It's only 3 feet, Ok maybe 4 feet long honey. CL

well you could try this:

1-you can point that the price is well below 1930s contract specs and its a steal at just $1000.

2-you can hope she wont notice is there...my wife didnt notice when the PC 17" CRT turnined overnight into a 19" LCD for two whole months and when she did she was already used to it... and I told her we have had that for over 8 months

3-you can say is an auxiliary for volunteer help with the flood in the US....

4-and the best one: you could point you could also spend that on a strip club while going to Vegas with your buddies.... then they will allways ok the boat, video card etc...

:|\\

[Digital_Trucker]

Currently I'm Trying to figure out how to tell my significant other why we need to spend 1K USDs for an RC PT boat. It's only 3 feet, Ok maybe 4 feet long honey.
I had the same problem when I was into RC planes, but my problem was trying to convince my better half that I needed to rebuild one that I'd flown into the ground a little harder than intended or found a tree with:rotfl:

I heard about invisible gun crew?
.... <execellent explanation snipped to save room>

Thanks for the tip, Mr X. Yours and Mikhayl's creations have been excellent examples of how to set things up. My problem was not having a good grasp of how many file interactions there are that you don't see at first (like the relationship of the upc and the upgrades files). I think it's finally starting to come together in my head (lots of room in there, 'cause it's empty:rotfl:).


What we have now is basically a toy with 2 AA positions, 2 overly large deck guns, 3 1500 hp motors that sound "mahvelous", 4 torpedo tubes (with TBT) and a partridge & a pear tree. She's a lot of fun to play with, but has a long way to go before we'll consider her "complete".

To do list:
Complete damage modelling and equipment setup.
Complete sensor setup.
Possible total remodelling from the deck up
Modelling of the below decks areas
Texturing
Weapons selection/cloning and upgrade evolution
Complete setup of fuel economy and range
Rework of wakes
Try to solve the launch position of torpedos
Add a third prop shaft and rudder to go with the third prop.
Adjust firing angles on all guns.
If possible, add controllable smoke generators for cover.
Rework of "on board" sounds (she's not a submarine, she doesn't need sub sounds)Problems:
Deck and AA guns will not fire on seperate targets (game limitation, I don't think there is a solution other than you manning the aft deck gun or either of the AA guns and firing on a different target)
AA guns will only fire on aircraft (not sure if it is possible to modify the guns to fire on either aircraft or surface vessels, I know the AI guns will do that, so I'm going to look into that one)
Anything else that I've forgotten to mention.Pics to follow in next post:D Will probably release a beta to play around with shortly.

[Digital_Trucker]

Nice big boom!

http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/2867/20080629113742xg6.jpg

Those 40 knot torpedo runs ARE fun!

http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/3376/20080629112545cx3.jpg

Target practice for the AA crew


http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/2686/20080629112046ia9.jpg


Those guys sure are slow, guess we'll have to come around yet again


http://img362.imageshack.us/img362/9687/20080629111910nu5.jpg

Whew! That was close!


http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/1595/20080629111718uz7.jpg

Brought some of our AI pals with us, but they aren't much help (no torpedos).


http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/6042/20080629111610am6.jpg


Not HIM again:arrgh!:


http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/2392/20080629111402zn8.jpg

Another close one!


http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/2750/20080629111326ak6.jpg


Wake up guys and get him:roll:


http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/5448/20080629111249ze5.jpg

They're baaaaaaaaack!

http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/7669/20080629111008ny4.jpg

[cgjimeneza]

two virtual cases of scoth on the way, trade them for some construction crews... those SeaBees will be glad to help.:yep:

[gimpy117]

are those big honkin' guns historic?

[Mickle]

I was wondering that, they look huge!

[Digital_Trucker]

No those big honking guns are not historic. As I said earlier, this boat is far from "complete" (ahould have added accurate, too:D). We had to start somewhere and the only deck cannons that were available (at the time) were the 3 that the sub uses.

Along those lines, we've gotten the twin 40mm bofors converted from an AA gun to a deck gun, but it's being a little squirelly (no crew where the other deck guns had crew and CTDs when the bow gun starts firing), sooooo, more work to be done there.

[ReallyDedPoet]

Take your time DT, look forward to trying this when it is done :yep::up:


RDP

[Digital_Trucker]

Thanks, RDP, we'll make sure you're one of the first testers:up:

Hey, y'all, do these guns look a little more realistic? (trick question:D)

http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/9803/20080630163639fu5.jpg


http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/1632/20080630163737oh5.jpg

Still have to adjust the firing angles, tweak the firing rates and positioning and see if we can add a third deck gun.........

[sqk7744]

Nice work DT

She's a tough ol' gal

lmk and I'll work on the ROF. Last night's fire test was a bit aggressive :arrgh!:

* Hmm should we make the third DG a twin .50 cal?

[Digital_Trucker]

Yep, that "machine gun" ROF on the 4-50 was a bit much.

I don't know about the twin .50 (it's not in the sub parts secion), but I'll try one of these

http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/7521/20080630184146ft2.jpg

http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/3221/20080630184104xa1.jpg

[sqk7744]

Nice DT!

You are the master of the nodes!


Ay, the 4_50's from last night shedded everything in site, made a real junkyard of the ocean floor. ;)

[gimpy117]

nice 50's but i'd rather have the dual 40mm!

did they have the 50's in the front? or were larger guns there normally?

[Digital_Trucker]

Nice DT!

You are the master of the nodes!


Ay, the 4_50's from last night shedded everything in site, made a real junkyard of the ocean floor. ;)

Master of the nodes, not quite, master of the CTD maybe :rotfl:

The twin bofors (I wish there were some quads) were driving me nuts. Evidently the stock game twins had some problems with one of the particle generators. After ruling out ID duplications (what a pain in the arse, but still much easier with skwas' S3D than searching with a hex editor:yep:), the only things I had left to blame for the CTDs when they started firing was animations and particle generators, sooo, I took out some of the lesser particle generators and no more CTDs. May go back at some time in the future and add them back in one at a time to see where the problem lies.

nice 50's but i'd rather have the dual 40mm!

did they have the 50's in the front? or were larger guns there normally?

I doubt if they ever had a .50 mounted on the bow like that, I was just playing around with all the possibilities of gun mountings and making sure that the .50s would function as a deck gun rather than AA. Doubt if there's enough room on the current deck to add a third DGun, anyway.

[gimpy117]

Actually I wouldn't mind a couple 150 round 50's on the side:arrgh!:

or give one for me to shoot while I'm sitting on the bridge....lol one hand on the gun the other on the wheel...I guess I'll use telegraph with my foot

helm! commence zig-zags!!

[Charlielima]

Actually I wouldn't mind a couple 150 round 50's on the side:arrgh!:

or give one for me to shoot while I'm sitting on the bridge....lol one hand on the gun the other on the wheel...I guess I'll use telegraph with my foot

helm! commence zig-zags!!

I believe the nearest twin 50 behind the bridge would be a cool default for the Skippers' gun. That 40mm on the bow is nice.
Guns, Papa Tangos, This is turning my screws: http://www.ptboatworld.com/photos2.htm
:rock: CL

[cgjimeneza]

nice 50's but i'd rather have the dual 40mm!

did they have the 50's in the front? or were larger guns there normally?

hey, those boats were made of plywood!!!

a dual 40 mike mike would rip your deck in real life, but I agree it would be nice, too much weight and not that many rounds probably.:|\\

[Charlielima]

My perception is that the most or heavy the Papa Tangos went / had was a single 40 mike mike both for and aft. Check out: http://www.ptboatworld.com/photos2.htm. CL

[Digital_Trucker]

Yep, the singles are probably what will end up on the boat, but we also wanted to test the functionality of the other possibilities. It never hurts to have options (even if the rivet count doesn't quite add up:lol:)

[Charlielima]

A 40 bofars on both for and aft was used on some elco and higgins boats. For those that want more cannon type guns the oldsmobile 37 mm had a habit of being acquired and utilized as a field mod by PT boat crews who desired more punch just as we do. Too bad the elco boat has a cabin taking up the deck space between the bridge and the rear gun. The higgins boat was open there. The higgins PTGB had 4 twin 50s mounted amidships .That would be a natural location for 4 of the oldsmobile guns. or 20mm if that area is to tender for 37s. Since the use of the 37mm was a field mod the rivet counters would need some official documentation of where 37mm guns would not be mounted sensibly. If you need pics, PM me and I'll flip you some. CL

[gimpy117]

I think the Pt boat would be wonderful in the costal areas, like the islands off australia...could we make it only assigned to those waters

[Digital_Trucker]

Once we get to the campaign building part, we'll have to do some heavy research as to where would be good places to operate. My guess, also, is that coastal waters are going to be the best place to operate.

Personally, I'd like to be as realistic as possible, but still make it fun and interesting, so.........

[ReallyDedPoet]

Thanks, RDP, we'll make sure you're one of the first testers:up:


Nice, thanks :oops::D


RDP

[AVGWarhawk]

Need to set up a go rescue McArthur from Corrigedor in a PT Boat patrol :up:

[sqk7744]

Need to set up a go rescue McArthur from Corrigedor in a PT Boat patrol :up:
Yes sir!

PT41 MTB RON3 ala 'They were expendable' (the movie) ~Fire in the paint locker ;)

http://www.compuglobalhypermeganet.tv/images/sh4/Mtbs3.GIF

http://home.st.net.au/%7Edunn/ppines.jpg

http://home.st.net.au/~dunn/ptboat.htm (http://home.st.net.au/%7Edunn/ptboat.htm)


At dusk on 11 March 1942 General MacArthur on PT 41, and Admiral Rockwell on PT 34, were lead through US minefield and the Japanese defences by PT 41 bound for Mindanao. These PT boats were armed with four .50 calibre machineguns and four torpedo tubes. They finally cleared the minefield by 9.15pm.

By 3:30 a.m. on 12 March 1942, John Bulkeley's four PT boats are separated by heavy seas. PT 32, was having trouble keeping up with the other three boats. It saw an enemy destroyer, and jettisoned some of its gasoline to escape. This meant it would not now reach Mindanao.

The four war weary PT boats stagger into the Cuyo Island hideout. PT 32 was. It was low on gasoline and it engines were unserviceable. Another boat, PT 35 was also unserviceable with fouled gasoline strainers.

The passengers were divided between two PT boats, PT 32 and 41.

By the time they reached Cuyo Island MacArthur and his son were both soaked and very seasick. Jean MacArthur put on a brave face.

The escape plan was behind schedule. They were originally meant to move on from Cuyo Island in the dark. MacArthur ordered Bulkeley to depart Cuyo Island at 2:30 p.m.. They risked a possible daylight encounter with the Japanese Navy.

The PT boats were in the open sea by 3:30pm. Within 15 minutes they spotted the Japanese heavy cruiser Ashigara. It carried eight-inch guns and Long Lance torpedoes and could travel at 35 knots. By then, PT 41 was only capable of 18 knots.

They took evasive action and were never seen by the Japanese. As they approached Negros Island that evening, Japanese artillerymen hear the PT boats engine noises, and thought they could hear American aircraft. They fire their artillery and light up the sky with flak tracer shells. The PT boats have another lucky escape.

By now General MacArthur is extremely sea sick in the lower cockpit of PT 41. His wife Jean comforts him by rubbing his hands.

At 6:30 am on 13 March 1942, PT 34 sights Cagayan Point on Mindanao Island. They had spent 35 hours travelling through 560 miles of Japanese waters. John D. Bulkeley, who had commanded his boat continuously for those 35 hours, arrived at Del Monte precisely on time.

General Douglas MacArthur stood on the prow of his PT boat shaking the salt water from his braided cap. He flipped it back on at a jaunty angle, and helped his wife ashore. MacArthur was most appreciative of the crews of the PT boats and he told their commander:-

"Bulkeley, I'm giving every officer and man here the Silver Star for gallantry. You've taken me out of the jaws of death, and I won't forget it."

He then apparently proceeded to ask Col. William Morse where he could relieve himself!

A book and a movie called "They Were Expendable" was made about their amazing escape. Bulkeley became quite famous after this. After commanding some PT boats in the Mediterranean, he eventually rose to the rank of Admiral. He died in 1996 and was buried at Arlington with full military honors.

On 15 March 1942, while they waited for the B-17's to rescue them, MacArthur's aide, Sid Huff, takes Jean MacArthur's mattress off PT 41. This event lead to a wild story that the mattress was supposedly full of gold bars. It was only full of feathers.

