an idea to drastically improve SH3 graphics (normal maps)

[kapitan_zur_see]

There sure are a lot of talented skinners here at subsim and it really shows off in GWX but one thing really struck me.
Indeed, I'm suprised nobody ever thought of that for any skins... If you already rummaged through SH3 textures, you might have see that crews models does use 2 sets of textures, one being the "diffuse" map (the regular one) and another one wich is a NORMAL map (i suggest you look on google if you don't know what it is). That mean SH3 engine is capable of handling normal maps wich are vastly used for high levels of details in nowaday nextgen games. In SH3, those maps are strangely used on crew only but i don't see why it couldn't be used on any other objects (although they are in a distinct shade of yellow instead of the usual blue color)... All we have to do is find (if it has to) what triggers the use of normal maps in SH3 and design some for every objects.
I do believe (wll i'm sure in fact ;)) it could greatly improve our u-boats details for example. I did made some early attempts, still without any success for the moment, but i think you guys here should consider the idea.
:know:
any idea how to do this? i mean, assign a normal map to any object?

[oRGy]

Bump.

This should be looked into.

[ref]

The problem with the bump map controller is that it disables dinamic lighting.


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[Madox58]

Even on the Helmets?

[ref]

Yes, have you noticed the bluish color of the watch crew at night, even on a dark one?, that's due to the bump map controller.

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[Hylander_1314]

How about non-mirrored skins for the ships?

[Dowly]

How about non-mirrored skins for the ships?

For that, all you need to do is make a new UV map for the ship´s model to cover the two sides as two different sides. The same goes for aircraft.

[ref]

How about non-mirrored skins for the ships?

The big problem is that to mantain the texture quality you'll need to make the tga texture files at least twice bigger.

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[HundertzehnGustav]

yea but there are people who would actually paint the ships that way... side by side.

time we have and photoshhop too:up:

[Woof1701]

The idea is great. Some of us with older systems, who already have problems with the frame rates in ports an near convoys will surely encounter difficulties, but if it's possible to switch between "normal" and "improved" graphics there shouldn't be a problem. :)

[ref]

yea but there are people who would actually paint the ships that way... side by side.

time we have and photoshhop too:up:

The drawback is not to paint the ships, but the FPS hit it would take using the double of memory for textures, not to mention re UV mapping all the ships...

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[HundertzehnGustav]

FPS

imagine in a Convoy...

but if i can switch back and forth between the old ship mapping and the new one, y not?
have 512 mem myself, but would love to see proper non repeptitive mapping for the ships and all its parts, hull superstructure and masts etc etc etc

[ref]

There are two parts with this problem:
a.- make the ships texture individual for each side of the ship
b.- eliminate the repetitions on the texturing.

a: Not practical, the fps hit will be huge, we can't double the size of the textures with the current sh3 engine.

b: Not practical for the existing ships, it's a big work to change the UV mapping for all the ships. It could be done optimizing the uv mapping of new ships, I'm working on a US Heavy Cruiser, and it doesn't repeat the hull texture, and has minimal repetition on the superstructure, because it has more than one deck, with simple deck ships it's easier to do, the problem is that it took me twice the time to UV map it than to build the 3d model.

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[kapitan_zur_see]

damn! i sure didn't knew nthe bump maps controller would kill dynamic lighting... such a strange behavior though :shifty: SH3 engine can be so unlogical some time lol

[Hylander_1314]

Thanks for the responses guys!

I can understand the "fps" hit, but I'm flying BoBII WOV and the .dds artfiles are 2048 x 2048 for the planes, and there can be up to 300 planes in the vacinity at one time during some of the big battles, and I don't get any real nasty results.

I just thought it would look good, especially with the camo patterns. Mainly the naval vessels, and u-boats. Not really necessary for ships that are one colour on the hull sides and upper decks. And since the lower hulls are pretty much so red or black, or one solid colour at any rate.

But these are two different game engines and what may be fine for one may not be for the other.

[kapitan_zur_see]

Thanks for the responses guys!

I can understand the "fps" hit, but I'm flying BoBII WOV and the .dds artfiles are 2048 x 2048 for the planes, and there can be up to 300 planes in the vacinity at one time during some of the big battles, and I don't get any real nasty results.

I just thought it would look good, especially with the camo patterns. Mainly the naval vessels, and u-boats. Not really necessary for ships that are one colour on the hull sides and upper decks. And since the lower hulls are pretty much so red or black, or one solid colour at any rate.

But these are two different game engines and what may be fine for one may not be for the other.

I second that, there shouldn't be a great impact on FPS in SH3. This is even more true given the fact SH3 engine is very well optimized and not GPU ungry.