Overview of Realism settings

[Incubus]

All these are based on stock SHIII:

Limited Batteries- Pretty pointless having this on. Also creates a stupid 'overlap' with 'limited fuel' (just travel around submerged 99% of the time) which artifically lets you get away with more 'realism' than you should. Limited batts is exciting; seeing if you can manage to sneak through the Strait of Gibraltar or other dangerous places. Another silly thing is even if the batteries are completely dead your sub still goes at 1kt. People say, 'just use X mod' but I'd actually rather see a patch for these kind of things.

Limited Fuel- Same issue as limited batteries. The point of the type IX series is range; using limited fuel really forces you to think about your patrols and be conservative. The thing I like about this game is that every decision has consequences, but the consequences are abstract and not scripted (running out of fuel because you cruise too fast, for example)

Historical Loading time- Makes convoy attacks stupidly easy. If you know what you are doing, you can pretty much flatten the whole convoy with the increased load time. Keeping them at historical levels also gives you a point to handing out Torpedoman designations, and making sure the torpedo sections are properly manned. It also makes loading external stores a harrowing experience (particularly for the type IX boats which have way, way too many externals!)

Limited Compressed air- I'm not sure why they even bothered to put this in. Does compressed air do anything beyond blowing ballast? Generally, if you have to blow more than once/twice, you're probably hosed anyway. So even if you can mash the 'e' key to your heart's content this isn't gonna help much. Even for newbie/young players I'd say keep it realistic.

No map contact updates- This one is debatable. BdU did gives subs contact reports (it was even in Das Boot, damn it!:stare: ) and since stock doesn't allow you to form wolfpacks and the radio function is extremely limited as it is, I don't mind this. Disabling it definitely does put your sensors (both the subs and your own eyes and ears) to the test. Ironically enough, I blunder into more convoys than BdU points out for me. Go figure :rock:

Weapon officer assistance/Manual aiming- Funny thing about these two is you can have one on and one off and get virtually the same benefit while having a slightly higher realism %. Not very practical, but there are a few benefits- by having manual off but weapon officer on, you can 'train' yourself to fire manual solutions; if the firing solution is iffy you can have the weapon officer plot the solution, otherwise, go it manually. Another thing novice players should know is that while 'auto' mode is theoretically easier to set a firing solution, it is by no means a guaranteed hit. Often times setting up a auto shot that has a good chance of hitting isn't much harder to do manually, also.

Noise Meter- Maybe useful for someone who hasn't had any idea what sub warfare is like. Personally its pretty easy to do without. Actual crews had enough common sense to know how noisy their subs were- if the screws are chugging away, stuff is banging and clattering around in compartments, you are probably making a big noise signature. Silent Running mode means you don't really need the noise meter. If you are worried about noise, rig for silent running and creep very slowly. There is very, very little gray area between 'quiet' and 'too noisy' when it comes to nearby DDs.

Event Camera- Fun, but makes things too easy. It is neat having a chance to watch a ship crack in two while you are hiding several kms away, but the fact that it activates when planes are making attack runs makes it too easy to escape danger. Part of the fun of the game is you have to be on guard during the WHOLE patrol, because there are so many ways to get caught with your pants down. The event camera can kind of take the suspense out of it.

Free View- More flexible than the Event Camera. At the worst, Free View lets you blatantly cheat; you can see depth without pinging, or spot ships in bad weather. However, it is nice in other situations, like setting up screenshots, or just admiring your boat gliding through calm water during sunrise. Since you can control it, it is a 'for fun' toggle in my opinion.

[Incubus]

oops, forgot two:

Realistic Sensors- Takes the fun out of the hydrophone/radar upgrades. Just because you have detection capabilities, doesn't mean they are foolproof. I like working with the limitations of the technology of the time, it makes it feel nicer when you get a better radar set/detector/widget/etc.

Realistic damage- A lot of players have mentioned that even with it set to 'realistic' its too unrealistic. I think for very novice players, having this be more forgiving gives them a chance to practice evasion and stealth techniques without having to repeatedly die and try again. However, once you know how to stay unseen/unheard, no reason to not have realistic damage. As a submarine, YOU have the iniative, and can pick your fights. If you sink, often it is because of a chain of decisions you made. Because of this, it doesn't benefit in the long run to have this 'off' (well, maybe for little kids and stuff)

[Incubus]

Finally, I had some ideas that would have been cool to see. The main point of these isn't to eliminate the 'sim' aspect of the game, but to give the player a better sense of enemy detection.

Asdic Signature Meter- Would be represented by a horizontal bar. The wider the bar, the bigger your signature to Asidc. if you deployed decoys, they would have their own bar. This would mainly be for 'training' purposes so when you play the game for real, you know when to use decoys, which direction to best turn, etc. Right now I'm not really sure how the game models your sonar signature- the manual hints that it does, but nobody has given me a straight answer or pointed to a .cfg file that breaks it down. As such, it would be nice to have something like this just to know if it is even a factor in the game.

