I just saw "Das Boot" for the first time.

[highkoo]

It is hard to explain how empty a hole this movie left me with, its as though an excavation crew holowed out a deep core within me.

Now more then ever i see how strange and silly any war is, men fighting men is the most insane and criminally inhumane act ever to breech its ugly head on the face of this planet. It is so clear to me how the men fighting the wars and those orchestrating them are in such a complete way totally separate that one knows nothing of the other, if those that create these situations were to be in the thick of there creations i see for certain that they would most certainly avoid them.

Besides all of the above i do enjoy the hide and seek of such simulations, and yet must say the glorification of there actuallity is in the best sense of the word a totall act of mentall insanity.

H>K.

[Cakewalk]

"The Horror... the horror..."

- The final lines from Apocalypse Now, another great war movie that gives the same feeling.

Such destruction, and all for nothing... we see in the end despite all the accomplishments his crew made, his U-Boat sinks in port...

That's humanity, I guess.

[Beery]

I agree completely.

Another truly great anti-violence film is Gus van Sant's 'Elephant'. It is the only movie I know which shows violence without glorifying it in any way. A lot of people didn't get the film at all, mostly because of the fact that the vast majority of films with violent content tend to glorify the violence to some extent, so an audience is usually spoonfed a message that involves a stereotypical bad guy and some kind of violent catharsis (i.e. the 'bad guy' gets his violent comeuppance in the end). Gus van Sant's film presents violence that is truly realistic - utterly pointless, sordid and without catharsis, so many people felt it cheated them somehow. I didn't feel the same way at all, and Elephant is one of the most interesting and moving films I've ever seen.

[highkoo]

I agree completely.

Another truly great anti-violence film is Gus van Sant's 'Elephant'. It is the only movie I know which shows violence without glorifying it in any way. A lot of people didn't get the film at all, mostly because of the fact that the vast majority of films with violent content tend to glorify the violence to some extent, so an audience is usually spoonfed a message that involves a stereotypical bad guy and some kind of violent catharsis (i.e. the 'bad guy' gets his violent comeuppance in the end). Gus van Sant's film presents violence that is truly realistic - utterly pointless, sordid and without catharsis, so many people felt it cheated them somehow. I didn't feel the same way at all, and Elephant is one of the most interesting and moving films I've ever seen.
Thank you Beery, ill have to check that one out soon.....

glad im not the only one that see's things this way.

*EDIT* I also must say how much i admire all your hard work across the scope. ty beery

[WilhelmSchulz.]

umm wrong fourm. :roll:

[highkoo]

umm wrong fourm. :roll:

sorry didnt see the i saw "das boot" forum located anywhere, point me in the right direction then plz?

[Boris]

I just saw letters from Iwo Jima yesterday. An awesome, but utterly depressing anti-war film which shows the Japanese in a most realistic way, unlike which I have seen before. It does for Japanese servicemen what Das Boot did for the Germans.

[WilhelmSchulz.]

umm wrong fourm. :roll:

sorry didnt see the i saw "das boot" forum located anywhere, point me in the right direction then plz?

No das boot fourm but there is the SHIII fourm.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/forumdisplay.php?f=182

BTW: Yes it is a grate movie. :rock:

[P_Funk]

Gus van Sant's film presents violence that is truly realistic - utterly pointless, sordid and without catharsis, so many people felt it cheated them somehow.
Thats because most movie goers or people in general are shallow and don't want a shot of harsh reality which might supplant their pleasant delusions.

Thats the short answer. Forgive my generalization.

[TriskettheKid]

There are a lot of movies that are similar in message to Das Boot. Some are very old, some are very young, but they have a similar message.

-Band of Brothers (One you hit Episode 4, you really start seeing the overall feeling shift dramatically, most notably The Last Patrol (ep 8) and Why We Fight (ep 9))
-The Enemy Below
-All Quiet on the Western Front (1930 version)
-The Longest Day
-Black Hawk Dawn

The odd thing is that, in order to convey the message that we feel from these movies, the movies themselves have to almost glorify the very violence that many of them detest.

[StandingCow]

-All Quiet on the Western Front (1930 version)


You beat me to it. :p I read this book a long time ago and loved it, you really get a good perspective from the side of the German troops.

[JackChen]

Well, I played SH2 before I saw the movie. SH2 does pay attention to certain details and the movie gives you a good idea and understanding of how it was like to fight in a sub.

You know, I have asked myself, if I survived the whole trip like the German crew and I made it back to port (without that destruction at the end), would I step back into the sub for the next mission? It's only after watching the movie that you understood why the men are drinking themselves silly in the beginning.

[ccruner13]

i bought all quiet on the western front in 8th grade and i have read it several times. easily top 5 ive ever read.

the book chickenhawk also up there. vietnam helicopter pilot's story

[highkoo]

umm wrong fourm. :roll:
sorry didnt see the i saw "das boot" forum located anywhere, point me in the right direction then plz?
No das boot fourm but there is the SHIII fourm.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/forumdisplay.php?f=182

BTW: Yes it is a grate movie. :rock:

Good to know WilhelmSchulz, movie just hit me pretty hard and i couldnt think of any other place to share but here ;)

[Platapus]

If you have many hours to kill, I would recommend reading the book "Das Boot". The author was very skilled in his craft.

The vast majority of the cruise nothing but nothing was happening, but the author was able to express this killing boredom very well but still keeping the story moving.

While I love the movie, somehow the book conveyed the atmosphere a bit more emotionally to me.

[ryuzu]

If you have many hours to kill, I would recommend reading the book "Das Boot". The author was very skilled in his craft.

