View Full Version : The Ashes
Congratulations to Australia for wining back the ashes.
May as well get it over with, England players don't look like they are up to it and there performance has been like a wet weekend in Manchester.
bookworm_020
11-21-06, 07:54 PM
I won't celebrate untill Australia lifts the urn in triumph at the end of the final test match.:-j
My Brother in law would want to shoot you on the spot as he has ahd great fun in reminding us who won the ashes last time, and I don't think he wants to give it up! (he's English, but I forgive him for it!;))
You never know, we thought we would wipe the floor with the English, but got thumpted well and truly!:oops: (They played better by a clear margin)
Time to go get plasted:()1:
This has to be the most anticipated Test series of all time (well at least since the very first Ashes after the death of English cricket).
Boxing Day test at the MCG will be HUGE!!!
C'mon Aussie C'mon (C'mon)
bookworm_020
11-21-06, 09:44 PM
Did you get tickets????:o
If you did, your a lucky B!@%$&#!:x
Tried for some here in Sydney, but no joy. I've never seen so much intrest in an Ashes series in Australia.
Can't wait for it to start, the Barmy army needs taking down a peg or two!
Steed, I wouldn't chuck the towel in too fast. While' I'm hoping for a return of the copy of the ashes to its tradtional home (the real ones stay in England except for the occasional promitional tour), I think it will be a lot closer than some might think.
I also had a hard time from my brother-in-law and father-in-law last year. Being married to a pom can be hard at times.
SteveW1
11-22-06, 05:16 AM
Hopefully the aussies will put up a better fight this time round,
If they dont win the first test maybe we should send in the PM IX to beat the english again.:lol:
cmon aussies
I just can not see England doing it, after winning the ashes are performance has been lacking the biting edge. Well we shall see very soon.
Konovalov
11-22-06, 04:51 PM
Come on Aussie come on, come on. Come on Aussie, come on. I have my food and the kettle is on perma-boild for the long nights ahead. 2 hours and 8 minutes till the first ball is bowled. :up: May Australia regain the Ashes. :yep:
Congratulations to Australia for wining back the ashes.
May as well get it over with, England players don't look like they are up to it and there performance has been like a wet weekend in Manchester.
For Christ's sake cheer up man :D
http://www.bbc.co.uk/bradford/big_questions/images/marvin_150.jpg
cheer up man :D
http://www.bbc.co.uk/bradford/big_questions/images/marvin_150.jpg
Bloody cheek :D
Hey Marvin kid how you been, parking cars. :hmm:
bookworm_020
11-22-06, 06:42 PM
Here we go, here we go, here we go! Can't wait to see how the first test goes. Lets hope for a good fight from both sides (with the Aussies winning!)
Did you get tickets????:o
If you did, your a lucky B!@%$&#!:x
Tried for some here in Sydney, but no joy. I've never seen so much intrest in an Ashes series in Australia.
Can't wait for it to start, the Barmy army needs taking down a peg or two!
Nah but I think theres still a few left for the later days of the Melbourne test, the benefit of having a ground that could potentially get a crowd of half a million for a test match.
Watch out for that Barny army they eat raw meat. :roll:
bookworm_020
11-22-06, 09:16 PM
They may eat raw meat, but they wilt in the Australian Sun!:sunny:
SteveW1
11-22-06, 11:59 PM
Damn 3 for 217 after 52 overs, looks like there might be a bit of fight in them english after all.
@Bookworm
Have you seen the adverts on TV for the Aussie invading the Barmy Army for the ashes series, what a laugh hugh jackman put him up to it.:rotfl:
THE_MASK
11-23-06, 12:18 AM
And you can send us over the real ashes when we win .
bookworm_020
11-23-06, 12:32 AM
The ashes are already here, there on a promotional tour of Australia.
Reminds me of a joke,
What do pixie Skase and the Lord's cricket club have in common??
Neither will give Australia the ashes!!
@SteveW1, haven't seen the ad, but I'm sure I will by the time the series id over.
THE_MASK
11-23-06, 01:02 AM
OH , so you think there the real ashes:rotfl:
SteveW1
11-23-06, 03:31 AM
ah Ricky Ponting is a legend :rock: , another century to his tally.
@Bookworm The show is being presented on Fox8 on Foxtel i found out just before i dont think it will be on free to air tv
Aussie Aussie Aussie
Oi Oi Oi
I hear you guys are in control, so what's new? :yep:
After last our Ashes effort you've got to let us crow a bit. Honestly I hope it is as exciting a series as the last one. I don't think I've been as rivetted by a game of cricket as much as the last 3 tests last series.
mr chris
11-23-06, 04:11 PM
Im sure if Freddy and the boys up there game we can give the Aussies a good run for there money in there back yard but it is not going to be easy. Take the venue for the First test for starters, i cant remember the last time the aussies lost a test at the Gabba.
bookworm_020
11-23-06, 08:43 PM
Ponting is geting into the rythem, this could cause some big problems for England if he keeps this up.
If it wasn't for Flintoff, England would be dead on there feet! All they can hope for with this match is for a draw.:yep:
mr chris
11-24-06, 04:06 AM
Gotta agree with you there bookworm:yep: To let you guys get to 602-3dec is just not good enough. I just hope that bell and peterisen can steady the ship and get some runs on the board. We now need massive porformances from Bell, peterisen, Flintoff and jones just to get a draw in this match. Have been very impressed with the bowling of clark though he seems like McGrath heir waiting in the wings. Looks like it going to be another good series.
Some time during the series England will do the batting collapse routine. England stop doing it, every test series this happens who ever they are playing. Right back to the present, well done Australia for a great 1st innings England will never beat it.
PS: Not the way they are batting at the moment. :down:
mr chris
11-24-06, 07:42 AM
Aye steed we need to see a major improvment in the batting side of are game. I really dont want to see too many more famous England batting collapses.:doh: Also the other blowers need to step up and be counted Freddy cant do it all on his own. It is a big loss not have simon jones on the team.
England's biggest weakness is the tail enders and always has been so why has there nothing been done about it? mr chris, your right we have also this problem when we get one good all rounder like freddy far to much pressure is put on him to pull the team though, come on it's a team of eleven men not freddy and co.
mr chris
11-24-06, 08:23 PM
What the hell is happening it is the dredded Batting collapse routine. As perdicted by Steed. 91-5:damn: :damn: :damn: :nope: :nope: To lose petiersen and Flintoff in the space of 2 overs is..... well words cant describe it:doh: :doh: Now the first innings rests on the shoulders of a guy who was not even in the team during the summer as he was not even deemed good enough. Step forward MR G Jones.:oops: :oops: I think as far as the first test goes we have been well and truely whipped.:yep:
EDIT:- The score is now 102-5 only 301 more runs needed to avoid the follow on. Not a problem:rotfl: :rotfl:
THE_MASK
11-25-06, 04:58 AM
Aussies are the best , forget the rest .
So the first Batting collapse has happen and it will not be the last. :nope:
Well done Australia for some great cricket as for England you are scum.
bookworm_020
11-26-06, 05:31 PM
They showed a little more fight toward the end of play, so, even if they loose here, they are showing some improvement.
Pietersen is showing some fight, so at leat it isn't all one sided. Just as long as the Barmy army relize that there going home without the ashes, then it's all good.:up:
Aussies one nil up in the series. Woohoo!:rock:
Our rotten team should be put in stocks and have rotten fruit and veg thrown at them for a dreadful first game. And in the second they should be made to play in drag. :x
Konovalov
11-27-06, 10:52 AM
Better start than the last Ashes series for us even though we had a win last time also. Happy days and I hope that there are many more over the next month. :yep:
This time the England bowlers, in particular Harmison, are demoralised whilst some of Englands key batters have had double failures in Strauss and Flintoff. But for England the biggest problem and the most important factor in deciding the outcome of this series are the bowlers. Englands bowling effort with the exception of Freddie Flintoff was appalling. I have seen better bowling in Sydney grade level club cricket over the years. Check out the stats for the England bowlers from the first Test:
The best and only bowler for England -
Andrew Flintoff Wickets 4, Average 27.50, Strike Rate 52.5, Economy 3.14
The rest and rubbish for England -
Mathew Hoggard Wickets 2, Average 70.50, Strike Rate 126.0, Economy 3.35
Ashley Giles Wickets 1, Average 113.00, Strike Rate 180.0, Economy 3.76
Steve Harmison Wickets 1, Average 177.00, Strike Rate 253.0, Economy 4.19
James Anderson Wickets 1, Average 195.00, Strike Rate 228.0, Economy 5.13
Bottom line is that if the England bowlers don't start doing what they are employed to do, in other words take 20 wickets in a match, then England can fly home now and not bother. For my mind Monty Panesar must come into the side either at the expense of Giles or more liklely Anderson for the Adelaide test. My two cents worth. :up:
bookworm_020
11-27-06, 06:38 PM
You better hope that Flintoff doesn't injur himself, or England will be slaughtered on the cricket pitich.
I think England better be prepared to win the Ashes in 2020, that's if they get lucky!:yep:
Honestly their batting wasn't up to much either. It was a batting pitch for the first 4 days and even the 5th didn't do a great deal. Great bowling by the Aussies though and I think they played a much better psychologial game also.
I know it's a moot point now but did anyone else wonder why Punter didn;t force the follow on? I know he's only ever done it once before, but if it were me I probably would have gone for in the kill on the 3rd day instead of batting again.
The only explanation I can come up with is that he wanted to rest the bowlers, but to be honest they hadn't been out in the field for that long and I think they could have knocked them over by lunch on the 4th day, give the mood they were in.
But then again I'm not the captain of the Australian Cricket team.
The next Test in Adelaide will really show whether England are capable of retaining the Ashes or not.
If the pale folk from the british isles cannot win in Adelaide then it is all but over IMHO.
The Adelaide Oval's pitch is the opposite to Brisbane's Gabba. The Gabba was totally suited to the Aussies, wheras AO should favour the poms.
I think the battle truly starts with the 3rd test in Perth.
I think England better be prepared to win the Ashes in 2020, that's if they get lucky!:yep:
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
Round two this weekend. England better put up a better fight this time.
PS: If they can. :shifty:
PPS: If they loose the coach should give there backsides a good paddling with the bat, six of the best. :p
badhat17
11-29-06, 03:44 PM
I know it's a moot point now but did anyone else wonder why Punter didn;t force the follow on? I know he's only ever done it once before, but if it were me I probably would have gone for in the kill on the 3rd day instead of batting again.
The only explanation I can come up with is that he wanted to rest the bowlers, but to be honest they hadn't been out in the field for that long and I think they could have knocked them over by lunch on the 4th day, give the mood they were in.
But then again I'm not the captain of the Australian Cricket team.
I feel Ponting wanted to show how easy it was to score on the pitch after England had struggled so badly on it. That meant England had no excuse.
No doubt Cricket Australia were delighted to sell tickets for the fifth day.
bookworm_020
11-29-06, 05:21 PM
It was a ground record attanedance for the GABBA, so they would be happy! I wonder if Cricket Australia had a word to Ponting to try and make the match strech so they could get the fans in.
Roll in the Second Test!:rock:
Konovalov
11-30-06, 04:56 AM
I feel Ponting wanted to show how easy it was to score on the pitch after England had struggled so badly on it. That meant England had no excuse.
Yep, no doubt. I also think that Punter wanted to hammer the English bowlers and in particular further damage their confidence. The tactic had it's risks. For example the England bowlers could have picked up some Australian top order wickets to boost their confidence and get one back on the Aussie batsmen. As it tirned out that didn't happen and Langer and Ponting heaped on the misery upon the bowlers which is what I like to see. :up:
mr chris
11-30-06, 08:15 AM
Team England have let loose Big Monty for the second test. Now your in trouble you gloating banana benders:rotfl:
Have lost count of the times things go wrong in the first test of a series over the years and everyone thinks "Well just play this guy and all are problems will go away" fat chance.
The problem is we are a team of a few good players and at most 2 world class players. (Flintoff and Peterisen) and that is it when they are on form we can give anyone a game. But if just one of them is off the boil we get smashed. We just had a lucky summer last time round lets be honest with our selfs did anyone really belive we would beat the world champs in there own back yard. We have not won a series down there since the 80's.
NOW COME ON ENGLAND PROVE ME WRONG.
England has just been spotted making there way to the Adelaide Oval for the start of play........
http://img117.imageshack.us/img117/4390/englishcricketteamss9.jpg
bookworm_020
11-30-06, 05:14 PM
:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
Love it!!! You just need a picture of the Barmy Army to go with it and then it would be complete!!:up:
That's looks about right. :rotfl: :rotfl:
bookworm_020
11-30-06, 08:43 PM
First wicket gone!! Starting to sound like the same old tune!!!:up: I love beating the poms at cricket!!!
2-58 at lunch. Even on the first day England is looking gun shy.:dead:
badhat17
12-01-06, 05:20 AM
I reckon England just about shaded the first day. Looking forward to more of the Warne and Pietersen show tomorrow, hope we have a contest this time.
Pitch did not offer much assistance for the bowlers this time but of course that may change. England must make the most of batting first. Amazed they have left Monty out again, not looking forward to watching wheelie bin fail to turn it more than an inch when we have a guy sat watching who can make it rip.
Close of day 1 England 266-3
Not bad but England must remember they are playing the world's best team and not throw it all away.
Konovalov
12-01-06, 06:34 AM
I reckon England just about shaded the first day. Looking forward to more of the Warne and Pietersen show tomorrow, hope we have a contest this time.
Pitch did not offer much assistance for the bowlers this time but of course that may change. England must make the most of batting first. Amazed they have left Monty out again, not looking forward to watching wheelie bin fail to turn it more than an inch when we have a guy sat watching who can make it rip.