After the General MacArthur's staff were transferred from PT-32, Lt. (jg) V.E. Schumacher and his crew were picked up by the submarine USS Permit, which took them to Fremantle. They intentionally destroyed PT-32 during the rendezvous, to prevent the Japanese from capturing it. With the crew of PT-32 on board, USS Permit was severely overloaded with passengers. The Permit's mission had been to evacuate from Corregidor a group of code breakers who were capable of translating intercepted Japanese military communications. These code breakers apparently knew beforehand, the position of the Japanese destroyers that depth-charged the Permit a few days later, but did not tell the captain of USS Permit for fear that his taking another route to avoid them would reveal that the US had broken the Japanese code.

[AVGWarhawk]

Yes sir! This could be a very cool mission to make when you PT is ready for patrol.

[Scharnhorst1943]

Mission? How about a PT campaign!!! I am excited about that!

[Doc_uk]

The wait is killing me, :lol: :up:
Doc:rock:

[Digital_Trucker]

Hopefully we'll have something for y'all to play with soon (I know I keep saying that). Sqk's working on some ROF adjustments and then the real "fun" begins.

[Charlielima]

Well don't rush it like some, ah, well ah, submarine sim makers do. CL

[Digital_Trucker]

Well don't rush it like some, ah, well ah, submarine sim makers do. CL
Actually, it wasn't the makers of the sim that rushed, it was their bosses, the money-hungry megaconglomerate corporate evil thing:rotfl: That's how they make the money to pay the developers to make the next game that the corporate evil thing makes them rush on to make more money:hmm:

[Charlielima]

I stand corrected then. How about don't do the megaconglomerate corporate evil thing. Its ok do be money hungry tho. CL

[sqk7744]

Hopefully we'll have something for y'all to play with soon (I know I keep saying that). Sqk's working on some ROF adjustments and then the real "fun" begins.

You got it DT, I owe you the ROFs forthwith. :oops:
-sqk

[Digital_Trucker]

Other than the obvious lack of texture and all the alignment problems, could anyone tell me what I'm doing wrong to have this kind of effect?

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b173/digital_trucker/Screenshots/20080709-194511.jpg

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b173/digital_trucker/Screenshots/20080709-194530.jpg

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b173/digital_trucker/Screenshots/20080709-194545.jpg

No matter what angle or distance that I view this piece of added 3D from I get the same "cut-out" look. The original piece was constructed from 2 cylinders and an extrusion that I connected in 3ds max 8. I'm stumped as to what is causing it. With a previous attempt at it that I had textured, the same thing happened. If anyone can tell me what I'm doing wrong (besides the long list that's already known:rotfl:), I'd be eternally (or at least until I forget) grateful.

[Digital_Trucker]

Many thanks, Mikhayl:up:I'll give that a shot as soon as I clear the cobwebs from my eyes:yep:

Edit : That worked a charm, Mikhayl. Somehow, only the faces on the base column got flipped. Guess I learned something new today, so I can stop thinking for the rest of the day:rotfl:

[Xantrokoles]

Did PT boats had Depth charges for Ijn subs?

I know of the gme Battlestations Midway where you have DCs:hmm:

[Digital_Trucker]

Yes, sir, some of them sure did.

[Xantrokoles]

:up:

We need the SDK for this things.

Okay I made a torpedo overwriting barrel which falls in the water and makes a splash, but it is bad when you know you are just making a fake boom.
It has to be a real BOOOOM.

Also we could let the flaks shoot at ships and planes. :-)

[Digital_Trucker]

That "splashing torpedo" would be wonderful for this boat. It's one of the things on my to do list (way down there somewhere). And AAs shooting at boats would be wonderful, too. I thought that there was a problem with guns firing in two different directions when that was done?

Edit : On a different note, I ran across another oddity when texturing those AA "turrets" that I showed screenies of earlier. I did the texturing the "cheap way" (exporting the model as a -uv2) and accomplished getting the second (rear) turret textured. Then used the exact same 3d model and material for the front one and it still shows as solid black. If anyone has any ideas what's up with that, scream.

[skwasjer]

DT, if you check/uncheck (depending on your current settings) 'Reverse face winding' in S3D during import it's the same as flipping in Max.

[Xantrokoles]

Yeah, You can only aim one target. But is this a problem on a PT boat?:rotfl:
I though they had only two small AAs and 4 torps:hmm:

But for gameplay you have to make a commerce raider out of it:yep:

When I worked on DDs I had the idea making the torpedo turrets turning as an door animation. I recommend this.
You could use a torp 3d model as an external door. It goes like you want it to go.
It is a lot of frame setting but after this it is great:smug:

[Xantrokoles]

DT, if you check/uncheck (depending on your current settings) 'Reverse face winding' in S3D during import it's the same as flipping in Max.
I mustn't be too lazy to read tutorials:damn:

[Digital_Trucker]

DT, if you check/uncheck (depending on your current settings) 'Reverse face winding' in S3D during import it's the same as flipping in Max. I mustn't be too lazy to read tutorials:damn:
me either, Mr X. Thanks, skwas. That'll save me some effort:up: Hopefully, someday, I'll truly learn how to operate 3ds max.

[Digital_Trucker]

Yeah, You can only aim one target. But is this a problem on a PT boat?:rotfl:
Nope, not a problem at all. I just thought that I read that when the guns were set to be both AA and deck guns, and they were placed on opposite sides of the ship, that they would fire in both directions (possibly hitting a friendly on one side or the other). I'd be interested in knowing how that's done though (making them perform both functions)

I though they had only two small AAs and 4 torps:hmm:
Nope, some of the ones that we've looked at had several AAs, 4 torpedos and fore and aft deck guns as large as single 40mm bofors. Right now, our working model has 2 twin 20mm AA and 2 40mm single bofors.

[peabody]

Yeah, You can only aim one target. But is this a problem on a PT boat?:rotfl:
Nope, not a problem at all. I just thought that I read that when the guns were set to be both AA and deck guns, and they were placed on opposite sides of the ship, that they would fire in both directions (possibly hitting a friendly on one side or the other). I'd be interested in knowing how that's done though (making them perform both functions)

I though they had only two small AAs and 4 torps:hmm:
Nope, some of the ones that we've looked at had several AAs, 4 torpedos and fore and aft deck guns as large as single 40mm bofors. Right now, our working model has 2 twin 20mm AA and 2 40mm single bofors.
Dt,
It may be something I did wrong, I am very new at this but it happened to me (fireing both ways). To make an AA fire at ships, set the sim to obj cannon instead of obj turret and change AA to cannon instead of AA and give it ammo to fire at both.
EDIT: Just to clarify, if the gun is able to shoot at a ship it will. The ones on my Sen Toku were on a platform and could shoot both ways, so they would both shoot at the ship. But the ones I tried on the Maya obviously couldn't aim at a target on the other side of the ship so they just fired into the sea. It was early in the conversion so something may have been set wrong, and I changed the guns shortly after so I don't have enough tests to say it happens all the time.

Peabody

[Digital_Trucker]

Thanks Peabody. That's what I did to convert the deck mounted Bofors AA guns into deck guns. I hadn't noticed them shooting at any planes (on their own, anyway). I thought that's what Xantrokoles was saying (that they would fire, on their own, at either planes or ships).

[peabody]

Thanks Peabody. That's what I did to convert the deck mounted Bofors AA guns into deck guns. I hadn't noticed them shooting at any planes (on their own, anyway). I thought that's what Xantrokoles was saying (that they would fire, on their own, at either planes or ships).
Mine did ,as long as I was set to "fire at will" it would fire at ships or planes. Maybe only at 'Battlestations' ??? I'll have to check that out again. Otherwise the gun wouldn't be manned unless you got the pop-up asking 'engage, periscope depth, or Shut up, I'm running this ship"

Oh, as I am sure you noticed It should be wpn_cannon not obj_cannon.

Peabody

[Digital_Trucker]

Thanks for the info, Peabody. It may be because of the fact that mine are deck mounted (mounted on M nodes), but even when firing at will, they only shoot at ships. I'll double check the ammo (which I didn't change from their original setup as AA guns) and the firing angles. It's not really a big deal as the two twin 20s do a pretty good job against aircraft.

[peabody]

Thanks for the info, Peabody. It may be because of the fact that mine are deck mounted (mounted on M nodes), but even when firing at will, they only shoot at ships. I'll double check the ammo (which I didn't change from their original setup as AA guns) and the firing angles. It's not really a big deal as the two twin 20s do a pretty good job against aircraft.

That's weird, I would think if the didn't work for both they would shoot at planes, being AA guns. Maybe because they are on M nodes? (A little bit of info to tuck away for testing.)

Peabody

[Captain Vlad]

Guys, when it comes to missions, don't overlook the Atlantic and Med. There were lots of PT actions 'round Sicily, Italy, the south coast of France during Operation Dragoon, etc.

[Digital_Trucker]

Guys, when it comes to missions, don't overlook the Atlantic and Med. There were lots of PT actions 'round Sicily, Italy, the south coast of France during Operation Dragoon, etc.
Thanks, CV.:up: We haven't gotten anywhere close to the "real missions" stage yet, but every little piece of info we can gather now helps for the future. Eventually, we'd like to have a full blown campaign that would encompass as much of the known PT activity as possible.

[Charlielima]

Some links for guns on PT Boats.

Single 40mm, fore and aft on a model of PT-59, posted by AKDAVIS: This model really turns my screws:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=136592&highlight=boats

General guns and torp stuff:
http://www.ptboats.org/20-01-05-ptboat-009.html

Twin 50's on the bow and the 4x20mm thunderbolt system:
http://www.ptboatworld.com/photos.htm
http://www.ptboatworld.com/PT174.htm

Enjoy, CL

[Digital_Trucker]

Thanks for the links, CL.

I think we've reached the point where we feel comfortable letting this one out for a little testing (and hopefully for some mission planning gurus to get some ideas for:)). We're calling this an alpha version because it really is nowhere near ready, but it's playable. Before any rivet-counters start trying to count, there aren't any rivets in a wooden boat:rotfl:Just kidding:D. Seriously, we know it's not historically accurate as it is, but we're doing the best we can with what we have to work with.

Some things to keep in mind while playing.

Don't zoom the bofors on an airplane, it'll CTD (maybe). Probably going to remove the zoom function on those guns anyway.
The steering seems to have a bit of lag in it and at high speed this can become a problem. Try to think ahead a bit when travelling at 40 knots.
Speaking of which, the knotmeter hasn't been adjusted yet, it's on the to-do list.
The turrets that the AA guns are in are there to cut down on the "Philadelphia Experiment" effect that was present when the guns were on the deck. For some reason, the AI gunners and weapons are smaller than the weapons and crewmen from the submarines. Because of this, the gunmen were "passing through" parts of the boat and the torpedos when they were on the deck. In the future, we're considering scaling the boat up a little or remodelling the decks so that they have room to work.
There is no damage model, per se. That will have to be worked out as we progress, as will the systems of the boat.
Whatever you do, do not leave this mod enabled while attempting to play the game in career mode or a single mission that isn't for the PT. It'll probably ruin a good day:arrgh!:
There are 3 single missions included with the Alpha. The test mission is just a bunch of aircraft and fishing boats and sampans to act as target practice along with an AI PT boat for company. The "lotta fun" mission throws you into some action against aircraft and ships. The 12/7 mission is a surprise from sqk. If you want to stir things up a bit, fire a round or 2 at a friendly and see what happens.

You can download the alpha at http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=612

Enjoy:arrgh!:Any and all constructive criticism is welcomed (as are any ideas for improvements or missions).

[ReallyDedPoet]

Nice work lads :yep::up:


RDP

[ekempey]

Great job with the mod so far! I have been waiting for a mod like this for a long time! After trying the alpha, here are my observations.

-when battle stations is not manned, there is no crew on deck, it looks like there is no one piloting the ship.
-for some reason, the AI collision alarm keeps going off on the boat, even when I am alone in the sea.
-The deck gun zoom does indeed cause a ctd, lol, I had to try it out myself.
-the gun turrets don't match the textures of the rest of the boat. I don't know if this is just the state of the mod, or if my machine is bugged.
-The fore deck gun only has one man manning it, when on the 3d model there are two seats.

No criticism is meant by this, and thank you for working on this mod!

[Digital_Trucker]

Thanks for the feedback, ekempey:up: No offense taken by the constructive comments.

My addled brain forgot to mention the state of the turret textures. They surely do need work and so do I in the 3D department. Nothing wrong with your rig, they're wonkey on mine, too:rotfl:The only thing from your list that I hadn't even thought about was the collision alarm. I'll add it to the list of things to do.

I also forgot to mention that the TBT does actually work for targeting torpedos (I don't believe there was such a thing on PT Boats, but we'll work on that later). Eventually, it will probably be removed in favor of a "point and shoot" torpedo launch method that will be more in line with the reality of the time. Still have to do some research on what methods were employed in torpedo launching from the boat.

[sqk7744]

Nice work DT :up::up::up:

What do you think of the ROF for the dual 40mm Bofors?

[Digital_Trucker]

The ROF on the dual? As Chevy Chase said in "Modern Problems"

"IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII LIKE it!"

[Hylander_1314]

Guys, when it comes to missions, don't overlook the Atlantic and Med. There were lots of PT actions 'round Sicily, Italy, the south coast of France during Operation Dragoon, etc.

But a Higgins 78ft boat would be more accurate in those theaters, as they were used more than the Elco boats in those waters.

[sqk7744]

Roger that :up:

The ROF on the dual? As Chevy Chase said in "Modern Problems"

"IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII LIKE it!"

[Charlielima]

Just loaded the beta and took the boat out for a spin. The boat speed and 40 mike mike was quite delightfull. The Elco boat just as a PTGB is quite lethal. I can't wait until you get the gun imagery fine tuned and the who shoots at what and when thing done. CL

[woofiedog]

What else can you say... This is One Hec of a Blast! LoL :lol:

Fantastic work on this project... about the only thing I would ask for... is a bigger bow splash.

Can't say it enough for this addon... Thank's

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v438/woofiedog/ScreenShot193-1.jpg

[WalterJConklin]

Hey guys,

Did this PT-109 boat carry depth charges? If that is the case, I was wondering if you had any success with creating operatable depth charges. Walter

[keltos01]

are there AI submarines that dive and move underwater then ?

superb ship btw, PT 109 was one of my favorite books back in the days ;)

[sqk7744]

DT, take a bow sir! :up::up::up::up::up::up:

[spike12]

Hmmm...the port&starbord AAgun tubs seem a mite...big:nope:.But other than that ,looks o.k:up::rock:

[Digital_Trucker]

Just loaded the beta and took the boat out for a spin. The boat speed and 40 mike mike was quite delightfull. The Elco boat just as a PTGB is quite lethal. I can't wait until you get the gun imagery fine tuned and the who shoots at what and when thing done. CL

The who shoots at what will probably end up being the way it is now. AA at planes and DG at ships. As fragile as this boat is going to end up being when the damage modeling gets done, I don't think we want to take a chance on any of the gunners getting stuck on shooting at the wrong kind of target.

What else can you say... This is One Hec of a Blast! LoL

Fantastic work on this project... about the only thing I would ask for... is a bigger bow splash.

Can't say it enough for this addon... Thank's



Yep, the bow splash definitely needs work. Gonna have to figure out the particle generators to get that one closer to reality.

Hey guys,

Did this PT-109 boat carry depth charges? If that is the case, I was wondering if you had any success with creating operatable depth charges. Walter

Haven't even given it a shot yet. I think the only use for them would be for a multiplayer scenario in which PTs were trying to protect a ship from submarines and I don't think that was one of their roles (although I could be dead wrong about that)

are there AI submarines that dive and move underwater then ?

superb ship btw, PT 109 was one of my favorite books back in the days

I don't know if the AI subs do any diving or if they could be set to operate at a particular depth. If the AI subs act anything like the AI ships do sometimes, it would probably dive to about 1000 feet and never be seen again:arrgh!:

DT, take a bow sir!

<takes bow, promptly falls flat on face and sheepishly climbs back into chair>:oops:


Hmmm...the port&starbord AAgun tubs seem a mite...big .But other than that ,looks o.k
And there is where we're kinda stuck as far as proceeding:damn: . We kinda have to make a choice and, personally, I'm not sure which is the best way to go. As far as I can tell, the boat itself is scaled correctly. It appears that the crewmen are scaled a little bit "larger than life" and they certainly take up a lot of space when manning the AA guns. Notice how close they are to the sides of the tubs when they are rotating to get into firing position. Then take a look at where the sides of the tubs are. Without the tubs, the crewmen look a lot like they're in the "Philadelphia Experiment" (their bodies pass through parts of the boat as they swing around).

There's 4 (that I know of) solutions to the problem (in order of perceived difficulty):
Put them in elevated tubs, like we've done and try to overlook the size.
Scale the boat up a little so that the crewmen have room to move around and hope that you don't notice how big the boat is compared to other vessels.
Modify the deck structure so that the men don't run into anything.
Scale the weapons (and possibly the crewmen) down a little bit so that they don't run into things.The third choice is probably where we're headed because I just don't like the deck structure much anyway. That's gonna take a bit of thought and 3D work to get everything right.

Anyway, it's all still being pondered and we're glad the current version is getting some time in the ocean.

[WalterJConklin]

I read somewhere, after I made my first post, that the Pts did have depth charges. Xantroles, forget how to spell his name, was working on creating a set of opertable depth charges. He said he doesn't have experience with modeling the particles effect of the explosion though.

[Digital_Trucker]

I remember Mr X (easier to spell that way:lol:) trying to get those sorted out. I thought that part of the problem was that they were modified torpedos and were duds, but I haven't kept up with it. Guess, I need to do some more reading:yep:

[woofiedog]

A few shots of the PT 617... I took back in 2005 at Battleship Cove, Fall River, Massachusetts.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v438/woofiedog/9-26-05123.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v438/woofiedog/9-26-05117.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v438/woofiedog/9-26-05126.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v438/woofiedog/9-26-05116.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v438/woofiedog/9-26-05129.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v438/woofiedog/9-26-05124.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v438/woofiedog/9-26-05120.jpg

[Digital_Trucker]

Thanks for sharing those, woofie:up: That gives me an idea that may solve part of the "huge tubs" problem. If I made the tubs similar to the ones in the pix (well, technically, they wouldn't be tubs any more), e.g. made tubular railing instead of straight sides, perhaps they wouldn't be so humongous looking. Will have to get back to the 3D programs and give that a try. Muchos gracias, mein freund:sunny:

[woofiedog]

Glad the photos will help you out with this project... Thank's

Again... Thank's for the hard work making this boat seaworthy! :up:

http://realwarphotos.com/yahoo_site_admin/assets/images/N26312A.83160006_std.jpg

http://www.bluejacket.com/usn/images/sp/oth/w2_new_guinea_mtb.jpg

[sqk7744]

Woofiedog your pics are awesome!


I want one :arrgh!::arrgh!::arrgh!:

[sqk7744]

Night Mission Test against a TF
http://battleflags.net/images/pt/SH4Img@2008-07-07_17.35.58_812.jpg
http://battleflags.net/images/pt/SH4Img@2008-07-07_17.49.28_921.jpg
http://battleflags.net/images/pt/SH4Img@2008-07-07_17.56.jpg
http://battleflags.net/images/pt/SH4Img@2008-07-07_18.25.13_828.jpg




http://battleflags.net/images/pt/SH4Img@2008-07-07_18.05.jpg

http://battleflags.net/images/pt/SH4Img@2008-07-07_18.20.11_984.jpg

http://battleflags.net/images/pt/SH4Img@2008-07-07_17.57.jpg

http://battleflags.net/images/pt/SH4Img@2008-07-07_18.19.44_718.jpg

[woofiedog]

sqf7744... Thank's.

But have to say those screen shots of your's are Wicked... night action at it's best! :up:

This addon is a Blast!

[Digital_Trucker]

That looks like my kinda fun, sqk:up:I'll see y'all next week:D

[Fish40]

Sorry if I missed something, but is this still a WIP, or has it been released?

[Digital_Trucker]

Sorry if I missed something, but is this still a WIP, or has it been released?
No problem:D It's still very much a WIP, but we released an alpha version for y'all to have to test (and basically play around with). There's a link to it in this post http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=901819&postcount=89

If you play a single mission with it, make sure it's one that starts on the surface, though:arrgh!:

[Fish40]

Thanks DT:up:

[sqk7744]

http://battleflags.net/images/pt/SH4Img@2008-07-07_12.08.01_359.jpg
http://battleflags.net/images/pt/SH4Img@2008-07-07_12.08.02_906.jpg
http://battleflags.net/images/pt/SH4Img@2008-07-07_12.08.03_859.jpg

[Charlielima]

The twin 50 tubs are to big not because the crewmembers are to big but that the guns you chose are not twin 50s and they pivot on a pedestal in the center of the tub not a vehicle style pintle ring where the gun / guns are mounted on the outside of a ring with the gunner in the center that I believe I see in that museum boat. No clue how to model this but it's been done on PBRs, armor, and trucks. Amazing this project has got this far. Incredible. You still like those 2 5inch guns for and aft huh? I am kinda partial to the result my self. Good Luck! CL

[Rockin Robbins]

That's kinda cool looking with the 5" guns. In reality they'd tear themselves right off the deck, but who's complaining. This is a vacation away from the submarine. Looks like it's time to load it up and have some fun. Which missions start on the surface?

You DO know that never in the history of the war did a PT boat go out and tear up a convoy? Still, I'm willing to dispense with reality and have some fun with what the PT boat should have been.

[Digital_Trucker]

RR, there's a single mission called "lotta fun" that tosses you into the middle of a convoy that comes with the mod. Tokyo Express also starts on the surface. There are some others, but I can't think of them off the top of my head.

[peabody]

Looks like it's time to load it up and have some fun. Which missions start on the surface?


I am sure you know this but if you don't or for those who don't. I needed a mission for the Kongo BB I built so I just took Battle off Samar and loaded it into Mission editor and set the subs depth to 0, save and away you go. Of course mine was real easy the sub was attacking the Japanese ships and my ship, being Japanese didn't even need to be moved. But I have done that with several missions when I just needed a quick mission to test with.
Now there's one that would be a good time, for about 3 seconds:rotfl:. Battle off Samar, let me see, Yamato, 4 or 5 Kongos, some Heavy Cruisers, Lots of DDs. How much ammo do you have?:arrgh!: Let me at em.

You guys are doing a great job on this. I wish I knew more about these things, I can make them playable and that's about it, but I'm still learning. Learn something new each time I do one.

Peabody

[sqk7744]

Thanks Peabody, DT is quite the Guru :arrgh!:

[fireship4]

I didnt't see whether you had implemented brownings, here is a link to some being worked on elsewhere if you want to get in contact:

http://forum.kickinbak.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=745

[Digital_Trucker]

Yep, played around with them some, but were really hoping to implement twin 50s (which the game doesn't have). We were going to use them as more of a surface attack weapon than AA, though. They may still get into the mix when we get to the point of completely remodeling the above decks part of the boat and can make room for some. Thanks for the link, though.:up: Interesting thread.

[peabody]

Guys, I'm afraid someone overtook you on the job :

:D;)

Maybe if you guys ask nice, they would let you use some of the graphics.:lol:

Peabody

[Digital_Trucker]

Guys, I'm afraid someone overtook you on the job :

:D;)
Maybe if you guys ask nice, they would let you use some of the graphics.:lol:

Peabody

Thanks for the info guys:up: I guess I'll have to dust of DOSBox and see if I can't get some ideas from the game:p

[Demon777]

I haven't tested this playable PT yet, but the screens are perfect! Amazing job gyus! :up: Is this 'mod' compatible with JMSGE? And is the PT available in career mode?

P.S. I hope some day there'll appear playable US destroyers, cruisers and battleships (like Iowa)


Regards,

D777

[Digital_Trucker]

Hey, Demon. Those answers would be yes and not yet. It definitely JSGME compatible (I can't imagine a mod other than an application that shouldn't be JSGME ready:up:). And nope, it's not available for use in a career yet. It can be used in any of the single missions (a couple come with it) that start on the surface. That's part of the reason that it's not available for career mode yet. New missions need to be written specifically for the boat (since it really didn't serve the same functions as a sub or have the same range) and the whole career put together.

We're hoping that these things come together soon, but we still have a lot of work to do on the model itself and the damage model and all sorts of things that we haven't encountered yet. Right now, it's more of an interesting toy until we get the rest of it put together.

Thanks for the interest and enjoy it when you get to play with it:up:

[Demon777]

Thanks Trucker!

Hope the rest of this job will be done with no bugs etc. Playable German pocket battleship is a good 'parrallel' example :up:

So I wish everyone who works at US/GB playable surface ships to finish their job successfully. If I could provide any assistance, feel free to contact me. Actually I'm not a modder, but I'd be glad to help. BTW, recently I found an amazing site of Naval warfare/industry

http://ship.bsu.by/

Unfortunately it seems to be completely in Russian, BUT if you'd like to get some info from there, I can help to translate the needed issues!

Brgds,
D777

[Digital_Trucker]

Thanks, Demon. We may have to take you up on that translation offer. I can barely read a little German, I don't stand a chance with Russian:D

[Buddahaid]

Looking at this and dowloaded it and call me stupid, but, what are you opening the dat file in the documentation with?

Buddahaid

[Digital_Trucker]

Silly me, I used the documentation folder as a place to save backups of files as I was changing them. I should have removed it from the folder before I zipped it all up. If you really want to look at it, get skwas' S3D, but there's no documentation in the file. It's just a game file. Sorry for the confusion.:oops:

[sqk7744]

Outstanding work DT! :know:

[woofiedog]

Any news on this great mod? :)

[Charlielima]

Ya whats the latest news? I am currently honning my MTB skippering skills on a Schnell Boote in SH3. Even if the Elco boat has 2 x 40 mike mike bofars guns, I will be very hesitant to get in a gunfight with the german boat. That single 37mm flak gun can really impair the intent and functionability of a laminated wood motor torpedo boat.
CL

[woofiedog]

Yes the S-Boat does have a advantage over the plywood Elco & Higgins boats... but sometimes it's the skipper at the helm that counts the most. LoL :lol:

http://www.warship.org/images/PT_Boats_and_tender.jpg

[Hylander_1314]

Actually there wasn't a whole lot of plywood. The outer hull had mahoganey planks that went up at a 45 degree angle, then a layer of waterproffing glue and fine aircraft linen, and on top of that another layer of mahoganey planking again placed at 45 degrees perpendicular to the inner layer.

This is a good video in 3 oarts about PT Boat construction, which shows they didn't have "planked" and caulked decks. A good film, and it's in color!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8tQP3s9DIQ

[Sailor Steve]

Great videos! They left a few things out though. At one point it mentions the British wanting the boats as well, when in fact the Royal Navy invented the Motor Torpedo Boat, and had their own in production at the time. When playing German in the Atlantic the MTBs met should mostly be the 73-foot Vosper. Also, the ELCO boats were based on a powerboat design by an Englishman, Hubert Scott-Payne.
http://www.steelnavy.com/GMSElco77.htm

I think there's some confusion on the hulls. Yes, the frame was mahogany planking, and the hulls were mahogany shaved into veneer, then glued together to make a heavy sheet, but isn't that what plywood is?

[Charlielima]

Yes the S-Boat does have a advantage over the plywood Elco & Higgins boats... but sometimes it's the skipper at the helm that counts the most. LoL :lol:

http://www.warship.org/images/PT_Boats_and_tender.jpg

Bitchin' pic Woofie.
A PT chasing me with the 40 mike mike on the bow, and the 2 twin 50 cals Barking would quite likely " End my patrol"
CL

[cgjimeneza]

just wondering if it will be done in time for xmas....

:)

Carlos

[Digital_Trucker]

just wondering if it will be done in time for xmas....

:)

Carlos
Which year?:D Sorry, we haven't gotten any further with it. It kinda slipped through the cracks in my head:doh: and sqk's been busy with work.

[cgjimeneza]

then how about we write it down for easter next year???
will make a note on my Palm calendar
:D


just wondering if it will be done in time for xmas....

:)

Carlos
Which year?:D Sorry, we haven't gotten any further with it. It kinda slipped through the cracks in my head:doh: and sqk's been busy with work.

[Digital_Trucker]

then how about we write it down for easter next year???
will make a note on my Palm calendar
:D


Okeydoke, I'll write it on my Palm calendar, too, if I can find room

http://addanimage.com/content/funny/redneck-toys/Picture10.jpg

[cgjimeneza]

point and game to the gentleman!


:D
then how about we write it down for easter next year???
will make a note on my Palm calendar
:D


Okeydoke, I'll write it on my Palm calendar, too, if I can find room

http://addanimage.com/content/funny/redneck-toys/Picture10.jpg

[Hylander_1314]

Great videos! They left a few things out though. At one point it mentions the British wanting the boats as well, when in fact the Royal Navy invented the Motor Torpedo Boat, and had their own in production at the time. When playing German in the Atlantic the MTBs met should mostly be the 73-foot Vosper. Also, the ELCO boats were based on a powerboat design by an Englishman, Hubert Scott-Payne.
http://www.steelnavy.com/GMSElco77.htm

I think there's some confusion on the hulls. Yes, the frame was mahogany planking, and the hulls were mahogany shaved into veneer, then glued together to make a heavy sheet, but isn't that what plywood is?

Actually the hull sides, bottom, and upper decking were a composite laminent of wood planks, not "sheet" running perpendicular, with a layer of aircraft linen sandwiched between them. The planks were cut from African and Honduran mahoganey. In this sense, it wasn't "plywood" in the idea some folks may have, as plywood makes one think of the wood sheets that can be bought at the local lumber yard or home center.

I like the old ELCO Boats, as the Chriscraft plant up the river from my great grandparents house built them, and there were a couple old hulks left from the war in the marshy area that you could get up on, but had to be careful on them, for any rotted wood you could fall through.

I wish they were still there, but the latest aerial photos shows that nature has reclaimed the area. What fun it would be to restore one of them, and finish out like the early PT-103 class, from late 42 to 43, before they were turned mostly into barge busters.

[sqk7744]

then how about we write it down for easter next year???
will make a note on my Palm calendar
:D


just wondering if it will be done in time for xmas....

:)

Carlos
Which year?:D Sorry, we haven't gotten any further with it. It kinda slipped through the cracks in my head:doh: and sqk's been busy with work.

Easter huh? hmm guess that's coming r'ound the corner :03:?

[clayton]

Wow... This caught my eye...

I'm really looking forward to this 'mod'. PT Boats have much greater potential in the Pacific, than E Boots in the Atlantic.

Great job!

[linerkiller]

PT Boats have much greater potential in the Pacific, than E Boots in the Atlantic.
:up:I'm not sure about this...Compare the S-Boot successes in the Med, Channel,Baltic and Black Sea with PT boats successes in the pacific...
http://www.wlb-stuttgart.de/seekrieg/km/sboot/serf-ost.htm:arrgh!:
Pt boats in the pacific were barge busters...yeah, they had hard times in the Guadalcanal area in '42/'43...but the pacific ocean was too large for these small boats, their main role there was to interrupt the micro-traffic of microscopic barges and boats around Japanese-held small archipelagoes...like during the new-guinea campaign...I don't even think that they sank something with torpedoes there:06:

[cgjimeneza]

Easter huh? hmm guess that's coming r'ound the corner :03:?


ok. Easter seems to be gone.... will be generous... how about Haloween????

:haha::har:

[Karle94]

I am having problem with the control of the ship. After some time cruising at high speed the boat starts to zick zack. Any help would be appreciated

[Bubblehead1980]

so does this work yet, well enough to play? Enable JSGME? where is the link with the latest version.

[keltos01]

so does this work yet, well enough to play? Enable JSGME? where is the link with the latest version.


http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=612

keltos

[Bubblehead1980]

Tried this out, had a lot of fun.No real bugs or anything, just needs some adjustments.

US torpedos instead of German, is a US boat afterall.

Need more than person on deckwatch when not a battle stations...deck is empty during normal run.Free cam so can roam the deck and interior more.Other than that, pretty cool so far, running around at 40+ knots is a blast, no surface ship can really touch you, moving too fast.

[Rockin Robbins]

That 40 knot speed, while mondo fun, is nowhere near realistic. In war, your average PT boat was hard-pressed to get 25 knots. Any destroyer on the surface of the ocean could run them down and kill them. Every capital ship was faster than our terribly wimpy and ineffective PT boats.

Yeah, I know about They Were Expendable, a wartime fluff-piece written to romanticize these plywood death traps. Read the scathing put-down of that work in The Mosquito Fleet.

A realistic PT boat would be little better than a good place to die. Good thing Digital Trucker decided to go with the mythological PT boat instead.

[keltos01]

Could we use it in our mod as an AI unit ?

regards

keltos

[nikimcbee]

I can't believe I haven't seen this thread necro bump for later reference.

[yubba]

I got it to run pretty good, got it to fire torps I gave Nikimcbee, and Privateer the files on it a year or 2 ago, I still have it to be uploaded if anybody is interested, but you will have to tell me how to send it , from how to compress it to sending it that is my weak side. I couldn't tell you what I did it was so long ago. Some one needs to figure how to get it to run in a campaign.

[yubba]

I got it to run pretty good, got it to fire torps I gave Nikimcbee, and Privateer the files on it a year or 2 ago, I still have it to be uploaded if anybody is interested, but you will have to tell me how to send it , from how to compress it to sending it that is my weak side. I couldn't tell you what I did it was so long ago. Some one needs to figure how to get it to run in a campaign.

[Bladekill1298]

can you make a USS Fletcher mod or Type 34 Destroyer from Silent Hunter 3 mod for SH4

[aanker]

I got it to run pretty good, got it to fire torps I gave Nikimcbee, and Privateer the files on it a year or 2 ago, I still have it to be uploaded if anybody is interested, but you will have to tell me how to send it , from how to compress it to sending it that is my weak side. I couldn't tell you what I did it was so long ago. Some one needs to figure how to get it to run in a campaign.
Yes, what this PT-109 needs in addition to some important fine tuning to related files, plus more cosmetic and time consuming work on the model, is 'historically accurate campaign layers' and new defined missions for a realistic PT boat campaign. Of course first this requires a lot of research, then it is easier to create realistic traffic layers. Both the Subsim PT Higgins and this Elco topic (that both use the PT 109 mod ???) have that in common; no realistic campaign layers or defined missions to perform in a campaign.

Once historic campaign traffic layers are created, the Skipper could then, 're-create some of the famous PT-boat engagements from WW2' or similar type patrols that is one of the objectives of the Subsim Higgins project.

Unfortunately both of these projects have come to a halt - other than a few 'off topic' remarks here and there in other forums...... oop's, sorry Riken19 - I'm quoting a couple here for later reference because it's useful knowledge Yubba and it looks like some want to see it moved:
QUOTE=aanker;2322961]Well that would be nice, to have a PT boat that can fire a torpedo, and have the guns working. How did you do it?)[ QUOTE]
it was quite a while back,, use the pt 109 found here ,, it was lacking torpedos in the equipment files just add them like I said it was a while back and I mostly forgot what I did but I have it up and running sadly I couldn't get it to run in a campaign the torps will fire as same as a sub I had no problems running at full speed and fireing and hitting the target,, your best way to edit this mod is to compare the files of the pt 109 to the files of the sub it is based on and fill in where the torpedos are missing you only get 4 and you will have to go to battlestations and time compress and they will load into the tubes


Ok for you hot rods out there,, the pt 109 that is here lacks a torpedo room ,, to add,, open the pt mod go to data/submarine/nss-pt-109/nss-pt-109 UPC file,,,scroll down through compartments you'll find that there isn't a forward torpedo room, I went to the porpoise UPC file and scrolled down till I found that torpedo room I copied it and pasted into the pt109 UPC file reads User player unit 1 compartment 6 id forward porpoise bow torpedo room ,, and renumber other compartments accordingly,, you'll start mission with tubes empty go to battlestations and hit auto load an then time compress tubes will load,,that's the best of my recollection as I went back to my pt yubba and compared the files of both ,,it's a start for you and if you all don't mind how about fixing this so it is in a campaign ,, have fun,, Even I knew Riken 19 didn't mean any harm he fixed those mods so all of us could enjoy them,, I thought sub simmers were better than this after all the petty crap I've seen over in the IL-2 community

for some odd satanist reason the author of the pt 109 mod chose to have two deck gun mounts,,using the single 40mm which would have been fine if the bow mount would have been closer to the cabin instead of way forward on the bow,, which doesn't look realistic in my opinion plus it makes me sea sick,, the only way to rid of this is to go to data libairy sub parts and delete the single 40mm giving you no deck gun at all but cleans the boat up nicely,, some how I managed to get the daul 40mm on the stern how I did that is a mystery.


Thanks again, this may be of interest:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ec/ELCO_and_Higgins_PT_boats%2C_Know_Your_PT_Boat_US_ Navy_July_1945.jpg

This is from: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ec/ELCO_and_Higgins_PT_boats%2C_Know_Your_PT_Boat_US_ Navy_July_1945.jpg
On this page:
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:ELCO_and_Higgins_PT_boats,_Know_Your_PT_Boat_ US_Navy_July_1945.jpg

From pp 38 of this doc:
"Know Your PT Boat," July 1945"
http://www.maritime.org/doc/pt/know/index.htm

NARWHAL & NAUTILUS (maybe ARGONAUT too) campaigns are keeping me occupied now because it looks like I'm doing the exact same type of thing with them.