The vast majority of the cruise nothing but nothing was happening, but the author was able to express this killing boredom very well but still keeping the story moving.

While I love the movie, somehow the book conveyed the atmosphere a bit more emotionally to me.


True - the film had to fit a cinematic time frame and so the "non-action" parts were compressed just enough to convey the story line.

The original TV series was, if I remember correctly, 6 episdoes long - 6 hours - a bit over double the movie length. There was more time available to build the weight of boredom before releasing it with a brief attack and then once again letting the viewer see a depth charging for an extended period.

Worked rather well overall and probably more popular outside Germany than in...

r.

[Samu*]

Or if you arent a book type of person, try to find Das Boot - Director's Cut. Its more than 4 and ½ hour long version and its generally much better than original in my opinion. Comes much closer the general feeling of the book which I have read aswell

[ReM]

If you have many hours to kill, I would recommend reading the book "Das Boot". The author was very skilled in his craft.

The vast majority of the cruise nothing but nothing was happening, but the author was able to express this killing boredom very well but still keeping the story moving.

While I love the movie, somehow the book conveyed the atmosphere a bit more emotionally to me.


Amen

[Der Graf Von Rudkilde]

Das Boot is not fiction - Its based on the log book and the survivers storys from the boat -
What you c in the movie really happend during the war for that sub - Thus its compressed into one war patrol is it the most realistic submarine movie ever.

The directors cut wich last over 4 hours is the one to see :up:

Who will ever forget when Capitain Thomsen on his celebration of his iron cross after he pukes on the toilets in the bar, saying :

I am not in a conditon to *******, Sieg heil


.

[Beery]

i bought all quiet on the western front in 8th grade and i have read it several times. easily top 5 ive ever read.

the book chickenhawk also up there. vietnam helicopter pilot's story

Then you'll probably like The 13th Valley by John DelVecchio. One of the best war books ever written, and in my opinion the best Vietnam story ever written. Then there's The Middle Parts of Fortune, which takes place during the battles of the Somme and Ancre in 1916-17. Both of these are excellent 'anti-war' books, and in my opinion they deserve joint first place in any war fiction library.

[Platapus]

As described in another thread on this forum, the author of Das Boot recently died :(

[Sailor Steve]

BTW: Yes it is a grate movie.
It's "great".

The original TV series was, if I remember correctly, 6 episdoes long - 6 hours - a bit over double the movie length. There was more time available to build the weight of boredom before releasing it with a brief attack and then once again letting the viewer see a depth charging for an extended period.
It's available on DVD. It's called Das Boot: The Original, Uncut Version, and with the opening and closing episode credits removed it's just under 5 hours.

Das Boot is not fiction - Its based on the log book and the survivers storys from the boat. What you c in the movie really happend during the war for that sub - Thus its compressed into one war patrol is it the most realistic submarine movie ever.
Yes it is fiction. Lothar-Gunther Bucheim based the book on his own experience as a correspondent in a U-boat patrol, but he freely admitted that he changed names and fictionalized a lot of the story. Several real u-boatmen criticized him for this. If you want the reality, get his book U-Boat War.

He didn't even use a real boat in the book, he called it U-A. The real U-96 was indeed the boat he rode on, but it was sunk in an air-raid, but not until 1944. And the real "Old Man", Otto-Wilhelm Lehmanbock, didn't die, but served as a technical adviser on the movie.

The directors cut wich last over 4 hours is the one to see
No, the Director's Cut is only 3-/2 hours. As I said above, the Uncut version is the best, and it's just under 5 hours.

[Turm]

Recently watched the full uncut version for the first time, after owning it for almost a year. :oops: (Shame on me, but I can blame the computer for keeping me away from the TV).

Absolutely loved it. Not quite what I expected (a lot more of nothing happening than something happening), but it didn't disappoint me at all. I can't wait to watch it again, even though the end did leave me with a lasting impression about the pointlessness and tragedy of the people who fight in wars.

Even my wife thought it was fantastic. Despite having no plan to watch it she became drawn in as they headed out of port. Gave us something different to talk about for the rest of the evening after it finished. What's more, she wants to watch it again soon too! :smug:

[Sailor Steve]

It's odd, but I had the strangest reaction to the ending. I didn't take it as anti-war, and I saw no futility at all. It just seemed to me to be very German. After all, they did invent opera (even though the Italians took it to greater heights), and operas always have a bad ending.

[bigboywooly]

Recently watched the full uncut version for the first time, after owning it for almost a year. :oops: (Shame on me, but I can blame the computer for keeping me away from the TV).

Absolutely loved it. Not quite what I expected (a lot more of nothing happening than something happening), but it didn't disappoint me at all. I can't wait to watch it again, even though the end did leave me with a lasting impression about the pointlessness and tragedy of the people who fight in wars.

Even my wife thought it was fantastic. Despite having no plan to watch it she became drawn in as they headed out of port. Gave us something different to talk about for the rest of the evening after it finished. What's more, she wants to watch it again soon too! :smug:

WOW

Mine legs it as soon as it goes on
:rotfl:

[Jimbuna]

It taught me a moral: Always park your vehicle under cover :arrgh!:

[P_Funk]

Recently watched the full uncut version for the first time, after owning it for almost a year. :oops:
Don't feel bad. I've owned Apocalypse Now Redux since christmas and haven't watched it either. And its my favourite movie! I'm just biding my time for the right moment. Its really a once a year movie.

[Hitman]

A great discussion going on here, but the topic has clearly steered towards an area where placing it in the Films & Books forums will be more appropiate -and better seen by people who browse for those themes-. Moving it there :up: