[REL] Manual targeting Ship Centered, Accuracy Fix

[CapnScurvy]

Ship_Centered_Accuracy_Fix 1.4 and 1.5
Compatible with patch 1.4 and 1.5 respectively

The latest edition(s) of SCAF have been released April, 2010. Scroll down to check what's new with this icon. :ping:

This modification for Silent Hunter 4 changes the target ships manual range finding reference point from the mast, to a more central location. This change will provide a greater amount of accuracy between the sub and target by using structures that are easily seen and have been calibrated for the Stadimeter. The new central positions may use the top of a ships funnel(s), carrier flight deck, top of flag, or other structure to provide this reference point. More importantly, these new positions were calibrated for accuracy with various ship headings and ranges. The changes will provide a needed correction to the stock game data. This correction is good for both metric and imperial game play. For an understanding of why this fix is needed please read the "Discussion" section further down this page.

Included within the mod are changes to the Recognition Manual, that have the new reference point marked on the ship with a red pencil. Plus changes to some of the ships pictures for easier identification such as, adding or subtracting guns or funnels as the particular ship is actually displayed. Enlarging and changing the compass, telegraph, and depth dials for easier reading. Adding a Nomograph to the Map page for easier speed finding. Including an optional Metric Nomograph to the download, plus an optional modification that changes the magnification of both periscopes, binocular, and deck gun views, to aid in ship identification and targeting. The U.S. Medals Fix II has also been included with all editions released after March, 2009.


This mod should be used with the stock SH4 game files unless otherwise noted. Below are various editions that are compatible with the stock game or modifications that are widely used with the stock game. Just click on the title to go to the link to download. Included is a readme document for proper installation and use. The mod is compatible with the Generic Mod Enabler (JSGME), see it's readme.txt for installation details.

Be aware, activating other related mods with this mod may contribute to problems of CTD's or other errors. If a mod does not say it is compatible with another, assume it is not.


For Stock Silent Hunter 4


>>>SCAF for SH 1.4 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=623) For Stock SH4 patched only to 1.4
Released May 6, 2008.


>>>SCAF for SH 1.5 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=615) For SH4 version 1.5 Addon
Released March 26, 2009.
This version is to be used with the U-Boat Missions Addon patched to 1.5

1. A total of 102 ship classes were calibrated for accuracy to include all Axis Warships and merchants, as well as all Allied Warships and merchants.


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For Trigger Maru Overhauled:

:ping:>>>SCAF for TMO 1.9 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=1730) This edition is compatible with the latest patch "TMO19_patch_25012010"
released April, 2010


It should be noted that SCAF was incorporated in the TMO 1.7 edition released March 31, 2009. The following editions are for eariler TMO versions.


>>>SCAF 1.5 for TMO1.6.3 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=621) This edition is to be used with TMO 1.6.2 Full and it's Patch 1.6.3
Released March 26, 2009.

Note: If you intend to also use the Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign mod with TMO use one of the below SCAF mods compatible with RSRDC and it's several versions.


>>>SCAF for TMO (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=663) For the older TMO version for SH4 patched only to 1.4
Released Aug. 17, 2008


=================


For Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign:


:ping:>>>SCAF for RSRDC v502 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=1731) This edition is compatible to an RSRDC version that is compatible to TMO 1.9. It's also compatible to the "RSRDC_v5xx_Patch"
Released April, 2010


It should be noted that SCAF was incorporated in the RSRDC for TMO 1.7 version. It was in the RSRDC_V410_Patch 2A which was released March 31, 2009. The following SCAF editions are for the earlier RSRDC versions.


>>>SCAF for RSRD v410 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=622) This version is for RSRDC that is compatible to the Trigger Maru 1.6.3 modification.
Released March 26, 2009.

This version of SCAF 1.5 is compatible with the latest release of RSRDC v410 which is used with the Trigger Maru 1.6.3 modification. The current RSRDC_v410_Patch 2 is also compatible. There have been corrected calibrations made to 154 ship classes with the combined mods.



Note: Pre Silent Hunter 4 U-Boat Missions Addon (patch 1.5)
Do to the fact that RSRDC does not support any of it's older modifications for a Silent Hunter 4 game patched only to the 1.4 version, I have removed any SCAF mods that were compatable with them.


=================


For Real Fleet Boat v2.0

At this time I do not have an edition for the latest RFB edition.


=================

MaxOptics


The Maxoptics mod will add additional zoom levels to the attack and observation periscopes and increase magnification by 100%. The binoculars and deck gun views were also increased.


These versions are for a SH4 game patched to 1.5 (using either the Gold Edition or the U-Boat Missions Add-on)

>>> MaxOptics IV for SH4 1.5 (http://www.filefront.com/15854091/MaxOptics-IV-for-SH4-1.5.rar/) This version is for a basic stock SH4 game patched to 1.5
Released March, 2010



>>> MaxOptics IV for TMO 1.9 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=1589) This version is compatable to the TMO 1.9 and its most current patch 25012010.
Released March, 2010

>>> MaxOptics IV for RFB 2.0 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=1614) This version is compatable to the RFB 1.2 and its most current patch 06Mar10.
Released March, 2010


>>> MaxOptics IV for GFO 1.1 (http://www.filefront.com/15854657/MaxOptics-IV-for-GFO-1.1.rar/) Compatable to GFO 1.1
Released March 2010



For Silent Hunter 4 patched only to 1.4

>>> Clayp's Optics for SH4 1.4 (http://www.filefront.com/15813153/Clayps-Optics-for-SH4-1-4.rar/)This version is for the basic stock SH4 game patched to 1.4.
Released March , 2010


>>> Clayp's Optics for RFB 1.4 (http://www.filefront.com/15814487/Clayps-Optics-for-RFB-1-4.rar/) This version is compatable to a Real Fleet Boat 1.4 modification
Released March, 2010


====================

Please read the included readme document for each edition for an explanation of how to correctly install and use

====================

I have a SCAF Range Test (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=651) mission for comparing the difference between the stock game and SCAF found target ranges. It has three stationary ships, at various distances with a stationary submerged boat. Follow the instructions for testing ranges found by the computer and by manually using SCAF/Stock reference point heights. I also have my handheld AoB Calculator (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=596), and a High Realism Tutorial (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=907) for learning manual targeting and Navigation Map plotting and a Practice Mission for the Tutorial. (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=668)





Discussion


Since the rollout of this game, I have wondered why I couldn't hit the broad side of a barn when manually targeting ships. Sure, if you get close enough you can do OK. I however, prefer not to use my sub as a battering ram to sink ships. So I started to test stationary targets, with stationary subs at known distances, set up within the mission editor. At the outset of the games release, the mast heights (which help determine manual found ranges) were kind of a mixture of "I think so", or "Sounds about right", set of values. Maybe there were some set to historical measurements, but historically accurate figures are useless to a game engine that doesn't know how to calculate them. An example was the aircraft carrier Hiryu, which had an original mast height of 20 meters. In my tests at a known distance of 1153 yards, the single mast (which held the flag) gave a manually found range of 650 yards. That's a 503 yard error!! The mast top was only partially visible since it would fade from view with the roll of the ship. The flag which extended into thin air, higher than the mast, showed a range of 624 yards, another quarter of a football field further off, or a 529 yard discrepancy!!

Grant you, our developers have made advances toward correcting this. With the 1.3 patch most all mast heights were changed. The 1.4 and 1.5 U-Boat Missions patch has made no changes to the individual ship measurements. The Hiryu now has a mast height of 31 meters. So how does this compare to the above test situation? At the same 1153 yard distance, the top of the flag yielded a range to target of 973 yards, with the top of the mast giving 1008 yards. An improvement, but using those mast height figures you will still miss the correct distance by 1 and a half football field lengths! They say "A miss is as good as a mile", and that's about what you have as a result. With my testing, just less than half the ship's have mast heights that were found to be off by greater than 1 meter, a few by as much as 5 to 8 meters. How much difference does 1 meter height make at a 1000 yards distance? It can be up to 50 yards difference in the actual range found measurement but, the difference will mount up exponential the further away you are.


Below is a picture of a U.S. Fleet Carrier showing its computer found range to target as 1611 meters in the Clipboard.


http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/SH4Img2009-03-03_1213.jpg


The next picture shows a stock Mast Height of 50 meters in the Recognition Manual, with a manually found range of 1475 meters to target. That's an 136 meter error from the actual distance of 1611 meters.


http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/SH4Img2009-03-03_1211.jpg


To correct the error the Mast Height should be 54.4 meters high. A 4.4 meter difference from the stock height. The following picture shows the SCAF 1.5 modification activated with the correct Mast Height in the Recognition Manual. Notice the small flag, it tells you the placement of the range finding image's ship waterline should be at the top of the flag. The manually found range is now corrected, with a distance of 1616 meters over the same actual distance of 1611 meters. 5 meters difference at over a 1500 meter distance is like hiting the bulls eye in darts.


http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/SH4Img2009-03-03_1233.jpg


Here's another example using a British River Class DD. It's stock Mast Height is 19.5 meters, with a manually found range of 894 meters. The actual distance from target is 1183 meters, a 289 meter error over a roughly 1000 meter average distance!!


http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/SH4Img2009-03-03_1202.jpg


The correct Mast Height should be 25.5 meters. With SACF 1.5 the manually found range to target is now correct at 1182 meters / actual distance 1183.


http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/SH4Img2009-03-03_1235.jpg


So, you may be asking, are there other ships not having correct mast heights, and by how much are they off? Here are a few other examples:

Stock Mast Heights/SCAF Mast Heights

Iowa ----------45.5/44.3

Colorado-------42.2/44

N. Carolina-----37.0/32.6

NorthHampton--47.0/49

HogsIsland-----28.0/24.7

Ger. Pocket BB-47.0/37.9

Hiryu CV-------31.0/37.5

Shokaku CV----29.0/32.4

Depending on the various mods that are used, there are specific errors with them that are put into the game, such as TMO:

Hiyru CV-------20.0/ 37.5 (this 20 meter figure goes back to before the SH4 Patch 1.3 ?!?)

SubChaser-----21.0/17.9

Shokaku CV----29.7/32.4

Bottom line, 1/3 to 1/2 of the mast heights need correcting by over 1 meter or greater. To be fair, there are a few (less than 10) that are correct but, most need tweeking.


Lets look at another problem of mast placement. The masts are rarely centered on the ship lengthwise, usually one set towards the bow, the other to the stern. Sometimes there is only one mast such as the following example of the aircraft carrier Taiyo. This picture displays the actual range to target of 1054 yards in the Position Keeper readout using the stock game measurements of the 1.4 patch.



http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Taiyo1st.jpg


The next picture shows the Stadimeter in use with its second image of the ships waterline on top of the mast. The range was already found once, and shows on the PK as 986 yards. That's a 68 yard difference, which is a lot better than the Hiryu's difference, but not good enough for me.


http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Taiyo2nd.jpg



This next picture shows the Ship_Centered_Accuracy_Fix mod enabled. You will note the Recognition Manual has a red line drawn over the flight deck of the carrier. This is the new reference point for the Taiyo. The Stadimeter's image is on the top of the flight deck, centered at the periscope's vertical crosshair. A previous range check has already been taken. The PK reads 1046 yards, just 8 yards difference from the actual distance of 1054. There is a reason why the distance is off 9 yards, which I'll get to later. For the most part that's not bad, considering the distance is greater than 1000 yards. I'll take an 8 yard difference over 68 yards any day.



http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Taiyo3rd.jpg


This next example will show the problem of varying mast heights with the light cruiser Kuma. The actual computer found range to target was 1114 yards. [By the way, if you want accurate computer range to target during the game, make sure you do not checkmark the game play option for Realistic Sensors. By going to the sonar station and inputting the view bearing to target onto the right hand bearing wheel, you can receive and send to the PK the actual correct range to target. Just be sure the bearing to target is +/- 2 degrees of the ship, or the sonar will miss its ping.



http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Kuma4th.jpg


The above picture shows the taller bow mast with the Stadimeter's image at its top. The range was already checked with a result of 1074 yards showing in the PK. Since the 1.4 patch, the Kuma's mast height is 35.6 meters. But the question is, which mast do you use? The picture below shows the smaller stern mast being checked with a result of 1208 yards to target. Either way, both are a long way from the 1114 actual yard distance.


http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Kuma5th.jpg



With the Ship_Centered_Accuracy_Fix enabled again, the Kuma has its centered funnel marked as a reference point for the Stadimeter. Placing the water line on top of the funnel, the PK shows the manual found range to be 1114 yards. That's right on the money.



http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Kuma6th.jpg



The Recognition Manual ship pictures will aid you in finding the correct reference point for the ships changed. Besides the examples above, other reference points are wires, or ship wheel house roofs. All were chosen to be as close to centered upon the ship and as visible as possible.


I mentioned there was a reason why the manually found range on the example above was not exactly on the button to the actual distances. You will note that the ships above were all about 30 degrees AoB. I found during my testing that when a target ship was positioned at 90 degrees AoB (at the same distance) there could be as much as 20 yards difference with the manually found ranges compared to it at 30 AoB. With some ships the difference was less, and others (like the Kuma) no difference at all. I believe the images within the periscope camera changed slightly to produce the difference. How or why I don't know, but a work around is to take an average difference for each ship and have this average your base figure for the Stadimeter to use. It's not perfect but better than the stock game figures. I debated for quite a while why a ship coming towards you at 1000 yards or more, should not give "spot on" correct range compared to a ship at 90 degrees. My conclusion was to settle for the average, giving equal range discrepancy to all possible ship headings.


Another problem worth mentioning is the way the Stadimeter reads its position in the periscope camera. As the overlay image is being lowered, you can hear a distinct clicking or ratchet sound representing the pixel horizontal lines that it passes. These pixel lines are defined through the individual ship mast height measurements. The smaller the mast height figure, the smaller the difference between adjacent pixel lines. I wondered why with stationary points (the sub and target ship), a range to target could be as much as 8 to12 yards off with what appeared to be an exact placement of the Stadimeter image. I found I was placing the waterline image just a bit off (onto the adjacent pixel line) due to the image actually changing. One second the top of the reference point image is there, the next it is gone. This difference can be somewhat manipulated by lowering the mast height but, the different camera position will also change to reflect the same basic difference in adjacent pixel lines. In other words the position of the waterline image when set towards the top, middle, or bottom of the periscope image will reflect a smaller, larger, or larger yet (respectively) difference in the range compared to its adjacent pixel line. I've tried to look for this effect within the game files, but a safe answer from me is it's hard coded in the game engine. I believe the reason for this is due to two things. First, a distant ship will appear lower to the waterline than a closer one, thus the closer the ship, the taller the ship within the periscope, the less variance between pixel lines when the Stadimeter is placed towards the top of the screen. Second, the developers designed a bit of realism into this portion of the game by not giving you the exact manual range every time you ask for it. A bit of variability is good for game play.


I stated above to place the Stadimeter's waterline overlay image at the center vertical crosshair with the carrier Taiyo. This is important since the basic game calculates distance from ships center to center. You can see this when working with the mission editor. Each ship is positioned and tracked as if it were on an unseen mathematical grid map. The game calculates these positions and can pinpoint the difference with ease. This is why the computer found ranges have always been correct within the game. When manually finding range, a different set of calculations are considered. However, some game aspects stay the same such as the "lock view" to target. The locked view is centered on the target no matter what the different ship angles or headings are. Please keep in mind, not all ships have a convenient centered reference point such as a funnel to use, and not all of them are perfectly centered. But when there are ships that have flight decks or wires that are shown for range finding reference use the vertical center line of the periscope or UZO to match up the overlay image to the reference point.


This post is getting way too lengthy. I covered the how, and why. Try it, and see if it doesn't increase your hit percentage with manual targeting.


Cheers

[capt_frank]

Looks great, thanks!

[nattydread]

Dude, that is sweet. It fixes the prblem with the thin masts not being drawn in or visible and longer ranges...that screws me up all the time for fast movers that dont provide much time for accurate ranging at close range.

[black1]

Tried it along with the T.M. 1.7 mod and it does need to overwrite a few things, but, got a CTD after a try out with the torpedoe mission. Probably because of T.M. 1.7 and the recognition manual changes. Looks interesting and will try it without T.M. 1.7 i really like T.M. though.

[fireship4]

Thanks for your hard work on this, looks to be very useful indeed. As to reality, i guess they chose the most appropriate height at the time and input it into the stadimeter, then did the measurements. Is this possible by moving bits on the stadimeter about?

[WernerSobe]

ive noticed that you have centered your horizon line with real horizon.

This is not necessary. The Stadimeter in 91KA40T/1.414HA Type periscope was gyrostabilized and this is modeled correctly in game. The horizon line is just a reference but basicly you dont need it for finding range. You can see what i mean in rough sea. Both images are jumping up and down but the difference between them remains.

Knowing that makes finding range a lot easier and saves time on fast movers since its one less thing to carry about. All you have to do is to make sure that mast and water line are coincident, forget about the horizon line.

[CapnScurvy]

By fireship4

As to reality, i guess they chose the most appropriate height at the time and input it into the stadimeter, then did the measurements. Is this possible by moving bits on the stadimeter about?


Sorry if I don't understand you, but I think your asking by moving the stadimeter waterline image to another spot on the ship that has a known height, could you get an accurate range to target? The short answer is yes and no. The spot would have to be calibrated to how the game calculates the particular height. Unfortunately the game does not take into account more than one point of reference height, nor does it consider the amount of difference the point could have when the ship is at different AoB positions. The AoB settings have no realationship to finding range, it only sets the gyro angle for the torpedos. So when you set the stadimeter to the stern mast the range reading will be off centered from the true center of the ship. This is providing the stern mast has been calibrated to be correct for the game calculations, which they are not!

Quite the conundrum indeed.

By WernerSobe

ive noticed that you have centered your horizon line with real horizon.

Thanks for noticing the detail, but its purely coincidental. I just left the periscope positioned wherever the opening screen took me. But your right, the periscope horizontal line has no bearing on range finding. So move the periscope up or down to whatever spot that suits you. The vertical line only helps in lining up the center of the ship when "locked" in view. If the vertical line is in the way of placing the Stadimeter waterline at the correct spot, "unlock" the view, and move it a bit out of the way. The line is only for reference.

[fireship4]

well what i meant was close to that.

You send the height of the mast (or whatever part) to the stadimeter using the numbers in the manual, before you do the split imaging. What im saying is there a way to manually input the height into the stadimeter, maybe through one of the dials on the stadimeter.

[CapnScurvy]

By fireship4

You send the height of the mast (or whatever part) to the stadimeter using the numbers in the manual, before you do the split imaging. What im saying is there a way to manually input the height into the stadimeter, maybe through one of the dials on the stadimeter.


Ok, I'm a bit dense but I understand the question now. Yes, the Attack Data Tool (the dial that has multiple parts to it, one of which is the Stadimeter, in the right top corner) can have the mouse click & drag the outer marker to any height measurement you choose. So lets say in the game manual or someone else's historically accurate manual (or for that matter a fictitious manual) you read the measurement to the poop deck is 110 ft. You can move the Attack Data Tool dial to 110 ft. and take a Stadimeter reading of the poop deck (wherever that is), and a range to target will appear in the Position Keeper. Will this range be correct? Probably not, because the height must be calibrated to the ship at a known correct distance before it will be accurate. If I were part of the game engine design team I might understand the complete equation and match the correct figures together to get accurate findings. Since I'm not, the only part I can manipulate is the mast height figure and calibrate it to a known distance for a particular ship.

[rascal101]

Hi CapnScurvy,

Just a thought, I understood the way the stock range finder works ie against mast height. Was this how the original US range finding system worked, I understood that at least in this regard the US targeting system was quite advanced, (for their day) as compared to other nations.

Is the targeting system featured in the game historically accurate?

My real question is this:

As a former photographer I used Range Finder Cameras, unlike the old, film, not digital SLRs where you focused through the lens, with a range finder you start with two converging images, which gradually you converge until they were exactly superimposed when you were properly focused.

I never understood why the US targeting system was calibrated against mast height when perhaps it would have been easier, not to mention quicker to set range by simply adjusting two opposing images of the target in the perescope view until they were superimposed exactly, and you took your range from the resultant sharply focused image.

What I'm trying to say is why stop at the deck height or smoke stack height, why not just set your system by the direct focus system I'm trying to describe above.

Hope I am describing the concept so folks can understand what I'm trying to describe

Regards
Rascal


By fireship4

You send the height of the mast (or whatever part) to the stadimeter using the numbers in the manual, before you do the split imaging. What im saying is there a way to manually input the height into the stadimeter, maybe through one of the dials on the stadimeter.

Ok, I'm a bit dense but I understand the question now. Yes, the Attack Data Tool (the dial that has multiple parts to it, one of which is the Stadimeter, in the right top corner) can have the mouse click & drag the outer marker to any height measurement you choose. So lets say in the game manual or someone else's historically accurate manual (or for that matter a fictitious manual) you read the measurement to the poop deck is 110 ft. You can move the Attack Data Tool dial to 110 ft. and take a Stadimeter reading of the poop deck (wherever that is), and a range to target will appear in the Position Keeper. Will this range be correct? Probably not, because the height must be calibrated to the ship at a known correct distance before it will be accurate. If I were part of the game engine design team I might understand the complete equation and match the correct figures together to get accurate findings. Since I'm not, the only part I can manipulate is the mast height figure and calibrate it to a known distance for a particular ship.

[WernerSobe]

Hi CapnScurvy,

Just a thought, I understood the way the stock range finder works ie against mast height. Was this how the original US range finding system worked, I understood that at least in this regard the US targeting system was quite advanced, (for their day) as compared to other nations.

Is the targeting system featured in the game historically accurate?

My real question is this:

As a former photographer I used Range Finder Cameras, unlike the old, film, not digital SLRs where you focused through the lens, with a range finder you start with two converging images, which gradually you converge until they were exactly superimposed when you were properly focused.

I never understood why the US targeting system was calibrated against mast height when perhaps it would have been easier, not to mention quicker to set range by simply adjusting two opposing images of the target in the perescope view until they were superimposed exactly, and you took your range from the resultant sharply focused image.

What I'm trying to say is why stop at the deck height or smoke stack height, why not just set your system by the direct focus system I'm trying to describe above.

Hope I am describing the concept so folks can understand what I'm trying to describe

Regards
Rascal


If you are interested in details how the stadimeter and periscope worked i suggest reading this:

http://www.hnsa.org/doc/fleetsub/index.htm

very interestning find if you want to study every screw and bolt of the fleet type submarine ;-) Including pretty detailed description of its optics, its in periscope manual.

By the way... looking at this ive found a very interestning detail. Looks like the stadimeter was not just able to find range by displacing two pictures verticaly. It could also be moved horizontaly to find AoB. To bad its not in game.

But to your question. The method you are talking about is just and simple not acurate enough. It becomes very inacurate at great ranges. And they took masts as reference points because they returned the highest angles. They wanted the reference angle as high as possible because it made the calculations more acurate. And remember they had no problems with limited screen resolutions :-)

[CapnScurvy]

Hi CapnScurvy,

Just a thought, I understood the way the stock range finder works ie against mast height. Was this how the original US range finding system worked, I understood that at least in this regard the US targeting system was quite advanced, (for their day) as compared to other nations.

