Women? On nuclear subs?

[Onkel Neal]

I guess this was bound to happen.

US Navy Mans Two Nuclear Subs with Women (http://www.subsim.com/new_york_times_sub_article.htm)

[nikimcbee]

A distracted crew is a dead crew, it's just a matter of time. From all of the Navy stories I've heard of mixed crew ships, they were constantly sending pregnant women home, who got pregnant onboard. I'm glad everybody is focused.:roll:

[Wreford-Brown]

Mixed crews have been used in the Royal Navy for a fairly long time. There have been a few instances such as the one nikimcbee describes, but that's because 'another pregnant sailor' gets more headlines than 'females on board ships are actually quite good at the job'.
If they are as good as their male counterparts, and discounting the few bad headline grabbers, why shouldn't females be allowed on board ship?

[nikimcbee]

Mixed crews have been used in the Royal Navy for a fairly long time. There have been a few instances such as the one nikimcbee describes, but that's because 'another pregnant sailor' gets more headlines than 'females on board ships are actually quite good at the job'.
If they are as good as their male counterparts, and discounting the few bad headline grabbers, why shouldn't females be allowed on board ship?

It just seems like it would be a major distraction. I see the whole thing as a political agenda that's being forced down our throats( no pun intended.:rotfl: :roll: )

[Wreford-Brown]

I'm a ground pounder and in a trade where no females are allowed. We still get the odd female clerk or mechanic who volunteer to go with us so they can search other females, but they are few and far between. They share the same risks we do and get injured and killed the same way we do, plus they are all volunteers - no politician can force them to leave the camp gates.

You can't afford distractions and they've proven themselves time and again.
I'm definitely pro-female - some of them have got more guts than some of the guys I've worked with.

[Sailor Steve]

I hate you. I also deleted my all-too serious reply, which I never do.

Color me :oops:

:rotfl:

[CptGrayWolf]

Hey Sailor Steve what happened!? I was just going to answer your old men, young men war theory! :p
Women on subs... is it really a distraction? I'd like to think we are more sophisticated then that. Then again, it is young men and young women... :hmm:

[Wreford-Brown]

They are great eye-candy, the problem comes when they get too familiar.
We had one sent home for being too free with her affections - the comment was: 'I'm all for morale, but eventually she'll destroy the morale of this unit'.

I'm not going back on my previous comments - she was one bad apple among a number of great female soldiers.

[Vacillator]

Quoting from the linked article:

"the Navy plans to get women into submarines and avoid mixing with seamen by making two US Virginia class subs consist of all-female crew and officers"

so there shouldn't be too much distraction of the mixed sex variety.

[danlisa]

Slow this morning, aren't we.

:ping::ping::ping:

[rod_oil]

USS "Lez" ready to depart, sir!:rotfl: USS "Pregnancy" succeful arrive at homebase!:lol: Which submarine will serve better well see after USS "Lez" return back!:rotfl:

[flakmonkey]

Whats next, women being allowed to vote!?!

Seriously whats all the fuss about, its 2008 people! This should have happened at least 20 years ago!

Any sailor that can`t prioritise between Launch Nuclear Warhead or Stare At Boobies really shouldnt be in the navy to begin with.

[Uncle Goose]

I highly doubt any women would have wanted to serve on a U-boat, the lack of sanitation would have scared off any woman wanted to serve on it. nowaydays subs have showers.

[Penelope_Grey]

Alright, which three chauvenist pigs voted for " Women should stay home and make cookies"?

[SmokinTep]

I can't believe we are going to waste 2 Virginia class subs on some women. Why not give em a couple of 688's.

[3Jane]

I can't believe we are going to waste 2 Virginia class subs on some women. Why not give em a couple of 688's.

lol Why?

[Torplexed]

I can't believe we are going to waste 2 Virginia class subs on some women. Why not give em a couple of 688's.
Just change their name to the Virginia Slim class. 'You've come a long way, baby'. :cool: Let's face it. Sooner or later, someone is gonna bring up those old patronizing cigarette ads.

http://www.euro-cig.com/gal_images/20060405161024.jpg

[SmokinTep]

:rotfl: :rotfl: Good one..........

[Rhodes]

Mix crews, like one guy (me), or two (I am not greedy) and all the rest women!!!:p

[Kaleu. Jochen Mohr]

Alright, which three chauvenist pigs voted for " Women should stay home and make cookies"?its 7 now :lol:

[antikristuseke]

Alright, which three chauvenist pigs voted for "Women should stay home and make cookies"?

But...but I like cookies :cry:

[The General]

Hmm, USS Siren crewed entirely by women, Hubba hubba!:hmm:

[kurtz]

All for it, but you won't be able to call it the Silent Service any longer.

Seriously, when a crowd,bunch,gaggle of women are together there body clocks synchronise 3weeks per month lovely calm atmospher, feng shui, flower arranging, emroidery, dare I say cookies. 1 week of, "I've got a frickin' big red button here and if you don't say the tuna casserole is the nicest you've tasted....."

and what's this about pregnant sailors having to be airlifted home? I mean, how long is a tour of duty? It takes my wife at least 9 months gestating before anything noteworthy happens. IIRC the RN hasn't got the diesel for anything more than a trip round the harbour.

[Penelope_Grey]

Oh you have no idea...:damn:

[kiwi_2005]

Only if they were all Dikes that way they would be agressive in combat:D

[Penelope_Grey]

Ah... that must be why all male submariners are gay then... :hmm:

[linerkiller]

italian telephone company tv spots.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GISS23eL2RA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlnwYj5OyPQ


;)

[Mush Martin]

I always figured the first all female sub in the world would be
HMS Revenge by name.

[ReallyDedPoet]

I always figured the first all female sub in the world would be
HMS Revenge by name.
He, he, good one :up:


RDP

[Gorduz]

The reason you would like women as a part of a team, any team is because they have different ideas than men. When your in trouble and need of a solution you don't want a crew that are all the same, you need some diversity to come up with good ideas. You want women on subs because they can make subs better and more efficient, not becuse of equal rights. I dont get the problem several other NATO countries have had female submariners, heck Norway even had a female commander :o

[3Jane]

Only if they were all Dikes that way they would be agressive in combat:D

The tone of the original post was bad enough, subsequent replies just compounded it. Mugs of mulled misogyny and homophobia now being served in the refectory.

[kiwi_2005]

Only if they were all Dikes that way they would be agressive in combat:D
The tone of the original post was bad enough, subsequent replies just compounded it. Mugs of mulled misogyny and homophobia now being served in the refectory.
Not homophobic at all. Ive known a lesbian lady who has been a good friend for many years now, shes a tough one that could easily punch over the average bloke. Thats why i said if the navy had a bunch of dikes to man a sub they would probably be very agressive in combat and do it well :)

[Mush Martin]

I can't believe we are going to waste 2 Virginia class subs on some women. Why not give em a couple of 688's.
The potential of another Plunger Incident :rotfl:

Uhm Hi Comsublant.....we have a problem here

[Vacillator]

Slow this morning, aren't we.

:ping::ping::ping:

Not just this morning Dan ;), but it just shows how little of an article you can manage to read in a quick scan (like the title and a couple of random sentences)...

[Sailor Steve]

Hey Sailor Steve what happened!? I was just going to answer your old men, young men war theory! :p
Women on subs... is it really a distraction? I'd like to think we are more sophisticated then that. Then again, it is young men and young women... :hmm:
What happened was I *********** can't tell you right now.:damn:

We can still have that conversation; just not here.

[Uncle Goose]

Alright, which three chauvenist pigs voted for " Women should stay home and make cookies"?


Guilty as charged!! But purely because submariners need good cookies on those long dull patrols!!

[Hanomag]

Love this thread...

I definitely think it would be kool for an all female sub.

Maybe the USS Amazon! /Ducks the flak... :lol:

My current GF is ex US Navy sailor and she was on a sub tender which was a mixed crew, they survived.. but there was plenty of hanky panky onboard. :o

[sh3rules]

I have nothing against lesbians.

(Commenting on an earlier post).

[5string74]

I was a commercial fisherman out of Cape Cod in the late '70s and had occassion to ship out with a few female crew. We would go out for two weeks at a time. Our regular crew were a bunch of animals without the discipline of the US Navy and I have to say that everyone behaved themselves quite well. And the women were quite capable and hard working. There was never a thought that they did not do their share.

[Kipparikalle]

Women? On MY sub? It's more likely than you think!

[Pikes]

I served in the Royal Signals which was mixed. I'm afraid men and women when stuck together for long periods of time tend to want to have sex. Sorry to state the obvious, but generally speaking and from bitter experience there is going to be trouble. And on a 6 month undersea tour with nowhere to hide I think i would prefer "no trouble" to the kind of trouble caused from the highly motivational factors surrounding sexual tension.

And on the note of all female crews, i strongly believe that given experience an all female crew would be very suited to submarine warfare although i have an inkling that an all female crew may suffer from an incredibly competitive environment. Women can be better AND worse than men in some respects. Good on the Yanks for having a shot at this though, luckily they have the resources to make these things happen.

[EDIT]
May i draw your attentions to Article VI of the Bartholemew Roberts' pirate code back in 1720....
ARTICLE VI.
No boy or woman to be allowed amongst them. If any man shall be found seducing any of the latter sex and carrying her to sea in disguise he shall suffer death.

Now there has to be a reason for such strong feelings, lets not make the same mistake twice :)

[Jimbuna]

I served in the Royal Signals which was mixed. I'm afraid men and women when stuck together for long periods of time tend to want to have sex. Sorry to state the obvious, but generally speaking and from bitter experience there is going to be trouble. And on a 6 month undersea tour with nowhere to hide I think i would prefer "no trouble" to the kind of trouble caused from the highly motivational factors surrounding sexual tension.

And on the note of all female crews, i strongly believe that given experience an all female crew would be very suited to submarine warfare although i have an inkling that an all female crew may suffer from an incredibly competitive environment. Women can be better AND worse than men in some respects. Good on the Yanks for having a shot at this though, luckily they have the resources to make these things happen.

[EDIT]
May i draw your attentions to Article VI of the Bartholemew Roberts' pirate code back in 1720....
ARTICLE VI.
No boy or woman to be allowed amongst them. If any man shall be found seducing any of the latter sex and carrying her to sea in disguise he shall suffer death.

Now there has to be a reason for such strong feelings, lets not make the same mistake twice :)

Just so long as you don't try to load your torpedo into the tube, you should be okay http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/whistle.gif

[CptGrayWolf]

Ah... that must be why all male submariners are gay then... :hmm:

Oh no you din't! *SNAP**SNAP*

[Jimbuna]

Alright, which three chauvenist pigs voted for "Women should stay home and make cookies"?

But...but I like cookies :cry:


http://imgcash3.imageshack.us/img152/9959/rollingaroundlaughingly2.gif


http://imgcash4.imageshack.us/img504/2364/submarinecp8.gif

[sh3rules]

I served in the Royal Signals which was mixed. I'm afraid men and women when stuck together for long periods of time tend to want to have sex. Sorry to state the obvious, but generally speaking and from bitter experience there is going to be trouble. And on a 6 month undersea tour with nowhere to hide I think i would prefer "no trouble" to the kind of trouble caused from the highly motivational factors surrounding sexual tension.

And on the note of all female crews, i strongly believe that given experience an all female crew would be very suited to submarine warfare although i have an inkling that an all female crew may suffer from an incredibly competitive environment. Women can be better AND worse than men in some respects. Good on the Yanks for having a shot at this though, luckily they have the resources to make these things happen.

[EDIT]
May i draw your attentions to Article VI of the Bartholemew Roberts' pirate code back in 1720....
ARTICLE VI.
No boy or woman to be allowed amongst them. If any man shall be found seducing any of the latter sex and carrying her to sea in disguise he shall suffer death.

Now there has to be a reason for such strong feelings, lets not make the same mistake twice :)

Please, define “trouble”. Women don’t object to having sex, and in the case of a long deployment, everyone just has to make sure that there are enough condoms on board. What’s the point of being in the company of members of the same sex for so long? (I like watching lesbians, but that’s another topic).

[Laufen zum Ziel]

Will it be a virgin or a virginia type sub? I am for it the only problem is which torpedo will I want to launch.

We have come a long way Baby???


http://silent-hunter-addict.com

[Dronston]

Interesting topic ;)


If we can all agree that in a military situation discipline and rule are paramount.
If we can all agree that both men and women have unique qualities.
If we can all agree that all people are equal.

Than we can all agree that it is logical that women should be part of any military unit.
Every individual doing what he or she does best and is allowed to do it.

It's the democratic way!

:up:

[-SWCowboy.]

The military is not a democracy...nothing would get done if it was...

There have been instances in the past where certain crew members were caught doing certain things on the weather decks, in broad daylight on one of the carriers I was on.

Mixed gender submarines would be a bad idea... A carrier is cramped enough as it is, I could only imagine a submarine full of horny sailors.... :o

[NealT]

Don't know if this was an April 1 prank or not but...

IMHO...

Do it.

I remember when they first let women into Law Enforcement in the military...many said it would not go well.

I can think of many a woman law enforcement officer I would want watching my back in a bad situation. And did have. They held up to the task quite well.

I remember when they first let women pilot commercial jets. They do pretty darned good there too.

[sh3rules]

Men need women, that’s a natural instinct. If there aren’t any around, then we find girls who say “Me love you long time”. We are not animals but, contrary to what the religious conservatives tell us, abstinence is not an option.

[devildog]

i get to be kapatun-just go to random grid, dive deep and give orders-might have to surface every few days for o2,then straight back down. seriously tho it would be to much discration on crew-their sposed to work as team-not compete.. :o

[bookworm_020]

There has been mixed crew subs in the Royal Australian Navy for the last couple of years. There was some resistance at first, but it seems to have gone well.

Plus we need of the sub crews we can get. We only have enough to crew half our subs!:huh:

[ReallyDedPoet]

Ahhh, this has been quite the day :yep:. To see all the different reactions :doh::-?:o:88) on the various threads that have been under the influence of April 1 has been interesting to say the least

On a serious note, after having witnessed childbirth 3 times I have come to a couple of conclusions. One, my wife owns my butt. Two, she could hold her own in any situation, in any circumstance.


RDP

[Captain Vlad]

Kinda funny to see all the opposition to something that other countries are already doing successfully.

What, the Swedes and Aussies can handle mixed sub crews better than us?

[Madox58]

The BEST backup I've had for a long time?
My Wife!
:yep:
Got into a scuffle where all the Bouncers were holding me back.
The Target was just standing there running his mouth.
:stare:
Over TOP of me and the bouncers came my Wife!
:o
Broke that punks nose in one shot!!
:up:

My Wife's friends are a force I would not attempt to battle!
They are all some of my best friends and would trust my life to them.
With no hesitations.

During WWII.
Some of the most outstanding Snipers to serve on the Eastern Front?
Women.

[d@rk51d3]

The BEST backup I've had for a long time?
My Wife!
:yep:
Got into a scuffle where all the Bouncers were holding me back.
The Target was just standing there running his mouth.
:stare:
Over TOP of me and the bouncers came my Wife!
:o
Broke that punks nose in one shot!!
:up:

My Wife's friends are a force I would not attempt to battle!
They are all some of my best friends and would trust my life to them.
With no hesitations.

During WWII.
Some of the most outstanding Snipers to serve on the Eastern Front?
Women.


Sounds like my missus.

Ex builders labourer, and ran rings around any of the blokes.

Getting a bit soft now, though.:D


ooooooooh, I'm a dead man now.:dead:

[Chisum]

Alright, which three chauvenist pigs voted for " Women should stay home and make cookies"?its 7 now :lol:

24 now.

Well, woman in sub ?
I the peace time it's a job like an other.
But war is a man affair and if a woman commands a submarine like she drives a car, I'm sure our enemy get some chances to win.
:p
Of course modern sub are easy to use, just push on a button to fired nuclear weapon and destroy a half Earth.
And it's for that I'm affraid that she maby push on the wrong button when she needs a coffee cup.

:lol:

I'm out, I'm out, don't kill me woman keep your energy to the war !
--->
:arrgh!:

[CptGrayWolf]

Eh? Why wouldn't a woman be able to command a sub in war? You guys know women have been very successful fighter pilots in wartime?

[bobchase]

An all female crew is not a problem, no matter what type the ship is.

A mixed crew is a problem and has been from the late 60's. Distractions? Yes, but sailors of both sexes can deal with that. The problem is that the rules forbid fraternization and these are harsh rules when enforced.

The US Navy in it's lack of wisdom and, yes, under political pressure started mixed crew experiments back when ships were built only for men. So they would corden off an area of the ship for "women only" which, necessarily, would include a head. I was TAD on a destroyer tender in the '70s where the ship had two enlisted heads, one CPO head, and one officer head. One of those two enlisted heads were in the off limits female section. I was working up on the 09 level my 1st day aboard and asked where the hell the head was. It was way aft and, worse, down on the 3rd deck. That meant I had to go down eleven levels and the whole length of the ship to take one. Oh Boy! :nope: And the officers and politico's of the day wondered why all 'the men' were upset and couldn't cope. And that's just the tip of the iceberg. Try to take a shower when you berthed up forward and the head was aft. But that was then.

Today's ships are built for having women aboard. They still have their 'turf' that's off limits to men. And that still causes conflicts. But the real problems are from the unreasonable rules and the on-again, off-again enforcement of the same. When they take adolescent men & women and put them at sea for six months to a year, in very tight quarters, in a high stress job, working side-by-side every day and every night, and then you tell them "no touching or else" - are you kidding me? They are kid's, just out of high school, all alone, at sea, for months! And No Fraternization - EVER? The penalty for disobedience is Captains Mast or Court Marshal, depending on what they were caught at. Both are severe and the latter is career ending.

The answer is not tenable for most Americans because the answer to the problem of mixed crews is literally found on Battlestar Galactica. (Or, to a lessor extent, like the Israeli Army.) That's mixed crews together in working spaces, berthing compartments, heads, everywhere. Kissing, touching, etc. is OK. And, no, you do not get an easy-out just because you got pregnant. You just have to deal with it.

Harsh, but that is what it will take to put an end to the problem of mixed crews.

Oh, and here is another crack in the Navy's hull. By Presidential edict last year, it is now a Courts Marshal office to fraternize with a prostitute when (and if) you go ashore. That form of sexual gratification is now "trafficking in human bondage / slavery" even when it's legally sanctioned by the country that is the port of call. So now, our mixed crew sailors (I'm including both sexes here) are forced to work along side each other 24 hours a day with no fraternization whatsoever for months on end and, if they are lucky enough to get liberty in a foreign port, they're expected to act like they are in church back home.

I just can't believe that this is the same planet that I grew up on.

Bob Chase, ETC

[Captain Vlad]

The answer is not tenable for most Americans because the answer to the problem of mixed crews is literally found on Battlestar Galactica. (Or, to a lessor extent, like the Israeli Army.) That's mixed crews together in working spaces, berthing compartments, heads, everywhere. Kissing, touching, etc. is OK. And, no, you do not get an easy-out just because you got pregnant. You just have to deal with it.

Harsh, but that is what it will take to put an end to the problem of mixed crews.


I got no problem with this. I don't think most younger folk would either. The reasons it's hard to do things like this is all....old fogey politics.

[sh3rules]

A female captain? Well, as long as she doesn’t want to nuke a country every 28 days we should be fine. Go Women! (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/%5Burl=http://www.mothernature.com/Library/Bookshelf/Books/19/153.cfm%5D%20Women%21%5B/url%5D)

[Jimbuna]

There have been instances in the past where certain crew members were caught doing certain things on the weather decks, in broad daylight on one of the carriers I was on.


Ooh!!......Homing torpedoes on carriers :o

[Graf Paper]

Mixing genders in the military in frontline situations is ultimately a bad idea simply for the fact that you're adding sexual tension to a situation that is already full of its own stresses and demands.

I am far from sexist, but human nature is human nature no matter how much you try to moralize or intellectualize it.

Why do you think the U.S. Navy had to make it a courts-martial offense for an active duty woman to become pregnant while on the job?

There were so many mixed crews that couldn't keep their hands off each other while at sea or women using pregnancy to get a medical discharge as an early "out" that the Navy had to take drastic action.

Before anyone shouts that such military laws are sexist, there are also laws for men to be court-martialed if their sexual behavior renders them medically unfit for combat.

You can use all the modern arguments of "civilized" society you like, but no amount of politics can neuter one of the fundamental urges that makes us human.

Then again, many draconian sexual harassment policies, "equality" laws, and other "liberation" philosophies have done their level best to socially castrate men.

I'm all for everyone being treated fairly and with an even hand but we also should temper it with the wisdom that it's okay for women to be women and men to be men.

And people wonder why the divorce rate in the U.S. is 80% and rising and why a growing number of young men are waiting to marry until they're almost 30, if they marry at all! :nope:

(edited for typos I just noticed after finally getting some sleep. lol)

[Myxale]

:hmm: Hmm, bein' a Anti-Air dude in RL i see mixed units quite often...but an all woman sub is kinda well...strange!

What's the point of that!:hmm:
It's not like this set-up has a a impact on anything special! (where Warfare is concerned)

:shifty:

Knowing a bit of the ploitical clima in the USA concerning this topic...my guess is that this is rather a political course rather than a honest intention to make the Navy better.

[HundertzehnGustav]

women only uboats.

and then sink those uboats, and thus save the world from all those women.
:arrgh!:

bring it on...:oops:

[Jimbuna]

women only uboats.

and then sink those uboats, and thus save the world from all those women.
:arrgh!:

bring it on...:oops:




ALLAAAAARRRRRRRRRRMMMMMM!!!!!

http://imgcash5.imageshack.us/img134/3995/newshy222ul3cg8.gif

[irish1958]

How do I enlist in the submarine corps?

[kiwi_2005]

Eh? Why wouldn't a woman be able to command a sub in war? You guys know women have been very successful fighter pilots in wartime?

Russian woman were some of the best Snipers during WW2. :yep:

[Myxale]

Eh? Why wouldn't a woman be able to command a sub in war? You guys know women have been very successful fighter pilots in wartime?
Russian woman were some of the best Snipers during WW2. :yep:
You're right!
(Russian ladys rock BTW):yep:

Anyway...I get that!
And it makes sense to have good Men and Woman in a unit! If they can contribute and do their Job well!

But is still fail to see the logic behind the "all woman Sub"

[yamato9]

IEEERRRRRR..........hm....:hmm:
Well...dont get me wrong but, man, boys love war toys and we allways are stuned with some good action scenes, tanks, subs, battleships..etc, in way: wow..look how this Leopard II or Akula have awsome design. But women they more tend to train good look on her selves, and most of them dont even got a shred of feel or apeel for military equipment and tactic. Most of women like yellow pages, make up, skirts etc...c´mon fellas because who?.. us or womens today exists so many stupid yellow pages? On the other hand even most ordinary guy when see in newspaper picture of nuclear sub he stops, investigate picture (in mind he thinks: wow look... nuclear sub....i wonder how is look like sailing on her) and then turn page and search somethin else, on the other hand women se same picture and turn page in blink of the eye and stops on issue about Britney Spears and what she wearing yesterday.

So my general opinion is that man should be in navy, military because we have greater feel and love for that occupation, and we are physicaly better suited for that.
Women they are more powerful in psychical durability(they dont crack easily on psychical stress),maybe they will be good in politics.

Women who is in navy, military they are mostly careerist, or life push them into and ONLY small very,very smal portion of them are realy nuts and they love this like all other boys.

On the end i don´t wanna to counter that women are not good in military sevice, i only want to say that man always whoud be better in that field.

Just look how many women play sub, plain, tank simulations and how much of them plays adventures and RPGs?:hmm:

Imagine U-boat cramped with women crew, how they will look or act after months on sea?

Uh ohh womens dont like each other they will poke eyes of each other.

Report over.

[CptGrayWolf]

Mixing genders in the military in frontline situations is ultimately a bad idea simply for the fact that you're adding sexual tension to a situation that is already full of its own stresses and demands.

Do you really think sexual tension is a problem when the enemy is trying to blow your head off on the frontline?

eh no jokes with 'blow your head off', I know you guys...

[sh3rules]

I'm all for everyone being treated fairly and with an even hand but we also should temper it with the wisdom that it's okay for women to be women and men to be men.

This sentence reminds me of videos such as this one:

Video. (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/%5Burl=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKcgB68h2M4%5DVideo.%5B/url%5D)

Two robots and one guy comment on this video.

[flag4]

i think all women are very naughty and should be told off quite a bit.


its the only way to control them. i mean, it's like, they are completly silly and wont keep still; and all that hair combing - it's bound to get caught in moving parts, dont you think ?

and they just dance too.


or, we could store them in pickle jars and save them till winter.

[Jimbuna]

How about you just carry them about like 4-packs. http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/4030/winkbigid2zj6.gif

[flag4]

HEY, THASS RIGHT !!

it's just like they are beer

they are the same as beer are'nt they ?

WOW you are so spot on, yeah !

i mean, i has a cheese sandwich for lunch, you know, with onions and tomatos, and oh boy was that just like them: they are the same - are the same as sandwiches too....Jeeez

i mean, they are like everything !!

HEy, Albert Speer missed out on so much !!, even though he had food in prison - i wonder if he realised.

yeah, he did stuff with plants, in the garden and that.

cool, yeah !

Speer ROCKS :rock:

[d@rk51d3]

How about you just carry them about like 4-packs. http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/4030/winkbigid2zj6.gif

eewww, I'll give that a miss.

[Dronston]

An all female crew is not a problem, no matter what type the ship is.

A mixed crew is a problem and has been from the late 60's. Distractions? Yes, but sailors of both sexes can deal with that. The problem is that the rules forbid fraternization and these are harsh rules when enforced.

The US Navy in it's lack of wisdom and, yes, under political pressure started mixed crew experiments back when ships were built only for men. So they would corden off an area of the ship for "women only" which, necessarily, would include a head. I was TAD on a destroyer tender in the '70s where the ship had two enlisted heads, one CPO head, and one officer head. One of those two enlisted heads were in the off limits female section. I was working up on the 09 level my 1st day aboard and asked where the hell the head was. It was way aft and, worse, down on the 3rd deck. That meant I had to go down eleven levels and the whole length of the ship to take one. Oh Boy! :nope: And the officers and politico's of the day wondered why all 'the men' were upset and couldn't cope. And that's just the tip of the iceberg. Try to take a shower when you berthed up forward and the head was aft. But that was then.

Today's ships are built for having women aboard. They still have their 'turf' that's off limits to men. And that still causes conflicts. But the real problems are from the unreasonable rules and the on-again, off-again enforcement of the same. When they take adolescent men & women and put them at sea for six months to a year, in very tight quarters, in a high stress job, working side-by-side every day and every night, and then you tell them "no touching or else" - are you kidding me? They are kid's, just out of high school, all alone, at sea, for months! And No Fraternization - EVER? The penalty for disobedience is Captains Mast or Court Marshal, depending on what they were caught at. Both are severe and the latter is career ending.

The answer is not tenable for most Americans because the answer to the problem of mixed crews is literally found on Battlestar Galactica. (Or, to a lessor extent, like the Israeli Army.) That's mixed crews together in working spaces, berthing compartments, heads, everywhere. Kissing, touching, etc. is OK. And, no, you do not get an easy-out just because you got pregnant. You just have to deal with it.

Harsh, but that is what it will take to put an end to the problem of mixed crews.

Oh, and here is another crack in the Navy's hull. By Presidential edict last year, it is now a Courts Marshal office to fraternize with a prostitute when (and if) you go ashore. That form of sexual gratification is now "trafficking in human bondage / slavery" even when it's legally sanctioned by the country that is the port of call. So now, our mixed crew sailors (I'm including both sexes here) are forced to work along side each other 24 hours a day with no fraternization whatsoever for months on end and, if they are lucky enough to get liberty in a foreign port, they're expected to act like they are in church back home.

I just can't believe that this is the same planet that I grew up on.

Bob Chase, ETC

Wisdom.