Manual Targeting Academy

[Contact]

I wonder how many of us are a True ship killers ? My confession I'm not. I'm still finding myslef weak in manual targeting and various calculations. Well as an excuse I often think that captains job is to give orders to others and WO does the hard work in calculations but... Still real captain should know how to blow a hole in a ship if WO suddenly catches a flu with fever in the patrol or smth else might go wrong :o

So is there any volunteer to be a teacher of marine mathematics to me and anybody else who decides to join the class ? :huh: Would be appreciated

[fair_weather]

I had one hit out of 5 shots using manual targetting...mind you the last 4 were really damn close...so...I'm getting there...

[Contact]

I had one hit out of 5 shots using manual targetting...mind you the last 4 were really damn close...so...I'm getting there...

Almost lucky u, u're close to the score of realizing how it works, as for me I'm totaly newbie in this... :nope:

[TheDarkWraith]

I'm a true ship killer. I do all of the charting and speed calculating, distance ranging, etc. Once you know how it's not so hard to do. This should get you started:

http://dodownload.filefront.com/8095330//0b5c7a1080f93c948ee53f8dc18aed873e83548cd5965af167 ee25eabe729d330b9bad71f9c07173

It was created by Wazoo. I'll look for more that I read to get me up to speed on this.

Racerboy :|\\

[Contact]

I'm a true ship killer. I do all of the charting and speed calculating, distance ranging, etc. Once you know how it's not so hard to do. This should get you started:

http://dodownload.filefront.com/8095330//0b5c7a1080f93c948ee53f8dc18aed873e83548cd5965af167 ee25eabe729d330b9bad71f9c07173

It was created by Wazoo. I'll look for more that I read to get me up to speed on this.

Racerboy :|\\

Thanks Racerboy, I own u a pint :up:

[Contact]

I've just started reading it. I wonder how fast I could make all those calculations in the middle of convoy :o I hope I will find answers about it later.

[fair_weather]

I'm a newb at targetting, so here's a newbs guide to targetting.

-Find the Target, identify it at the longest possible distance. Afterwards, go under and get to within 1,500 to 1,200 meters of it.

-For most targest I set the depth to 5 meters ahead of time and open the tubes.

-Raise Attack scope and get the speed, then get the range, speed again and finally the AoB. (30-45 seconds work if you're fast enough)

For angle on bow, make sure the target is going to broadside you. This way you'll have an easy time of it and probably get a good solid hit. and use the protractor! It's simple! And effective!

After you've got all that done. Fire.

And pray...It's better to test it on the sub school.

[Contact]

:doh: lots of things to remember... tough it is..

[Dimitrius07]

I `am playing at 100% realism (took me more that 2 month to learn the basics):oops: .
i`am using the Wazzo manual and the fast speed calculation, it depends on the situation, if i have time i using both in the same time.

The Wazoo way is more or less accurate, the fast speed calculation is accurate only when target between 80-90 degree (angel of bow)

[TheDarkWraith]

I've just started reading it. I wonder how fast I could make all those calculations in the middle of convoy :o I hope I will find answers about it later.

Here's how I do it and it's basically from Wazoo's write up:

After taking several range and bearing readings (convert bearing readings to target bearing true north - see below) and plotting them for 3 minutes 15 seconds you'll know the enemy's speed and course. Now there's really only a couple of calculations you need to know:

target bearing true north = bearing + current sub course course
scope bearing = perpendicular course to target - current courseThe perpendicular course to target is easy but let's explain:


X----x1----x2----x3----> enemy course

^
/
/ sub course

In this example the sub is heading 045
The initial X is the first sighting of the enemy. It was sighted at bearing 270 (through the attack scope or uzo). We use the rec manual to identify the ship as a small merchant. We use the stadimeter and find it's distance at 5,000 yards. We quickly go to the map view and plot a mark on our sub. First we convert this to target bearing true north. So it's 270+45 = 315. We click on the '?' icon on the map tools so that our ruler has a compass on it. We draw a line from the mark out to 5,000 yards crossing through the compass at 315. We repeat this whole procedure how many times you want (more is more accurate). At 3mins 15 seconds we plot our last position of the enemy and then we use the ruler and draw a line from the first plot to the last plot - the length of that line is the enemy's speed. In this example his speed is 6 knots. Now take the compass tool (located in the top right hand corner of screen) and drag it so the center point is somewhere on this 'speed line'. Where it intersects the compass is the enemy's heading. In this example the position fixes were moving left to right therefore we know he's moving in a generally easterly direction. Using the compass we find it to be 85 degrees.
Now we know two vital pieces of information: the enemy's speed and his course. We align our sub for best shot or continue on our current course. In this example I'm going to stay on my current course of 45 (and not change it or speed since I'm leading him). Now since I'm not perpendicular to the enemy I have to 'calibrate' my scope so that the AOB computer will calculate AOB correctly.
First we have to find the perpendicular course to the enemy. Since his heading is 85 and we are located south of him the perpendicular couse to target is 85-90 = -5 + 360 = 355 degrees. Now we calibrate our scope: 355-45 = 315. We turn our scope to 315 and then go to the F6 page. We enable manual targeting and move the AOB to 90 degrees starboard (the enemy is north of us and moving in an easterly direction therefore we'll see his starboard side). We also move the needle for the enemy's speed to 6 knots. Then we disable manual targeting so that the computer can continually update the AOB and all. Then we turn our scope back to the enamy and lock back onto him.
We now keep taking range readings and if we're satisfied with our 'solution' thus far just keep with the range readings (be sure to click the check mark in the notepad to send these range readings to the torpedo computer! The only thing you want to see in your notepad is the ship's name and it's distance - nothing else for what I'm saying to work). If we think our solution isn't that good we do the above all over again.
If you change course at any time after calibrating your scope you have to recalibrate your scope - very important!
We finally have a range reading @ 700 yards - ohhh time to fire. We set the torpedo parameters for the proper depth, speed, etc., open the torpedo door, and then take one final range reading. Now as long as the AOB (look at it on the F6 page or if you have the mod that allows them on the attack periscope you'll see it right there) is relatively small (I don't fire unless it's +-15) I fire the torpedo. Several seconds later.....direct hit!! Manual targeting isn't that hard...........

Racerboy :|\\

[Hitman]

I'm not bad at all with manual targeting, though I must confess that I improved noticeably to my current level when I started digging deep into historic systems of collecting data and building wiz-wheels. I can't explain it easily with words, but there comes a moment after studying this all in deep when suddenly everything seems to fall into place and it is pristine clear to you. Incredibly enough, once I learnt well how to do all the process, I suddenly improved a lot in those "intuitive" shots, when you must set up your firing solution quick and based in guesses of some values:) Then again I went into a more difficult level when I tried to replicate the historical procedures, as I like to be as historically accurate as possible, but also once I got the hang of it, it was much easier:yep:

My advice: Learn the maths behind the basics well, and then practice, practice, practice!!:know:

Anyway you have given me an interesting idea here: So is there any volunteer to be a teacher of marine mathematics to me and anybody else who decides to join the class ? :huh: Would be appreciated

I might look into this when I come back from holidays. I have been writing a long article about real life targeting methods in WW2 german U-Boots that I will finish and translate to english in my holidays, but come to think of it the materials could well be used to create some sort of "Naval Academy" here in a sticky thread :D with various lessons, and exercises:up: I will look into that:yep:

[Puster Bill]

Listen to Hitman, young jedi.

:yep:

[Puster Bill]

:doh: lots of things to remember... tough it is..

Do yourself a favor: Download Hitman's Kriegsmarine Whiz-wheel, build it, and learn how to use it. It makes targeting so much easier.

:yep:

[TheDarkWraith]

:doh: lots of things to remember... tough it is..

Do yourself a favor: Download Hitman's Kriegsmarine Whiz-wheel, build it, and learn how to use it. It makes targeting so much easier.

:yep:

do you have a link to this?

[Contact]

I will be getting back to my studies, after I get back home from work.. Thank u everyone for support, I already prepeared myself for long hours of theory learnings and practise failures.
Any video thread about manual targeting ? would make it a bit easier..:-?

[joegrundman]

Actually, I don't think there should be a thread for a naval academy. I think there should be a forum so that different aspects can have their own thread.

E.g. a whole thread on uses for the whiz wheel, a whole thread on approaches, a whole thread on use of radar and sonar and so on.. all kept in one forum

Come to think of it, a forum for modding guides would be useful too...:hmm:

[R1fl3M4n]

I dont do all the calculations required' i just point and aim and 90% change i get a hit :) even from 2000m

Manual Targeting for me.

[Maraz]

I am not bad at manual targeting, though I tend to use the Kriegsmarine method to avoid missing: shot from short distance (below 1000m).

When I have to shoot from longer distance, I use a large fan of 2-3 torpedoes, so that 1 or 2 of them can hit the ship.

Example: shooting at a large merchant from 2000-2500m I use three torps, one aimed slightly in front of the bow, one at the center, one slightly behind the stern. If my firing solution is good enough (which usually is), 2 hits are almost assured. If it's bad, I still have one hit.

Maraz

[Puster Bill]

:doh: lots of things to remember... tough it is..
Do yourself a favor: Download Hitman's Kriegsmarine Whiz-wheel, build it, and learn how to use it. It makes targeting so much easier.

:yep:
do you have a link to this?

The thread you seek is http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=114351, Grasshopper.

[Uber Gruber]

Actually, I don't think there should be a thread for a naval academy. I think there should be a forum so that different aspects can have their own thread.

What a great idea....a forum dedicated to how things were/should be done such as navigation, artillary, convoy hunting, evasive maneuveurs, air defence procedures.....the list is endless.

Take note moderators, take note.:yep:

[Puster Bill]

Actually, I don't think there should be a thread for a naval academy. I think there should be a forum so that different aspects can have their own thread.
What a great idea....a forum dedicated to how things were/should be done such as navigation, artillary, convoy hunting, evasive maneuveurs, air defence procedures.....the list is endless.

Take note moderators, take note.:yep:

Seconded.