Is the targeting system featured in the game historically accurate?

My real question is this:

As a former photographer I used Range Finder Cameras, unlike the old, film, not digital SLRs where you focused through the lens, with a range finder you start with two converging images, which gradually you converge until they were exactly superimposed when you were properly focused.

I never understood why the US targeting system was calibrated against mast height when perhaps it would have been easier, not to mention quicker to set range by simply adjusting two opposing images of the target in the perescope view until they were superimposed exactly, and you took your range from the resultant sharply focused image.

What I'm trying to say is why stop at the deck height or smoke stack height, why not just set your system by the direct focus system I'm trying to describe above.

Hope I am describing the concept so folks can understand what I'm trying to describe

Regards
Rascal


A couple of really good questions. First I will defer answering the historical accuracy question to those more educated than myself in submariner history. My off the cuff thoughts are that there was no such thing as an Attack Data Tool or a Position Keeper that kept the info nice and neat. I would also guess that the horizontal lines within the periscope were the guage an experienced captain used to compare structures with known heights and made calculations for range by hand math. But, I'm just guessing. I hope someone could help us both out on this one.

For your second question, I do understand. Its been a long time, but I seem to remember a sub game that did just as you describe. It overlayed the image with a blurry one, and once focused you could get the estimated range to target. I don't wish to sell anyone short within this community who could correct me for saying this but I don't think the capabilities of changing SH4 to this type of game play could be done outside the game developers. I'm sure I could not.

[WernerSobe]

A couple of really good questions. First I will defer answering the historical accuracy question to those more educated than myself in submariner history. My off the cuff thoughts are that there was no such thing as an Attack Data Tool or a Position Keeper that kept the info nice and neat. I would also guess that the horizontal lines within the periscope were the guage an experienced captain used to compare structures with known heights and made calculations for range by hand math. But, I'm just guessing. I hope someone could help us both out on this one.

For your second question, I do understand. Its been a long time, but I seem to remember a sub game that did just as you describe. It overlayed the image with a blurry one, and once focused you could get the estimated range to target. I don't wish to sell anyone short within this community who could correct me for saying this but I don't think the capabilities of changing SH4 to this type of game play could be done outside the game developers. I'm sure I could not.
look at my previous post there is a link to fleet boat manual.

So to answer your question. It is very good modeled in sh4. They had all this. Position keeper, stadimeter (even more powerfull one that could find AoB too) all these tools. Actualy they had even more toys then what we have so firing solutions were pretty advanced at that time id even say they had it easier.

They had other problems though. They didnt have data for every ship. Often they had to guess the mast high, lenght and draft. It sounds like a very inacurate method but guessing a size of a ship is not that hard. Its easier in real world because a simulation can never convey the right proportions to our eyes. Just look outside your window and try to guess a size of something big (bridge/house etc) you will see you are pretty good ad guessing sizes. Expirenced submariners are even better at guessing the size of ships.

And thats were they needed the vertical marks in optics. When they had to guess the high of unknown vessel. They used the marks for reference on something which size they would guess best.

Example. youre trying to guess the mast high of unknown vessel. You look at it and find a seaman smoking on deck. You know that a seaman is about 5 feet tall. So you try to fit him between two marks. When you found something he fits in just count how often you can put a 5 feet tall seaman into the mast. Of course sometimes there are no seaman on decks but then you can just take containers, cars/tanks or anything else...

edit: irony of destiny - if that seaman smoking on deck was just a head taller, that might have saved his life :-)

[CapnScurvy]

Thanks WernerSobe for the answers.

I just had no idea how advanced the TDC really was for a WWII sub. You mentioned the original devices calculated the Aob as well. That is one reason why I tried to center the reference points as much as possible on the target ship. The game could have used the AoB bearing inputted through the Attack Data Tool for figuring the difference in mast placement comparied to the center of the ship, but it doesn't. It's probably just as well, there would have been another calculation required to find range. So, you get a different range finding because of the off centerd position of the mast.


It sounds like a very inacurate method but guessing a size of a ship is not that hard. Its easier in real world because a simulation can never convey the right proportions to our eyes. Just look outside your window and try to guess a size of something big (bridge/house etc) you will see you are pretty good ad guessing sizes.


That's exactly what I have noticed too. Judging distance and size can be fairly easy in real life. With a little practice we have all learned not to walk off the side of a cliff (well we try not to anyway). But, the game only provides a 2 dimensional image. The screen that your looking into is still flat, it has no depth, even if the images are drawn in 3 dimension. Take your sugestion of looking out the window and make a perception estimate of any object. Now cover one eye, and try to make the same perception. It's not nearly as easy or accurate. Thats exactly what the game is revealing to us with its 3 dimensional image on a 2 dimensional screen. The game image is comparable to looking at real life with one eye closed.

[gg5056]

Ship_Centered_Accuracy_Fix
Compatible with patch 1.4



This modification for Silent Hunter 4 changes the target ship’s manual range finding reference point from the mast, to a more central location. This change will provide a greater amount of accuracy between the sub and target by using structures that are easily seen and have been calibrated for the Stadimeter. The new central positions may use the top of a ship’s funnel(s), carrier flight deck, or other structures to provide this reference point. These new positions were calibrated for accuracy with various ship headings and ranges. The changes will provide a needed correction to the stock game data. This correction is good for both metric and imperial game play.

The changes are:

1. All mast heights for Japanese (Axis) warships and merchants were changed (except smaller vessels such as sampans and fishing boats), plus Allied merchant ships (Allied warships were not changed). A total of 57 ship classes were modified.


2. The Recognition Manual includes a stock game ship picture that is highlighted (in red) to indicate the correct Stadimeter reference point for manual range finding. Correct text for the new positions, plus a repositioning of the next/previous page buttons to a more convenient setting.



The mod is compatible with the Generic Mod Enabler (JSGME), and uses the JTxE.exe (.ini installer by jimimadrid) to place some of its components into the game with minimal interference to other mods. Both installers can be found within the subsim.com website. See the readme.txt for installation details.


The Ship_Centered_Accuracy_Fix is in .rar format for ease of download, and can be found at the below listed site:


http://Hosted.FileFront.com/Capnscurvy/



Discussion


Since the rollout of this game, I have wondered why I couldn’t hit the broad side of a barn when manually targeting ships. Sure, if you get close enough you can do OK. I however, prefer not to use my sub as a battering ram to sink ships. So I started to test stationary targets, with stationary subs at known distances, set up within the mission editor. At the outset of the game’s release, the mast heights (which help determine manual found ranges) were kind of a mixture of “I think so, or sounds about right” set of values. Maybe there were some set to historical measurements, but historically accurate figures are useless to a game engine that doesn’t know how to calculate them. An example was the aircraft carrier Hiryu, which had an original mast height of 20 meters. In my tests at a known distance of 1153 yards, the single mast (which held the flag) gave a manually found range of 650 yards! The mast top was only partially visible since it would fade from view with the roll of the ship. The flag which extended into thin air, higher than the mast, showed a range of 624 yards, another quarter of a football field further off!! Grant you, our developers have made advances toward correcting this. With the 1.3 patch most all mast heights were changed. The 1.4 patch has made no changes to the individual ship measurements. The Hiryu now has a mast height of 31 meters. So how does this compare to the above test situation? At the same 1153 yard distance, the top of the flag yielded a range to target of 973 yards, with the top of the mast giving 1008 yards. An improvement, but using those mast height figures you will still miss the correct distance by 1 and a half football field lengths! They say “a miss is as good as a mile”, and that’s about what you have as a result.


Let’s look at another problem of mast placement. The masts are rarely centered on the ship lengthwise, usually one set towards the bow, the other to the stern. Sometimes there is only one mast such as the following example of the aircraft carrier Taiyo. This picture displays the actual range to target of 1054 yards in the Position Keeper readout using the stock game measurements of the 1.4 patch.



http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Taiyo1st.jpg


The next picture shows the Stadimeter in use with its second image of the ship’s waterline on top of the mast. The range was already found once, and shows on the PK as 986 yards. That’s a 68 yard difference, which is a lot better than the Hiryu’s difference, but not good enough for me.


http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Taiyo2nd.jpg



This next picture shows the Ship_Centered_Accuracy_Fix mod enabled. You will note the Recognition Manual has a red line drawn over the flight deck of the carrier. This is the new reference point for the Taiyo. The Stadimeter’s image is on the top of the flight deck, centered at the periscope’s vertical crosshair. A previous range check has already been taken. The PK reads 1046 yards, just 8 yards difference from the actual distance of 1054. There is a reason why the distance is off 9 yards, which I’ll get to later. For the most part that’s not bad, considering the distance is greater than 1000 yards. I’ll take an 8 yard difference over 68 yards any day.



http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Taiyo3rd.jpg


This next example will show the problem of varying mast heights with the light cruiser Kuma. The actual computer found range to target was 1114 yards. [By the way, if you want accurate computer range to target during the game, make sure you do not checkmark the game play option for Realistic Sensors. By going to the sonar station and inputting the view bearing to target onto the right hand bearing wheel, you can receive and send to the PK the actual correct range to target. Just be sure the bearing to target is +/- 2 degrees of the ship or the sonar will miss its ping.]



http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Kuma4th.jpg


The above picture shows the taller bow mast with the Stadimeter’s image at its top. The range was already checked with a result of 1074 yards showing in the PK. Since the 1.4 patch, the Kuma’s mast height is 35.6 meters. But the question is, which mast do you use? The picture below shows the smaller stern mast being checked with a result of 1208 yards to target. Either way, both are a long way from the 1114 actual yard distance.


http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Kuma5th.jpg



With the Ship_Centered_Accuracy_Fix enabled again, the Kuma has its centered funnel marked as a reference point for the Stadimeter. Placing the water line on top of the funnel, the PK shows the manual found range to be 1114 yards. That’s right on the money.



http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Kuma6th.jpg



The Recognition Manual ship pictures will aid you in finding the correct reference point for the ships changed. Besides the examples above, other reference points are wires, or ship wheel house roofs. All were chosen to be as close to centered upon the ship and as visible as possible.


I mentioned there was a reason why the manually found range on the example above was not exactly on the button to the actual distances. You will note that the ships above were all about 30 degrees AoB. I found during my testing that when a target ship was positioned at 90 degrees AoB (at the same distance) there could be as much as 20 yards difference with the manually found ranges compared to it at 30 AoB. With some ships the difference was less, and others (like the Kuma) no difference at all. I believe the images within the periscope camera changed slightly to produce the difference. How or why I don’t know, but a work around is to take an average difference for each ship and have this average your base figure for the Stadimeter to use. It’s not perfect but better than the stock game figures. I debated for quite a while why a ship coming towards you at 1000 yards or more, should not give “spot on” correct range compared to a ship at 90 degrees. My conclusion was to settle for the average, giving equal range discrepancy to all possible ship headings.


Another problem worth mentioning is the way the Stadimeter reads its position in the periscope camera. As the overlay image is being lowered, you can hear a distinct clicking or ratchet sound representing the pixel horizontal lines that it passes. These pixel lines are defined through the individual ship mast height measurements. The smaller the mast height figure, the smaller the difference between adjacent pixel lines. I wondered why with stationary points (the sub and target ship), a range to target could be as much as 8 to12 yards off with what appeared to be an exact placement of the Stadimeter image. I found I was placing the waterline image just a bit off (onto the adjacent pixel line) due to the image actually changing. One second the top of the reference point image is there, the next it is gone. This difference can be somewhat manipulated by lowering the mast height but, the different camera position will also change to reflect the same basic difference in adjacent pixel lines. In other words the position of the waterline image when set towards the top, middle, or bottom of the periscope image will reflect a smaller, larger, or larger yet (respectively) difference in the range compared to its adjacent pixel line. I’ve tried to look for this effect within the game files, but a safe answer from me is it’s hard coded in the game engine. I believe the reason for this is due to two things. First, a distant ship will appear lower to the waterline than a closer one, thus the closer the ship, the taller the ship within the periscope, the less variance between pixel lines when the Stadimeter is placed towards the top of the screen. Second, the developers designed a bit of realism into this portion of the game by not giving you the exact manual range every time you ask for it. A bit of variability is good for game play.


I stated above to place the Stadimeter’s waterline overlay image at the center vertical crosshair with the carrier Taiyo. This is important since the basic game calculates distance from ship’s center to center. You can see this when working with the mission editor. Each ship is positioned and tracked as if it were on an unseen mathematical grid map. The game calculates these positions and can pinpoint the difference with ease. This is why the computer found ranges have always been correct within the game. When manually finding range, a different set of calculations are considered. However, some game aspects stay the same such as the “lock view” to target. The locked view is centered on the target no matter what the different ship angles or headings are. Please keep in mind, not all ships have a convenient centered reference point such as a funnel to use, and not all of them are perfectly centered. But when there are ships that have flight decks or wires that are shown for range finding reference use the vertical center line of the periscope or UZO to match up the overlay image to the reference point.


This post is getting way too lengthy. I covered the how, and why. Try it, and see if it doesn’t increase your hit percentage with manual targeting.


Cheers

Tried it works great. Very easy to line up with top of funnal, than masts.

great job, Thanks

[Drakken]

Neato! :up:

Will you try to make it compatible with TM in a near future?

[CapnScurvy]

By Drakken

Will you try to make it compatible with TM in a near future?


Yes, I think I will. Right now I am working with the Real Fleet Boat mod and should finish my tests with it soon. I am finding there is a small difference with RFB from the stock game version with image size. So a bit of tweaking will match the accuracy between the two. I am already impressed with the image though, the flicker I became so use to with the stock game is gone. This should create an even better visual environment to find the top of a funnel/structure. Due to the time I have spent with my mod, I have had little chance in knowing what others have done or how my mod will work with them. Through my own testing I have found that changing AngularAngle or image Clip distance, or magnification in the camera files, will create the need to recalibrate the ship heights to match the true range to target.

[rascal101]

Thanks to both for answering my questions

R

[LukeFF]

Tried it works great. Very easy to line up with top of funnal, than masts.

great job, Thanks
You don't need to re-quote every single damn image in your post, when they're right above yours. :roll:

[fireship4]

what might be good is to have screenshots in the manual instead of diagrams. If we did, we could put lines beside the ship graduated in feet and maybe a few choice areas specifically marked with exact height on the screenshot. This way we could choose ourselves which point to measure from (ie, funnel, mast, top of bridge) if we did not have a clear sight of one area.

With screenshots you can be sure that the proportions are correct, even if they are not historically accurate.

[CapnScurvy]

Fireship4

The problem with having multiple sites? The game is only capable of calculating from one site. That's hard coded in the game engine. There is nothing we can do about that. What we can do, is change the one reference site (if we wish), calibrate it to a correct distance and use it the best we can. :yep:

[fireship4]

Yes I understand the game is only able to have one sight as part of the recognition manual which can be sent to the TDC through it.

What I meant is that on the ship display picture there could be multiple labels showing various heights on the ship - this is a matter of photoshopping a screenshot and no coding need be done.

Then you can personally choose a height and manually input it into the stadimeter, before taking your split image measurement.

[rocco]

Thank you.

I was just about to go back to auto target because I noticed the stadimeter wasn't giving acurate ranges (off by 300 yds at 1000 yds range sometimes).

Did a search here for stadimeter and thank god this thread was listed near the top!

hope I installed it right, never used JTxE before.

Thanks again Capn':up:

Rocco

[Schultzy]

You're a clever man Capn! :arrgh!:

Thanks a lot, it makes a big difference!

[Doolittle81]

Am I correct in assuming that one must choose either this Mod OR the "SHIV Recognition Manual" by FooFighters.

[CapnScurvy]

By Doolittle81

Am I correct in assuming that one must choose either this Mod OR the "SHIV Recognition Manual" by FooFighters.

I don't have any idea. I do not know what the Foofighter manual is nor do I know what my mod has to do with it.

[Schultzy]

Am I correct in assuming that one must choose either this Mod OR the "SHIV Recognition Manual" by FooFighters.

Taken from the FAQ in Foofighter's thread:

2) Is this mod compatible with other mods ?
- Yes, with ROW, Run Silent Run Deep, Trigger Maru 1.7, Manual targeting ship centered

hth :)

[Doolittle81]

Am I correct in assuming that one must choose either this Mod OR the "SHIV Recognition Manual" by FooFighters.

Taken from the FAQ in Foofighter's thread:

2) Is this mod compatible with other mods ?
- Yes, with ROW, Run Silent Run Deep, Trigger Maru 1.7, Manual targeting ship centered

hth :)
Thanks...I didn't read the small print in the Foo thread...I apologize.

[FooFighters]

Am I correct in assuming that one must choose either this Mod OR the "SHIV Recognition Manual" by FooFighters.

Taken from the FAQ in Foofighter's thread:

2) Is this mod compatible with other mods ?
- Yes, with ROW, Run Silent Run Deep, Trigger Maru 1.7, Manual targeting ship centered

hth :)
Thanks...I didn't read the small print in the Foo thread...I apologize.

It's compatible, There is just one slight problem.
If you use mods like TM and RDRSC you will have some new added ships that does not have these new mast heights.

[hyperion2206]

I tried to download your mod, but it only takes me to the filefront homepage.:doh:

EDIT: Funny, now it has worked.

[CapnScurvy]

First up

By Doolittle81

Thanks...I didn't read the small print in the Foo thread...I apologize.


No need to apologize around here. The worst question you could have is the one you don't ask! :lol:

By Foofighters

It's compatible, There is just one slight problem.
If you use mods like TM and RDRSC you will have some new added ships that does not have these new mast heights


I have been working with both Trigger Maru and Real Fleet Boat to make the range correction compatible for both. The different approachs for their respective mods has caused me to tweak the pictures or move the text or change the text a bit. All cosmetic, the same basic reference point changes work equally well for the two. Both are working on new releases and my mod should work right in.

As far as one mod being compatible with another it just depends which files are different and which are the same. AND which mod gets loaded last. If two mods change the same file (although the changes were in different areas of the file), the last mod to be loaded will overwrite the other erasing the first mods part of the file. This is why I elected to use the JTxE.exe enabler by Jimimadrid which can change pieces of the same file without overwriting the rest. I'm planning to start a new thread regarding JTxE and its benifits to modding so I really don't want to get too involved, but its the next best thing for us to use.


By Hyperion2206

I tried to download your mod, but it only takes me to the filefront homepage.

EDIT: Funny, now it has worked.


Yep, thats happened to me several times on FileFront with other downloads. You will see the correct download page created for a second or two, but by the time you get your mouse moving the page changes to FileFronts home page. Going back to the url link will get you thru, but it may take a couple of tries. FileFront hiccups.

[hyperion2206]

Yes, filefront is a bit touchy at times.:shifty: I really don want to put any pressure on you BUT...;)
do you know if your mod is compatible with TM 1.7.2 and FooBar's updated Recognition manual?

[CapnScurvy]

do you know if your mod is compatible with TM 1.7.2 and FooBar's updated Recognition manual?


"Yesterday...December 7th,1941---a date which will live in infamy---" No better words could have described that day.

No, and yes Hyperion,
I wish to report that sadly the Ship_Centered_Accuracy_Fix did not become inbedded with the Trigger Maru 1.7.2 release.

Ducimus states: "ALso for now, i do not recommend anyone run ANY MODS with Tmaru 1.7, except maybe sub skins. The only mod i would recommend, is RSRD for Tmaru 1.7 if and when lurker_hlb3 makes a version compatible with both patch 1.4, and TM 1.7.

Since most mods are in a state of flux right now, i do not recommend running any mod in tandom with TMaru, this is also why in packaged more into it this time. This includes 90% of ROW at the moment. The only ROW mods i could recommend, is anything that is a DDS file. If its not a DDS file (IE, textures), id wait for Leovampire and company to make a 1.4 update."

Considering this, I am just as well not involved with the mod until other aspects shake out. Being the new kid on the block usually gets the evil-eye. So I proprose to wait one week for the community to take TM 1.7.2 out for a run and see what your game reports are. If their positive, I'll be happy to release my mod next Saturday. If not, you won't be playing TM anyway. I had sent my portion of S_C_A_F for TM to Ducimus so it's ready for release, but sitting on it for now would be the best thing for me and You. You can still download the stock game version to try and enjoy, but for now I will take the same approach as Ducimus and tell you don't run it with any other mods. My mod has started to use the JTxE utility, if all mods used it the tool should help in cross overlay of file changes that creates incompatibility.

As far as I know Real Fleet Boat will include S_C_A_F with their next release.

As far as Foofighters manual I have not looked at it just yet (other irons in the fire). I did download it and will check it today for compatibility. To best serve the wide range of mods and gamer interests. I think either having my mod inbedded into the supermods like TM or RFB, or having specific editions especially made for each is the best course. That includes a smaller mod like Foos Rec Manual.

Cheers

[hyperion2206]

Thank you for your reply. Since I can't play SH4 without TM I just have to wait until it's safe to use your mod but I'm sure it will be worth the wait.:yep:
BTW: I love your tutorial on the AOB, now I frequently use your AOB calculator!:rock::up:

[Webster]

can this be done for auto targetting as well for stock game 1.4 ?

the auto targetting of torps ends up with 95% of the time your hitting props and rudders of ships at 1000 range or more if not seeing the torp pass just behind the target.

im not sure what is the best "fix" for this, but it is something i wish could be corrected.

im not talking about ships speeding up or manuvering out of the torp path but rather the average target point seams to be the stern rather than midships.

[CapnScurvy]

the auto targetting of torps ends up with 95% of the time your hitting props and rudders of ships at 1000 range or more if not seeing the torp pass just behind the target.

im not sure what is the best "fix" for this, but it is something i wish could be corrected.


In my opinion, if it has to do with the computer finding the correct angle or speed I think we are out of luck. I have seen the samething with my tests of stationary ships and wondered why does'nt the torpedos line up straight to the front of the sub when the target is at 0 speed. I think the computer found aim is a smidgen off. I asked Maerean M about the pixel horizontal lines creating too much of a difference in range when pulling the Stadimeters waterline image over the periscope camera. He said that it was hard coded and they didn't think it was a parameter for us to use at this time. So maybe if we sweet talk the devs, they may consider opening up the computer found speed area for modification. At least maybe a report to them may correct it if there was another patch in store.


BTW: I love your tutorial on the AOB, now I frequently use your AOB calculator!:rock::up:


Thank you very much! That stuff has been around for so long I didn't think anyone used it. Now that the Navigation Map has 50 unit measurements (meters or yards) instead of tenths of nm, I'm looking foward to revising the Tutorial for High Realism Play. AND I hope to make another AoB Calculator that can be downloaded with a PDF file so we can get a better resolution of the images. The .jpg images lose a lot of detail.

[hyperion2206]

BTW: I love your tutorial on the AOB, now I frequently use your AOB calculator!:rock::up:

Thank you very much! That stuff has been around for so long I didn't think anyone used it. Now that the Navigation Map has 50 unit measurements (meters or yards) instead of tenths of nm, I'm looking foward to revising the Tutorial for High Realism Play. AND I hope to make another AoB Calculator that can be downloaded with a PDF file so we can get a better resolution of the images. The .jpg images lose a lot of detail.
I have to admit that I found your calculator by accident, but it's really helpful!:yep: I wish you good luck with the PDF version of it, a little more detail wouldn't hurt.;):up:

EDIT: I've seen that you uploaded a new version of your mod. Am I right when I think that your mod should only be used with SH4 1.4 aka "vanilla game"?

[CapnScurvy]

EDIT: I've seen that you uploaded a new version of your mod. Am I right when I think that your mod should only be used with SH4 1.4 aka "vanilla game"?

Yes, for now just use it by itself. I've started to look at how it will work with Foofighters Rec Manual and should have an edition that works in a day or two. And while I've been at it I will have one compatable for Trigger Maru 1.7.2 this weekend. I have wanted to see how the new TM is working out before I bring another mod to the table. AND the release of the latest Real Fleet Boat supermod will include it as well.

Cheers

[Doolittle81]

editing

[CapnScurvy]

I have revised the Ship_Centered_Accuracy_Fix to a 1.1 stock SH4 version. Extending the calibrated range distance to 1500 yards, adding 3 more ship classes to a total of 61, and removed the use of the second enabler (JTxE text merger) which proved to compete with JSGME (or JSGME competed too much with it?).

With this release I also added two editions of my mod specifically made to accompany the two mods "Foofighters Recognition Manual for stock SH4" and "Trigger Maru 1.7.2". These two editions are ment to be installed after their respective companion mods, and should work well. I have not attempted to consider compatability with the two mods when other mods are installed (except for a mod such as ROW, which deals only with graphic effects, there should be no problem with it. HOWEVER, I have heard that ROW may not be compatible with the 1.4 patch so there goes that theory). So be aware that mixing mods can be a tricky buisness. I took the time to incorporate their part with mine to blend them, making the installation as simple as I could.

[hyperion2206]

Thank you for your great work, but before I download it I got to ask a question:
I've TM 1.7.2 and FooFighters Recognition manual installed, so which version of your mod do I have to download?

[CapnScurvy]

Thank you for your great work, but before I download it I got to ask a question:
I've TM 1.7.2 and FooFighters Recognition manual installed, so which version of your mod do I have to download?

I have just uploaded the edition of SCAF that should work with the combination of
the two. The two editions that were posted on Filefront yesterday are specifically stand alone editions for those respective mods. When you wish to add SCAF to the two combined, I suggest you use the edition called "SCAF4FooRM+TM1.7.2" (the + is missing at the Filefront site, but you'll find the right one). Read the inclosed documentation for how to down load and use. Keep your fingers crossed too, I just don't like to have a mod, cover a mod, that covers a mod. Too many things have to be in a row in order for them to cooperate with each other. :roll:

[hyperion2206]

Thank you for your great work, but before I download it I got to ask a question:
I've TM 1.7.2 and FooFighters Recognition manual installed, so which version of your mod do I have to download?
I have just uploaded the edition of SCAF that should work with the combination of
the two. The two editions that were posted on Filefront yesterday are specifically stand alone editions for those respective mods. When you wish to add SCAF to the two combined, I suggest you use the edition called "SCAF4FooRM+TM1.7.2" (the + is missing at the Filefront site, but you'll find the right one). Read the inclosed documentation for how to down load and use. Keep your fingers crossed too, I just don't like to have a mod, cover a mod, that covers a mod. Too many things have to be in a row in order for them to cooperate with each other. :roll:

I can totally understand you and I'm impressed that you try to please everybody! To quote the BDU: "Keep up the good work!":up::rock:

[DrBeast]

I really hate asking for stuff, but could it be possible to make an RSRDC-compatible version of this mod as well? :D Pretty please with extra beer on the house? :cool:

Also, since this is for patch 1.4, what needs to be done to make it 1.3-compatible? Are there only changes in menu_1024.ini involved?

[CapnScurvy]

MY BAD!!!

Yesterday afternoon, when I released this SCAF for Foofighters RM + TM 1.7.2 mod I missed the correct ship pictures for the RM. We went out and on our return home at 9PM the electric had been off for an hour. Electricity returned at 6AM this morning with an overnite low of 14 degrees (-10c) so a make shift bed in front of the fire place got us thru. It wasn't till later I found my error. The corrected mod is at Filefront with the title "SCAF4FOORM4TM_1.7.2", dated Dec. 17. :oops:

One note though, Foofighters RM+TM1.7.2 does not contain the Parker patrol boats that TM 1.7.2 has. This kind of stuff is what I referred to when I spoke about mods covering mods, covering mods. The last mod activated is only as good as the previous mod. Its a simple mistake but Foofighter should be told.


I really hate asking for stuff, but could it be possible to make an RSRDC-compatible version of this mod as well? :D Pretty please with extra beer on the house?

Yes, I plan to, maybe nothing much to it at all. I will have to look.

This mod as written works equally well with the 1.3 patch. Again, watch what you combine it with. As Dad used to tell us when he had chef suprise (beef tongue or head cheese to name a couple) "There ain't nothin' in there that`ill hurt you". :huh:

[hyperion2206]

I use TM and RSRDC and so far I don't have any trouble with SCAF for Foofighters RM + TM 1.7.2, so I guess it's safe to use.

[DrBeast]

I really hate asking for stuff, but could it be possible to make an RSRDC-compatible version of this mod as well? :D Pretty please with extra beer on the house?

Yes, I plan to, maybe nothing much to it at all. I will have to look.

This mod as written works equally well with the 1.3 patch. Again, watch what you combine it with. As Dad used to tell us when he had chef suprise (beef tongue or head cheese to name a couple) "There ain't nothin' in there that`ill hurt you". :huh:
Like I said yesterday, I hate to ask for stuff, so I decided to take a peek at the files and see what needs to be done, both with regards to 1.3 compatibility and making it RSRDC-compatible. For the first issue, one just needs to copy over the changes to rec manual layout from menu_1024.ini and omit all the new entries introduced with 1.4, and also change a couple of lines in menu.txt (mast becomes funnel/structure). Pretty easy, done that already. As for RSRDC, I took notice of which files this mod would overwrite if I installed on top of RSRDC. I then checked out those files (all .cfg, by the way), and copied over only the mast height differences from this mod to the RSRDC files, leaving everything else intact (some small variations in width, length, displacement and speed, as well as air groups). Seems to work ok. If lurker is ok with it, I can submit you an RSRDC-ready version to save you from the hassle ;)

[black1]

Hello Capnscurvy, write now i use 1.4ROW, T.M.1.7.2,RSRDC118 for T.M. Which version of your mod should i use and what order should it all be in, at the moment that is the order my mods are in. Thanks mate i appreciate your hard work.

[lurker_hlb3]

I really hate asking for stuff, but could it be possible to make an RSRDC-compatible version of this mod as well? :D Pretty please with extra beer on the house?

Yes, I plan to, maybe nothing much to it at all. I will have to look.

This mod as written works equally well with the 1.3 patch. Again, watch what you combine it with. As Dad used to tell us when he had chef suprise (beef tongue or head cheese to name a couple) "There ain't nothin' in there that`ill hurt you". :huh:
Like I said yesterday, I hate to ask for stuff, so I decided to take a peek at the files and see what needs to be done, both with regards to 1.3 compatibility and making it RSRDC-compatible. For the first issue, one just needs to copy over the changes to rec manual layout from menu_1024.ini and omit all the new entries introduced with 1.4, and also change a couple of lines in menu.txt (mast becomes funnel/structure). Pretty easy, done that already. As for RSRDC, I took notice of which files this mod would overwrite if I installed on top of RSRDC. I then checked out those files (all .cfg, by the way), and copied over only the mast height differences from this mod to the RSRDC files, leaving everything else intact (some small variations in width, length, displacement and speed, as well as air groups). Seems to work ok. If lurker is ok with it, I can submit you an RSRDC-ready version to save you from the hassle ;)


I've do problem but RSRDC P2 will be out shortly and you may want to wait

[DrBeast]

If lurker is ok with it, I can submit you an RSRDC-ready version to save you from the hassle ;)

I've no problem but RSRDC P2 will be out shortly and you may want to wait

Cheers for the green light :up: Here's what I think: since I'll be away from the forum for a couple of weeks, I'll submit all the stuff I've done so far (for P1) to CapnScurvy. Hopefully, by the time I'm back, P2 will be out and I'll check it out as well.

[java`s revenge]

Great fix!!!
Thanks a lot. Hitting is indeed much better now.

[CapnScurvy]

Thanks to all for the help on this. What I usually do is give the files my mod alters a good check and simply overwrite the previous modded files with what my mod needs to correct. In the case of the ship.cfg files, I just change the Mast Height values leaving alone whatever another mod has changed. The same for the menu_1024_768.ini or menu.txt files. I only ask to load my mod last, so another mod won't overwrite my moifications (unless they took the time to carry over my alterations).


i use 1.4ROW, T.M.1.7.2,RSRDC118 for T.M. Which version of your mod should i use and what order should it all be in, at the moment that is the order my mods are in.


For now using the SCAF for TM 1.7.2 will be a good match for the RSRDC 118 mod. As you probably know, load TM 1.7.2, then RSRDC, then SCAF for TM 1.7.2. Row shouldn't make much difference when it loads. Some of the RSRDC ship classes won't be included in my mast height changes so use the Stadimeter as you would the stock SH4. The pictures in the Recognition Manual will guide you, those having the reference points highlighted in red have been changed. Those pixs that have no red markings should be manually checked like you would with the stock game. I'll be looking to see what I can do about making an edition specifically compatible for TM 1.7.2 and RSRDC soon.

[black1]

Great thank you mate.

[DrBeast]

CapnScurvy, I was reading through this thread (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=127379), where it's mentioned that the draft values of some ships seem to have been broken with patch 1.4, and I'm wondering: since your mod deals with .cfg files, can you check that thread out and possibly merge the changes proposed in there with this here mod? I'd do it myself if I weren't leaving for christmas vacations to my parent's place, where I won't have a computer.
Cheers and happy holidays! See ya in a couple of weeks! :up:

[CapnScurvy]

I have released the latest editions of Ship_Centered_Accuracy_Fix for Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign_P2 versions 200 and 220. You will find a link at the first post of this thread. The SCAF editions have no compatibility problems with the Dec 21 and 22 released patch's by Lurker.

Happy Holidays everyone, Merry Christmas to you all!! :sunny:

[FooFighters]

Hey Capn,

More work to do, just checked Duci's TM patch 1.7.4.
He added 2 German boats to the roster.

I will begin fixing the Rec manual after christmas.
This time with the 2 missing boats and with Duci's added ships.
And afcourse a clean menu.ini file :D

[Doolittle81]

I have released the latest editions of Ship_Centered_Accuracy_Fix for Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign_P2 versions 200 and 220. You will find a link at the first post of this thread. The SCAF editions have no compatibility problems with the Dec 21 and 22 released patch's by Lurker.

Happy Holidays everyone, Merry Christmas to you all!! :sunny:

When I try to enable your SCAF, I get these announcements:

"menu_1024_768.ini" has already been altered by the "ClassicBetterScopes_NomoGraph_MiniChrono" mod.
Folder "Data\Sea\NAGB" has already been added by the "RSRDC_P2_v200" mod.
"NAGB.cfg" has already been altered by the "RSRDC_P2_v200" mod.
"NAGB_sil.dds" has already been altered by the "RSRDC_P2_v200" mod.
Folder "Data\Sea\NAPD_Clemson" has already been added by the "RSRDC_P2_v200" mod.
"NAPD_Clemson.cfg" has already been altered by the "RSRDC_P2_v200" mod.
"NAPD_Clemson_sil.dds" has already been altered by the "RSRDC_P2_v200" mod.
Folder "Data\Sea\NAuxCru" has already been added by the "RSRDC_P2_v200" mod.
"NAuxCru.cfg" has already been altered by the "RSRDC_P2_v200" mod.
"NAuxCru_sil.dds" has already been altered by the "RSRDC_P2_v200" mod.

Should I just ignore and procede to enable your SCAF?

[ATR-42]

CaptScurvy,
This mod makes manual targeting much more of a science than a guessing game, nice job with it. :up:

[CapnScurvy]

Hey Capn,
More work to do, just checked Duci's TM patch 1.7.4.
He added 2 German boats to the roster.

I will begin fixing the Rec manual after christmas.
This time with the 2 missing boats and with Duci's added ships.


Yep, I saw them too. The TM 1.7.4 may be official in a bit, so I think I'll enjoy the holiday away from the computer. There's always something to keep up with. Have a Merry Christmas Dennis!


When I try to enable your SCAF, I get these announcements:

Quote:
"menu_1024_768.ini" has already been altered by the "ClassicBetterScopes_NomoGraph_MiniChrono" mod.
Folder "Data\Sea\NAGB" has already been added by the "RSRDC_P2_v200" mod.
...........
Should I just ignore and procede to enable your SCAF?


Yes, ignore this warning and select the "Yes" button. I have explained the "where for's and the how come's" with the included SCAF Readme.txt. It's basically a JSGME warning that those particular files have already been changed (by whatever mod that has been loaded first). Even if the next activated file is exactly the same as the first, JSGME will make it appear that the new file will blow your computer to bits if you activate it. That's well and good if the modder of the second file isn't paying attention to what he is building upon. But, I take great pains to lose nothing of the first modded files, and build my changes along with them.


This mod makes manual targeting much more of a science than a guessing game, nice job with it. :up:


Thank you ATR, have a happy holiday.

[Doolittle81]

....
....It's basically a JSGME warning that those particular files have already been changed (by whatever mod that has been loaded first). Even if the next activated file is exactly the same as the first, JSGME will make it appear that the new file will blow your computer to bits if you activate it. That's well and good if the modder of the second file isn't paying attention to what he is building upon. ...

Ahhh! Thanks for the explanation!

Merry Christmas!

[CapnScurvy]

I wish to update you regarding several revised editions for SCAF. I have revised the mod to be compatable with the latest release of Trigger Maru 1.7.5. I added the two new ship classes for the German Navy, plus the changes to the menu files that relate to SCAF.

I have also made revisions to SCAF for the Foofighters Recognition Manual latest version 3. Both for the stock game, and TM 1.7.5. I must warn you that Foofighters RMV3 + TM1.7 does not provide you with all the ship classes that come from Trigger Maru 1.7.5. The Parker class, the two German additions, plus several others are missing in Foofighters manual. If he adds these missing ship classes my mod will be ready, providing the manual dosen't stray too far from the norm.


The latest edition links for download can be found at the first post of this thread

Best regards

[Doolittle81]

So, does this mean that there will also be an update forthcoming to the "SCAF4RSRDC_P2_v200; this edition is to be used with RSRD's stock SH4 mod"

[CapnScurvy]

Hi Doolittle, yes I am downloading the latest versions of RSRDC now. FileFront was being stuborn this morning, so I'll have them looked at soon.

[Ducimus]

Just wanted to say, im sorry i didnt get to this mod. I had a case of tunnel vision, and totally forgot about this.

[CapnScurvy]

Perfectly fine!!! I know how hard you've worked at Trigger Maru and the pressure to keep up with the small details. I'm well aware of the work involved in my small undertaking, I couldn't begin to handle what you've so brilliantly accomplished. My hats off to you for a well deserved rest.
:up:
Best regards to you and the family.

[swdw]

Hi Capn,

Removed the line about the hi res textures from the RFB thread.

[CapnScurvy]

Thanks Sam, I'll clean up my main post as well. I will be checking on Real Fleet Boat with the RSRDC newest versions to see if there is a need to revise this mod as well. There wasn't much to do on my account to update SCAF to RSRDC's other versions.

[Quagmire]

Nice job Scurvy!

Just one question though. Which mod version should you use if you are running TM 1.7.5 + RSRD 221 + FooFighters Recognition mod? I tried the TM 1.7.5 + Foo version and the TM 1.7.5 + RSRD 221 and both went haywire.

Thanks in advanvce!
.

[CapnScurvy]

Which mod version should you use if you are running TM 1.7.5 + RSRD 221 + FooFighters Recognition mod? I tried the TM 1.7.5 + Foo version and the TM 1.7.5 + RSRD 221 and both went haywire.

Ok, I've been seeing some stuff too so I have to ask, what have you been seeing to make it go haywire? What I've seen is the Recognition Manual dosen't list all the ship classes that TM or RSRDC uses. Where is the German Navy section with the Z class DD or the Schnell Boat that came with TM 1.7.5? Where are some of the RSRDC ship classes like the Momi and some others? Get back to me on what you know or have seen, then I'll give you my two cents worth.

[CapnScurvy]

I have just updated the latest editions of SCAF to include the Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign P2 for Real Fleet Boat 1.4 rc1, version 241. AND I have combined the stock and ROW versions of RFB 1.4 rc1, since doing so creates no contradictions to the SCAF mod compatibility.



Which mod version should you use if you are running TM 1.7.5 + RSRD 221 + FooFighters Recognition mod? I tried the TM 1.7.5 + Foo version and the TM 1.7.5 + RSRD 221 and both went haywire.



Ok, I've been seeing some stuff too so I have to ask, what have you been seeing to make it go haywire? What I've seen is the Recognition Manual dosen't list all the ship classes that TM or RSRDC uses. Where is the German Navy section with the Z class DD or the Schnell Boat that came with TM 1.7.5? Where are some of the RSRDC ship classes like the Momi and some others? Get back to me on what you know or have seen, then I'll give you my two cents worth.


Since I haven't heard from Quagmire yet, I'll give my two cents worth anyway. Rule 1, the order of activation for any group of mods is to install a mod that is compatible with whatever mod you already use and have activated. If the latter mod makes changes to the preceeding mod by ommiting parts or covering up the previously modded files then find the waste can and take a 3 point shot!! Save yourself some future trouble and pitch it out.

With TM 1.7.5 there are ship classes that were added to the roster. In RSRDC P2 there are additional ship classes added. When both TM 1.7.5 and the proper RSRDC v221 are combined by activating in JSGME, they will get along. But make no mistake, the order of activation is critical. Activate TM first, RSRDC second.

When you decide to throw a third or fourth mod into the mix then Rule 1 really applies. If the third mod doesn't comply, how do you suppose the fourth mod will do? Even if the fourth mod is completly compatible with the first two, the fourth is only as good as the mod preceeding it. If you know a mod is changing preceeding files by ommiting various parts, that's your first clue to problems to come.

[zanzo]

Is there another version needed to make this BRILLIANT Mod compatible so I can run RSRD Phase Two with Foofighter's RM? If I'm not mistaken, Foofighter's manual for RSRD isn't covered (as yet)? I'm only asking because I've been trying out various combinations to get something I really like like. That, I suppose, is what all the people who hang out in this neck of the woods do anyway!!!

Ideally I'd like to run RSRD Phase Two with Foofighters Manual AND the Ship-Centred Accuracy Fix..............................Then I'd be like the proverbial pig in you-know-what!!!!

[Doolittle81]

Is there another version needed to make this BRILLIANT Mod compatible so I can run RSRD Phase Two with Foofighter's RM? If I'm not mistaken, Foofighter's manual for RSRD isn't covered (as yet)? I'm only asking because I've been trying out various combinations to get something I really like like. That, I suppose, is what all the people who hang out in this neck of the woods do anyway!!!

Ideally I'd like to run RSRD Phase Two with Foofighters Manual AND the Ship-Centred Accuracy Fix..............................Then I'd be like the proverbial pig in you-know-what!!!!

Me too....Exactly what I am looking for...

[CapnScurvy]

Zanzo and Doolittle, Are you saying you both would like the RSRDC p2 for the stock game, plus the Foofighters RM v3 for RSRDC, plus SCAF? If so I can look at it in a couple of days. I'll have to make sure that Foos RM isn't missing the ship classes that his Trigger Maru version does. I have just about come to the point of pulling the SCAF for Foos RM v3 for TM 1.7 since it's like throwing good money out with the bad. Why put a mod on the line that depends on another to be accurate? So, if this is what you want, I'll take a look at his mod and see if there's anything missing from RSRDC. If not I'll have it ready in a couple.

Cheers to you both

[zanzo]

That would be it in a nutshell, Capt Scurvy (in my case certainly).

[CapnScurvy]

Ok men, I've looked at "RSRDC_P2_v201" and compared Foofighters "Recognition Manual V3 Stock SH4 RSRDC" to it.

1. There are no Greman Nationality ships, neither the Armed Merchant Cruiser, nor the Armed Trawler.

2. There is no Auxilery Gun Boat (it looks like a Coastal Merchant but with 4 masts and a couple of large deck guns)

3. There is no PB 103-105-107 class boats (they look like a tug)

4. There is no Clemson APD

5. The TB Coastal Defense, is this suppose to be the RSRDC Otori-Tomozuru Torpedo Boat?

6. The Type D Coastal Defense should look like an Evarts (it has the same dimensions as the Evarts) except it's a picture of what I believe to be the Momi Patrol Boat which should have a much larger dimension then what is listed. Of course there is no Momi named ship class listed in the New Recognition Manual.

I didn't do anything that you couldn't do yourself to see the omissions. Run RSRDC first and make a record of the RM, then do the same after activating Foofighters RM. Until the New RM corrects it's error I will not recommend using it. Since this same type of inaccuracy has occuried with the New RM for TM 1.7.5 I will pull my work from it also. I will keep SCAF for Foos New RM V3 for stock SH4, even though the German Nationalities are NOT represented. I'm not sure why not, but that's how it will stand for now.

Sorry men.

[DrBeast]

Ok men, I've looked at "RSRDC_P2_v201" and compared Foofighters "Recognition Manual V3 Stock SH4 RSRDC" to it.

1. There are no Greman Nationality ships, neither the Armed Merchant Cruiser, nor the Armed Trawler.

2. There is no Auxilery Gun Boat (it looks like a Coastal Merchant but with 4 masts and a couple of large deck guns)

3. There is no PB 103-105-107 class boats (they look like a tug)

4. There is no Clemson APD

5. The TB Coastal Defense, is this suppose to be the RSRDC Otori-Tomozuru Torpedo Boat?

6. The Type D Coastal Defense should look like an Evarts (it has the same dimensions as the Evarts) except it's a picture of what I believe to be the Momi Patrol Boat which should have a much larger dimension then what is listed. Of course there is no Momi named ship class listed in the New Recognition Manual.

I didn't do anything that you couldn't do yourself to see the omissions. Run RSRDC first and make a record of the RM, then do the same after activating Foofighters RM. Until the New RM corrects it's error I will not recommend using it. Since this same type of inaccuracy has occuried with the New RM for TM 1.7.5 I will pull my work from it also. I will keep SCAF for Foos New RM V3 for stock SH4, even though the German Nationalities are NOT represented. I'm not sure why not, but that's how it will stand for now.

Sorry men.

So if I get this correct, if Foofighters corrects/makes an RSRDC-compatible RM, you might follow suit and make a compatible version of SCAF as well? Need to know who I should bribe with tons of ouzo! :lol:

[Doolittle81]

Ok men, I've looked at "RSRDC_P2_v201" and compared Foofighters "Recognition Manual V3 Stock SH4 RSRDC" to it.

1. There are no Greman Nationality ships...
2. There is no Auxilery Gun Boat ...
3. There is no PB 103-105-107 class boats....
4. There is no Clemson APD
5. The TB Coastal Defense.....
6. The Type D Coastal Defense ....



Mod's are confusing at times...to say the least. Am I correct in assuming that if I enable the Mod's as shown below, the SCAF and Recog manual will work correctly for all ships other than those few types identified above as absent or erroneous in sme way?
http://members.cox.net/doolittle80/JSGME.jpg

[zanzo]

Thanks for your input, Capt S...............

I think I may look at another "combo". Isn't it just wonderful when you're (almost) spoilt for choice?

[FooFighters]

Ok men, I've looked at "RSRDC_P2_v201" and compared Foofighters "Recognition Manual V3 Stock SH4 RSRDC" to it.

1. There are no Greman Nationality ships, neither the Armed Merchant Cruiser, nor the Armed Trawler.
They in the original German Roster.. So they will work with RSRDC.
They are not vissible because the German manual has not been created yet.
It will be in the future.

2. There is no Auxilery Gun Boat (it looks like a Coastal Merchant but with 4 masts and a couple of large deck guns)
Which filename are you refering to ?

3. There is no PB 103-105-107 class boats (they look like a tug)
it's in the patrol boats section (orig netherlands).
The file is called PB10X

4. There is no Clemson APD
Just checked it's there, in the US section (orig NewZealand).

5. The TB Coastal Defense, is this suppose to be the RSRDC Otori-Tomozuru Torpedo Boat?

6. The Type D Coastal Defense should look like an Evarts (it has the same dimensions as the Evarts) except it's a picture of what I believe to be the Momi Patrol Boat which should have a much larger dimension then what is listed. Of course there is no Momi named ship class listed in the New Recognition Manual.
The Momi should be in the Patrol section, my mistake.
But it is in the original Japan map so it should work fine in game.

I didn't do anything that you couldn't do yourself to see the omissions. Run RSRDC first and make a record of the RM, then do the same after activating Foofighters RM. Until the New RM corrects it's error I will not recommend using it. Since this same type of inaccuracy has occuried with the New RM for TM 1.7.5 I will pull my work from it also. I will keep SCAF for Foos New RM V3 for stock SH4, even though the German Nationalities are NOT represented. I'm not sure why not, but that's how it will stand for now.

I've downloaded the Stock + RSRDC phase II version of my mod, and compared it with your questions. I've checked all versions and several other have tested them. Even if there are some boats do not show up in the manual, the original files are all there just renamed to not show up. So CTD must have another source.

I do sometimes leave out some ships, mainly because they were added later and they use the same 3d files and rec manual pictures as the original file.
If 2 ships use the same 3d files and manual picture how can you identify which one is which ?

[Quagmire]

Since I haven't heard from Quagmire yet, I'll give my two cents worth anyway. Rule 1, the order of activation for any group of mods is to install a mod that is compatible with whatever mod you already use and have activated. If the latter mod makes changes to the preceeding mod by ommiting parts or covering up the previously modded files then find the waste can and take a 3 point shot!! Save yourself some future trouble and pitch it out.

With TM 1.7.5 there are ship classes that were added to the roster. In RSRDC P2 there are additional ship classes added. When both TM 1.7.5 and the proper RSRDC v221 are combined by activating in JSGME, they will get along. But make no mistake, the order of activation is critical. Activate TM first, RSRDC second.

When you decide to throw a third or fourth mod into the mix then Rule 1 really applies. If the third mod doesn't comply, how do you suppose the fourth mod will do? Even if the fourth mod is completly compatible with the first two, the fourth is only as good as the mod preceeding it. If you know a mod is changing preceeding files by ommiting various parts, that's your first clue to problems to come.

Sorry I havent posted in a while. Life has been super-busy. Anyway I think the problem boils down to the fact that your awesome mod doesnt come in a
version that can work with TM1.7.5 + RSRDC phase II (version 3) + FooFighters Rec Manual. I am using Foo's TM1.7.5 + RSRDC phase II (version 3) mod which allows for his manual on top of TM and RSRDC. You have a stock + FooFighters Manual mod and a RSRDC + TM mod, but what probably is needed is a TM1.7.5 + RSRDC phase II (version 3) + FooFighters Manual version of the mod.

What happens when using your mod with TM1.7.5 + RSRDC phase II (version 3) and FooFighters mod is the fonts are all messed up in the manual and you get a CTD when clicking through the American ship roster.

I guess you and Foo just need to knock your heads together and merge your two MOST AWESOME mods. Thanks again for your hard work!
.

[CapnScurvy]

To make it clear where some of the errors or omissions are in Foofighters New RM V3 comparied to the Recognition Manual that would be used with Run Silent, Run Deep P2 v201. I have down loaded some of the actual pictures for comparision.

In the below images you will see the RSRDC P2 v201 images on the left, with the closest comparied Foofighters RM V3 pictures on the right. Again, as I have pointed out in a couple of thread replies ago, there is NO Auxilery Gun Boat listed in Foos RM. There is no ship that looks like the 4 masted, heavy deck gunned version on the left in Foos RM. The closest match is the Japanese Taihosan, or the friendly Coastal Merchant.

Going down to the next three pictures, you will notice the Auxilery Cruiser RSRD version has 5 deck guns with a sea plane launcher to the stern. The following two pictures show Foos Victory Cargo looking exactly the same as his Hokoko Maru, neither one looking like the RSRDC version. Why is this important? When modders like Lurker_hlb3 increase their roster with new ship designs you can bet your butt the ship you incounter within the game is going to look an awfull lot like the ones in the RM. There has to be a way of finding the difference between friend or foe and the RM serves this purpose, as well as viewing the nationality flag it flies. The RSRD Yubari again shows a difference comparied to the Foofighter RM version.


(http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Comparision11.jpg)http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Comparision11.jpg


This next set of pictures shows the RSRD Momi which within the Foofighters Manual does not even name. The closest comparision is to the Minekaze, but it still is not the same. The RSRD Japanese Type D Coastal Defense shows a picture of a boat simular to the US Evarts, except for the larger bow deck gun. The FooRM shows a completly different boat, however if you look at the weight or dimensions of the boat the're the same as the other two?!?! I have no idea where this picture has come from, I have looked through TM 1.7.5 and RFB 1.4 and have found no match to this picture.


http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/crawlee/Comparison22.jpg


There is a problem of having inaccurate pictures in the Recognition Manual when comparing what you incounter within the game. This will lead to firing on friendly ships, or could cause erroneous data to be gathered when not all ships have the same dimensions or statistics.

I should point out that indeed the APD Clemson is found within the Foofighters RM in the US Naval section.

Look, there is nothing easy about changing or modifing game files, nor is it easy to have one mod work with another, then another and so on. It takes hard work and skill to read a file and invision how to change it to create your plan. Foofighters RM took no less effort!! I believe he will make the changes to give the game community the tool he invisioned.

Am I correct in assuming that if I enable the Mod's as shown below, the SCAF and Recog manual will work correctly for all ships other than those few types identified above as absent or erroneous in sme way?

Doolittle, that is the correct order if you want to use the mods as is. However, the SCAF4RSRDC_P2_v201 is intended to load directly to RSRDC without the RM mod before it or after.

What happens when using your mod with TM1.7.5 + RSRDC phase II (version 3) and FooFighters mod is the fonts are all messed up in the manual and you get a CTD when clicking through the American ship roster. Yes, I know the fonts are out of wack. I could fix it, but not untill this Recogintion Manual problem is resolved. Those changes need to come from the creator of the RM. I recommend you either choose between having correct range finding or an inaccurate Recognition Manual.

[Killjoy12]

Is this compatible with the latest TM 1.7.6?

[CapnScurvy]

I've been away for a bit, so I've just seen the new TM 1.7.6. I suspect the compatibility will come from me taking the TM files and simply adding my ship dimensions fix to them. As usual, the JSGME activation will go "NUTS", explaining that the files SCAF changes were already changed by Trigger Maru. For the savvy gamer, you know this will not cause your computer to blow up in a poof, but simply overwrite the TM files with SCAF added.

I have been working on my own upgrade for the stock version of SCAF with several additional mod inhancements, so I will have both versions updated soon. Thanks for your intrest. :up:

[Killjoy12]

Hey - thanks for your hard work!

[Doolittle81]

I have the Stock SH4 installed..then all the ROW Mods...then "RSRDC_P2_v201"... then the final "Addon for Reflections On The Water"...

I want to add Foofighter's "Recognition manual V3 Stock SH4 RSRDC" and the SCAF MOD....I think all I need will be the "SCAF4RSRDC_P2_v201"...Is that correct??? [When I had added both "SCAF4RSRDC_P2_v201" AND "SCAF1.1 _w_Nomo_Chrono_btrScopes", my Rec Manual in game was drastically alterred/Scr&wed up!]

[CapnScurvy]

I wish to update you regarding the latest release of SCAF for Trigger Maru 1.7.6. This edition I call version 1.2 since I have added several enhancements to the original. I have reworked several of the TM ship pictures in the Recognition Manual to indicate the added firepower of the actual ships such as the Jap Armed Trawler, Parker's Tincan II, the Auxilery Sub Chaser and a few others. I have taken a note to the work done by ATR-42 and have added an imperial nomograph to the Map screen. It's a bit smaller and I have readjusted the figures to have greater accuracy (credit goes to ATR-42 for his inspriation to combine this tool to SCAF). I have also added Captain Cox's larger bearing indicator to the attack periscope to give greater accuracy to finding your target. The link to the latest edition can be found at the first post in this thread.



I want to add Foofighter's "Recognition manual V3 Stock SH4 RSRDC" and the SCAF MOD....I think all I need will be the "SCAF4RSRDC_P2_v201"...Is that correct??? [When I had added both "SCAF4RSRDC_P2_v201" AND "SCAF1.1 _w_Nomo_Chrono_btrScopes", my Rec Manual in game was drastically alterred/Scr&wed up!]


I am not recommending you to either use Foofighters manual, or both SCAF4RSRDC_P2_v201 overlayed with SCAF1.1_w_Nomo_Chrono_btrScopes together. Regarding the "New Manual", take a look at just a few replies ago to understand why I have removed my support to Foofighters mod. It does not have all the ships you will encounter during game play. Run up against any of the German ships and you'll find nothing in the manual to set the Position Keeper to. Several of the other possible ships are inaccurate as well.

As far as running SCAF4RSRDC......it is compatable with the RSRDC for stock mod. BUT, if you try to add another mod after my version anything can happen. I realize you are trying to add the features that ATR-42 has with his mod that uses SCAF. However his mod is not compatible to RSRDC.

I am compiling a group of mods together to work with SCAF that will be released soon. I will have it compatible to RFB 1.4 as well as RSRDC.

Cheers

[Killjoy12]

Which one is the correct one for TM1.7.6 and RSRD ?

[CapnScurvy]

Killjoy12, I have not looked at the latest release for RSRDC phase III. I see it just came out yesterday, and right now FileFront is having a problem with it's page. Saturday morning, with the "B" team working at Filefront I guess. I had a small change for Filefront this morning and I can't log into my page either. So when I do, I'll check out the RSRDC III for TM 1.7.6 and get SCAF up to snuff too.

[Killjoy12]

Thanks!

When I posted that, I hadn't realized RSRD 3 was out, so I was actually referring to TM 1.7.6 and RSRD2. In any event, I certainly appreciate your work on this, and look forward to a TM+ RSRD3 version.

[CapnScurvy]

I have released the updated edition of SCAF for RSRDC P3 v320. This edition carriers over the RSRD mod made for compatibility with TM 1.7.6. I made several changes to this edition which are:

Modified several Recognition Manual pictures to give a more accurate representation of the ship you will encounter.

Added a larger Bearing indicator to the periscope and TBT (Uzo).

Resized the Nomograph that Lurker included to fit the Navigation Map page better.

Also in the Recognition Manual, added a US national flag to the Coastal Merchant and Small Split Freighter to represent their nationallity alliance. Added a Japanese flag to the new carriers Hiyo, Shinano, and Unryu pictures, to represent the Stadimeter's reference point for finding range.

I will be releasing the edition of SCAF for RSRDC P3 v300 tomorrow, and an edition of RSRDC v340 for Real Fleet Boat very soon.

[Donner]

As always, excellent work CapnScurvy!! :up:

We look forward to the other editions that are in the works!! :ping:

[Doolittle81]

I have released the updated edition of SCAF for RSRDC P3 v320. .....

Modified several Recognition Manual pictures to give a more accurate representation of the ship you will encounter.
.....
.....I will be releasing the edition of SCAF for RSRDC P3 v300 tomorrow.....

The SCAF Mod(s) are a great addition/aid in targeting...they have seemed to work well for me with RSRDC part 2....But, I still have a bit of confusion....How do these three Mods, below, relate to one another:
RSRDC_P3_v300 (Lurker's)
Recognition manual V3 Stock SH4 RSRDC (Foofighter's)
SCAF4RSRDC_P3_v300 (assumed name of your soon to be released SCAF Mod)

My intention is to JSGME-enable them in the order shown (first RSRDC, then Rec manual, etc), but I'm not sure if that is correct nor exactly what is 'happening'....which is the chicken and which is the egg, so to speak... Any clarification would be appreciated. Tks.

[Killjoy12]

Thanks!

[CapnScurvy]

For those that have downloaded the "SCAF for TM 1.7.6" please redownload with the version dated Feb. 8 from FileFront. I have discovered an error in the Parker II config file and a CTD will result when moving through the Recognition Manual. The error was my fault by playing around with the name Parker ll rather than Parker II. I was trying to get a different look to the small font SH4 uses and simply forgot to change the correct name back to what Trigger Maru uses.

With the latest Feb 8 edition I also added a couple of different ship pictures to the RM (the Small and Medium Gunboats, plus the stock Minesweeper). I don't know if anyone else has seen this, but since TM 1.7.5 the RM does not show a "Tonnage" amount for either Parker Tincans. I added a figure to those reporting "zero". Also I noticed the config file for the Parker's does not give a Renown Awarded amount. I choose the figure 40 for this parameter, since that is what you would receive if you sink the stock SubChaser.

The SCAF Mod(s) are a great addition/aid in targeting...they have seemed to work well for me with RSRDC part 2....But, I still have a bit of confusion....How do these three Mods, below, relate to one another:
RSRDC_P3_v300 (Lurker's)
Recognition manual V3 Stock SH4 RSRDC (Foofighter's)
SCAF4RSRDC_P3_v300 (assumed name of your soon to be released SCAF Mod)

RSRDC P3 v300 is Lurkers latest edition of Run Silent Run Deep for the stock game. His RSRD Campaign edition Phase 2, had 14 new ENEMY ship classes over the stock SH4 game. His latest Phase 3 has 6 additional ENEMY ship classes. That's a total of 20 new enemy ships added to the stock game, not counting the many Friendly ship classes he has added.

Foofighters Rec Manual does not cover all of the RSRDC Phase 2 ships added. Check with him on revising his manual for Phase 3.

SCAF 4 RSRDC v300 will be a compatible mod to overlay RSRDC Phase 3. It will be activated in JSGME behind RSRDC Phase 3 v300. SCAF will improve the stock Recognition Manual by having many of the pictures showing the actual guns that the various new ship classes will have as you encounter them.

SCAF is compatible with "Foofighters New RM for Stock SH4" only in the "SCAF_RMV3_Stock_SH4" edition. The "New RM for Stock SH4" is not compatible with anything other than the Stock SH4 game. It will not have the correct pictures to use with any other modification. Mixing any combination other than what the mods are intended for and you risk having a problem. Do so at your own risk.

[Donner]

I don't know if anyone else has seen this, but since TM 1.7.5 the RM does not show a "Tonnage" amount for either Parker Tincans. I added a figure to those reporting "zero". Also I noticed the config file for the Parker's does not give a Renown Awarded amount. I choose the figure 40 for this parameter, since that is what you would receive if you sink the stock SubChaser.

I noticed this and assumed Ducimus had set up that way so the Parker tincans would not "skew" your career tonnage totals. Same thing for renown...why get renown for a training mission? :hmm: :ping:

[CapnScurvy]

I don't know if anyone else has seen this, but since TM 1.7.5 the RM does not show a "Tonnage" amount for either Parker Tincans. I added a figure to those reporting "zero". Also I noticed the config file for the Parker's does not give a Renown Awarded amount. I choose the figure 40 for this parameter, since that is what you would receive if you sink the stock SubChaser.

I noticed this and assumed Ducimus had set up that way so the Parker tincans would not "skew" your career tonnage totals. Same thing for renown...why get renown for a training mission? :hmm: :ping:

I've never run into one outside my testing, so maybe I'm missing something. Do the Parker's show up like moths to a light bulb, and your shooting fish in a barrel when you find them? If it is, perhaps I should leave the parameters like they were. Maybe I'll check with Ducimus to see why they were put like they were

[Donner]

I don't know if anyone else has seen this, but since TM 1.7.5 the RM does not show a "Tonnage" amount for either Parker Tincans. I added a figure to those reporting "zero". Also I noticed the config file for the Parker's does not give a Renown Awarded amount. I choose the figure 40 for this parameter, since that is what you would receive if you sink the stock SubChaser.

I noticed this and assumed Ducimus had set up that way so the Parker tincans would not "skew" your career tonnage totals. Same thing for renown...why get renown for a training mission? :hmm: :ping:

I've never run into one outside my testing, so maybe I'm missing something. Do the Parker's show up like moths to a light bulb, and your shooting fish in a barrel when you find them? If it is, perhaps I should leave the parameters like they were. Maybe I'll check with Ducimus to see why they were put like they were

The Parker Tincans show up only on the "New Construction" career starts. They are special created subchasers for the "New Construction" training missions. At least that's the impression I have from Duci's work.

[CapnScurvy]

I have released the latest edition of SCAF for Run Silent, Run Deep P3. With this mod I have added several established mods from the community that I feel best fits my goal of accuracy and fun. The changes are:

1. Mast heights to all Japanese warships and merchants (except for sampans and smaller fishing boats), the Axis country ships, Allied merchant ships (some Allied warships were included). A total of 82 ship classes were changed.

2. The Recognition Manual ship pictures have the new reference point funnel(s)/structure highlighted in red to aid in reference point identification. The ship pictures not highlighted indicate the mast heights were not changed. Changes were made to some of the pictures to represent the firepower of some of the modified ships. Flags were added to the Coastal Freighter and Small Split Freighter to represent their alliance. Flags were also added to several of the new Jap Cariers to indicate the Stadimeter reference point is at the top of the flag (where it attaches to the mast).

3.New text was added to the Recognition Manual releated to the changes. The Next/Previous page buttons were moved to a more convenient position.

4. A larger bearing indicator was added to the attack and observation periscopes, and TBT (Uzo) for greater accuracy. The backgrounds and lenses were changed to the periscope, observation periscope, TBT, binoculars, and deck gun. Credit goes to their creator Captain Cox for his great work. I made only adjustments to have these parts fit together.

5. Guages were changed within the ship and in the quick controls panel, credit to OakGrove. Some markers were modified for clarity. The Hud Orders Bar and Crew System Management screen was changed as well as a couple of guage indicators, credit to Jimimadrid for his talents. Real Award Medals by Fullmetaledges were added.

6. A different Recognition Manual cover and pages, credit to OakGrove. Minor changes by me to have the text fit.

7. Captain Cox's 360 DBP (Imperial) was added to the Navigation and Attack Map. Added several new map sizes to the nav and attack map screens. Added the Nomograph found in RSRDC v320 to the Nav map, I have no idea who created it. Credit to Lurker for using it and my borrowing. I did resize it to fit the page.

8. Added the Improved Nite Visibility mod by RedWine.

Credit to ATR-42 for his inspiration to add mods to SCAF.

You can find the links to the Filefront download site in the first post of this thread.

[Doolittle81]

I have released the latest edition of SCAF for Run Silent, Run Deep P3. With this mod I have added several established mods.... :

...
4. A larger bearing indicator was added to the attack and observation periscopes, and TBT (Uzo) for greater accuracy. The backgrounds and lenses were changed to the periscope, observation periscope, TBT, binoculars, and deck gun. Credit goes to their creator Captain Cox for his great work. ....

... The Hud Orders Bar and Crew System Management screen was changed... Real Award Medals by Fullmetaledges were added.
....

I am looking forward greatly to the new manual.

I'm not sure about the new periscope lense, though. After trying several Periscope MODS, I settled on the "2RTR US Periscope v1.1" MOD, which I like very much for its somewhat smeared/dirty lense and its gradation markings (No horizontal line). I assume I can install this MOD again after I install your "SCAF_4_RSRDC_v300" MOD to get my preferred scope back???

I also have concerns about the changes to the HUD Orders Bar as I went through many MODs to settle on a bar that suits me.

I also have been using the " AllMedalsBeta Revised" MOD by Captain Cox and I am satisfied with the medals.

I guess I am confused over the addition of some of these Periscope, HUD, Medals MODs to your SCAF MOD.

Can your SCAF 'manual' be released just by itself, as I think was the case with your previous SCAF MODs?

[DrBeast]

I'm not one to complain, after all I already use the majority of the mods you added to the new release of SCAF :up:
But I can see Doolittle81's point, though. Not everyone will accept/agree with the added mods :hmm:

[CapnScurvy]

OK OK OK,!!!...... I hear you loud and clear. I'll release SCAF with just the bare bones edition later today. But thanks for the input men!!! :yep:

[DrBeast]

OK OK OK,!!!...... I hear you loud and clear. I'll release SCAF with just the bare bones edition later today. But thanks for the input men!!! :yep:

Heh...you're easily convinced ;)

[Doolittle81]

Thanks Cap'n....

I sincerely hope I didn't come across as excessively negative nor unappreciative of your great work. S!

[stufer]

Captain Scurvy

Just wanted to drop by and say thanks for the new versions of this. I was playing without it after the release of the last version of RSRDC and I missed it terribly.

It really makes the game that bit less frustrating (I like some frustration, but this removes the part I don't like!).

Really excellent job - thanks a lot.

Stu.

[CapnScurvy]

I have just released the latest editions of SCAF compatible to "RSRDC P3 v300 with patch II" with two variations.

SCAFb for "Bare Bones". This edition has only the Sub Protractor made by Captain Cox for the Navigation and Attack Maps, and OakGroves created Recognition Manual. I reworked the Rec Manual cover and slightly changed the interior page.

SCAFx for "Extra modified". This edition has the above mentioned additions plus a larger bearing indicator added to the attack and observation periscopes, and TBT (Uzo) for greater accuracy. The backgrounds and lenses were changed to the periscope, observation periscope, TBT, binoculars, and deck gun. Credit goes to their creator Captain Cox for his great work. I made only adjustments to have these parts fit together.

Guages were changed within the ship and in the quick controls panel, credit to OakGrove. Some markers were modified for clarity. The Hud Orders Bar and Crew System Management screen was changed as well as a couple of guage indicators, credit to Jimimadrid for his talents. Real Award Medals by Fullmetaledges were added.

Added several new map sizes to the nav and attack map screens. Added the Nomograph found in RSRDC v320 to the Nav map, I have no idea who created it. Credit to Lurker for using it and my borrowing. I did resize it to fit the page.

Added the Improved Nite Visibility mod by RedWine.

My desire is to provide you a choice between a cut down version and a more modified rich version to use. I feel this may create a better choice for the various skilled gamers looking to modify the stock Silent Hunter 4. The links to the download FileFront site are at the first page of this post.

Cheers

PS. Not to worry Doolittle, I'm greatfull to have input on what you don't like just as I am pleased for a compilment. Thanks Doolittle and Stufer.

[DrBeast]

Uhm...Redwine's Improved Night Visibility will conflict with later ROW work by kriller2 :yep:

Now, before you lop my head off screaming "Baruk Khazad! Khazad ai menu!", let me just say that I LOVE your mod! :D

[CapnScurvy]

DrBeast, you must of read Ducimus's post on proper etiquette for talking to modders!! It's just been posted on the Ubisoft forum site. :roll:

Anywho, I'm not sure what ROW has got for better nite visibility. If there is a mod you like better either load it after the SCAF activation in JSGME, or go into SCAFx_4_RSRDC_v300 (when it isn't activated in JSGME) and drill down through the folders:
Data/Textures/TLowRes/tex, and remove the two files named "Reflex_Pac.tga" and "Sky_Pac.tga". Do the same for the folder found at:
Data/Textures/TNormal/tex, and remove the same two named files there. The nite visibility by Redwine will be history.


:ping: I do wish to point out that I missed the RSRDC patch II addition of the Tench class sub. So today, Feb 12, I updated the Filefront download of SCAF to include the omission. Sorry for the oversight to those who already downloaded SCAF yesterday.

[DrBeast]

DrBeast, you must of read Ducimus's post on proper etiquette for talking to modders!! It's just been posted on the Ubisoft forum site. :roll:

LOL no, I don't go to the UBI forum. Got a link? I'm sure I'll die laughing when I read it!

Anywho, I'm not sure what ROW has got for better nite visibility.

The brand new Pacific Envoronment for ROW (http://files.filefront.com/Pacific+enviroment+for+ROWrar/;9600366;/fileinfo.html). Kriller2 has outdone himself :yep:

If there is a mod you like better either load it after the SCAF activation in JSGME, or go into SCAFx_4_RSRDC_v300 (when it isn't activated in JSGME) and drill down through the folders:
Data/Textures/TLowRes/tex, and remove the two files named "Reflex_Pac.tga" and "Sky_Pac.tga". Do the same for the folder found at:
Data/Textures/TNormal/tex, and remove the same two named files there. The nite visibility by Redwine will be history.

Aye...those two files set off my "incompatibility alarm", having recently used it myself and switching to Kriller2's latest a few days later ;)


:ping: I do wish to point out that I missed the RSRDC patch II addition of the Tench class sub. So today, Feb 12, I updated the Filefront download of SCAF to include the omission. Sorry for the oversight to those who already downloaded SCAF yesterday.

Subs appear in the Rec Manual too? Oooh, got it, the bearing indicator! Yeah, already have that. :roll: Made by Captain Cox and l3thal, if memory serves.

[lurker_hlb3]

Added the Nomograph found in RSRDC v320 to the Nav map, I have no idea who created it.

I made it

[Doolittle81]

After enabling the SCAF MOD, and previously the RSRDC Phase III MOD, I noticed the addition of the text/link shown below...Bottom one. It replaces the "Credits" text, but still links to the scrolling "Romanian" credits.

I assume this was this part of the SCAF MOD......? I didn't watch/read all the scrolling credits, but I'm wondering if those were changed somehow.

I don't recall such a change with any previous MODs...though I might have overlooked it. I'm just curious.

http://members.cox.net/doolittle80/MainMenu13Feb.jpg

[CapnScurvy]

That's an easy way of showing what two main mods your running. Simular to the 1.4 that stands for the patch you've downloaded. Trigger Maru does it too. Nothing within the credits folder was changed, although that could be done.

[CapnScurvy]

Added the Nomograph found in RSRDC v320 to the Nav map, I have no idea who created it.

I made it

Thanks Lurker for clearing that up. I gave you credit for using it, I'll be sure to give you the credit for its creation. It's hard to keep track of who's done what without a score card.

[CapnScurvy]

I wish to announce the latest releases of the Ship Centered, Accuracy Fix, moving the version to 1.2. The latest editions are for the stock SH4 game, and Real Fleet Boat 1.4 rc1. The SCAF 1.2 files contain several existing mods that enhance the playability of the basic game through better visual aids or correct game parameters for accuracy.

Improvements include changes made to some of the pictures in the Recognition Manual to represent the firepower of some of the ships. Flags were added to the Coastal Freighter and Small Split Freighter to represent their alliance. Flags were also added to several of the Jap Carriers to indicate the Stadimeter reference point is at the top of the flag (where it attaches to the mast). New text was added to the Recognition Manual releated to the changes. A different Recognition Manual cover made by me, with minor changes to the interior pages color and design. Added the nationality flags created by OakGrove to the front cover and interior pages. The credit for the original Recognition Manual Mod goes to the fine work of OakGrove.

Captain Cox's 360 DBP (Imperial) was added to the Navigation and Attack Map. This should help in plotting and general map use. I added two new zoom levels, with one existing zoom level change to the Navigation Map. Added three new zoom levels, with one existing zoom level change to the Attack Map. Added the Nomograph found in RSRDC v320 to the Nav map, created by lurker_hlb3. I did resize it to fit the page.

Added OakGroves guages and dials throughout the sub, highlighting them for greater readability, some received red pointers and markers. On others the numbers were lighten for clarity. Again original creation credit goes to OakGrove. The Hud Orders Bar and Crew System Management screens were changed, as well as a couple of guage indicators, credit to Jimimadrid for his talents. Real Award Medals by Fullmetaledges were added.

As an optional install I have added the Maxoptics mod originally created by WernerSobe, with some changes and additions by me (thus the 2 next to its name, Maxoptics2). This option will increase the Periscope's two zoom levels by 100% creating a much greater ability to visually make a correct Stadimeter measurement at most distances. It will aid in correct range finding at longer distances equal to the TBT (Uzo). The increase in zoom levels are not to be considered as historically accurate, but the advantage of making a correct mark for range finding is key to accurate measurements. Upon rechecking and calibrating all of the previous changed ship heights, I made slight changes to a dozen or so for greater accuracy. The ability to "see" a target more clearly will greatly aid in correct placement of the Stadimeter for manual range finding.

I also increased the single view level of the Binoculars by almost 250% to allow for seeing at longer distances. I highly recommend the use of these features to aid in range finding and ship recognition.

The links to the FileFront download site are at the first post of this topic.

[Paajtor]

Great...gonna try it now.

Btw, the previous version gave me an error (plus CTD), when trying to open the Pacific Museum.

[Paajtor]

I have the same error with this version....career and missions work fine, but the Museum gives an error, and SH4 needs to close.
Not a big deal, though...I hardly visit the museum.

One other thing:

I use a special metric nomograph, that works with RSRDC....but I couldn't get it to work with this latest SCAF-version.
It appeared, that the nomograph-mod installed the tool in the ...Data\Menu\Gui\Layout-folder, whereas your SCAF installed the imperial version into ...Data\Menu\Gui.

That's why I couldn't get it to work, so I changed the nomograph-mod, to work with SCAF1.2

Get it here (http://www.61shap.com/pilots/Paajtor/SH4/files/RSRDC_Metric_Nomograph_for_SCAF.rar)

[Paajtor]

As an optional install I have added the Maxoptics mod originally created by WernerSobe, with some changes and additions by me (thus the 2 next to its name, Maxoptics2).
This part is incompatible with the ROW-cameras, as it puts a different camera.dat in place.
Allthough I'd love to use Maxoptics, ROW-camera (ROW Camera vs_1a, in my case) is a must-have for me.:cry:

Other than that, everything seems to work fine. :up:

Thx.

[DrBeast]

Neat...good to know that Max Optics plays well with SCAF. Gonna download and merge the changes of that with my ROW Camera :up:
Will there be an RSRDC version, or is that not necessary?

[CapnScurvy]

As an optional install I have added the Maxoptics mod originally created by WernerSobe, with some changes and additions by me (thus the 2 next to its name, Maxoptics2).
This part is incompatible with the ROW-cameras, as it puts a different camera.dat in place.
Allthough I'd love to use Maxoptics, ROW-camera (ROW Camera vs_1a, in my case) is a must-have for me.:cry:

Other than that, everything seems to work fine. :up:

Thx.

I'm going to look at the ROW Camera file today and see if there is a way of merging the two together, off hand I'd say yes, no problem. I believe they both change different parameters within the same file, so it's an easy merge needed to have them compatible. However, I see there are 4 to choose from. A couple with SWAY, a couple without?!!? Look there may be others, hidden within one of the other ROW mod versions. I will say this though, if I've got to make 4 plus compatible versions to keep everyone happy, I won't. You may just have to keep your SWAY and forget the ability of making good visual contact with the Stadimeter for accurate manual range finding. The choice may end up being yours!! By the way, there's a version ".2whatever" for all the row camera mods too. You said you'r using ".1a". Is there a difference, that you like the older version better? What I may do is go to FileFront and see which camera mod is downloaded the most. I'll make a compatible Maxoptics2 version for it.

I have the same error with this version....career and missions work fine, but the Museum gives an error, and SH4 needs to close.
Not a big deal, though...I hardly visit the museum.

I will look at this museum bug to see what's what. Perhaps it's SCAF, or another mod that has eliminated a ship config or data file in the museum department. Since SCAF had not added to the stock game files any ship information before this latest release yesterday, I'm guessing it's one of the mods like RSRDC or TM that has a problem.

Will there be an RSRDC version, or is that not necessary?

If you've noticed my last release for RSRDC was for the Patch 2, Lurker_hb3 has come out with a Patch 3 and may have another for all I know. I believe his latest patch was a minor change, so try it and see. He changes things like changing your socks!!! TM has a new beta release floating around as well, that will stir the pot with a trickle down effect for those wishing to be compatible. For me to keep up with every fart that someone has with a mod, is like a one armed paper hanger doing a two story room!! Luckily for me I'm retired, and it's winter. I can afford to have my butt pinned to the computer chair. But, that won't be the case for long with spring almost here. :yep:

[DrBeast]

Will there be an RSRDC version, or is that not necessary?
If you've noticed my last release for RSRDC was for the Patch 2, Lurker_hb3 has come out with a Patch 3 and may have another for all I know. I believe his latest patch was a minor change, so try it and see. He changes things like changing your socks!!! TM has a new beta release floating around as well, that will stir the pot with a trickle down effect for those wishing to be compatible. For me to keep up with every fart that someone has with a mod, is like a one armed paper hanger doing a two story room!! Luckily for me I'm retired, and it's winter. I can afford to have my butt pinned to the computer chair. But, that won't be the case for long with spring almost here. :yep:

Well, so far there doesn't seem to be a problem with RSRDC Patch III and SCAF in my game. And if memory serves, he didn't change something in the SCAF territory. So, all well and good. Btw, did you fix the minor graphical glitch on MaxOptics? Don't quite remember the nature of it, but I do remember you had worked out a fix.

[CapnScurvy]

Btw, did you fix the minor graphical glitch on MaxOptics? Don't quite remember the nature of it, but I do remember you had worked out a fix.

Yep, WernerSobe had a problem with the scope at rest, showing a partical black box over the lens, allowing some of the background view to show on the sides. The view in the scope now "disappears" as it goes to rest.

[DrBeast]

'k, cheers! :up: I'll integrate your changes to the camera file I'm using, then.

[Meridian]

Yep, WernerSobe had a problem with the scope at rest, showing a partical black box over the lens, allowing some of the background view to show on the sides. The view in the scope now "disappears" as it goes to rest.

How can I apply that fix to the SCAF-TM-RSRD version I am currently using?

Thanks

[CapnScurvy]

I'll integrate your changes to the camera file I'm using, then.



Ok, so you know, you need to keep the SCAF menu_1024_768.ini file intact. Keep it from getting changed by another, later activated mod. The SCAF "Menu_1024........" file has the correct lens and background parameters for the problem we just talked about.

Cheers

[DrBeast]

Ah, 'k...thanks for the heads-up. I'll scan through that, too, to incorporate the changes to my .ini file.

[CapnScurvy]

Yep, WernerSobe had a problem with the scope at rest, showing a partical black box over the lens, allowing some of the background view to show on the sides. The view in the scope now "disappears" as it goes to rest.

How can I apply that fix to the SCAF-TM-RSRD version I am currently using?

Thanks

I'm going to release a new SCAF edition for TM 1.7.6 soon, with the changes I've made to the SCAF stock edition which will include the Maxoptics2 option. I'll of course keep most of the TM look, since it contains the same modded dials or guages that OakGrove created. I will check all ships for accuracy and change the files accordingly, as I did for the latest SCAF stock SH4 and Real Fleet Boat mods. I'll probably do the TM first, then the RSRDC version. I'm really not sure when will the smoke settle over RSRDC's patching and changes. A couple of replies ago, I addressed my concern over when will a finished product appear. I'm just not ready to keep track of the changing news on a per day basis. With a change here or a tweak there, I don't wish to follow every move to keep up.

[Paajtor]

As an optional install I have added the Maxoptics mod originally created by WernerSobe, with some changes and additions by me (thus the 2 next to its name, Maxoptics2). This part is incompatible with the ROW-cameras, as it puts a different camera.dat in place.
Allthough I'd love to use Maxoptics, ROW-camera (ROW Camera vs_1a, in my case) is a must-have for me.:cry:

Other than that, everything seems to work fine. :up:

Thx.

I'm going to look at the ROW Camera file today and see if there is a way of merging the two together, off hand I'd say yes, no problem. I believe they both change different parameters within the same file, so it's an easy merge needed to have them compatible. However, I see there are 4 to choose from. A couple with SWAY, a couple without?!!? Look there may be others, hidden within one of the other ROW mod versions. I will say this though, if I've got to make 4 plus compatible versions to keep everyone happy, I won't. You may just have to keep your SWAY and forget the ability of making good visual contact with the Stadimeter for accurate manual range finding. The choice may end up being yours!! By the way, there's a version ".2whatever" for all the row camera mods too. You said you'r using ".1a". Is there a difference, that you like the older version better? What I may do is go to FileFront and see which camera mod is downloaded the most. I'll make a compatible Maxoptics2 version for it.

I just checked the ROW-thread again, and it seems that I have the 2a version...but if you click on the download-link, you go to a 1a version (http://files.filefront.com/ROW+Camera+vs+1arar/;9095504;/fileinfo.html)

....or to a 2a-version, but with the wrong file name lol.

[CapnScurvy]

Great...gonna try it now.

Btw, the previous version gave me an error (plus CTD), when trying to open the Pacific Museum.

Paajtor, as I suspected, there is NO problem with the Museum running the SCAF 1.2 stock SH4 version. All ships and catagories are accounted for. I ran through most every object without a hitch. The same SCAF files are in the other compatible SCAF editions for TM, RSRDC or RFB. So I should believe my part is good to go. As I believe, one of their files has a wire crossed causing the Museum to CTD with an error. Sorry for not being able to help with their problem. :up:

[CapnScurvy]

As an optional install I have added the Maxoptics mod originally created by WernerSobe, with some changes and additions by me (thus the 2 next to its name, Maxoptics2). This part is incompatible with the ROW-cameras, as it puts a different camera.dat in place.
Allthough I'd love to use Maxoptics, ROW-camera (ROW Camera vs_1a, in my case) is a must-have for me.:cry:

Other than that, everything seems to work fine. :up:

Thx.

I'm going to look at the ROW Camera file today and see if there is a way of merging the two together, off hand I'd say yes, no problem. I believe they both change different parameters within the same file, so it's an easy merge needed to have them compatible. However, I see there are 4 to choose from. A couple with SWAY, a couple without?!!? Look there may be others, hidden within one of the other ROW mod versions. I will say this though, if I've got to make 4 plus compatible versions to keep everyone happy, I won't. You may just have to keep your SWAY and forget the ability of making good visual contact with the Stadimeter for accurate manual range finding. The choice may end up being yours!! By the way, there's a version ".2whatever" for all the row camera mods too. You said you'r using ".1a". Is there a difference, that you like the older version better? What I may do is go to FileFront and see which camera mod is downloaded the most. I'll make a compatible Maxoptics2 version for it.

I just checked the ROW-thread again, and it seems that I have the 2a version...but if you click on the download-link, you go to a 1a version (http://files.filefront.com/ROW+Camera+vs+1arar/;9095504;/fileinfo.html)

....or to a 2a-version, but with the wrong file name lol.

Yes, I saw this 1.a, 2.a thing as well, so I guess the latest is the 1.a. I checked the number of downloads since the ROW camera mods hit their Nov. '07 release, and the one you use is by far the greater downloaded version. Almost 2 to 1 over .c or .d. Nearly 75% greater than 2.b, so I think I'll take a look at merging Maxoptics2 with the ROW Camera 1.a version that you use and come up with a compatible fit for it.

I have one question for you about the Pacific Environment mod that Kriller2 recently released. The instructions say you should "have ROW downloaded before installing PE". What, or which part of "ROW" is he talking about? There's all sorts of "ROW" parts and pieces!!! I just looked through ROW's thread and I couldn't get much of an answer on what exactly needs to be loaded before the PE mod. Any Help!!!?? :88)

[Paajtor]

Capn, don't bother to much about the Museum-thingy...as I said, I don't use it very often, and if I'm the only one with a problem, then please leave it. :)
Anyway, thx for checking, also for the camera-thing!
I got SH4 1 week ago, and I'm doing my best to find a safe way to mod my game...but it means, that there's a good chance I screwed up somewhere.:oops:

About PE....you mean this part?:
These mods are included in this addon, so you don't have to install those before installing this mod.

ROW sky and water controls
ROW New sea foam by Jaketoox
ROW clouds.
JakeTooxs Water Edgde mod
I think he means, that from all the different ROW-parts that you can download (and install before you add PE), you don't have to get the 4 parts quoted above, as they're in the PE-mod already.

Here's my mod list...the text in bold is a reminder for myself, that I added to the filename:
ROW Textures without Sun Halo camera flair vs_5
ROW Sub Reflections and Roll Pitch Mod vs_5
ROW Special Effects with stock zones vs_5b
ROW Sound Effects vs_8
ROW Object Reflections and Search Lights vs_5b
ROW Camera vs_1a
Pacific enviroment for ROW
Addon for Reflections On The Water_MustBeLastEnabledModForRow
Remove grain effect
RFB_1.4_for_ROW_RC1
RSRDC_P3_RFB_v340
RSRDC_V340_Patch2
Neal Stevens Anniversary Chrono Rose
ContactTails
SI INTERIOR Kit
DialsGatoCT_Fix_14
SCAF1.2_RFB1.4_STKorROW
RSRDC_Metric_Nomograph
CompassHeading
SI Sonar Metric Scale Kit

[silent killer]

:up: Thanksfor your work,have dl the mod this afternoon will try tonight

[CapnScurvy]

Capn, don't bother to much about the Museum-thingy...as I said, I don't use it very often, and if I'm the only one with a problem, then please leave it. :)
Anyway, thx for checking, also for the camera-thing!
I got SH4 1 week ago, and I'm doing my best to find a safe way to mod my game...but it means, that there's a good chance I screwed up somewhere.:oops:

About PE....you mean this part?:
These mods are included in this addon, so you don't have to install those before installing this mod.

ROW sky and water controls
ROW New sea foam by Jaketoox
ROW clouds.
JakeTooxs Water Edgde mod
I think he means, that from all the different ROW-parts that you can download (and install before you add PE), you don't have to get the 4 parts quoted above, as they're in the PE-mod already.

Here's my mod list...the text in bold is a reminder for myself, that I added to the filename:
ROW Textures without Sun Halo camera flair vs_5
ROW Sub Reflections and Roll Pitch Mod vs_5
ROW Special Effects with stock zones vs_5b
ROW Sound Effects vs_8
ROW Object Reflections and Search Lights vs_5b
ROW Camera vs_1a
Pacific enviroment for ROW
Addon for Reflections On The Water_MustBeLastEnabledModForRow
Remove grain effect
RFB_1.4_for_ROW_RC1
RSRDC_P3_RFB_v340
RSRDC_V340_Patch2
Neal Stevens Anniversary Chrono Rose
ContactTails
SI INTERIOR Kit
DialsGatoCT_Fix_14
SCAF1.2_RFB1.4_STKorROW
RSRDC_Metric_Nomograph
CompassHeading
SI Sonar Metric Scale Kit

Thanks Paajtor, for getting back to me on the question of what Kriller2 means about having ROW installed before his Pacific Environment mod. I think I will try what you've done and go from there. OH, by the way, Welcome to SH4!!

One question about your list above, is this the order you load these mods in JSGME? I don't see anything wrong with the order, but I'm not really familar with all the mods you have listed. BUT, is this correct, >>> that your using the version of "SCAF1.2_RFB1.4_STKorROW"? If it is, you need to use the edition of SCAF that works with RFB AND RSRDC. The "SCAF1.2_RFB1.4_STKorROW" is to be used with only Real Fleet Boat v1.4 that is either for the STOCK edition of SH4 OR the additions of the RFB with ROW parts. IT IS NOT FOR USE WHEN YOU ADD THE RUN SILENT, RUN DEEP FOR RFB 1.4 v340. I have another edition for that combination.

You see, RFB 1.4 does not add new ships to the stock SH4 game. My SCAF mod above (for RFB stock or row) will work just fine with it. BUT, when you throw in RSRDC, this mod adds over a dozen new ships to the mix. My above mod will cause all kinds of problems because the new ships are not covered. Download the correct edition of "SCAF_4_RSRDC_RFB_v340" and your problems may be corrected!!

I know your probably saying, "there's too many different choices to choose from!!"
Yes sir, you've got that right!!! That's one reason I'm a bit skeptical about creating too many versions of Maxoptics2 compatibale with the ROW Camera.dat mods. With 4 different ones to use, that's 4 different ways of getting mixed up in which one is the right one to activate.

Cheers

[Paajtor]

I see....:hmm:
Thank you for claring this up.

Yep, that's the JSGME-order of installing the mods.
I just studied the list again, and I think there's room for improvement...plus SCAF_4_RSRDC_RFB_v340, of course. How could I miss that version?...you're right, it's all rather confusing, if you're new to the matter (but not new to modding SH, fortunately!).

It's still a bit early for it, but my guess is, that in 1 year time, we will have a few big supermods (à la GWX/NYGM/WAC, for SH3), which will make choosing and installing much easier...and modders will have less troubles keeping everything compatible.

I'm going to do a freshly modded SH4-install now, and get the other SCAF-file (I have a spare fully patched SH4-folder saved somewhere).

*edit* Couldn't find SCAF_4_RSRDC_RFB_v340 on your FF-account....but I guessed I needed SCAF4RSRDC_P2_RFB_v241.rar, so I downloaded that one.

[CapnScurvy]

Couldn't find SCAF_4_RSRDC_RFB_v340 on your FF-account....but I guessed I needed SCAF4RSRDC_P2_RFB_v241.rar, so I downloaded that one.




OOP'S, your right!!! I haven't released the v340 yet!!! :damn: Since there have been three patches to RSRDC P3, I've been draging my feet on releasing my latest version. I'm looking to see what changes Lurker_hlb3 makes next.

Yes, the SCAF version v241 (above) will do for now when using the combination of RFB and RSRDC. This stuff is getting too deep for me too!!! :doh:

[Paajtor]

I am glad to report, that everything works fine, including the Museum.:up:
Even with this "outdated" SCAF-version.

The only thing I had to change, was my metric nomograph again...this SCAF puts the Imperial one in the \Layout folder (see this post (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=787042&postcount=115)).

Thank you, for your support.

This is my current mod-order:

ROW Textures without Sun Halo camera flair vs_5
ROW Sub Reflections and Roll Pitch Mod vs_5
ROW Special Effects with stock zones vs_5b
ROW Sound Effects vs_8
ROW Object Reflections and Search Lights vs_5b
ROW Camera vs_1a
Pacific enviroment for ROW
Addon for Reflections On The Water_MustBeLastEnabledModForRow
Remove grain effect
RFB_1.4_for_ROW_RC1
RSRDC_P3_RFB_v340
RSRDC_V340_Patch2
SCAF4RSRDC_P2_RFB_v241
SI INTERIOR Kit
SI Sonar Metric Scale Kit
DialsGatoCT_Fix_14
ContactTails
CompassHeading
Neal Stevens Anniversary Chrono Rose
RSRDC_Metric_Nomograph

[Lopo]

@CapnScurvy

Can you tell us if SCAF1.2 for TM1.7.6 will work with the new release of TMO (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/6421019045/m/1191029895) (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/6421019045/m/1191029895%29)...

Thanks a lot

Lopo

[CapnScurvy]

@CapnScurvy

Can you tell us if SCAF1.2 for TM1.7.6 will work with the new release of TMO (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/6421019045/m/1191029895) (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/6421019045/m/1191029895%29)...

Thanks a lot

Lopo

Lopo, I'm sorry, I do not know if it will or won't. I've been busy with RFB and just haven't had the time to check out TMO. Last I looked, the TMO was still in a beta form which means changes could still be made before a finished product appeares. So I've not been too quick to check it out. I will though soon.

[Lopo]

@CapnScurvy

Can you tell us if SCAF1.2 for TM1.7.6 will work with the new release of TMO (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/6421019045/m/1191029895) (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/6421019045/m/1191029895%29)...

Thanks a lot

Lopo
Lopo, I'm sorry, I do not know if it will or won't. I've been busy with RFB and just haven't had the time to check out TMO. Last I looked, the TMO was still in a beta form which means changes could still be made before a finished product appeares. So I've not been too quick to check it out. I will though soon.

Thank you for yor answer... and don't be sorry. I have just believed that the last release of TMO wasn't a beta form. I'm confused...

[DrBeast]

@CapnScurvy

Can you tell us if SCAF1.2 for TM1.7.6 will work with the new release of TMO (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/6421019045/m/1191029895) (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/6421019045/m/1191029895%29)...

Thanks a lot

Lopo
Lopo, I'm sorry, I do not know if it will or won't. I've been busy with RFB and just haven't had the time to check out TMO. Last I looked, the TMO was still in a beta form which means changes could still be made before a finished product appeares. So I've not been too quick to check it out. I will though soon.
Thank you for yor answer... and don't be sorry. I have just believed that the last release of TMO wasn't a beta form. I'm confused...

That's true, TMO is out of beta and released. I'm sure CapnScurvy will take a look at it as soon as his schedule allows him :yep:
BTW, I ran across a "side-effect" of MaxOptics: I think I can actually see the molecular composition of the stains on my periscope lens! :rotfl: I think I've gotten too used to the clean-as-a-whistle textures I've been using lately and forgotten that, just a while ago, I was using the "dirty-as-hell" masks from betterscopes. ;)

[Lopo]

@CapnScurvy

Can you tell us if SCAF1.2 for TM1.7.6 will work with the new release of TMO (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/6421019045/m/1191029895) (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/6421019045/m/1191029895%29)...

Thanks a lot

Lopo
Lopo, I'm sorry, I do not know if it will or won't. I've been busy with RFB and just haven't had the time to check out TMO. Last I looked, the TMO was still in a beta form which means changes could still be made before a finished product appeares. So I've not been too quick to check it out. I will though soon.
Thank you for yor answer... and don't be sorry. I have just believed that the last release of TMO wasn't a beta form. I'm confused...
That's true, TMO is out of beta and released. I'm sure CapnScurvy will take a look at it as soon as his schedule allows him :yep:
BTW, I ran across a "side-effect" of MaxOptics: I think I can actually see the molecular composition of the stains on my periscope lens! :rotfl: I think I've gotten too used to the clean-as-a-whistle textures I've been using lately and forgotten that, just a while ago, I was using the "dirty-as-hell" masks from betterscopes. ;)

:up:
You're right...:rotfl:

[CapnScurvy]

I have just added the latest edition of SCAF 1.2 to the FileFront site. This edition is compatible to Trigger Maru Overhauled and includes several adjustments and changes to the past SCAF editions. Several ingame stations such as the Binocular, Deckgun, or TBT have been enhanced to appear "weathered" thanks to the original fine work by Captain Cox. The view of the attack and observation periscopes have been inlarger and magnified with the optional installation of the Maxoptics2 mod, included in the download. Credit to WernerSobe for his original work.
Various guages and dials were lighten or reworked to increase readability, thanks to OakGrove for his fine work. The Recognition Manual was reworked to match the TMO periscope station.

Several ship funnel or structure heights were tweaked to match the calibrated correct range to target for manual range finding. I highly recommend the use of the Maxpotics2 mod for increasing the view of the target ship for greater accuracy in manually finding range and ship identification.

I will finish my testing on the RSRDC P3 version for TMO soon and have it available as time allows.

The link to the SCAF 1.2 for TMO can be found at the first post of this thread.

Best regards

[Killjoy12]

Thanks for continuing work on the RSRDC P3 version for TMO!

[Lopo]

Thank you very much Sir!
I'm downloading it now!

[Paajtor]

I highly recommend the use of the Maxpotics2 mod for increasing the view of the target ship for greater accuracy in manually finding range and ship identification.
Any more plans for adapting one of the ROW-camera's into a SCAF-version?
We had a little discussion about it on page6 of this topic. :D

(note: there seems to be a problem with ROW-cameras + the Uboat-addon...see here (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=791568#post791568))

[CapnScurvy]

Paajtor, I've been thinking about you (ok, not like it sounds!!!!). I was thinking if you're using TMO or RFB, those mods (I believe) already have the ROW camera feature rolled into it. So adding the feature may be redundant. I know RFB is planning a new release soon and I've got the Maxoptics2 mod ready for it. I'm not sure if swdw will have it as an optional install, bundled with the new RFB or not. We will see.

As far as Trigger Maru Overhauled is concerned I've got the Maxoptics2 bundled with the "SCAF1.2 for TMO" as an optional install. I just released it yesterday.

If your looking for a stock SH4 version to use with the ROW Camera.dat version 1.a or 2.b just wait a bit, like an hour or less, I'll put them on Filefront with a link to the site at the first post of this topic. I've got them, just haven't uploaded them yet. BUT please remember to install the right edition for the correct mod(s) that you follow.

[Paajtor]

We will see.


Rgr that...probably the best thing to do right now.
I mean, it looks like one moment you come up with some updated version, so suit another mod that just got updated...and when your update is released, it's almost outdated, so fast things change right now. :lol:

Oh, and nope...won't play stock SH4, just to get a ROW-camera...but thx for the offer.:up:

[CapnScurvy]

We will see.


Rgr that...probably the best thing to do right now.
I mean, it looks like one moment you come up with some updated version, so suit another mod that just got updated...and when your update is released, it's almost outdated, so fast things change right now. :lol:

Oh, and nope...won't play stock SH4, just to get a ROW-camera...but thx for the offer.:up:

Paajtor, if it wern't for the stuff between my ears, I could hear better. They would probably fall off the side of my head anyway. You wanted a Maxoptics2 version to work with RFB 1.4 rc1. Here it is:

http://files.filefront.com/Maxoptics2+for+SCAF+RFBrar/;9727682;/fileinfo.html

As I said, I have one for the latest RFB rc2 version when it's released by swdw, comming soon.

[Paajtor]

OMG, you work fast, Sir!:D

Hey, one thing is not clear to me: I went to your FF-account overview, and saw 3 Maxoptics uploaded today:

1 - the one you linked to above, being Maxoptics2_for_SCAF_and_RFB.rar
2 - Maxoptics2_ROW_Camera_vs_1a.rar
3 - Maxoptics2_ROW_Camera_vs2b.rar

I downloaded #1 and 2.

We spoke about a particular ROW-camera not working with that older Maxoptics, but then you said that a ROW-camera is probably already included by one of the big mods I have installed.
So I will disable my ROWcamera_1a mod, and verify whether a ROW-cam is still present...and then try both downloads.

Be back soon.

[Paajtor]

Maxoptics2_ROW_Camera_vs_1a.rar is the one I have to use.:up:
I first had to disable the "stock" ROW-camera (the version I installed with all the other ROW-parts).

(Maxoptics2_for_SCAF_and_RFB.rar doesn't work....well, the maxed zoom works...but I loose the ROW-camera)

A big thank you!

[CapnScurvy]

Maxoptics2_ROW_Camera_vs_1a.rar is the one I have to use.:up:
I first had to disable the "stock" ROW-camera (the version I installed with all the other ROW-parts).

(Maxoptics2_for_SCAF_and_RFB.rar doesn't work....well, the maxed zoom works...but I loose the ROW-camera)

A big thank you!






Your welcome.

As I indicated, I'm not at all sure what parts either Trigger Maru or Real Fleet Boat uses of the ROW Camera mods. Their's could easily be some sort of a hybrid cross between what Leo but forth and what the other modders finally released. The best I could do is take what they gave me and added the magnified Maxoptics to it for compatibility.

See you under the sea.

[znatan]

If there, pls post a link here - there is so much is running now in the forums.. Thanks !!

[Paajtor]

Nope, there isn't one yet.

[CapnScurvy]

I have just added the latest editions of SCAF 1.2 to the FileFront site. These editions are for the latest stock version of RSRDC plus v350 (http://files.filefront.com/SCAF12+for+RSRD350+14rar/;9825272;/fileinfo.html) and RSRDC plus v370 (http://files.filefront.com/SCAF12+for+TMO+RSRDCv370rar/;9816982;/fileinfo.html) compatible to Trigger Maru Overhauled patched 1.4 compatible. In all, over 90 ships were calibrated for correct distance when using manual targeting. SCAF 1.2 includes several adjustments and changes to the past SCAF editions. Several ingame stations such as the Binocular, Deckgun, or TBT have been enhanced to appear "weathered" thanks to the original fine work by Captain Cox. The view of the attack and observation periscopes have been inlarger and magnified with the optional included installation of the Maxoptics2 mod. The "SCAF for RSRDC v350" edition contains several versions of Maxoptics2 to be compatible with a stock game or a ROW modded Camera.dat game. Credit to WernerSobe for his original idea.

Various guages and dials were lighten or reworked to increase readability, thanks to OakGrove for his work. The Recognition Manual cover was reworked to match the TMO periscope station. Many Recognition Manual ship pictures were reworked to depict the actual ship you will encounter. Several ship funnel or structure heights were tweaked to match the calibrated correct range to target for manual range finding. I highly recommend the use of the Maxpotics2 mod for increasing the view of the target ship for greater accuracy in manually finding range and ship identification.


For more information regarding these or other releases please see the first post of this thread, or the readme included in the download.

[Doolittle81]

I look forward to this MOD as I really like the SCAF Mods to Rec Manual...improvements to manual targeting, etc..

My concern is that when enabling with JSGME, a huge list of effected files are listed, most of which seem logical (e.g.,overwrites of RSRDC350 files) however quite a few seem to have nothing to do with the SCAF MOD; for example, the SCAF MOD seemingly may effect files related to Uniforms, Medals, CrewSystem management, the INTRO (main) Menu Screen, etc... I'm curious how these earlier MODs (see below) in my SH4 installation will be effected.....? I don't need details, just a confirmation that the essence of these MODs will remain uneffected. Thanks

"AwardsItems_1.dds" has already been altered by the "AllMedalsBeta Revised" mod.
"AwardsItems_2.dds" has already been altered by the "AllMedalsBeta Revised" mod.
"CrewSystemsManagement.dds" has already been altered by the "AllMedalsBeta Revised" mod.
"CrewSystemsManagement.dds" has already been altered by the "John Hamm's Uniform Mod V1.0" mod.
"HUD.dds" has already been altered by the "LeoVampV HUD" mod.
"Intro_logo_bkg.dds" has already been altered by the "Dave Tribute Mod" mod.

[CapnScurvy]

The SCAF MOD seemingly may effect files related to Uniforms, Medals, CrewSystem management, the INTRO (main) Menu Screen, etc... I'm curious how these earlier MODs (see below) in my SH4 installation will be effected.....? I don't need details, just a confirmation that the essence of these MODs will remain uneffected.

Doolittle, you are right to think the SCAF mod will "do things" to the various areas you state. This was done for the average gamer in mind who is looking for an improvement to the stock game, without loading a bunch of mods together. For instance the Bronze Star should look like a Bronze Star, not a cheap "Wallmart" knockoff! I understand why the game did it, but that's no reason to not change it by me.

My solution for you is to simply load those game particulars after SCAF 1.2 in JSGME. Then you get the benefits of the SCAF corrections for ship mast heights while flavoring your game as you see fit. I released the mod as I see fit. :D

Cheers

[Doolittle81]

The SCAF MOD seemingly may effect files related to Uniforms, Medals, CrewSystem management, the INTRO (main) Menu Screen, etc... I'm curious how these earlier MODs (see below) in my SH4 installation will be effected.....? I don't need details, just a confirmation that the essence of these MODs will remain uneffected.

Doolittle, you are right to think the SCAF mod will "do things" to the various areas you state. This was done for the average gamer in mind who is looking for an improvement to the stock game, without loading a bunch of mods together. For instance the Bronze Star should look like a Bronze Star, not a cheap "Wallmart" knockoff! I understand why the game did it, but that's no reason to not change it by me.

My solution for you is to simply load those game particulars after SCAF 1.2 in JSGME. Then you get the benefits of the SCAF corrections for ship mast heights while flavoring your game as you see fit. I released the mod as I see fit. :D

Cheers

Thanks for the quick response and confirmation/clarification. I'll do as you suggest with the Uniforms MOD, installing after SCAF; the Medals MOD also was done to replace make-believe medals with images of the real Medals, so it prob doesn't need to be enabled if your SCAF MOD does the same thing. I don't even know what the Crew System Management file does.

[DrBeast]

I don't even know what the Crew System Management file does.
It's the graphic of your crew list. If memory serves, it's safe to let SCAF overwrite both that and the award items, since they're from the same mod (by Captain Cox, again if memory serves).

[CapnScurvy]

Yes Doolittle81, the order of activation is usually the largest stumbling block for gamers who wish to have the JSGME MODS folder look as long as their arm. Without knowing what each mod will do can create undesirable results, or even CTD's. It's good that you look at the JSGME file overwrite warnings to see just what changes each mod may do over the previously activated one.

With running the game with the various mods enabled, you can usually come up with a version that you like just by selecting the order of activation. With mods that are fairly large and inclusive, many file areas may "cross over" onto another's files. The creator should use his knowledge of all the various mods to make it as compatible as possible.

The HUD (image) file you referred to provides the images of the lower border of the main game screen, where the "buttons" are for going to the various stations and such. My version for the stock game was created by Jimimadrid which gives a "green glow" when a button is pushed. It's only used for the stock game. The HUD version of TMO was created by someone else and is intact with the SCAF editions, I did not change it from their version. The Crew System Management (image) file is the group of images that is used when you go to the Sub Management Station. This is where the correct medals image needs to be provided so it will display correctly when you award a crewman for his work, plus some other image changes.

[Hobnail]

Thanks CaptScurvy,

I've used your mod since its release and appreciate your efforts. Being a 1.5 (U-boat Misisons)/TMO/RSRD user I'm not using it at the moment and missing it.

Any plans to include 1.5 support?

[CapnScurvy]

Any plans to include 1.5 support?



Znatan,Paajtor and anyone else interested. I have not purchased the Add-On 1.5 patch. Frankly, it's against my releigon. Thou shalt not pay for stuff that you don't need. I see the bargin based price of SH4 with the Add-On (patch 1.5) is now 27 dollars, I paid 50 for my first copy and had to work long and hard to figure out how to make the damn thing calculate manual range correctly. They should pay me for my efforts, but thats not too likely. So, I'm not to likely to fool around with a patch that costs me more than what I've already paid. Sorry men, but I usually don't go back on my word.

[CapnScurvy]

Doolittle81, and to those that have downloaded the latest "SCAF for RSRDC v350" (between it's release, to the 15th). Please accept my apologies for an error that I became aware of while looking at the Crew Management System.dds file that we were talking about yesterday morning (a couple of replies ago). I found that the file in question is the original stock file and not one that actually depicts the correct U.S. Medals for the Crew Management Station. This only effects a handfull of users, but I'm not one to let an error on my part go unattended. To check if you need to redownload the SCAF edition, go to the Crew Management Station and take a look at the small images of the medals for the crew. The first left medal should say "Purple Heart" when you mouse over it, and it should be the image of the Purple Heart. The stock image file does not have the correct medal picture shown, (although the mouse over text is correct). The corrected download was put on the Filefront site late March 15th, and is here SCAF for RSRDC v350 (http://files.filefront.com/SCAF12+for+RSRD350+14rar/;9825272;/fileinfo.html). :oops:

[Paajtor]

Any plans to include 1.5 support?


Znatan,Paajtor and anyone else interested. I have not purchased the Add-On 1.5 patch. Frankly, it's against my releigon. Thou shalt not pay for stuff that you don't need. I see the bargin based price of SH4 with the Add-On (patch 1.5) is now 27 dollars, I paid 50 for my first copy and had to work long and hard to figure out how to make the damn thing calculate manual range correctly. They should pay me for my efforts, but thats not too likely. So, I'm not to likely to fool around with a patch that costs me more than what I've already paid. Sorry men, but I usually don't go back on my word.
Scurvy, would it have made a difference, if you had more affinity with Uboats in general?
Not that I don't respect your decision, though.

[u.Prestige]

Hi, CapnScurvy
Can Maxoptics2 work on TMO-v1.5?
I use SH4 v1.5+TMO-v1.5+RSRDC371 now, can SCAF1.2_for_TMO_RSRDCv370.rar (http://files.filefront.com/SCAF12+for+TMO+RSRDCv370rar/;9816982;/fileinfo.html)
Thanks! also work on RSRDC371?

[CapnScurvy]

Scurvy, would it have made a difference, if you had more affinity with U-boats in general?
Not that I don't respect your decision, though.

Paajtor, no not at all. I enjoyed playing the SHIII game. I cut my eye teeth with studying Wazzo's great tutorial for learning manual targeting and Navigation Map plotting of ships. The AoB calculator that I used then was the inspiration for making my own version today. I found the game to be interesting, but not soul catching. In my view, it's a game simulation based on an enemy war machine that did its job very effectively. Many of you can defend Ubisoft all you want, but I ask you, have you seen a game simulation based on the B29 Air Corps with the Angola Gay dropping "Fat Boy" as a mission? Men, it’s not too likely. Nor should we!!

I admit I have an allegiance to one side or the other, my generation was perhaps too close to the real thing not to “pick sides”. I grew up with a father who served during WWII, South Pacific, Army Tank Battalion serving almost 3 years overseas. He didn't talk about the war much when I was a kid, but I remember he refused to buy anything "Made in Japan" until 1979 with a Nissan auto purchase. That was tuff to do when Jap products were just about all you saw during the 1950’s & 60’s. Some of his few stories I do remember were of the brutality which the Japanese used on their enemies and the equaled measure the U.S. GI learned to give back to them (ever wonder why there's not much talk of prisoners of war in the Pacific after the Bataan Death March?). There's plenty written about the prisoner of war camps from the European Theater though.

I believe the learning curve for many GI's from the Pacific took a long time to overcome, once they were stateside. The Navy and Air Corp guys seldom looked the enemy in the eyes as the “ground pounders” did. I guess there’s something about having to watch your fellow tank commander get cut in two as he tried to escape his burning tank due to an ambush. As you pull your tank up to block the line of fire you watch the other crewmen deal with the lower half of the torso, stuck in the hatch as they tried to make their escape. With the next day, it’s just more of the same. I just happened to have seen first hand what effects this type of war had on a person, and believe me, dad was very well adjusted. I admit I have a definitive interest in the U.S. Pacific Theater. Thanks, for the question though!!

My problem simply stems from the idea of paying for an update that I have no interest in. Yet, a patch 1.5 (that should have been made separate) was included for the price as well. Bull Balls!!!! I’m just not a shill for this kind of treatment from a game company that’s looking for a profit over substance.


Can Maxoptics2 work on TMO-v1.5?
I use SH4 v1.5+TMO-v1.5+RSRDC371 now, can SCAF1.2_for_TMO_RSRDCv370.rar (http://files.filefront.com/SCAF12+for+TMO+RSRDCv370rar/;9816982;/fileinfo.html)
Thanks! also work on RSRDC371?

u.Prestige, I’m sorry I can not answer your questions. Without having the Add-On 1.5 patch I have no way of knowing. The version of Maxoptics2 included within the “SCAF for TMO" (the patched 1.4 TMO version) edition may work?!?! I just do not know, try it and see. You probable notice, I don’t have that particular version of Maxoptics2 (for TMO 1.4) on the main links of this post because I only have it paired with the correct version of TMO. If you download the “SCAF for TMO” (http://files.filefront.com/SCAF12+for+TMOrar/;9723605;/fileinfo.html) you’re welcome to try it but I have no way of knowing what will happen when it’s paired with the 1.5 versions. If the wheels come off the cart, just uninstall and then you’ll know. And if you get the word back to me, then I’ll know too. As far as the “SCAF 1.2 for TMO RSRDCv370” (http://files.filefront.com/SCAF12+for+TMO+RSRDCv370rar/;9816982;/fileinfo.html) compatible to the 1.5 RSRDCv371 question. The same answer applies. Sorry to be as stubborn as a mule about the 1.5 thing, but that’s just me.

I will suggest something for those that want greater accuracy with manual targeting. It’s not as accurate since it doesn’t provide the ship centered method that SCAF has. However, for those who see a benefit in correcting the mast heights the stock game provides (and that other mods such as Trigger Maru or Run Silent, Run Deep don’t address) Try “SH4 Stock Mast Height Correction” (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=132683) it’s a simple mod that used the same calibration techniques SCAF used to find the correct range to target, but doing so with the bow stock masts as the reference point. Except for the Agano, (and a couple of other ships) this has a single stern mast. There are no frills to this mod. I tried to make it as lean as I could so it could work with any patch, past or future, or any Add-On short of a complete game rework or ship additions beyond stock. But, again use at your own risk, I’ve not tried it with 1.5.

But, I do recommend you try the latest “RFB 1.4_03,14,08” (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=125529) version that has SCAF 1.2 and Maxoptics2 included. It’s a fine “super mod” as TMO is, with RSRDC missions added and more on the way. Ok, I will be a shill for RFB mod!! :up:

[Paajtor]

Rgr that, Capn...:up:
As things look now, I guess I'll have 2 SH4-installs for at least 6 months: one for Fleetboats, and the other for Uboats...so I will continue to use your excellent SCAF-mods.

To me, it doesn't matter which warmachine I'm playing.
In the end, it's all crazy.
The theatre is what matters most to me, and that's why I prefer the N-Atlantic.

But you already knew that. :D

[CapnScurvy]

Paajtor, I'm going on a short spring vacation this week. St. Paddies day has always been lucky for me. This is my wedding anniversary today, 35 great ones. It's possible I'll feel different about things when we get back. A little time away without the computer can do a lot of good sometimes. No promises, but I know there has been an interest in the 1.5 compatibility with SCAF, and I need to give those that would like to try it a chance. :hmm:

[Paajtor]

Hey, congrats....and a nice day!;)

You're right. Step away for a little, never hurts.

[DrBeast]

35 years...wow! And here I was smug about celebrating the 5-year anniversary with my g/f a week ago! Congrats, man! You're a hero! :D

[CapnScurvy]

I've just released the latest editions of SCAF. The 1.4 version is intended to be used with the SH4 patched to 1.4. It has a few minor tweaks and changes to any previous versions.

The SCAF 1.5 edition is just that, compatible with the Addon. I've listed the modifications included with this version at the first post of this thread.

Both editions have a change log text file to explain what is added or changed.

[Paajtor]

Awesome!:up:

Thx...and I hope you had a good time.

[CapnScurvy]

Hi Paajtor, Good to see your still on line!!! Yes we had a great time away. The wife and I were married in Columbia, South Carolina, so it was good to return to Myrtle Beach in the spring.


Since I've returned I've been slow in wraping up the Stock SCAF 1.5 version. I've been helping with the RFB 1.5 version (coming soon) and just recently had the time to update the stock editions of SCAF. I know there have been several new mods like TMO 1.5 A,B,C,whatever, and RSRD's latest, so I'll get around to looking at them as time allows. ;)

[Iain MacLean]

Hey CapnScurvy-

Just a quick question, and I'm not sure if it has already been answered, but as this thread is quite lengthy, and nothing is found in the read-me, I thought I would make haste the better part of valor and just ask you straight aways-

I have downloaded and un-rared the latest version of your mod that is supposed to run with TMO and RSRD, but whenever I enable it and attempt to start the game, I recieve an error partway through the loading of the game-

It tells me that I am missing a data/menu/gui/layout/crewmanagement thingie. tga file- I have gone through the stock files, the TMO files, your mod files, and cannot for the life of me find it- any clue how to fix this? If I disable your mod, the game runs fine with any other mod- it is only after I enable your mod that I get this message.

I think the work you've done is exceptional and I would love to be able to benefit from it, suffering from the same frustrations that lead you to create this mod in the first place, and would therefore be thankful for any help you can give me.

Cheers,

Iain.

[CaptainHunter]

I get the same error Iain:cry:

[CapnScurvy]

Iain Maclean and CaptainHunter, I must ask you what versions of TMO and the releated RSRD are you installing before running SCAF? and what version of SCAF are you using 1.4 or 1.5? I've been away for a bit trying to keep up with real life; as they say you make hay when the sun shines and that's exactly what I've been doing lately. Anyone needing some good quality Timothy!?!

Anyway, before I jump to conclusions please give me a little more to go on. I'll try to look at what could be causing this, But I admit I've not kept up with TMO's latest versions or RSRD missions as well. I was spending a fair amount of time helping with RFB and let TMO and RSRD get ahead of me. :D

[CaptainHunter]

http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj230/GunnyMac222/GME.jpg

[CapnScurvy]

Thanks CaptainHunter for getting back to me. I see your using TMO 1.5.2 and to answer your first question with a short answer, SCAF 1.2 was not made compatible for this later release of Ducimus. SCAF 1.2 did work beautifully with the first release of TMO but there has been several updates made to the original TMO (thus the "2" in the title, actually the TMO that SCAF 1.2 is compatible with is a version released before the 1.5 Addon). SCAF 1.2 or any other SCAF version is not recommended for compatibility with TMO 1.5.2.

The same is true with the current RSRDC v371. SCAF 1.2 was compatible with Lurker's original TMO v370 but not with his v371, nor with the nine patches he has done after the first v371 release!

If this is confusing to you then all you really need to understand is that for me to keep SCAF updated to mods that revised themselves as often as you change your socks became too much of a chore. I'd have to track these mods and check for compatibility with every change they made. If I had the time to keep up I would but frankly I don't. I have said I would do so, so perhaps I will in the near future. I'm not going to promise, but if I can find some time soon I'll release a newer version that will be compatible untill one of them decide to change something again. :o

Best regards

[neilbyrne]

Captain,
I really like your mod and I really like TMO.

Ducimus has said recently in his thread that he will probably be hanging up his binoculars to deal w/ RL issues and start modding another game. If so, 152 is likely the last version of TMO.

Is there a way to install just the ship and recog manual pieces of SCAF into TMO 152 so it will work without all the frills? Just replace the DATA/SEA files and the recog manual? If there are some new ships to which it doesn't apply then OK provided it doesn't CTD.

Thanks so much.

[CaptainHunter]

CapnScurvy :up: understood sir.

[CapnScurvy]

Men, I should tell you that I've been working on the revised SCAF mod for TMO 1.5.2 and I'm 95% done. I've been checking the ship mast heights on the newest ships and have the pictures updated. I will probably have a completed edition soon after a couple more tests. Sometimes the uploading of the mod with the proper links to the thing take as much time as the testing itself. I've got some RL things to do as well so I should have the revision ready very soon.

I know there are a lot of you that use RSRD with TMO, so I do plan on updating it as well, but for now the TMO edition will have to work for you.


Is there a way to install just the ship and recog manual pieces of SCAF into TMO 152 so it will work without all the frills? Just replace the DATA/SEA files and the recog manual? If there are some new ships to which it doesn't apply then OK provided it doesn't CTD.


Yes and no, you could hand type each ships "Mast Height" into the particular ships config file but the height you use has to be calibrated to the particular point of reference you choose (funnel, mast top, flag). Then you would have to mark this location within the Rec Manual so you remember to use that point when making a range finding. To do just the stock ships for both American and German sides there's over 100. When you add additional ships like TMO's, and then even more with RSRD's, you've got your work cut out for you. Can you do it? Heck yes!! If I can, so can a monkey. But, this monkey's peddling as fast as he can so you won't have to, so hang in there the banana is about to be grabbed. :rotfl:

[Iain MacLean]

CapnScurvy-

Thanks, sorry for not responding ASAP, but Captain Hunter has the same mod build I use minus RSRD (latest version and Patch 9 ;). That clears things up very nicely, thank you.

I look forward to your next release, and best of luck. Thanks again- it's people willing to put the hard work into these mods that makes playing this game truly a pleasure. I will watch the forums eagerly.

Clear skies and calm seas,

Iain

[CapnScurvy]

I have uploaded the latest revised edition for SCAF 1.5, compatible for Trigger Maru 1.5.2 to the FileFront site. The link to the download can be found at the first post of this thread. Please read the document and readme files for installation and use. Remember this edition is to be used only with a "stand alone" version of TMO152. Using RSRDC v371 with TMO152 will create CTD's if you use this mod.

I will be working on revising the Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign compatible editions next.

Good Hunting
and Thanks for your support!

[CaptainHunter]

Thanks CapnScurvy:rock:

[CapnScurvy]

The latest release of the revised SCAF 1.5 modification is now on the first post of this thread. Entitled "SCAF 1.5 for RSRDv371" it is compatible with the latest Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign version that works with the TMO 1.5.2 mod. This edition of SCAF is also compatible to the latest patch for RSRDC "Patch 9".

In all there were 154 ship classes checked and calibrated for accuracy, making this one of my largest undertakings. Several Recognition Manual pictures had to be changed to represent the actual ship one will encounter during play, as well as the reference point for range finding. The same additions of the stand alone SCAF for TMO152 were included in this edition.

My next revision will be for the RSRDC v355 stock Silent Hunter 4 modification. For right now I plan to enjoy the holiday, Have a safe July 4th!!

[neilbyrne]

Cap'n Scurvy,
Thanks for all your work. As one who wouldn't know a line of C++ if he found it in his breakfast cereal, I can't help but be taken by your capability and even more impressed by the selfless dedication to the community. :sunny:

[CaptainHunter]

Been using your mod for two days now and if works flawlessly.

Thanks

[Fearless]

The latest release of the revised SCAF 1.5 modification is now on the first post of this thread. Entitled "SCAF 1.5 for RSRDv371" it is compatible with the latest Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign version that works with the TMO 1.5.2 mod. This edition of SCAF is also compatible to the latest patch for RSRDC "Patch 9".

In all there were 154 ship classes checked and calibrated for accuracy, making this one of my largest undertakings. Several Recognition Manual pictures had to be changed to represent the actual ship one will encounter during play, as well as the reference point for range finding. The same additions of the stand alone SCAF for TMO152 were included in this edition.

My next revision will be for the RSRDC v355 stock Silent Hunter 4 modification. For right now I plan to enjoy the holiday, Have a safe July 4th!!

Sorry for the delayed response but I have RFB v1.5 and latest RSRDC (compatible with RFB). Will there be a revised SCAF for the above combination provided?

[CapnScurvy]

Well bless Lurker's pea picking heart!! He's made another patch to check. Thank's Fearless for asking. :up:

Yes, I'm going to take a look at the latest RSRSC_patch 10 release for TMO 152 and also see what he's been up to with the latest RFB version.

I've not forgotten about SCAF for the stock "RSRDC_v355_for_v15" either. Frankly I've been looking at a sound change for the stock game and plan to include it with the SCAF stock versions. Being summer for me doesn't allow much time to sit at the computer and keep up with the changes others come up with.

Again, thank's Fearless for asking, I will check these today.

[Seminole]

Love this accuracy fix mod so far, I really do... but am left wondering why in the world it included awards modifications?

There are separate mods for changing the awards if the player wants this... and the accuracy fix mod did a number on John's Uniform mod...at least that is what JSGME told me. It won't even let me disable the uniform mod now without taking out the accuracy fix mod first...:shifty:

Though I haven't played enough to see what "damage" if any this has caused.

[CapnScurvy]

Seminole, you must be referring to the stock SCAF 1.5 version. That's the only edition that I put the Midnite's medal correction in. Why I did it was to correct the problem of inaccurate medals in the stock game. I believe the Silver Star should be called what it is, not the Patrol Star, and look like it should. I made the change for the good of the order and because I could.

If your talking about the John Hamm's Uniform mod is being overwritten by SCAF, may I suggest you load the Uniform mod after SCAF. I don't know what files are being used by the Uniform Mod that SCAF has, but placing the Uniform Mod later in the JSGME order will overwrite SCAF's and off you go. JSGME get's it's panties in a wad when files are over written and the warning makes it sound as if the computer will fry before your eyes if you continue. Just ignore the warnings and load in the order I suggest. The only harm may come from the awards get screwed back to the stock version. Then go see John Hamm. :D

Best regards

[Seminole]

Sorry captain ..."fraid not..I'm using SH1.4 waiting on Amazon to send me me Gold1.5.

No ...I'm not mistaken I rechecked my SHIV downloads folder and the only one in there is clearly labeled for SCAF 1.4 It did change the medal awards and it did rewrite Mr Hann's uniform mod.

Here is the mod's properties namel cut and pasted from the download:

"SCAF_for_SH_1.4.rar"


These files are included: in SCAF 1.4 Data folder:

AwardsItems_1.dds
AwardsItems_2.dds

I did not even download version1.5 of SCAF



But again ...why include all that peripherial stuff in such a profoundly useful mod at all? The idea to fix the accuracy was a brillant stand alone idea. It didn't need award changes or new maps or bearing plotters...I could get those elsewhere if and when needed or wanted.

(..and no I am not complaining..believe it or not..I'm just expressing my feelings. )

[CapnScurvy]

Yep, your right. I did put the FullMetaledges Award mod in the 1.4 version. I forgot some folks still use the 1.4 version. Sorry about that. Believe me, when I updated to 1.5 I didn't want to spend more money on a patch that put the German's in the Pacific! To me, that's really useless.

Also, I don't think of the comments as being critical. Your input is helpful in understanding what you see as a point worth making. I apperciate your point and will consider it's consequence. However, knowing that the stock game is flawed with inaccurate mast heights used for manual targeting and the awards are screwed up too, was to much for me to over look. It's like saying the American flag has green stripes on an orange background, so use it anyway. No way! The stock awards are more than nonauthentic in their image but screwed up in what is presented (either for the crew or the player). Adding a correction that fix's some of the screw up (although there are still award issues that are hard coded within the game we modder's can not fix) seemed to be the right thing to do.

[Seminole]

I agree with you that the awards that came with the game are as dopey an idea as ever came down the pike. No argument Gives me the shivers too.

Still a specific mod to correct awards is the way to deal with that. Like I said the accuracy fix mod by itself is more than enough.

Thanks for understanding.

[CapnScurvy]

I have uploaded two revised SCAF mods to the first post of this thread. Both are editions that are compatible with the latest Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign mod that is compatible for Real Fleet Boat 1.51 and Trigger Maru Overhauled 1.5.2.

The RSRDC v395_RC5 is to be used with RFB 1.51; the latest RSRDC_Patch 4 and the RSRDC_AuxGB_Fix are all compatible with the "SCAF for RSRDC v395" mod.

The RSRDC v371 is to be used with TMO 1.5.2; the latest RSRDC_Patch 10 and the RSRDC_AuxGB_Fix are also compatible with the "SCAF for RSRDC v371" mod.

Both SCAF mods have optional mods for use specific to the parent modification, such as MaxOptics for TMO or MaxOptics for RFB or Metric Nomograph's. As always, read the documentation that is included and make sure you download the correct application for the intended parent mod. Again, the mods can be found at the first post in this thread.

[Genferret]

I have uploaded two revised SCAF mods to the first post of this thread. Both are editions that are compatible with the latest Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign mod that is compatible for Real Fleet Boat 1.51 and Trigger Maru Overhauled 1.5.2.

The RSRDC v395_RC5 is to be used with RFB 1.51; the latest RSRDC_Patch 4 and the RSRDC_AuxGB_Fix are all compatible with the "SCAF for RSRDC v395" mod.

The RSRDC v371 is to be used with TMO 1.5.2; the latest RSRDC_Patch 10 and the RSRDC_AuxGB_Fix are also compatible with the "SCAF for RSRDC v371" mod.

Both SCAF mods have optional mods for use specific to the parent modification, such as MaxOptics for TMO or MaxOptics for RFB or Metric Nomograph's. As always, read the documentation that is included and make sure you download the correct application for the intended parent mod. Again, the mods can be found at the first post in this thread.

With the RSRDC v395_RC5 version installed the game crashes about 1/2 way through the loading screen.

Currently have installed (in this order):

RFB_v1.51_062308
RSRDC_RFBv15_V395_RC5
RSRDC_V395_Patch4
RSRDC_AuxGB_Fix
SCAF1.5 for RSRDC_395_RC5

If I remove the SCAF1.5 for RSRDC_395_RC5 the game loads without any issues.

Also since I am in the process of deciding between TMO and RFB I decided to do a load with TMO instead of RFB and that version worked just fine.

[Genferret]

I have uploaded two revised SCAF mods to the first post of this thread. Both are editions that are compatible with the latest Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign mod that is compatible for Real Fleet Boat 1.51 and Trigger Maru Overhauled 1.5.2.

The RSRDC v395_RC5 is to be used with RFB 1.51; the latest RSRDC_Patch 4 and the RSRDC_AuxGB_Fix are all compatible with the "SCAF for RSRDC v395" mod.

The RSRDC v371 is to be used with TMO 1.5.2; the latest RSRDC_Patch 10 and the RSRDC_AuxGB_Fix are also compatible with the "SCAF for RSRDC v371" mod.

Both SCAF mods have optional mods for use specific to the parent modification, such as MaxOptics for TMO or MaxOptics for RFB or Metric Nomograph's. As always, read the documentation that is included and make sure you download the correct application for the intended parent mod. Again, the mods can be found at the first post in this thread.
With the RSRDC v395_RC5 version installed the game crashes about 1/2 way through the loading screen.

Currently have installed (in this order):

RFB_v1.51_062308
RSRDC_RFBv15_V395_RC5
RSRDC_V395_Patch4
RSRDC_AuxGB_Fix
SCAF1.5 for RSRDC_395_RC5

If I remove the SCAF1.5 for RSRDC_395_RC5 the game loads without any issues.

Also since I am in the process of deciding between TMO and RFB I decided to do a load with TMO instead of RFB and that version worked just fine.

Ignore this now.

For some reason when I downloaded the RFB/RSRDC version again (third attempt) it now works. I had tried that once before to make sure it wasn't a corrupt download issue but it still crashed, however third time is a charm I guess.

Sorry for the bad initial report, I swear I'm not a n00b. :nope:

Now to check out RFB finally. :rock:

[CapnScurvy]

Genferret, Thank's for trying the mod. FileFront has never been known to be problem free. I've heard people from other countries outside north America sometimes will have trouble with the downloads from it. You saved me from sticking my head under the hood to tinker with the thing. I'll be the first person to admit every computer is different and sometimes the results of one application can be different for another.

Best regards

[CapnScurvy]

I have just uploaded to FileFront two newer released Ship Centered, Accuracy Fix mods. Both new releases can be found at the first post of this thread.

SCAF for TMO is an edition that is compatible with the Trigger Maru Overhauled mod compatible with SH4 patched to the 1.4 version only. This latest release adds larger Hud dials to the game making for greater readability (original work done by AOTD_MadMax).
Also an Hud compass center "releative bearing" dial was added to help in making course changes for the sub (original design by Jimimadrid). All ships were rechecked for accuracy with the optional use of the "MaxOptics for TMO" mod included in the download. A "Metric Nomograph" was also included as an optional download.

SCAF 1.2 for RSRDC v370 is a SCAF mod for the older Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign set for TMO (for the SH4 1.4 version). RSRDC v370 has a "Patch 1" as well, and this latest SCAF version is compatable to all. It also has the "MaxOptics for TMO" and the "Metric Nomograph" added to the download as an optional install. A total of 103 ship classes were calibrated for accuracy, and proper Recognition Manual pictures changed for the game. The Hud dials were inlarged as in the SCAF for TMO mod as well as the additional compass "releative bearing" dial center.

Again, both of these editions are for the older Silent Hunter 4 patched to only 1.4. Compatible with the older TMO and RSRDC mods.

Best regards

[CapnScurvy]

With the release of my U.S. Medals Fix mod I've taken the time to update the Ship Centered, Accuracy Fix (SCAF) mod and incorporated the two together. The latest downloadable editions are now in the first post of this thread. The U.S. Medals Fix modification is only compatible to the SH4 patched 1.5 versions. I've not looked at the 1.4 versions to see what exactly I'll need to do to make it compatible, I do know there are changes which will need to be made.

Best Regards

[Rockin Robbins]

http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa293/RockinRobbins13/smileys/thumbsup_weird-1.gif

[RAM]

Is it available for RFB+RSRD?

[CapnScurvy]

Is it available for RFB+RSRD?

Yes, at the first post of this thread look under the Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign section and find the "SCAF for RSRDC v395 RC5". The order of install through JSGME should be:

RFB_v1.51_062408
RSRDC_RFBv15_V395_RC5
RSRDC_V395_Patch4
RSRDC_AuxGB_Fix
SCAF1.5 for RSRDC_395_RC5

[Fish40]

I use RFB as well as RSRD, so no problems there. What about the addition of OM? I also use that mod which is installed after RSRD. Will I encounter any problems there?:hmm:

[RAM]

Is it available for RFB+RSRD?

Yes, at the first post of this thread look under the Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign section and find the "SCAF for RSRDC v395 RC5". The order of install through JSGME should be:

RFB_v1.51_062408
RSRDC_RFBv15_V395_RC5
RSRDC_V395_Patch4
RSRDC_AuxGB_Fix
SCAF1.5 for RSRDC_395_RC5

Thank you very much both for the answer and the mod!! :up:

[Matilda]

Gr8 mod! Keep it going. Your work helps many enjoy the game more than you would guess. I especially liked the work on the HUD Dials done by AOTD_MadMax, and the inclusion of MaxOptics3 by WernerSobe. Thanks to all.

[CapnScurvy]

I use RFB as well as RSRD, so no problems there. What about the addition of OM? I also use that mod which is installed after RSRD. Will I encounter any problems there?:hmm:

I'm fairly sure Operation Monsun will probably give you a CTD. New ships, new ship names will do you in. I would have to run a complete check on all the files long before I'd release a compatible version. Personaly, I like the Fleet Boat side, so I guess I'm not too crazy about doing the German side of things.:88)

[CapnScurvy]

I have updated all of the Silent Hunter 1.5 versions of SCAF to include a newer and different version of the U.S. Medals Fix modification. Because of a conflict between the Captain's award and the crew awards where the same label description had to be used for both, I have decided to remove the "Dolphins Badge" from the Crew awards and replace this 1st tier award with the Navy Commendation Medal. This will allow for a better written award citation (which I did improve) for the Captain.

I also removed the conflicting medals from the Captain's Award Box (found in the office). No medals will be seen in the Box when opened now. However, when mouse clicking the interior, the screen will change to whatever medals the Captain has received along with the written citation. To change medals (if more than one has been issued) clicking on the small "left hand" icons will take you to that specific medal, much as how it has been.

For those interested, there will not be a revised edition of SCAF 1.4 to include the U.S. Medals Fix. I have struggled with the files and come to the conclusion you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear!!! Our friends from across the pond have too many hard coded issues (that are out of our control) to make this a reality. This is one of the fixes the 1.5 version corrected (to a point) and why the Addon is needed. Do I think the Addon is worth the extra money, Heck No. This game should have been reasonably bug free at the time of release a year and half ago!!! We should'nt have to pay extra for a lame attempt at a fix!! Don't get me wrong, I blame the game producer for the mess not the developers. Ubisoft knew what they had two years ago, but the call of the money had them push the devs to give them what was done, ready or not. We the consumer are left with the end result. Hopefully we're a bit wiser, come any attempts at a future SHV. (Sorry about this, I've got a little steam to blow).


Again, all SCAF 1.5 editions have the U.S. Medals Fix modification incorporated within the different mods as of Oct. 3.

[C DuDe]

Hi,

Could you tell me if this MOD is compatible with the newest release of RFB or when it will be.
Also, is there going to be a readme where I can decide for myself what part of this MOD I want to use and what part I don't want?

Basically I'd like to only use the accuracy fix.

Thx

[CapnScurvy]

Hi,

Could you tell me if this MOD is compatible with the newest release of RFB or when it will be.
Also, is there going to be a readme where I can decide for myself what part of this MOD I want to use and what part I don't want?

Basically I'd like to only use the accuracy fix.

Thx

The current "RFB 1.51 062308" has the Ship Centered, Accuracy Fix (SCAF) included. Just down load the RFB 1.51 dated 062308.

All my SCAF mods have a readme for installation and instruction of use. And most have a Change Log that defines what is what, and what is "changed". As far as being able to pick and choose what you like and don't like is up to you, but I have included "other" changes to the basic modification for the "Good of the Order". Some things are interwound which should not be removed for the basic concept of playability.

[GOZO]

Hi Cptn. scurvy.:)

Got tha last version.

A maybe stupid question:

The periscope mods, have they differed in this version or can I use the ones I already am using?

Cheers

Per:cool:

[CapnScurvy]

Hi Cptn. scurvy.:)

Got tha last version.

A maybe stupid question:

The periscope mods, have they differed in this version or can I use the ones I already am using?

Cheers

Per:cool:

GOZO, the periscope optional files are no different in the latest editions. So using an older file is just fine.

[Very Jerry]

Does the version of SCAF (for TMO 1.5.2) work with the just released TMO1.6.2? Really like the plain SCAF for SH4 (v1.5), but am getting bored and want to go to TMO soon.

[CapnScurvy]

I would not attempt it. I'm certain the Menu.txt and the Menu_1024.ini files will need to be made compatable. Plus I'll have to check for ship accuracies; if there are new ones added, and just to check the old.

Unill then, TMO 1.6.2 looks like a well done mod. Go get your feet wet.

[filippm]

Does the version of SCAF (for TMO 1.5.2) work with the just released TMO1.6.2? Really like the plain SCAF for SH4 (v1.5), but am getting bored and want to go to TMO soon.

same question...pls answer :)

[CapnScurvy]

I have just released the latest revised editions of SCAF 1.5 for compatibility with Trigger Maru Overhauled 1.6.2 patched to 1.6.3, and the Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign v410 with its present Patch 2 that is compatible with TMO 1.6.3. Wheeeew, that's a lot of stuff in one sentance!!

The two revised editions have the latest ship configurations calibrated for correct manual range finding. Also, MaxOptics (magnification of several sub station views for target identification and an aid in manual range finding) has been included as an optional mod. The U.S. Medals Fix II mod is incorporated within the various editions of SCAF1.5 with a release date of March 2009 or later. I also did some house cleaning of the first post in this thread, and added some additional images in the "Discussion" portion of that post.

[Meridian]

Is there any chance that this could be updated to work with RFB 1.52?

Thanks

[keith_uk]

I have Trigger Maru Overhauled 1.6.2 patched to 1.6.3, and Run Silent, Run Deep with Patch 2 and i downloaded and installed the SCAF 1.5 thats said to be compatible with these mods, but its not. It crashes to desktop before the game has even loaded.

Also, why is the medals fix mixed in with this mod? I think the medals fix should be a separate mod or at least give clear instructions on how to separate them.

Anyay, i would have liked to have used this mod, as i hate the range finding system in sh4, but it keeps crashing.
I would also like the medal fix and i waited until i was back in port before installing the mod, but like i said, it crashes.

Keith.

[jimbob]

Them change logs has perty good info what's going in the files.

[magic452]

Capnscurvy Is it possable to install just the periscope Max optics and not change the binoculars, the very high magnification makes it hard to use unless you have stabilized view on.
Love the rest of your mod.

Magic452

[CapnScurvy]

I have Trigger Maru Overhauled 1.6.2 patched to 1.6.3, and Run Silent, Run Deep with Patch 2 and i downloaded and installed the SCAF 1.5 thats said to be compatible with these mods, but its not. It crashes to desktop before the game has even loaded.

Also, why is the medals fix mixed in with this mod? I think the medals fix should be a separate mod or at least give clear instructions on how to separate them.


Keith.

Keith, sorry to hear about your CTD's. I'm going to recommend that you follow the mod activation order found in the RSRDC thread.

TMO 162
TMO Patch 163
RSRDC_TMOv163_v410
RSRDC_V410_Patch 2 (date of FileFront upload Feb. 20)
RSRDC V4xxx Hotfix (date of FileFront upload March 14)

Activate the "SCAF for RSRDC v410" (date released March 2) next.

I get no CTD's startimg a new campaign. If you are finding your still having problems, try a new campaign. I know attempting to replay a saved game MAY create problems due to the changes held whithin specific saved game files.

You asked why is the "U.S. Medals Fix" included within the SCAF mod. I take the stand that the medals fix is exactly that, "a fix" to a dismal stock attempt at awards. Since SCAF is also a "fix" to mast heights for manual range finding, they go hand in hand. I modded both, and together they are presented. It's also one less mod that needs to be activated through JSGME. I didn't ask you "what other mods are you running?" with the above mods. However, adding mods that are not compatable can easily be a problem causing CTD's. I know the above activation order is compatible and correct, but I have no way of knowing what other mods get mixed in.

[keith_uk]

Thanks, i'll try it again, as i don't have the RSRDC V4xxx Hotfix (date of FileFront upload March 14).

I don't want to start another campaign though, so it might still crash.

Thanks,

Keith.

[keith_uk]

Still doesnt work. I don't know if its anything to do with my save game files, but this is crashing before the game has even loded to the menue screen, so i don't get chance to tyr and load a saved game.

I have the following mods:

TMO 162
TMO Patch 163
RSRDC_TMOv163_v410
RSRDC_V410_Patch 2 (date of FileFront upload Feb. 20)
RSRDC V4xxx Hotfix (date of FileFront upload March 14)

I don't have any other mods and i never have had. This game is a fresh intstall on new computer with only the mods above.

Keith.

[CapnScurvy]

Thanks, i'll try it again, as i don't have the RSRDC V4xxx Hotfix (date of FileFront upload March 14).

I don't want to start another campaign though, so it might still crash.

Thanks,

Keith.

Keith, a previously saved campaign "should" be ok to continue as long as your back at port starting a new mission when you activate the mods listed. The new mission should start with the differently modded files and should run without a CTD. The problem will appear if you decide to go back to a previously saved point that did not have the modded files used. That's when trouble will come knocking on your door.

====================

Capnscurvy Is it possable to install just the periscope Max optics and not change the binoculars, the very high magnification makes it hard to use unless you have stabilized view on.


For you to do it yourself you'll need the S3D Silent Editor and change the Binocular Optical parameters in the Cameras.dat file. If this isn't something you want to do, give me a bit of time and I'll make a Binocular that will have a stock magnification setting and the ability to zoom out to the 250% view that's used in the MaxOptics mod. This way you may chose which zoom you wish depending on the circumstances. Tell me magic, do you use the MaxOptics mod with the stock game or with TMO. It will make a difference since TMO uses a different Camera.dat file than stock. I know this isn't realestic for Binocular's to zoom, but hey it's fun to see the enemy up close and personal.


=======================


Is there any chance that this could be updated to work with RFB 1.52?


Yes, I'm looking at it now. I've just started to compare the RFB 1.52 funnel heights (the RFB Manual states all warships use funnels) for some of it's warships and I'm finding quite a large difference in range. For instance, the Yamato has an RFB funnel height of 27.4 meters, I checked the range at an actual true distance of 1053 meters and the manual found range was 120 meters too short. The Fuso was 177 meters too short after a manual range check over an 1120 meter distance. These checks were done with both sub and target stationary, and zero wind to cause a rough sea. To miss a target range by that much you had better be really close to expect a hit.

[CapnScurvy]

Still doesnt work. I don't know if its anything to do with my save game files, but this is crashing before the game has even loded to the menue screen, so i don't get chance to tyr and load a saved game.

I have the following mods:

TMO 162
TMO Patch 163
RSRDC_TMOv163_v410
RSRDC_V410_Patch 2 (date of FileFront upload Feb. 20)
RSRDC V4xxx Hotfix (date of FileFront upload March 14)

I don't have any other mods and i never have had. This game is a fresh intstall on new computer with only the mods above.

Keith.

That's the latest group, make sure you have the "SCAF for RSRDC v410" not the "SCAF 1.5 for TMO1.6.3". There is a difference in the two. Sorry, about your trouble.

[keith_uk]

Yes, RSRDC v410 is the one i used.

Thanks,

Keith.

[magic452]

Capnscurvy I don't have s3d editor and if I did, I wouldn't have a game left to play. My skill at this sort of thing is next to zero. :damn:

I am playing TMO 1.63 and SCAF I think there are others out here that would like to see such a mod as you described. I know of at least one.

Much Thanks :salute: Magic452

[CapnScurvy]

Capnscurvy I don't have s3d editor and if I did, I wouldn't have a game left to play. My skill at this sort of thing is next to zero. :damn:

I am playing TMO 1.63 and SCAF I think there are others out here that would like to see such a mod as you described. I know of at least one.

Much Thanks :salute: Magic452

Magic, try the "MaxOptics for TMO 1.6.3_Bino" that I have just released. This modification is similar to the MaxOptics that's included in the SCAF for TMO 1.6.3 download BUT, I was able to create an additional magnification for the Binoculars. Using the mouse wheel, the first magnification is the same as stock. The next magnification will give you a 250% increase over stock. This should help in giving you a more stable view at the lower zoom setting, yet giving you an increased magnification when needed.

The link to the download can be found at the first post in this thread under the Trigger Maru heading.

[magic452]

THANKS VERY MUCH capnscurvy :salute: I know at least 2 captains over at UBI that are looking for this. I'll try to hook them up with your mod.

Great work and I'm sure there are a lot of guys who will join me in saying thanks.

Magic

[Armistead]

Can I just use the periscope zoom function with RSRD, without changing the stad. Use TMO1.7RSRD. I'm not clear. It seems it can be done with TMO, but the link for RSRD seems you have to accept the whole deal, I just want more zoom and would love a clear periscope.

[CapnScurvy]

Can I just use the periscope zoom function with RSRD, without changing the stad. Use TMO1.7RSRD. I'm not clear. It seems it can be done with TMO, but the link for RSRD seems you have to accept the whole deal, I just want more zoom and would love a clear periscope.

Are you talking about the MaxOptics feature? If you are, you don't need to use SCAF, the "MaxOptics for TMO 1.6.3" included in the download is separate. Just activate the portion that you want. But I see you refer to the TMO1.7 mod. Don't expect the 1.6.3 version to work with the 1.7!! The Cameras.dat file could be quite different (it's whatever Ducimus changed, if anything between the two). If I state my mods are for a certain version, THEY ARE FOR THAT CERTAIN VERSION!! Since 1.7 is a beta I have no reason to release a compatible mod for it, (even though one sits on my computer now).

Also, you request a "clear periscope". MaxOptics does not clear the periscope screen. Whatever 1.6.3, or 1.7 uses for a periscope image so does MaxOptics. MaxOptics changes magnification.

[Armistead]

Are you talking about the MaxOptics feature? If you are, you don't need to use SCAF, the "MaxOptics for TMO 1.6.3" included in the download is separate. Just activate the portion that you want. But I see you refer to the TMO1.7 mod. Don't expect the 1.6.3 version to work with the 1.7!! The Cameras.dat file could be quite different (it's whatever Ducimus changed, if anything between the two). If I state my mods are for a certain version, THEY ARE FOR THAT CERTAIN VERSION!! Since 1.7 is a beta I have no reason to release a compatible mod for it, (even though one sits on my computer now).

Also, you request a "clear periscope". MaxOptics does not clear the periscope screen. Whatever 1.6.3, or 1.7 uses for a periscope image so does MaxOptics. MaxOptics changes magnification.

Using 1.7, so will wait and see. I did try it and it seemed to work fine. The only problem was the deckgun. You barely move the aimer and it takes way off, like the mouse is set to super high speed. Love the magnification, so hope you guys will eventually get it working.......

[CapnScurvy]

Using 1.7, so will wait and see. I did try it and it seemed to work fine. The only problem was the deckgun. You barely move the aimer and it takes way off, like the mouse is set to super high speed. Love the magnification, so hope you guys will eventually get it working.......

Armistead, there is little I can do about the horizontal movement speed at the high magnification for the deck gun. If you back off the zoom to the second level the speed left or right is manageable, then zoom in for a mark before firing. You will find by using the "Shift" key the elevation at the high magnification level is much faster, giving you a quick range adjustment. There is no such key for "slowing down" the horizontal deck gun movement.

Again, regarding the difference between the TMO 1.6.3 and TMO 1.7 for the Cameras.dat file (which is where the MaxOptics changes lie). Ducimus could have easily made some sort of change to how the walk-around view feature is used, or some difference between the "Environmental" mods (or whatever the heck TMO 1.7 uses different than stock for color or image views) which are changes made from Kriller2 or W_clear (these too change the Cameras.dat file). Without looking at every aspect of the Cameras.dat file and comparing one to another I have no way of knowing what tweak (may or may not) be different in the TMO versions. And really I don't care, I'm concerned about taking whatever is released and adding my magnification changes to them, thus making the two perfectly compatible.
So, can the MaxOptics version for TMO 1.6.3 work with the TMO 1.7, maybe. I just don't guarantee everything will be the same as intended.

[Zardiz]

hey, new to here and have recently started playing SH4 after year since I stopped SH3. Been looking at diffrent mods and have found TMO the choice for me, along with RSRD and this SCAF, but as of TMO 1.7 (no longer beta, relased yesterday) any change on update for TMO 1.7 + RSRD? would perfect my sub experience :)

Zard :salute:

[CapnScurvy]

hey, new to here and have recently started playing SH4 after year since I stopped SH3. Been looking at diffrent mods and have found TMO the choice for me, along with RSRD and this SCAF, but as of TMO 1.7 (no longer beta, relased yesterday) any change on update for TMO 1.7 + RSRD? would perfect my sub experience :)

Zard :salute:

Hi Zardiz, Welcome to SubSim !!

Since SCAF is incorporated into the TMO 1.7, I will have to see what RSRDC has done with its files. On the Run Silent, Run Deep Campaign thread it states SCAF is incorporated with the latest patch "RSRDC_V410_Patch 2A". The activation order in JSGME is as follows:

TMO 17
RSRDC_TMOv163_v410
RSRDC_V410_Patch 2A

Lurker kindly asked for my files when Ducimus and I were trading files. So I would think SCAF is "how it should be" with RSRDC and TMO.

Good Luck!!

[Zardiz]

thanks for the info, much appreciated :)

Time to head sink some ships :arrgh!:

Zard

[CapnScurvy]

I have added a Binocular mod to the first post in this thread for TMO 1.7. It's possible the TMO 1.6.3_Bino mod is the same but without messing around with every little tid bit I took the "safe" approach and combined one with the other.

This mod adds to the incorporated MaxOptics magnification of TMO 1.7 an additional Binoculars zoom level. The first level is the same as stock (a 7x zoom), the second zooms out to 250% (a 24x zoom). It was found that the rocking of the sub prevented a steady view to either port or starboard at the highest zoom level. This stock view will help when looking at a perpendicular angle to the boat over long distances.

Just activate the "MaxOptics for TMO 1.7_Binocular" after the TMO 1.7 version.

[JGoldrick]

I know that your mod is included with both TMO 1.7 and RSRDC (latest).
My question is, how can I import you fantasic looking scopes,tbc, hud dials and binocs into the mods? Those two mods have your data but didn't include your updated graphics mods. Is there someway to incorporate them? I have found that my mods list that I include has all of your updated scopes, etc. Is there a "danger" in installing your mod on top of the others even though your mod is included with TMO and RSRDC?


TriggerMaru_Overhaul_17
RSRDC_TMOv163_V410
RSRDC_V410_Patch2A
SCAF1.5_RSRDCv410 *(this is what is in question)*
#1 Real Environment mod install
#1a Lite Fog
#2 ROW Sound Effect v_9
#4 Ships_Reflect and Caustic_Environment Mod 5.1
MaxOptics for TMO1.7_Binocular
black smoke2
TMO_Deckguns_M32_paint
Nisgeis' Range Ring and Bearing Line Mod
Small Radar Contacts Stage 1

[CapnScurvy]

I know that your mod is included with both TMO 1.7 and RSRDC (latest).
My question is, how can I import you fantasic looking scopes,tbc, hud dials and binocs into the mods? Those two mods have your data but didn't include your updated graphics mods. Is there someway to incorporate them? I have found that my mods list that I include has all of your updated scopes, etc. Is there a "danger" in installing your mod on top of the others even though your mod is included with TMO and RSRDC?


Haaa! I didn't think anyone noticed the scopes!!

Yes, there is a possible problem with using the "SCAF1.5 for RSRDCv410" since it was made specifically for TMO 1.6.3 (and of course the compatible RSRDC for TMO1.6.3). There could be some files that will be overwritten in the 1.7 version that will change whatever they intended to do. I've not fully checked to see what SCAF changes that could effect TMO 1.7.

You may notice the center bearing of the American compass dial in TMO. That's something I added to the Compass to give a little help in bringing the sub to a target "relative" bearing, when one is called by a crewman. I simply took it from the German side, colored it a bit, and stuck it on the American compass. What I'm getting at, is what would you like for scopes and the HUD, or Deck Gun etc? I could probably make a small mod that adds different views of these stations with what I've already made or change it to suit a need.

[JGoldrick]

Thanks for the reply. I really do like the scopes, in fact if you could make up a small "Scopes" mod, that would be really cool. I did some testing after I removed said file. The attack scope was the one you made and if you looked at it in the "Full Down" possition, you could see a black bar through the center, which is the Obs Perisope, and see the ocean out the sides of the scope. The other scopes, obs, tbt, and binocs went back to "normal" which are okay, but now with this situation with the new attack scope, I will keep my mods the way they are. I never have used or will I in the future use, "manual" targeting on ships. So, if something doesn't work right I know what the problem is.
Thanks again.

[CapnScurvy]

Thanks for the reply. I really do like the scopes, in fact if you could make up a small "Scopes" mod, that would be really cool. I did some testing after I removed said file. The attack scope was the one you made and if you looked at it in the "Full Down" possition, you could see a black bar through the center, which is the Obs Perisope, and see the ocean out the sides of the scope. The other scopes, obs, tbt, and binocs went back to "normal" which are okay, but now with this situation with the new attack scope, I will keep my mods the way they are. I never have used or will I in the future use, "manual" targeting on ships. So, if something doesn't work right I know what the problem is.
Thanks again.

Sounds like you're doing a bit of modding, good for you!

In the "SCAF for RSRDCv410" download you will find a "Change Log" word document. In it are the changes that I made to the Stock game. Under the heading of the file "menu_1024_768.ini" look for the [G26 I147] entry. This entry and the following [G26 I148] and [G26 I149] sections are the ones you will have to change to enlarge the "dark screen" effect when the larger periscope mask SCAF uses is in the down position. In the game files themselves, look for the Data/Menu/menu_1024_768.ini file and open it with "notepad". You should place a ; in front of the stock lines (this tells the game engine to ignore the following line), and copy and paste the change log line just above the stock line. Save the file. You should now find the periscope screen is dark when it's down.

What you'll actually do is "widen" the dark mask to cover the larger SCAF periscope view area when it's in the down position. I don't know how much you would like to learn, but a great tool to use to compare two files is a utility called WinMERG (http://winmerge.org/). It shows you what is different between the files, line by line and if you wish to merg one with another a quick key stroke is all it takes, save the file and your done.

[Zardiz]

I did a little modding myself aswell and got the attack periscope texture and bearing indicator ok, but don't know what I did wrong (or did not do) but the night periscope is still stock (TMO 1.7 + RSRD + SCAF for RSRDCv410), just remove the medal fix files, regonition manual, and other ship related files from RSRDCv410 and look what you got left, and ofc edit the menu_1024_768 file (thanks for CapnScurvy pointing out the WinMERG btw :up:). Never modded SH4 or 3 for that matter but most filenames gave good hint what they were, I brobably was too careful and missed file or two what were for the night periscope?

atleast so far I havent ran into any odd behaviour, other then that attack periscope is transperent, just barely able to see sea trough the textured area, got no idea where to fix this though :D

Zard

[Dr. Evil]

Perhaps I don't have a good enough understanding of what's going on, but it isn't clear to me if this is compatible with just plain RSRDC without TMO or RFB...

[Zardiz]

Stock (SH4 v15) RSRDC

Current Version

RSRDC_SH15_v400

Link:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/down...do=file&id=606 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=606)

RSRDC_V400_Patch 2A

Link

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/down...do=file&id=865 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=865)


Install via JSGME

RSRDC_SH15_v400
RSRDC_V400_Patch 2A

Edit: misunderstanding :oops:
It is not supported!


regarding the scopes I have now taken closer look for it and I don't see any problems using the scope files from SCAF1.5_RSRDCv410 for use in TMO 1.7. also found I had just forgot the Obscope.dds and transparency was most likely from poor (fast) combining of menu_1024_768.ini file, did not see that this time.

[CapnScurvy]

Perhaps I don't have a good enough understanding of what's going on, but it isn't clear to me if this is compatible with just plain RSRDC without TMO or RFB...

No Dr. Evil, I do not have an edition of SCAF for RSRDC v400 (which is the Stock only version of Run Silent, Run Deep). I've been busy with TMO stuff and just haven't looked at what needs to be done to make one.

[Magikhairbrush]

Hey, I was wondering what version of this I should be using with TMO 1.7 & the latest RSRD? I see a version for TMO 6.4 & RSRD so am I to understand one for 1.7+RSRD has not been done yet? Cheers
magik

[Webster]

i am guessing it will probably work fine as long as you understand you will be missing the accuracy fix for any new ships added since the last version of SCAF was made.

but i'm only guessing about that so only CapnScurvy can say for sure

[bybyx]

Something for TMO 1.9?

[Apos]

Something for TMO 1.9?

+1 So much missing it in TWO.

[CapnScurvy]

+1 So much missing it in TWO.


Hi men, it's been a long time since an update hasn't it?!

I've had an illness lately that has prevented me from spending much time with a computer. About a month ago I began to update SCAF, beginning with a request from WEBSTER to have it compatible with his GFO. My summer and fall has been quite busy with the usual home duties, plus both my kids had purchased new homes and 'ol dad helped both with electrical and renovation projects.

As you may know, modding takes a terrific amount of time. There are long hours just sitting at the computer. First, to figure what-the-heck does this file do? Then you make modifications to a file or image, and spend time checking its results.

On a day between Christmas and New Years, I was on my 5th hour straight sitting at the computer when my wife came in to tell me what's for dinner. I looked up but I could not respond. Nor could I move (if it wasn't for her I would have fallen out of the chair). I felt something come over me but I had no way of telling her to call for help. She figured it out when in a couple of minutes I was able to speak, but what came out of my mouth was not anything understandable. I was having a stroke and was helpless to do anything about it. Luckily my senses and function returned before I reached the hospital. After many tests it was concluded I had a TIA (mini stroke) with no lasting side effects at this time. I'm very fortunate!!!

It was found I had a hole between the upper chambers of the heart (we all have it, but the hole will usually close within the first months of life), mine had not sealed. The long periods of sitting at a computer was believed to have created a blood clot in my extremities and the hole allowed it to pass directly to the brain (usually small clots are taken to the lungs and dissipate before they do any harm). Through the grace of god the clot broke up without doing irreparable harm. I have just had a procedure (last Friday) to close the hole and I'm recovering at home. When I'm fit I'll be working on getting better blood flowing through the legs. Needless to say, I'm changing my outlook on spending as much time at the computer as I've done. A couple of hours at the most, then a walk around the block should help.

I have every intention to update SCAF, it's my goal to continue updating SCAF to the latest releases. Thanks for asking.

[vanjast]

WOW.. sorry to hear this...

Take your time, health is more important.. When you yearn for the smell-of-the-sea, we'll see you again.

Get well..
:up:

[Nisgeis]

Yeah, take it easy CapnScurvy and all the best.

[Wilcke]

Best wishes and good health! I think you are on the right path!

Take Care!