Radar Signature Meter- Same deal, only against radar while you are surfaced. The width of the bar would be based on 1.) Model of your radar (if its on) 2.)Distance to an enemy radar source and 3.) Profile of your ship against enemy radar. Weather would also be a factor.

another reason I'd want these is because right now there are 2 anti sonar coating upgrades and 1 anti radar upgrade. Nobody has given me a straight answer on their effectiveness, or any hard numbers on how they benefit you. It bothers me that I could be paying 1000/1500/2000 renown on something that may just be a placebo.

[WhiteW0lf]

How old are you? You seem to not understand these settings much at all but to complain about each of them, I am not even going to go into fixing each of your points in every setting that was grossly incorrect.

[Incubus]

I understand the settings perfectly fine. What is your problem? I was just talking about the pros/cons of them. This is a game first and foremost. The realism settings allow you to play the game in a way you enjoy the most.

I am not so much complaining about each setting, but rather talking about their purpose (like if having a setting be unrealistic actually makes the game easier, or a setting that makes the realism % artificially high)

[_Seth_]

Hey guys, ease up a little. Dont be bad at each other..:yep: The enemy is in Scapa Flow, not here.....
I like having the opportunity to set it all to "easy"... If im p**sed off after a bad patrol, i can go back and get my revenge!!! (Well, kinda cheating, but....Its a game!! :D) The only thing that sometimes bother me, is the possibility to press "esc", and "return to base". I have done this alot, but i would like it if i didnt had that opportunity, and was forced to go "manually" back to base. I know this isnt a big deal, but.....

[Tachyon]

How old are you? You seem to not understand these settings much at all but to complain about each of them, I am not even going to go into fixing each of your points in every setting that was grossly incorrect.

"How old are you?" was an unnecessary statement. Please choose your words carefully. That statement indirectly refers to a person being immature. If you'd like to contradict him, pls get to the point, and not via silly comments. We'd like to keep this board community friendly. And in case i sound like ur parents, ignore me.

Its just that I'd prefer ppl to get along well.

[Corsair]

The only thing that sometimes bother me, is the possibility to press "esc", and "return to base". I have done this alot, but i would like it if i didnt had that opportunity, and was forced to go "manually" back to base. I know this isnt a big deal, but.....

Solution is rather simple : just don't do it !!!:D

[HunterICX]

Fact: Ubi brought the game out uncompleted.

Fact2: Ubi isnt going to patch it anymore because they are too busy with SH4

Fact3: because UBI isnt going to patch or change anything on SH3 thats why the community gives you the option to download Mods that you can see as a Patch

because they fix what Ubi didnt
because they add more realism
they Add more Uboat warfare athmosphere.

still it stays a game with his limitations. you cant completly get the game 100% historical correct. but the supermods got as close as they can get.

thats the reason why most people mod their games to get rid of the dull stock SH3.

HunterICX

[melnibonian]

Realistic Sensors- Takes the fun out of the hydrophone/radar upgrades. Just because you have detection capabilities, doesn't mean they are foolproof. I like working with the limitations of the technology of the time, it makes it feel nicer when you get a better radar set/detector/widget/etc.

Realistic damage- A lot of players have mentioned that even with it set to 'realistic' its too unrealistic. I think for very novice players, having this be more forgiving gives them a chance to practice evasion and stealth techniques without having to repeatedly die and try again. However, once you know how to stay unseen/unheard, no reason to not have realistic damage. As a submarine, YOU have the iniative, and can pick your fights. If you sink, often it is because of a chain of decisions you made. Because of this, it doesn't benefit in the long run to have this 'off' (well, maybe for little kids and stuff)

Whait until GWX is released and you will change your mind. DDs are deadly and your hydrophones cannot ditect a convoy 1000 miles away as in the stock game. Once the Destroyers have you in their sonars it's mighty difficult to get rid of them (I said difficult not impossible). As for the damage from the depth charges??? I was attacked once and was blown to the surface from the depth charges, where the Royal Navy ships gave me the full gun salute :yep: :yep: :yep: :yep:

[_Seth_]

The only thing that sometimes bother me, is the possibility to press "esc", and "return to base". I have done this alot, but i would like it if i didnt had that opportunity, and was forced to go "manually" back to base. I know this isnt a big deal, but.....
Solution is rather simple : just don't do it !!!:D
:rotfl: I know, but sometimes i cant help myself.... I'll guess: if the reward for not pressing escape was something excellent, like 2000 renown, i could easily return manually to the port....but it is sooooo tempting...........:yep::nope:

[danlisa]

@ Seth

Then make it 2000 renown.:D I always edit my renown figures for Reaching patrol grid, Completing 24hrs & Returning to port. It makes it worthwhile to follow BDU's orders.

[_Seth_]

@ Seth

Then make it 2000 renown.:D I always edit my renown figures for Reaching patrol grid, Completing 24hrs & Returning to port. It makes it worthwhile to follow BDU's orders.

Yeah Dan, i could do that... But that could be cheating......Ohhhhh, its a hard dilemma....:cry::cry: What the h*ck, i'll do it! :D

btw: Dan, any repaints on the horizon?

[IceGrog]

I think this post was about the realistic part of the game, well as for myself I want it as realistic as I can get it but having said that I can’t get rid of my external camera, I’m addicted to it. I love watching all the screens of battle that goes on that in real life I wouldn’t be able to see. I feel so cheap………………but I get over it.

[danlisa]

A few, but not until GWX is released. New files and all that, as it is I will have to re-pack the ones I've released already.

[_Seth_]

Sounds good, mate! Lookin' forward to see those new ones! ...:D

[raduz]

your hydrophones cannot ditect a convoy 1000 miles away as in the stock game.

what exactly do you mean by this? AFAIK, if you (not your SO) man the hydrophone in the game, you can detect a ship or a convoy at 34km. on the contrary, i think that the game underestimate the capacity of the hydrophone, because in reality, the sonarmen were capable to detect a convoy even at 50-100 km. why do you think the game hydrophone range is unreal and too large?

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

How old are you? You seem to not understand these settings much at all but to complain about each of them, I am not even going to go into fixing each of your points in every setting that was grossly incorrect.

#1) "How old are you?" was not only rude, but unecessary.

#2) IMO sounds like he understands the realism settings just fine.

#3) Again, IMO, I'd think you'd spend a grand total of, oh, zero seconds 'fixing' things, as I don't see anything incorrect, let alone grossly incorrect, in his explanations.

[melnibonian]

your hydrophones cannot ditect a convoy 1000 miles away as in the stock game.

what exactly do you mean by this? AFAIK, if you (not your SO) man the hydrophone in the game, you can detect a ship or a convoy at 34km. on the contrary, i think that the game underestimate the capacity of the hydrophone, because in reality, the sonarmen were capable to detect a convoy even at 50-100 km. why do you think the game hydrophone range is unreal and too large?

The 1000 miles away was ment to indicate that in GWX the U-Boat sencors are a bit more realistic and pick up signals in normal distances (up to 50km in favourable conditions I think). In the stock game the hydrophones were always 'perfect' in their detection, something which is unrealistic, as in reality they were missing their targets quite a few times.

[raduz]

oh i see, the precision will be reduced, not the detection range... you should write it like that at the beginning:)

[Melonfish]

Weapon officer assistance/Manual aiming- Funny thing about these two is you can have one on and one off and get virtually the same benefit while having a slightly higher realism %. Not very practical, but there are a few benefits- by having manual off but weapon officer on, you can 'train' yourself to fire manual solutions; if the firing solution is iffy you can have the weapon officer plot the solution, otherwise, go it manually. Another thing novice players should know is that while 'auto' mode is theoretically easier to set a firing solution, it is by no means a guaranteed hit. Often times setting up a auto shot that has a good chance of hitting isn't much harder to do manually, also.

Right, so if i turn auto aiming off and weapon officer assist on i can learn how to launch my own torps right? yet if i'm really stuck i just bug the officer for a solution.

my realism settings have been creeping skyward as i've played this game and i think this may help the final transition to almost 100%!! (though i'll be keeping the external view cause thats kewl)
pete

[Corsair]

This is how I did it to go to 100% manual operations. I had the WO just in case things went wrong somewhere, then I used it less then I don't use it at all anymore. It was just moral comfort I guess...

[melnibonian]

oh i see, the precision will be reduced, not the detection range... you should write it like that at the beginning:)

Point taken :oops: :oops:

[dcb]

There is another realism option I didn't see debated here and which is bugging me for a long time: the stabilized periscope view. I was unable to find info about how affected by waves is a sub at P-depth. Do you think the heavy vertical rocking in SH3 is realistic?

[irish1958]

dcb,
You bring up a good point. In heavy seas, with the boat broaching the surface and sinking to 15 meters, and this option on, the periscope is useless. I suspect this is how it was.
Could submarines launch torpedos in heavy seas with 5 meter waves and 15ms winds??

[Sailor Steve]

"We rode some pretty massive North Atlantic storms which were really impressive.Nobody could see, move, aim or do anything. And then there were those occasions when you suddenly saw a single ship which would just steer a parallel course. You couldn't harm each other. Everybody thought of their own survival during those heavy seas. Nothing else mattered."
-Horst Elfe, officer on U-99 before commanding U-139 and U-93

When I'm in a heavy storm I write in my log that it's too rough to shoot torpedoes.

[AVGWarhawk]

There is another realism option I didn't see debated here and which is bugging me for a long time: the stabilized periscope view. I was unable to find info about how affected by waves is a sub at P-depth. Do you think the heavy vertical rocking in SH3 is realistic?
I think GWX addresses this issue with the u-boat reacting as closely as the real thing in heavy seas. We will have to wait and see.

I have stated many times before, this game requires a lot of imagination. I believe the realism settings are pretty good as they are. I do not understand why you would want to turn off the weapons officer. I use weapons officer assist. After all, that is what he is there for. Other than that, the GW mod has made the game all that much better irregardless of the settings options for realism. I believe GWX will only take it that much further.:rock:

[danlisa]

I believe GWX will only take it that much further.:rock:

Further & Beyond;)

[AVGWarhawk]

I believe GWX will only take it that much further.:rock:
Further & Beyond;)

I rest my case fellas!!!!!:up: