[REL] Increased ASW (revised)

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

After unzipping, place the increased ASW mod in the MODS folder of your SHIII directory. You must be running SHIII with the 1.4 patch and with GWX 2.0. The increased ASW mod was designed for use with GWX 2.0 and has not been tested with any other installation and probably will not work with them. The recommended installation method for the increased ASW mod is to use JSGME. Otherwise, back up your data folder, copy the mod files and paste them in their appropriate folders. Do NOT install this mod mid-patrol. You must first exit SHIII completely before enabling/installing this mod.

*** This release of the increased ASW mod has made some major changes to the depth charges. Escorts will no longer 'suicide' or blow their own depth charge racks off (at least, they haven't, so far, in all the tests I've run). Depth charges are now more accurate in terms of their detonation depth. Their damage radii has been reduced by quite a bit, while their explosive power has been increased quite a bit.

The net effect is that if/when a depth charge goes off very close to your boat you will be heavily damaged, but detonations at even a slight distance will only superficially damage you. Minor course changes during a depth charge attack should be sufficient to generate misses. However, if you just stooge along and have a string drift down next to you . . . .***

I've tried to keep this as historical/realistic as possible, yet also add a bit of additional 'thrill'. The changes made fall into two categories: Air and Sea.

Air:

1) setting all bombs so that they detonate when they impact the water, or just below.

2) setting the air depth charges to detonate at 9 meters (which isn't exactly historic, I'll admit; from what I've been able to research 7.9 meters seems to be the 'normal' depth setting, although I've only been able to find the tech details for British air depth charges so far).

3) setting the 'explosiveness' of air depth charges to match up to the weight of explosives they normally carried.

4) setting the sink rate of air depth charges to match the historical sink rates.

5) modified the Catalina, Sunderland, Wellington, select Liberator and select Fortress aircraft with ASW loadouts.

6) changed the Campaign_RND.mis and Campaign_SCR files so that theabovementioned aircraft carry the ASW loadouts (where appropriate).

7) ASW patrol aircraft now have the potential of spotting a submerged U-boat running at periscope depth. Their chances of spotting a U-boat and/or maintaining visual contact depends on several factors: day versus night, wind speed/weather conditions, clear versus foggy, whether they've already visually spotted the U-boat before it submerged, etc.

Basically, if you spot an aircraft at long range and dive right away you should be fine. If you delay diving you may wind up being bracketed with bombs going off on the surface above you and air depth charges going off below water *around* you. And if you get bushwacked and jumped (say, at night, or in a storm) and you get caught on the *surface*, well . . .

Sea:

Most British DDs and DEs begin carrying the Mark VII heavy depth charges starting September 1942. The Mark VII heavy had a somewhat improved sink rate from the addition of lead to the depth charge.

US DDs and DEs begin carrying the Mark 9 'fast sinker' depth charge starting June 1943. Designed to sink fast and detonate at up to 1000 feet, the Mark 9 was aerodynamically shaped, lead-weighted and finned. The lead weight and teardrop shape more than doubled its sink rate, while the fins spun it for stabilization while it sank and also produced a more reliable sink rate resulting in predictable depth charge patterns. Unfortunately I wasn't able to decrease its horizontal 'wandering' so I tightened the vertical as a compensation of sorts. And, of course, the Mark 9 actually *looks* like a Mark 9!

I'd like to thank the GWX team for providing such a wonderful expansion mod. I would have stopped playing SHIII long ago if it hadn't been for their work.

Thanks and credit:

skwasjer; without his wonderful Silent 3ditor I'd never have managed (or attempted!) to do any of this!

Kpt. Lehmann for permission to release modified GWX files

And special thanks and credit to: fury of a seraph; the Mark 9 graphics are entirely his work.

Feedback, comments and critiques are always appreciated!

~Albrecht von Hesse
albrecht_von_hesse@yahoo.com

http://hosted.filefront.com/vonHesse/
http://files.filefront.com/Increased+ASW+azip/;9843714;/fileinfo.html

[Uber Gruber]

Damn, just started my WaW patrol. But rest assured I will be loading this up the minute i get back.....thanks mate:up:

[Grayson02sept1980]

haven'd had time to test the first version... so... dumb question.

Why means "revised"? exactly.....?

anyway I say thanks already... your improved ASW for the planes was cool... this promises even more :up:

[Jimbuna]

haven'd had time to test the first version... so... dumb question.

Why means "revised"? exactly.....?

anyway I say thanks already... your improved ASW for the planes was cool... this promises even more :up:


To alter something already written or printed, in order to make corrections, improve, or update.

[Uber Gruber]

To alter something already written or printed, in order to make corrections, improve, or update.

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

haven'd had time to test the first version... so... dumb question.

Why means "revised"? exactly.....?

anyway I say thanks already... your improved ASW for the planes was cool... this promises even more :up:


To alter something already written or printed, in order to make corrections, improve, or update.

Errrrr . . . what Jimbuna said. :D

It's revised because, after digging into the 'nuts and bolts' of the depth charges, and because of something Sailor Steve had mentioned regarding the original release, I wanted to adjust the depth charges to be more historical yet (as much of what transpires) workable within the framework of the game.

Although tis true that, historically-speaking, escorts did, time-to-time, damage themselves due to shallow-water depth charging, with the depth charge settings I was originally using it was almost a given that they'd do so using the new Mark 9 'fast-sink' depth charges. Plus, after running about 80 different test missions and analyzing the results, I'd wanted to have depth charges that: 1) if they exploded within 2-3 meters they'd substantially, critically damage the U-boat (especially the pressure hull) yet, 2) if they exploded 3-9 meters away they'd only do minor to superficial damage.

Hopefully these new settings will do just that. --fingers crossed--

I haven't been able to get a DD/DE/escort to suicide with these, or blow their own racks off. Not even when running periscope depth at a dead stop and no manuevering. The warships often wind up with smoke-smeared behinds (--grins--) but they haven't blown themselves up.

With the depth charges, if you get depth charged at periscope depth, you will most likely get critically damaged. There just isn't enough time to evade. At depth, if you make even a small course change the depth charges (usually!) 'miss'. You'll still shake and rock from the near misses but not take damage.

Again, comments and critiques are appreciated!

[Jimbuna]

To alter something already written or printed, in order to make corrections, improve, or update.

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

What did I do ? http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/1817/thinkbigsw1yo4.gif

[Grayson02sept1980]

To alter something already written or printed, in order to make corrections, improve, or update.
:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

well... matter of perspective:

from the view of a english spoken person assuming you address and english spoke this is a lot like sarcasm --> laughter
from the view of a "not so good" speaking english person... well... just an explaination
from the view of a not native english speaking person with A-LVL papers in english you just explaine the "pure" meaning ... but that was futile ... still a bit sarcastic --> laughter
from my point of view.... still sarcastic... but I find it funny, too.

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

(my own fault... why do I put it into quote marks "" "" :roll: )

[Grayson02sept1980]

haven'd had time to test the first version... so... dumb question.

Why means "revised"? exactly.....?

anyway I say thanks already... your improved ASW for the planes was cool... this promises even more :up:

To alter something already written or printed, in order to make corrections, improve, or update.
Errrrr . . . what Jimbuna said. :D

It's revised because, after digging into the 'nuts and bolts' of the depth charges, and because of something Sailor Steve had mentioned regarding the original release, I wanted to adjust the depth charges to be more historical yet (as much of what transpires) workable within the framework of the game.

Although tis true that, historically-speaking, escorts did, time-to-time, damage themselves due to shallow-water depth charging, with the depth charge settings I was originally using it was almost a given that they'd do so using the new Mark 9 'fast-sink' depth charges. Plus, after running about 80 different test missions and analyzing the results, I'd wanted to have depth charges that: 1) if they exploded within 2-3 meters they'd substantially, critically damage the U-boat (especially the pressure hull) yet, 2) if they exploded 3-9 meters away they'd only do minor to superficial damage.

Hopefully these new settings will do just that. --fingers crossed--

I haven't been able to get a DD/DE/escort to suicide with these, or blow their own racks off. Not even when running periscope depth at a dead stop and no manuevering. The warships often wind up with smoke-smeared behinds (--grins--) but they haven't blown themselves up.

With the depth charges, if you get depth charged at periscope depth, you will most likely get critically damaged. There just isn't enough time to evade. At depth, if you make even a small course change the depth charges (usually!) 'miss'. You'll still shake and rock from the near misses but not take damage.

Again, comments and critiques are appreciated!

cool... so no more cat and mouse at peri depth... will test it at different years

again: thanks

[Paco]

thanks, downloading now :up:

Paco

[Grayson02sept1980]

little question...

the Increased ASW Mod has a "Conflict" with GWX Lite Harbor traffic and the RealWeatherFix.... are those two included in your mod... guess not....

any idea?
(with the real weather fix I have the solution using the files with the Real weather exe... but I guess I'll have to get used to laggy departured ;) )

Just wanted to mention that

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

little question...

the Increased ASW Mod has a "Conflict" with GWX Lite Harbor traffic and the RealWeatherFix.... are those two included in your mod... guess not....

any idea?
(with the real weather fix I have the solution using the files with the Real weather exe... but I guess I'll have to get used to laggy departured ;) )

Just wanted to mention that

From a quick glance it seems the conflict with the GWX Lite Harbor mod is with the Campaign_SCR file. It's going to be (for now) an either/or situation: either you run with a full harbor with ASW-ordnance loaded patrol aircraft, or a lite one without. --wry grin--.

Considering most of the aircraft (as far as I can tell, anyway; I'm rather new to modding :oops: ) in the original Campaign_SCR that are 'patrol aircraft' already carry air depth charges as their loadouts, enabling the GWX Lite Harbor mod after enabling the increased ASW mod should have little effect.

Once GWX 2.1 is issued, and if people want me to, I can set up 'tweaks'; for instance, a Lite Harbor-inclusive variation, and a variation for Mediterranean play.

[Madox58]

Face it.
After 2.1 is released?
Many of us will have the free time to look at conflicts with different mods.
And offer suggestions and fixes to make them more compatible.
I believe many of us have wanted to for sometime now.
But there just are not enuff hours in the day.
And who knows the files and what was done better then
a Grey Wolf?
;)

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

Face it.
After 2.1 is released?
Many of us will have the free time to look at conflicts with different mods.
And offer suggestions and fixes to make them more compatible.
I believe many of us have wanted to for sometime now.
But there just are not enuff hours in the day.
And who knows the files and what was done better then
a Grey Wolf?
;)

I really wasn't casting aspersions you guys way, honest.

[Madox58]

I know that.
I'm just saying that we'll be more able to help
where needed soon.
:up:

[Grayson02sept1980]

seems I get a CTD everytime Depthcharges are dropped...

now I must admit I have installed next to your mod the "Das Boot" Soundmod... but I can hardly imagine how the soundfiles would cause a CTD..

further studies will be made.

the problem with teh lite haror trafic is no more... I can handle the more ships etc.

well... hope it works out... I just intercepted a big covoy already shooting 40000t and always get a ctd with the depth charges..

I'll test it.

later that evening :


ok ten test runs and the same result... I also uninstalled everything else...

as soon as it is time to drop depth charges I get a BTW/CTD

doh....

even later:

ok ok ok... I am confused..

tested it again in a single mission... works...

whatever it is... I'll do more testing and start shouting "wolves" again when I think I found it... sorry

[xristoskaiti]

try to make the second download file....:D

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

seems I get a CTD everytime Depthcharges are dropped...

now I must admit I have installed next to your mod the "Das Boot" Soundmod... but I can hardly imagine how the soundfiles would cause a CTD..

further studies will be made.

the problem with teh lite haror trafic is no more... I can handle the more ships etc.

well... hope it works out... I just intercepted a big covoy already shooting 40000t and always get a ctd with the depth charges..

I'll test it.

later that evening :


ok ten test runs and the same result... I also uninstalled everything else...

as soon as it is time to drop depth charges I get a BTW/CTD

doh....

even later:

ok ok ok... I am confused..

tested it again in a single mission... works...

whatever it is... I'll do more testing and start shouting "wolves" again when I think I found it... sorry

I have no idea what the problem is. :(

If it happens again, please let me know. Also what month/year it happened, what type of escort was (trying) to drop the charges, and where the location was (grid zone).

So far you're the only feedback I've gotten on this, so I've no idea if anyone else is also experiencing this, or even if anyone else is running it. :(

[Grayson02sept1980]

well... I tried it ten times in single missions and no problem.

I will go on patrol and tease some DDs today... will report back then.

Also the problem could be the real weather fix. I have let that uninstalled right now.

Guess I will have to deal with the bad weather as it is...

No need to be sorry! I will see and I guess I have mixed up and screwed up something - I am a specialist in those things :88)

[KeldorKatarn]

seems I get a CTD everytime Depthcharges are dropped...

now I must admit I have installed next to your mod the "Das Boot" Soundmod... but I can hardly imagine how the soundfiles would cause a CTD..

further studies will be made.

the problem with teh lite haror trafic is no more... I can handle the more ships etc.

well... hope it works out... I just intercepted a big covoy already shooting 40000t and always get a ctd with the depth charges..

I'll test it.

later that evening :


ok ten test runs and the same result... I also uninstalled everything else...

as soon as it is time to drop depth charges I get a BTW/CTD

doh....

even later:

ok ok ok... I am confused..

tested it again in a single mission... works...

whatever it is... I'll do more testing and start shouting "wolves" again when I think I found it... sorry
I have no idea what the problem is. :(

If it happens again, please let me know. Also what month/year it happened, what type of escort was (trying) to drop the charges, and where the location was (grid zone).

So far you're the only feedback I've gotten on this, so I've no idea if anyone else is also experiencing this, or even if anyone else is running it. :(

I'm using it and was depth charged for a short time on my last patrol, took no damage though, just shook the boat.

[Grayson02sept1980]

ok

seems to work

I don't use the lite harbour trafic and I let lose of the DBSM and now it works

had some serious fights with some DDs and took some damage... but more pescy are the flyboys...

seems to work

btw I am playing March 1943

I don't know if there is a big difference but I must admit that my old tactic playing cat and mouse with the DD is not working anymore... and I haven't seen a DD blow himself up with DCs

another thing I cannot comment so far is the speed the DCs need to get down... I have hunted in shallow waters so far... that is the reason for me getting bombed by flyboys :roll: I just could not resist a convoy passing by ;)

[mengle]

I use merged campaign, i installed increased ASW a without campaign RND and SCR but it won't start even the intro file.
I have tried again without the six DC_R_KG_fs and the six DepthCharges_f files and now it works.
Question is: the 12 deleted files what does they do in the game ?
Or must i rename them like the orriginals like DC_R_KG and DepthCharges_SB and put them in the library.:hmm:

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

I use merged campaign, i installed increased ASW a without campaign RND and SCR but it won't start even the intro file.
I have tried again without the six DC_R_KG_fs and the six DepthCharges_f files and now it works.
Question is: the 12 deleted files what does they do in the game ?
Or must i rename them like the orriginals like DC_R_KG and DepthCharges_SB and put them in the library.:hmm:

I have no idea what 'merged campaign' does, so I've no idea what the problem might be.

The 12 files you've deleted (*_fs.* and *_fsbr.*) give British warships the Mark VII heavy depth charges and the US the Mark 9 'fast-sinker' depth charges. Deleting those files will most likely cause a CTD when the correct time period for those to appear rolls around and the game tries to spawn a British or US warship.

I'm not sure what the 'merged campaign' does; when I get a chance (and assuming no one else answers this first :) ) I'll try and see what the problem(s) most likely are.

[Jimbuna]

I use merged campaign, i installed increased ASW a without campaign RND and SCR but it won't start even the intro file.
I have tried again without the six DC_R_KG_fs and the six DepthCharges_f files and now it works.
Question is: the 12 deleted files what does they do in the game ?
Or must i rename them like the orriginals like DC_R_KG and DepthCharges_SB and put them in the library.:hmm:

I have no idea what 'merged campaign' does, so I've no idea what the problem might be.

The 12 files you've deleted (*_fs.* and *_fsbr.*) give British warships the Mark VII heavy depth charges and the US the Mark 9 'fast-sinker' depth charges. Deleting those files will most likely cause a CTD when the correct time period for those to appear rolls around and the game tries to spawn a British or US warship.

I'm not sure what the 'merged campaign' does; when I get a chance (and assuming no one else answers this first :) ) I'll try and see what the problem(s) most likely are.

I'm not sure precisely what question your asking here Albrecht and I'm sure you already know, but just in case.

On normal loading of GWX you automatically get the Atlantic and Med campaigns incorporated.
The merged campaign file merges the Black Sea and Indian Ocean files with those of the Atlantic and Med. http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

I'm not sure precisely what question your asking here Albrecht and I'm sure you already know, but just in case.

On normal loading of GWX you automatically get the Atlantic and Med campaigns incorporated.
The merged campaign file merges the Black Sea and Indian Ocean files with those of the Atlantic and Med. http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

Hey Jim! Thanks for taking the time to look at this.

Mengle had asked the following:

I use merged campaign, i installed increased ASW a without campaign RND and SCR but it won't start even the intro file.
I have tried again without the six DC_R_KG_fs and the six DepthCharges_f files and now it works.
Question is: the 12 deleted files what does they do in the game ?
Or must i rename them like the orriginals like DC_R_KG and DepthCharges_SB and put them in the library.:hmm:

I don't understand why he's having a problem, especially with the depth charge and rack additions. From what I see of the 'merged campaign' mod, that should only affect the campaign RND and SCR files, and shouldn't be affected by the depth charge changes.

It looks as if the ASW_a mod was enabled first and then the merged campaign mod enabled next that things should work fine. All that should happen then is that enabling the merged campaign mod would overwrite the changes I'd made in campaign SCR and RND. But those changes were minor (just altered the aircraft ordnance loadouts to the ASW package I'd made) and again I don't see why that should hang loading the game.

Again, thanks for looking at this!

[Jimbuna]

I'd agree with your thinking.....personally speaking though, I'd enable the merged campaign file first, then yours and see if that makes any difference. http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

[mengle]

Mod work perfect now

Could it be becouse i forgot the resolution fix to run again ?
otherwise i forget the first time something, becouse i installed the mod manually.

I also want to thank you for this great mod, no more destroyers blowing themselfs up :rock:

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

I'm glad it's working for you now!

@Jimbuna: Thanks again for taking a peek at this and offering advice!

[Jimbuna]

I'm glad it's working for you now!

@Jimbuna: Thanks again for taking a peek at this and offering advice!

Your welcome sir http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

[Grayson02sept1980]

first testing phase has ended official here

results:

almost bombed to death twice now as I fumbled with the ALARM key and went to peri depth - let that be a lesson (year: '43)

evading at peridepth is from the sensors not possible... and form the dc not any more - good work :up:
increased sink rate almost got me ass once... only the trick with the obs scope saved me - good work :up:

[Meridian]

Any chance of getting this mod compatible with the GWX merged Campaign files?

Thanks.

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

first testing phase has ended official here

results:

almost bombed to death twice now as I fumbled with the ALARM key and went to peri depth - let that be a lesson (year: '43)

evading at peridepth is from the sensors not possible... and form the dc not any more - good work :up:
increased sink rate almost got me ass once... only the trick with the obs scope saved me - good work :up:

Thanks for the feedback! I appreciate it. One of my intentions was to make running at periscope depth something one only did when making observations, plotting an attack and making a creeping, stealthy attack approach, and not something you did to avoid and evade aircraft or escorts. Seems to be working! :D

@Meridian: I'd thought that had been resolved. I guess not. :cry: I'll have to look into that further.

[Yorktown_Class]

I just started using this mod,and was baffled as to how I was getting detected far out away from shore based aircraft,and I found out they was what looked like SBDs,so of coarse I thought carrier.
I had seen two Bouge class carriers were I never saw them before the mod was enabled.
I just watched the special,The search for I 52,about a Japanese sub making its way to German occupied France with war materials,and was detected by planes from the USS Bouge and sunk with using sonar bouys and homing torpedoes,then it started to make sense as to why I was seeing aircraft so far out to see,I just want to say,if this was your intention with this mod,you hit a home run,it just kind of fell into place for me..I really like this mod,sorry it took so long for me to try it...Thank you:up:

[Grayson02sept1980]

hi... bringing back this thread.

I have a problem again.

After I activated the files for the 10th / the Indian Ocean campaign I get ... sometimes ... gamecrashes as soon as the escorts start dropping DCs... I don't even get the first DC... right then the game crashes... I disabled the mod now and have no problem...

it is sad as this mod is one of the best! need to get it back working...