[WIP] SubRon 50

[Ducimus]

This is a back burner project, and is not a priority in my schedule right now, but its something that id like to do evenutally. With all this hoopla about "U-boots" and the "atlantik" (yes with a K), some folks strutin about speaking psuedo german, and the upcoming addon, i figure, heck, maybe we can have some fun with this. When i read that Fleet boats were indeed in the atlantic, it was just too much to resist. So i started reading up on it some more.

So for some research into the history behind it, heres a couple links:
This one the most informative:
http://www.subvetpaul.com/SAGA_6_98.htm

This one had a small burlb toward the bottom about the atlantic fleet boats:
http://www.navy.mil/navydata/cno/n87/usw/issue_6/silent_victory.html


That prompted some more research, and ive narrowed it down to the information in this post:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=690368&postcount=23


As one can see, they weren't all that spectacular in their results. From readings, im of the opinion that these boats were mismanaged by higher ups, and werent really allowed to operate in an unrestricted fashion. Should this mod come to light, i will be taking alot of artistic license with it, in order to make it fun. After all, nobody wants to go on 5 patrols and not sink anything!




Now having pointed out SubRon50, i first had to see if this project (bringing fleet boats into the atlantic) was feasible from a modding perspective. So i then went about creating the flotilla, and positioning it in the UK. This part is accomplished as illustrated by these screenshots:

http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/wip_atl_01.jpg
http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/wip_atl_02.jpg
http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/wip_atl_03.jpg
http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/wip_atl_04.jpg

i know the location isnt 100% correct. I used Firth of Clyde since it was the closest harbor to rosneath that currently exists in the game.


Now then, after that, i went and starting messing around with Uboats -again. TMaru already has a type 9 in its roster, but being in the atlantic proper, this mod would require more in the way of a type 7. Now, using player subs as AI units caused a lot of issues in SH3, so, erring on the side of caution, im assuming the same problem would exist for Sh4. Obviously, not any old type 7 from Sh3 will do, so to this end i set about trying to find a type 7 uboat that was modified to use by the AI, not the player. I may know a thing or two about modding, but i dont know everything, so i had to find something prefabricated. In the bowels of NYGM for SH3, i found what could be the perfect solution - moreover, after examining it more closely, it could be the perfect solution, not just for a SubRon50 mod, but quite possibly for Japanese Submarines as well!

Let me illustrate this:

http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/wip_atl_05.jpg
Hey, whats this now? Looks like a broomstick. Hey jim we got periscope off the port bow!


http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/wip_atl_06.jpg
Up closer, you can see the test bed ive layed up for this. The stationary ship is a liberty ship. One that i know from SH3, is armed to the teeth. (using its gunfire makes spotting where the AI sub is easier)


http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/wip_atl_07.jpg
Side view of this uboat. Now, what i immediatly found really slick about this mod from NYGM, is how they got it to run submerged. Its actually surfaced, but its surfaced draft is like 12 meters, and its submerged draft is around 13, hence making it act as a submerged object. They raised the periscope out of the conning tower, and well, its just pretty damn slick. Well, then i thought, thats nice and all, but i want this baby to have teeth. Only way i can do that, is to change the draft, put it back on the surface, and give it some AI gunmounts like i did on the type 9 right? So thats what i did next, this the result:


http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/wip_atl_08.jpg
At this point, ones kneejerk reaction is, "WTF?!" So, examining this for a few minutes, the lightbulb finally clicked on, and i found this little gem in the eqp file.


[Equipment 3]
NodeName=M01
LinkName=UboatVirtualTorpedo
StartDate=19380101
EndDate=19421231


I noticed it before when adding the deck gun, but i just didnt add 2 + 2 until i saw the raised gun.

So immediatly, i saw what they did. I just had to test it out to see if i was correct, so i put the subs draft back to where it was, reran my test mission and looked to see where this gun would be at:

http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/wip_atl_09.jpg
My thoughts, "HOT DAMN!", and yes, that is him firing right as the mission started.

http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/wip_atl_10.jpg
heres a nice little shellhole he left in the liberty cargo ship




So, i did a little searching around, and found that what this concept is, / was, is simply taking a 14" gun, making it do the same amount of damage as a torpedo, and then greatly increase its reload time, and greatly reduce the guns ability to rotate left or right. The gunmount on this uboat ive been experimenting with, it will only shoot forward, it cannot rotate at all. If its not infront of the uboat, it wont shoot. Im debating if i want to loosen that up a little.


Now, unfortunalty ive been unable to get this "invisible 14 inch gun" that was in NYGM to support this boat, to work correctly. At least, near as i can tell its not working, as ive never seen it shoot, nor any damage done to the liberty in testing.

This is where im stuck on this mod at the moment. Now, subron50 modification or not, this entire concept with this uboat, is nothing short of genius. This has to be one of the most innovate mods ive seen.


As an aside, when i still had the uboat with its normal draft, i couldnt resist watching the liberty ship pound it to smithereens,
http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/wip_atl_11.jpg

It sank to the bottom in 1300 feet of water shortly after this picture. Kinda gratifying :arrgh!:



Again, this mod is on a back burner.

Im waiting for patch 1.4, then the add-on, and then ill re examine this WIP then. Waiting for the add on is probably the best idea, as im sure the ubi devs will make facilitiating modding any action involving the germans infinatly easier. The type 7, if i can get the "invisible gun" mod to work, i may start putting that into the japanese roster, and use it in place of an I boat. Woudlnt that be something to get "torpedoed" by an enemy submarine!!!

[Hitman]

Adding SubRon 50 is great, but if you are going for the artistic license -which I find a very good idea, given the historical facts- the perfect scenary for employing the US submarines would be very much the one historically patrolled by british submarines, i.e. the North Sea and norweguean coast, where german convoys went from Fjord to fjord and then finally to Wilhelmshaven or Kiel with raw materials and back with ammunition, troops, etc. Those convoys comprised usually some torpedo boats or Subchasers, and one or two merchants or troop transports. Sometimes, large war units were escorted from the Kiel or Wilhemshaven dry docks after repairs to their Norweguean bases, or from Fjord to Fjord.

I think that a Gato is way too big for maneuvering inside a Fjord, but taking an S-class on a phto recon mission to locate the Tirpitz for a later aerial bombardment (Which is more or less historically correct, as the brits conducted lots of reconaissence to find those big german ships) would be too cool :|\\

Also, scouting before some convoys to the Soviet Union and helping protect them from surface raiders could be interesting (And something british subs actually did)

Then as secondary theaters you also can have the Bay of Biscay patrols and such, but that wouldn't be so interesting because of the limitations of AI subs in the game.

[Ducimus]

you are going for the artistic license -which I find a very good idea, given the historical facts- the perfect scenary for employing the US submarines would be very much the one historically patrolled by british submarines,

You know, your right. Throw some S classes into the flotilla, and our british cousins can have their fun too!

[sergbuto]

Not really sure why you did this investigation about the AI Type 7 U-boat because NYGM uses this sub from my wolfpack mod as it is pointed out in NYGM's readme. In turn, Readme of my mod describes the concept of (what I call) "virtual torpedoes" in detail. The damaging properties and impact effects of virtual torpedoes (invisible gun) are set the same as for real torpedoes.

[Ducimus]

>>Not really sure why you did this investigation about the AI Type 7 U-boat

I was just looking for a non player uboat to mount a deck gun on. Nothing fancy. I had no idea what the AI type 7 in NYGM did, until i started noticing some odd things about it when i imported it into SH4. So i looked at it more closely, and thought, "wow, this is cool".

>> because NYGM uses this sub from my wolfpack mod as it is pointed out in NYGM's readme.

I looked in the PDF file but apparently not in the right pages. I did search the Sh3 forum, and saw your name come up for this concept of torpedo boats. At that point, i figured you thought up the orginal concept, and NYGM took that concept and applied it to another object.


>>In turn, Readme of my mod describes the concept of (what I call) "virtual torpedoes" in detail.

Cool. The AI uboat was a stroke of genius, and very creative. What amazes me more, is i never noticed it before until now. I saw your wolfpack mod in the past in its earlier stages, but only in passing, and never really read into it.

>>The damaging properties and impact effects of virtual torpedoes (invisible gun) are set the same as for real torpedoes.

This much i gathered. If one is trying to simulate a torpedo, then its usually best to apply the same damage a torpedo would do.

[Peto]

Good stuff!!!

Speaking of S-Classes: We sent a couple of those over during the war (4?) not sure how many though. I think that at least 1 was manned by a Polish crew so it would be easy to add another nationality into the mix as well! Voices could be an issue though...