You pretty well sum up exactly what I was thinking. Australia won the first session but after that it was all England though Kevin Pieterson almost threw his wicket away at the end of the day with that pull shot that just lobbed over a back peddling mid-on by only a few feet. I'm just glad that there is a real dogfight now. If Australia get early wickets tomorrow and end up keeping England under or around 400 then Australia can still win this Test match.
badhat17
12-01-06, 09:53 PM
http://www.waldorfenstatler.nl/images/statler-waldorf-tomatoes1.jpg
Shane Warne leads out Glenn McGrath after lunch on day two at Adelaide.
:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
I gotta agree. I think my earlier shot was of the Aussies. They are looking very pedestrian at the moment and I think the Poms might just scrape a win here. If nothing else its brought back some interest for the series.
badhat17
12-02-06, 12:30 AM
The pitch seems completely lifeless, if England can make it look easy then heaven knows what Australia will do here. That said a draw is looking the likely result. Maybe five bowlers will give England an edge but I am not going to hold my breath. I feel that Ponting has gone on the defensive early which has led to the current state of play. Lee bowling without a slip in place ? I hope that Flintoff keeps England batting for a while yet and he will be in straight after tea so maybe we shall see some fireworks, or an England collapse.:cool:
Make hay when the sun is shining if the conditions favour the batsmen, I would not let Australia leave the field until they were bled white. How fit is McGrath really ? I would like to see if he fancies two and a half days out there.
McGrath's in a bit of pain I'd say and if he's kept out there for another half day I'd say he might miss the next test unless they can rest him for a while.
As to the result it will depend on how the pitch holds up over the next day or so. It is a pretty dead track and not giving the bowlers much help at the moment.
EDIT: Well done to Collingwood! 1st Pom in 70 years to get a double ton on tour in Australia!
mr chris
12-02-06, 02:21 AM
551-6 Dec :doh: :rock:
Well it seems as if my pep talk from above has done the trick now all we need to do is make the most of the new ball. Fingers crossed :up:
Yes Big Fred strikes straight away and it is good bye langer.:rock: Long may this continue it seems as if you aussies now have a game on your hands:hmm:
THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK ;)
Eng: 551-6d
Aus: 28-1
:damn:1/28 Not happy Jan! Looks like we have a game on our hands and the series is alive and well. The Aussie batsman will need to keep their heads.
What did that guy in the crowd say to Langer on his way up to the dressing rooms?
bookworm_020
12-03-06, 05:30 PM
England has a chance!!:o It's turning into a real cricket match!!:hmm: This could beath some life into the series! As long as Australia doesn't do anything stupid we still have a chance of drawing this one
Nah, the lack of imagination and anything really happening with the pitch looks like a draw.
Konovalov
12-04-06, 05:36 AM
As long as Australia doesn't do anything stupid we still have a chance of drawing this one
Which thankfully they didn't. Pup batted well for a century. His shot selection has really improved and he has certainly matured as a world class international cricketer.
If Watson comes back into the side as expected for the game at the WACCA then I can't see how the selectors can drop Clarke. For my mind Marto is in danger of being dropped. If that is the case then I would say that Martyn's career as a test player is over.
Another positive note for us last night was Gilly who seems to have countered the around the wicket bowling of Flintoff and Co with a nice half century before giving his wicket away to the dull and boring Giles.
I'm glad we now have a real fight on our hands but I am a little dissappointed at the pitch that has been prepared by Les Burdett at Adelaide. Low and slow. I'm afraid that this seems to be the emerging trend in Australia. When Perth is overtaken by Brisbane as the fastest wicket in Australia you know there are problems.
badhat17
12-04-06, 07:40 AM
Didn't Gilchrist offer three chances before finaly throwing it away ?
I wouldn't be so hasty in saying that he has found the cure just yet.
I wonder what Monty thought when he saw Warne turn his first ball a yard after watching Giles fail to turn one all day long. I hope Fletcher sees sense but he's a stubborn bugger so I wont be holding my breath.
What about McGrath? He looks all but finished to me and Ponting seems to be thinking along similiar lines.
Did Giles drop the ashes ? That cost 100 runs and cost England the chance of a win at Adelaide.
Konovalov
12-04-06, 08:26 AM
Didn't Gilchrist offer three chances before finaly throwing it away ?
There was one that landed just inches short of Bell at gully while on the drive so that wasn't a chance. He had one airy fairy play and miss at one outside offstump in the area which he hot out so often in the last Ashes. There was also a close LBW call that was a 50/50.
I wouldn't be so hasty in saying that he has found the cure just yet.
Time will tell at the WACCA in under two weeks.
I wonder what Monty thought when he saw Warne turn his first ball a yard after watching Giles fail to turn one all day long. I hope Fletcher sees sense but he's a stubborn bugger so I wont be holding my breath.I share your sentiments on the Monty debacle.
What about McGrath? He looks all but finished to me and Ponting seems to be thinking along similiar lines.
I won't totally write him off just yet, but yeah, he looks to be struggling.
Did Giles drop the ashes ? That cost 100 runs and cost England the chance of a win at Adelaide.
Hmmm, that sounds stranegly familiar to a line uttered by Steve Tugger Waugh to Hershelle Gibbs of South Africa a few years back. ;)
Looks like a draw is on the cards.
mr chris
12-04-06, 04:23 PM
Yep a draw is ok roll on the WACCA Now with some wind in are sails we might be able to leave the series in Perth.
There's hope for a result yet! The poms are 5/89 at lunch!
badhat17
12-04-06, 09:58 PM
Nooooooooooooooooo. This can't be happening, it just can't. :-?
Oh yess it can!:D
Go Aussies!
Haha :D
England are 9 for. :up: :rock:
We should have about a session to get 170-ish
Can it be done?
edit - 36 overs to get 168 runs.
thats victory at 4.67 runs per over.
All out for 129!!! The Aussies now have to score at a little over 4.5 runs an over for victory!:D
SteveW1
12-05-06, 03:57 AM
Hussey you legend, got us over the line with plenty to spare what a fantastic 5th day.
Go aussies
badhat17
12-05-06, 04:07 AM
What a great days cricket by the Australians, and what a poor performance from England. So much for batting down to eight by selecting Giles ahead of Monty, watching Giles bowl in the final session was as painfull as I had feared.
Well, well yet again another batting collapse by England. :yep:
Went out on day five being cocky and payed the price for it. :nope:
THE_MASK
12-05-06, 04:38 AM
OH YEAH .
Konovalov
12-05-06, 05:58 AM
:zzz: :zzz: I'm shattered having stayed up all night watching the final day. I had a hunch that if we could get a few wickets and keep things tight that we might be a chance to snatch this game though I didn't expect Engalnd to aid our cause to such a great extent by a timid rabit in the headlights style batting performance.
@ the england cricket team :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
We have one hand back on the urn. Hopefully there will be many more days of misery ahead for England. Quite frankly with the way they played, they deserved the humiliation.
And please could someone talk some sense into Duncan Fletcher and put out to pasture Ashley Giles. Better still how about the ECB get rid of Fletcher and find a new coach who picks his first 11 on ability and not some chummy loyalty rubbish.
Happy days again. :sunny:
Oh God please let them prove me wrong.
To win test matches you have to do SOMETHING right .
The batting was wrong, and the bowling was wrong : the choice of captain is looking wrong, the selection is looking wrong and the tactics are looking wrong. And I’ve a horrible feeling Fletcher will have none of this and field basically the same team, doing the same thing, to prove this was just a bad day.
It’s not that they’ve had a nightmare defeat at Brisbane, it’s not that they’ve surrendered a match that was almost impossible to lose, it’s not that they’ve squandered the moral ascendancy : what is so terminally unacceptable about this is they have killed this series .
And please God, don’t let them rush Vaughan back for the third test and ruin his reputation as well. At least I can still watch the videos of 2005 with some pleasure.
Signed
Somebody who loves cricket but can’t understand why it gives him so much pain
To paraphrase, 'they snatched defeat from the jaws of a draw'.:roll:
Sack the lot of them and start again, that's my advice. ;)
mr chris
12-05-06, 12:41 PM
This series is turning into a nightmare of are own making. Not much chance of winning at the Wacca as we have only won once there ever before. As said before in this thread we need to start to pick the best players for the job not just because someone played well last summer. It is now winter 2006 get with the programe Fletcher and co.
bookworm_020
12-05-06, 05:12 PM
What a finnish!:D Just when you think there going to beat you (or get a draw), they implode!:p
Can't wait to see my English Brother in law, this will wipe the smile off his face!!:yep:
Bring on the Third Test!!!!!
I love the Australians playing cricket against the poms, It revenge for the bodyline series!!
bigboywooly
12-05-06, 05:39 PM
I love the Australians playing cricket against the poms, It revenge for the boadyline series!!
Should be revenge for getting your asses kicked last year
Anywho the series is lost now methinks
God knows why they played that wheelie bin ( Giles )
Hasnt played international cricket in god knows how long and he is just not a threat when bowling
Monty should have had the nod there
:nope:
bookworm_020
12-05-06, 10:05 PM
Monty Python????:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
I love the Australians playing cricket against the poms, It revenge for the boadyline series!!
Should be revenge for getting your asses kicked last year
After 2 decades of losing the Ashes you were bound to win a series at some point, even NZ would get lucky in that amount of time.
SteveW1
12-05-06, 11:48 PM
I do think that if Fletcher had Hoggard bowling from the River end of the Adelaide oval it might have been a different story, but instead Giles was bowling which lost the match for them, every over he bowled cost runs.
Now in the papers here the media are saying that the English press is already conceding defeat and that they might as well hand the Ashes over now.
While I would like to see Australia wipe the floor with England how about the Poms come back and level the series and leave it down to the last match and both teams going for it, I really enjoyed watching the last day of the second test yesterday, I think people here are going to be talking about it for ages.
Lets have some more good close matches, makes for good watching.
:up:
bookworm_020
12-06-06, 12:05 AM
I love the Australians playing cricket against the poms, It revenge for the boadyline series!!
Should be revenge for getting your asses kicked last year
After 2 decades of losing the Ashes you were bound to win a series at some point, even NZ would get lucky in that amount of time.
New Zealand!:o:lol::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
They have yet to recover from the under arm bowling incident!! Win the ashes?? No way:up:
I do think that if Fletcher had Hoggard bowling from the River end of the Adelaide oval it might have been a different story, but instead Giles was bowling which lost the match for them, every over he bowled cost runs.
Whilst the King of Spain's bowling was a contributing factor to the defeat, I think the negative attitiude to their batting really was the root cause of their demise. If they had been more positive in their batting they could have put the game beyond reach. As it was they had two things on their side and a number of things against them.
The two things were a 1st innings lead (not big but a lead), and time. Against them they had one of the best cricket teams in the world with a will to win and a risk all attitude that proved capable of overcoming what looked to be a match winning or at least drawing 1st inning total. On top of that they did not have the bowling attack to defend that lead.
Mind you all this is like saying to the runner that came second to Cathy Freeman in 2000; "All you had to do was run faster!" The English are frankly not good enough across the park and changes need to be made if they are to improve.
The English side that won the Ashes in 2005 had some luck, home crowd and conditions with them. This English side have none of those factors this time round.
(And I'm loving it):D
The English side that won the Ashes in 2005 had some luck, home crowd and conditions with them. This English side have none of those factors this time round.
What arrant nonsense.
The English team are coming a bad second best to Australia this time round but this shouldn’t be a smug excuse to write off England’s performance in 2005. England are not going to apologise for “home crowd and conditions” anymore than Australia should for their current home advantage. And where does this myth of “bad luck” come from ? Was it “bad luck” that Ponting blundered with the toss at Edgbaston, or “bad luck” that he chose to take a suicidal single at Trent Bridge, or I suppose it was “bad luck” that Warne spilled Pietersen on that final morning of the Oval test.. No my friend , all of that was bad play. If we’re into that sort of approach then I’m sure I could claim that England’s 7 dropped catches at Lords were “bad luck”. The only genuine “bad luck” was Glen McGraw stepping on a cricket ball immediately before the second test and maybe arguably that England won 3 tosses to Australia’s 2, but those shouldn’t be used as a panacea excuse for why Australia lost the Ashes. The fact is the England team played better. Not by a country mile , but enough to beat Australia on that occasion. With four effective in-form seam bowlers the English attack was able to keep up the pressure all the time, in a way Australia hadn’t experienced in a long while. And in one critical department they were clearly superior – the captain’s performance. The England team had become a tight knit unit over the previous 18 months with the added momentum of a winning habit. All the elements had come together at just the right time, as it does with all winning teams including Australia who have maintained their momentum for over a decade.
That winning English team was already falling apart even as the final 2005 Oval test was playing. Simon Jones was absent through injury so the relentless pressure of four effective bowlers was removed. He has never returned. Compound that with the loss Michael Vaughan early in the winter campaign, the various absences of Trescothick, Harmison, Flintoff and Giles (to name a few) and it should be no surprise that rhythm and form have suffered. England have stuttered and started ever since. The records speak for themselves. Australia have won 11 out of their 12 succeeding tests and England have won 4 out of 12 ( I’ll exclude the 2006 Oval fiasco from the statistics) .
This is not the same England team, and neither is it the same Australian team, so let’s have none of this nonsense that the current series is some sort of rerun and only luck and home advantage were the reasons for England’s Ashes victory in 2005.
Konovalov
12-06-06, 08:53 AM
Excellent post horsa. :yep: Honest, accurate and to the point. It is nice to read your comments from one who is obviously another cricket lover. :up:
Right England we need three wins now or two wins and a draw, can you possibly do one of those two if possible. :doh:
If the English Cricket team gets a 5-0 white wash don't bother coming home. :arrgh!:
bookworm_020
12-06-06, 05:15 PM
"we will beat you at cricket on the beach, we will beat you at cricket on the fields, we will beat you at cricket in the streets, but England will never surrender the ashes to Australia!":rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
England will never surrender the ashes to Australia!
Pay me £1 Million Pounds and there yours. ;)
The English side that won the Ashes in 2005 had some luck, home crowd and conditions with them. This English side have none of those factors this time round.
What arrant nonsense.
The English team are coming a bad second best to Australia this time round but this shouldn’t be a smug excuse to write off England’s performance in 2005. England are not going to apologise for “home crowd and conditions” anymore than Australia should for their current home advantage. And where does this myth of “bad luck” come from ? Was it “bad luck” that Ponting blundered with the toss at Edgbaston, or “bad luck” that he chose to take a suicidal single at Trent Bridge, or I suppose it was “bad luck” that Warne spilled Pietersen on that final morning of the Oval test.. No my friend , all of that was bad play. If we’re into that sort of approach then I’m sure I could claim that England’s 7 dropped catches at Lords were “bad luck”. The only genuine “bad luck” was Glen McGraw stepping on a cricket ball immediately before the second test and maybe arguably that England won 3 tosses to Australia’s 2, but those shouldn’t be used as a panacea excuse for why Australia lost the Ashes. The fact is the England team played better. Not by a country mile , but enough to beat Australia on that occasion. With four effective in-form seam bowlers the English attack was able to keep up the pressure all the time, in a way Australia hadn’t experienced in a long while. And in one critical department they were clearly superior – the captain’s performance. The England team had become a tight knit unit over the previous 18 months with the added momentum of a winning habit. All the elements had come together at just the right time, as it does with all winning teams including Australia who have maintained their momentum for over a decade.
That winning English team was already falling apart even as the final 2005 Oval test was playing. Simon Jones was absent through injury so the relentless pressure of four effective bowlers was removed. He has never returned. Compound that with the loss Michael Vaughan early in the winter campaign, the various absences of Trescothick, Harmison, Flintoff and Giles (to name a few) and it should be no surprise that rhythm and form have suffered. England have stuttered and started ever since. The records speak for themselves. Australia have won 11 out of their 12 succeeding tests and England have won 4 out of 12 ( I’ll exclude the 2006 Oval fiasco from the statistics) .
This is not the same England team, and neither is it the same Australian team, so let’s have none of this nonsense that the current series is some sort of rerun and only luck and home advantage were the reasons for England’s Ashes victory in 2005.
Horsa, It would appear that you have miscronstrued the last sentence in my post. My objective was not to make excuses for Australia's defeat in 2005 by blaming it on luck, conditions and crowd. My intent was to counterpoint the conditions under which the English are performing under this year as compared to last year. I could also have said that they are not the same team and that this years side is not performing as well as the 2005 side.
The main point of my post was that England this year do not appear to be as pschologically well prepared for the task as the Australians. If this is nonsense then Australia should have lost the first two tests and should lose the next 3.
I don't believe this to be so.
bookworm_020
12-07-06, 07:31 PM
England will never surrender the ashes to Australia!
Pay me £1 Million Pounds and there yours. ;)
How about $1.25 in pacific pesos and a case of VB?:hmm:
England will never surrender the ashes to Australia!
Pay me £1 Million Pounds and there yours. ;)
How about $1.25 in pacific pesos and a case of VB?:hmm:
Sounds like a good deal of an old clay urn full of burnt bails to me!:D
England will never surrender the ashes to Australia!
Pay me £1 Million Pounds and there yours. ;)
How about $1.25 in pacific pesos and a case of VB?:hmm:
Hey I'm not cheap you know. :p
Konovalov
12-08-06, 05:37 AM
More misery for team England in Perth today. :D
http://content-uk.cricinfo.com/ausveng/content/story/271729.html
The England XI made 8 for 259 and in reply the Cricket Australia Chairman's XI won with 3 for 260. The Chairman's XI got the runs in only 40.1 overs having hammered the England bowlers to all parts.
At least Panesar picked up a couple of wickets but apparently he looked a little rusty which doesn't come as much of a suprise considering Fletcher has turned him into a glorified drinks boy for the first two Tests. :roll: Sajid Mahmood bowled well and is threatening Anderson for a place in the Perth test. So another loss but some small positive signs for England.
Damien Marten retired this morning as well. He was not inluded in the squad for the Perth test and he said that he no longer has the passion for the game needed to play at the top level.
http://www.theage.com.au/news/news/ashes-shock-martyn-calls-it-quits/2006/12/08/1165081133434.html
Konovalov
12-08-06, 06:16 AM
Damien Marten retired this morning as well. He was not inluded in the squad for the Perth test and he said that he no longer has the passion for the game needed to play at the top level.
http://www.theage.com.au/news/news/ashes-shock-martyn-calls-it-quits/2006/12/08/1165081133434.html
Yep. Credit to him for making the call he did. Some guys would just hang around like a bad smell even though they knew that they weren't 100% commited any more.
This is good news for Australia in the long term. Marto was one of 4 top 6 bastmen in their mid 30's. We need to start bringing new players into the team as the last thing we need is all our senior players going at once. I would say that Symo will come into the team for this match and that Watson if fit will take back the place for the Boxing day Test.
I agree that it was time for him to go.
I saw something interesting on the Glasshouse (a local comedy show in Australia on ABC http://www.abc.net.au/glasshouse/ ), a couple of weeks ago, Merv Hughes was on the show and they were talking about sports people retiring. Merve said he knew the exact moment when it was time to retire. Bob Simpson (a selector at the time), came up and tapped him on the shoulder and told him it was time to retire!
Konovalov
12-08-06, 07:20 AM
Is that program still running on ABC? Is the comedian Dave Hughes still on it? I wish the ABC would bring back some great comedy like the Late Show from the early 90's with Micky Molloy, Rob Sitch, and co. Those were the days. :sunny:
Is that program still running on ABC? Is the comedian Dave Hughes still on it? I wish the ABC would bring back some great comedy like the Late Show from the early 90's with Micky Molloy, Rob Sitch, and co. Those were the days. :sunny:
No.
It got killed a few weeks ago.
About bloody time to.
If they want to make left-wing trash with thier own money thats one thing, but not on my dime :down:
My objective was not to make excuses for Australia's defeat in 2005 by blaming it on luck, conditions and crowd.
I must accept this is what you meant because that is what you tell me, but I have to say it doesn’t read that way. At the moment, there’s not much to feel pleased about, if you’re a supporter of English Cricket, and you need to understand that any hint that 2005 “was just a bit of luck” smacks a bit of cheap unnecessary vindictiveness.
I hope you can see that the events of Adelaide will have cut really deep. It’s a bit like a boxing match gone wrong where the champion has landed a knock out blow only to discover he has inadvertently killed his opponent in the process as well. Believe me, this is far worse than Headingley ‘81. I dread to think what this will have done to the psyche of the English game, the rest of this series, and maybe even the Ashes contest itself. All this talk of “bouncing back” and “ we must be positive” is only paper thin. Flintoff’s frozen demeanor at the press conference suggests a deeply damaged team.
Australia’s professionalism and Warne’s brilliance apart, the England team knows it cocked up big time – and this was supposed to be a team with mental toughness. One English media commentator believes they simply choked. They have nowhere to go for excuses. Even most of the Australian media have been sheepish about this, sensing the sheer cringing embarrassment of it all.
And then there’s Fletcher. He’s done wonders for the English game over the last eight years , but now he’s somehow contriving to wipe it all out.
There’s been a lot of talk about his wrong headed selection, and it’s difficult not to agree with it. Unfortunately, it’s creating the myth that the hapless Panesar is going to be a match winning saviour. He’s a clever bowler, sadly ignored by Fletcher, but he’s no Warne .I only hope he isn’t heading for an undeserved fall, crushed by the massive expectation that he can somehow reverse the series. We can dream of course …… hmmm “Panesar’s Series” . But let’s be realists. The insidious sadist that wrote the script for this series would take perverse pleasure in giving him a return of something like 0 for 130 at Perth ……… the same script writer, I might add, who decided that Giles was the only fielder placed to take Ponting’s catch on day three.
So you see ,when things go pear shaped, or as in this case, gigantic pumpkin shaped , we turn to the Ashes 2005. It’s our opium. It's going to have to last us a long time.
More misery for team England in Perth today. :D
God, it's getting so bad even the Aussi's are feeling sorry for us :o
Please, guys , promise you won't bowl underarm to us in the Third Test.
My objective was not to make excuses for Australia's defeat in 2005 by blaming it on luck, conditions and crowd.
I must accept this is what you meant because that is what you tell me, but I have to say it doesn’t read that way. At the moment, there’s not much to feel pleased about, if you’re a supporter of English Cricket, and you need to understand that any hint that 2005 “was just a bit of luck” smacks a bit of cheap unnecessary vindictiveness.
I hope you can see that the events of Adelaide will have cut really deep. It’s a bit like a boxing match gone wrong where the champion has landed a knock out blow only to discover he has inadvertently killed his opponent in the process as well. Believe me, this is far worse than Headingley ‘81. I dread to think what this will have done to the psyche of the English game, the rest of this series, and maybe even the Ashes contest itself. All this talk of “bouncing back” and “ we must be positive” is only paper thin. Flintoff’s frozen demeanor at the press conference suggests a deeply damaged team.
Australia’s professionalism and Warne’s brilliance apart, the England team knows it cocked up big time – and this was supposed to be a team with mental toughness. One English media commentator believes they simply choked. They have nowhere to go for excuses. Even most of the Australian media have been sheepish about this, sensing the sheer cringing embarrassment of it all.
And then there’s Fletcher. He’s done wonders for the English game over the last eight years , but now he’s somehow contriving to wipe it all out.
There’s been a lot of talk about his wrong headed selection, and it’s difficult not to agree with it. Unfortunately, it’s creating the myth that the hapless Panesar is going to be a match winning saviour. He’s a clever bowler, sadly ignored by Fletcher, but he’s no Warne .I only hope he isn’t heading for an undeserved fall, crushed by the massive expectation that he can somehow reverse the series. We can dream of course …… hmmm “Panesar’s Series” . But let’s be realists. The insidious sadist that wrote the script for this series would take perverse pleasure in giving him a return of something like 0 for 130 at Perth ……… the same script writer, I might add, who decided that Giles was the only fielder placed to take Ponting’s catch on day three.
So you see ,when things go pear shaped, or as in this case, gigantic pumpkin shaped , we turn to the Ashes 2005. It’s our opium. It's going to have to last us a long time.
Horsa, Thanks for the response. I meant no vindictiveness and remember that whilst 2005 is your opium it is also a deep cut for a team and group of supporters who were very used to being on top in this game.
I think that the 2005 ashes result is one of the reasons why the Australian team has got it's act together this year. They do not want to be on the losing side at home and will walk slowly over broken glass in bear feet to avoid that outcome.
Being married to a pom gives me a little objectivity (not a lot), and whilst I may not have chosen my words as carefully as I should my intent is as was stated.
Damien Marten retired this morning as well. He was not inluded in the squad for the Perth test and he said that he no longer has the passion for the game needed to play at the top level.
Last night I had a dream.
Flintoff .
“You know guys, I’ve been thinking. Since I’ve been captain I’ve not been the player I was. It’s just too much for one person. Bowling my heart out, batting like I’m supposed to be Botham at no.6, suspect ankle , carrying the Boys Own hero expectation thing, and so on . What I’m going to do is hand over to Andrew Strauss. He’s a level headed sort of guy, good cricketing brain, sort of in the Michael Vaughan mould, and doesn’t have any unnecessary baggage to carry.”
Gerait Jones
“ Hey Freddie. Great idea. Just what we’d all been saying the other day in the bar while you were at the press conference saying nothing. Now you mention it , I guess my batting’s a bit of a let down as well. Old Readie here is a good solid scorer and is just as capable as me with the gloves . How’s about we swop over ? “
Giles
“ You're right there, Jonesie old son. That’s got me thinking too. I know I’ve done valuable if unspectacular service to the team over the years and been a great team guy, but since my hip problem it’s just not been the same. Twelve months without any real cricket is not the best preparation for a test match comeback. I know Dunc will be disappointed, and he’s great with this loyalty thing, but lets face it, Monty here is frankly a better bowler than me. Let him take my place. ”
Harmison
“ Hmmmmm . Good point there Gilo. Well, I know I’ve got years of bowling in me still, but I think I could do with a rest. The rhythm’s just not there. Slowly falling down the ratings and getting marmalised by the best team in the world is not doing my confidence any good. I know second slip will miss their fielding practice without me bowling spectacular wides but Sajid, here, is raring to go. He couldn’t do a worse job than me so how about it, mate ?
Anderson
“ Well, Harmie, where does that leave me ? If I carry on playing with some real bowlers around me it might get noticed that I hardly ever take a wicket. Maybe I’m not really a test class bowler. I guess I ought to stand aside too. Liam’s not brilliant but he’s young, keen and learning fast, and at least he takes a wicket or two
Pietersen
“ Bang on there , mates. Maybe me and Collie won’t feel like we’re wasting our time carrying the team by ourselves. And to show my appreciation of you fellas I’ll promise to stop trying to be so bleedin clever and cut out the sweep stroke.
( nods and smiles all round)
Then I woke up and heard Fletcher on the radio saying it was all the batsmen’s fault, he doesn’t make all the decisions by himself anyway, and he sees no point in changing. After all that would only prove he was wrong in the first place.
mr chris
12-08-06, 01:40 PM
Fantasic post Horsa bang on i wish Big Dunc was reading this:yep: :up: :up:
Konovalov
12-08-06, 02:11 PM
Fantasic post Horsa bang on
Yep, another right on te mark post. :yep:
i wish Big Dunc was reading this:yep: :up: :up:
Are you kidding. Wish all you want. Big Dunc Fletcher is as deaf as a post on this issue.
Now, can someone explain this bit to me? Michael Vaughan has basically been ruled out by Fletcher not to play in the Ashes series and I think it is fair to say that everyone thought he was little to no chance months before the tour began anyway. So why do they plan on playing Vaughan in the 2 day game at Perth this weekend? Surely if the English batters are to blame as Fletcher implies then that would mean he would use this 2 day game as valuable practice for those batters out of form or for potential batters in the touring party that may come into the side. Can someone answer this for me? :damn:
I don't want to even touch the ridiculous situation of Michael Vaughan still being the captain of England despite not playing in 12 plus months. :roll:
P.S. I still have hopes of a tight and exciting Ashes series but Duncan Fletcher, ECB management and some English players are doing their best to turn this series into another boring whitewash in favour of Australia. I'm Australian and I feel sorry for England. There, I said it. :doh:
Venatore
12-09-06, 07:04 AM
Martin...........GONE !!!!!!!!!!!!!
bookworm_020
12-10-06, 05:33 PM
Horsa, could you write your post in another colour, the black isn't good for my eyes!
The Australian Cricket Board is flying out a British Bobby to sit with the Barmey Army, just to make them feel at home!:huh: Lucky Sod! Paid flight, accomodation and tickets to the Ashes!! I don't see them offering me the job!:88)
Just saw an interesting article on the English selections. Not sure how much Stuart Law knows but it sound like things look as crook as Rookwood for the poms...
http://www.smh.com.au/news/news/australian-weighs-in-to-defend-flintoff/2006/12/10/1165685554262.html
PS: for those that don;t know Rookwood is a big cemetary in Sydney. So big it has its own postcode.
Well this is it this week, England's team has there backs to the wall this is the fightback or the end? It dose not look good for our team at all, can they pull of a victory or a draw to stay in the series. :hmm:
mr chris
12-11-06, 07:01 AM
Well this is it this week, England's team has there backs to the wall this is the fightback or the end? It dose not look good for our team at all, can they pull of a victory or a draw to stay in the series. :hmm:
You are more opertmistic than me Steed. We lost the ashes long ago with are doggy team selections.
So why do they plan on playing Vaughan in the 2 day game at Perth this weekend? Surely if the English batters are to blame as Fletcher implies then that would mean he would use this 2 day game as valuable practice for those batters out of form or for potential batters in the touring party that may come into the side. Can someone answer this for me? :damn:
Not sure how much Stuart Law knows but it sound like things look as crook as Rookwood for the poms...
It's difficult to know what's going on. It all depends what you read and who you want to believe. Unfortunately for England it looks like a no-win situation in every sense of the word. An unfortunate casualty of all this is cricket in general and interest in the Ashes in particular. Adelaide was so damaging
melnibonian
12-11-06, 07:12 AM
We lost the ashes long ago with are doggy team selections.
I agree about the team selections but to be fair Australia is a better team
You are more opertmistic than me Steed. We lost the ashes long ago with are doggy team selections.
Am I? Just look at my first post. :lol:
Game on in less than 24 hours now. Here we go it's the make or break match number 3. :ping:
Blindfold and last cigarette on stand by. :dead:
bookworm_020
12-12-06, 08:16 PM
I'll organize the firing squad if you have trouble!
Bring it on! I'd like to see some fight out of the poms this test. Don't want to have to go an watch a dead rubber on my birthday (Boxing Day).
Konovalov
12-13-06, 06:02 AM
I plan on being in bed asleeep by 10pm tonight with the alarm clock set for 2 or 2:30am Thursday morning. :yep:
Several upbeat notes to buck the trend :D
Set aside the ridiculous last day at Adelaide, England did have the better of most of that test. It was hardly the ritual slaughter that England had been receiving since 1989.
England hold the Ashes so a drawn series would be sufficient.
There is an precedent for England coming back from 2-0 down to draw a series - I think it was against South Africa a few years ago.
The Aussies will probably retain the aging players that would have been discarded if results had gone against them.
God always smiles on the righteous and Freddie is a nicer all round guy than Rickie Ponting.
I can't take any more of this.
I'm going out for a drink. ;)
bookworm_020
12-13-06, 05:16 PM
"Well may they say 'God save the Queen', but nothing will save the English Cricket Team!"
Enjoy your drinking Steed! It may be the only pleasure you have in the next couple of days!:()1:
Konovalov
12-13-06, 05:32 PM
Hmmm, "because nothing will save the Governor-General."[ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gough_Whitlam#_note-6) Gough Whitlam. :lol:
I will not be cocky about this one. In fact, I think England could well bounce back in this test. They really have nothing to loose now. I guess we will all probably know more about the outcome of this series in four days or so.
Come on Symo, transfer that one day brilliance into the test arena. Don't become another Michael Bevan. This IS your last chance to save your fledgling test career.
England needs the cricket robots from Life the Universe and everything, the third book in the Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy.
Better still stick Marvin in. :rotfl:
badhat17
12-13-06, 10:43 PM
Good so far at the WACA from my England point of view, bit of something in the pitch for the bowlers and the batsmen get full value when they play shots, anyhow back to the telly.
badhat17
12-13-06, 11:33 PM
MONTY STRIKES !
Did you see that ! Why have we waited this long to see what Monty can do ?
Has to be Englands session.
Not a great start by the Aussie batsmen. Hussey and Clarke need to consolidate and start getting some runs. They look a bit pinned down at the moment.
Konovalov
12-14-06, 04:00 AM
Well done England. Monty gets a 5 for! I found this comment from the Cricinfo commentary quite amusing as I arrived into the office having watched the game earlier at home:
And Duncan Fletcher can be seen in the dressing room with a rather expressionless demeanor. Fortunately Jenny Thompson is rather more cheery and ready to take you through the final stages of today's play. Well done everyone. That's it from me for now. Hello! Everyone!
67.6Panesar to Lee, OUT, and he's got him! Monty has five! Lands this on middle, it turns just enough and Lee is rapped on the pad. Dar raises his finger and Panesar is the first English spinner to take five wickets at the WACA. This is Monty's day B Lee lbw b Panesar 10 (25b 2x4 0x6) SR: 40.00
Oh Mr Duncan Fletcher. :roll:
SteveW1
12-14-06, 04:18 AM
this is not looking good for the aussies but maybe they will beat england again like the last test
Oh Mr Duncan Fletcher. :roll:
I'd hold fire on your demolition job on Fletcher. It's far from clear who was the prime mover in Monty's ommission. The team that did so well against Pakistan in England last summer was Strauss' team with Panesar, Reid and Mahmood playing. Flintoff was absent with injury. Think about it. Flintoff returns for the Ashes, and Strauss' team is disassembled to recreate the 2005 Ashes team as far as possible.
badhat17
12-14-06, 06:01 AM
Phew ! What a day that was. Twelve wickets down at stumps on the first day makes a stark contrast with the eleven wickets that fell over the first three days back at Adelaide. Australia will be thankfull for the contribution made by Mike Hussey who ran out of partners on 74, it would have been a sorry total without his dogged innings.
The whole of England will be wondering why it has taken so long for Monty Panesar to make his ashes debut after his 5-92 performance today, not a great deal of turn on offer from the pitch but he didn't need much. With his usual drift and dip he created enough doubt in the minds of the batsmen to unsettle them and that seemed to be enough. Harmison looked much happier bowling on a track which offered good bounce and carry, I can't see this match going into a fifth day.
Australia though will surely be confident of bowling England out cheaply after taking two wickets in the last hour today, McGrath, Lee and Clarke all looked menacing. England will need an innings of character from somebody tomorrow if they want to keep the series alive.
What a difference it makes to a team to have five effective bowlers. :up:
Listen carefully to how Nasser Hussein talks us through the test matches . For him it's all about pressure. If you have the bowling weaponry to keep the pressure on, everything else starts to motor. If you lose the ability to apply pressure it all starts to unravel in every department, and not just the bowling.
Witness Warne today. Would he have dropped that catch if Australia had scored 600 in their first innings ?
And what happened in 2005 ? England were able to apply non-stop pressure to the Aussies because they had five effective bowlers going at them all the time. For my money they've missed Simon Jones more than any other team member, even more than Vaughan.
Good bit of bowling by England but poor batting start.
Konovalov
12-14-06, 02:04 PM
Good bit of bowling by England but poor batting start.
It could have been worse for you if Warney had of taken what was a fairly simple catch at 1st slip.
bookworm_020
12-14-06, 05:30 PM
What the heck happened!!!! It's not a batting wicket out there! Austrlia got hit by the full Monty!!!:doh:
Will be interesting to see how the Poms do on Day 2, If they can post a good score, they may have a chance of winning or at least drawing this, as long as they don't blow it!
SteveW1
12-15-06, 03:43 AM
Day 2 and the Poms didnt even reach Australia's score, come on Aussies bat out the day and tomorrow then bowl the Poms out nice and low
England :damn:
It's slipping away!!!
Konovalov
12-15-06, 06:37 AM
Day 2 and the Poms didnt even reach Australia's score, come on Aussies bat out the day and tomorrow then bowl the Poms out nice and low
I hope it runs to that script. I'd really like to see Punter score a big century and set England +400. But for the WA Cricket Association I would like to see this game go well into the 4th day as their finances aren't in the best state right now.
We're pretty well into the end game now, which means bye bye any real interest in Melbourne and Sydney.
Sad .
It should have been so much better. :-?
England needs the cricket robots from Life the Universe and everything, the third book in the Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy.
We do now, that's for sure. :yep:
I know there's still 1.5 innings left to play, but who is you pick for man of the match?
Monty?
Peitersen?
Hussey?
Konovalov
12-16-06, 02:22 AM
I know there's still 1.5 innings left to play, but who is you pick for man of the match?
Monty?
Peitersen?
Hussey?
Hmmm now that really is a hard one NOT! Hussey by a mile at this stage in the match. 103 and just out on the stroke of tea. Brilliant innings by the man known as Mr Cricket and well deserved. Not a flawless innings like some of his earlier efforts in the series but still his effort has set up probable victory in this test and indeed the Ashes series. Clarke is still there and with a leed of 386 with 6 wickets in hand and Symo and Gilly to come I think they have a little license to continue to up the tempo and flay the English bowling. I feel a target of 500 plus coming on. :sunny:
That middle session was Englands last chance I feel. They picked up only one wicket at the very end when they needed two or three earlier before the new ball was taken. Instead Hussey and Clarke were still there when the new ball was taken. Since the new ball there have been just 9 overs bowled and in that crucial time Australia carted England for 62 runs. :dead:
Oh, and unlike last year where South Africa managed to avoid defeat by batting over a day and a half this time it is different. Last year the pitch wasn't exposed to 40+ degree temperatures. This pitch will not be te easiest to bat on come day four and more so day five.
Yep, it's just all good news for Australia. :D We are still the best Test and one day cricket team in the world. :yep:
Konovalov
12-16-06, 04:31 AM
GILLY, GILLY, GILLY.
Was on track for the fastest hundred ever. The record though is still held by Viv Richards. On the last ball he faced for the chance to break the record Hogard bowled it so wide of offstump that the tallest man in the world wouldn't have been able to reach it.
Anyway he hot his hundred in the end and Australia declared with both Clarke and Gilly both not out. Now the England openers have to face 7-9 overs having been chasing leather all day in +40 degree heat. Good luck because Strauss and Cook are on a hiding to nothing. :lol:
SteveW1
12-16-06, 04:44 AM
And the Poms are already 1 out for no runs thanks to Brett Lee, beautiful LBW.
Cmon Aussies:rock:
It is almost over Australia are on the Verge of grabbing the fake ashes back. :damn:
Australia were awesome today. Congratulations to them for winning the Ashes so convincingly, as surely they must do now
Forget about it's never over till the fat lady sings, hindsight will prove the die was cast on this series some time ago.
So what moment would you choose ? Here's a few on my short list
1. Adelaide ,the morning of day five. ( surely everybody's favourite)
2. Losing the toss and bowling wide on the first ball at Brisbane.
3. Dropping Ponting on 30 odd at Adelaide.
4. The moment in selection when Panesar's inclusion was deemed "upsetting to the batting balance of the side"
Or how about
5 The moment when Vaughan's knee caved in.
My personal favourite is ( with all due respect to Freddie’s lionheart contibution as a very special cricketer) the point when they set aside Strauss’ captaincy in favour of Flintoff. Strauss had a winning team last September, and surely, under his regime, the same selection mistakes wouldn’t have been made. :-?
SteveW1
12-17-06, 05:09 AM
Close of play on day 4 and the Aussies were rejuvenated by Mcgrath taking 2 wickets in the 3rd last over of play with England at 5/256, im thinking this could be a close last day unless they get some early wickets.
im thinking this could be a close last day unless they get some early wickets.
I doubt it . Those last five wickets need to make 292 runs . If they did that, it would be the biggest upset/achievement in test cricket ever.
I'd love to wake up on Mon morning to hear that, but realistically I'll more likely hear that Australia will have wrapped up England's second innings some time either side of lunch. :-?
Konovalov
12-17-06, 02:00 PM
im thinking this could be a close last day unless they get some early wickets.
I doubt it . Those last five wickets need to make 292 runs . If they did that, it would be the biggest upset/achievement in test cricket ever.
I'd love to wake up on Mon morning to hear that, but realistically I'll more likely hear that Australia will have wrapped up England's second innings some time either side of lunch. :-?
I would agree. At least England didn't roll over in a couple of sessions on day four. There was some fight there and for the sake of the series I would like to see some more. :yep:
bookworm_020
12-17-06, 07:02 PM
I would love a draw as it would give some life to the series. That and if England could win one for the Boxing day match, it would make a great finnish to the test series....
Well it nice to dream!
Last day's play nearly ready to roll. The match poised for an interesting days play. IMHO we'll see 5 wickets before lunch today and the Ashes going to Australia.
EDIT: Monty has denied me and England have held on until lunch. I'm now looking forward to the Austraian team getting the ashes some time within the next few hours... It's only a matter of time now!
bookworm_020
12-18-06, 12:26 AM
It all over! The Ashes are Australia's again!!! The Poms can now fall back into that rut they were win before they won them.
I do wish them the best for the remaining matches and I do hope they put up a better fight next time round.
Congrats to the Austrlian cricketers!!!:rock:
SteveW1
12-18-06, 01:45 AM
So are there any bets who will win the next test match
Game over England! The Ashes return to their natural home!
Well done Australia and Warne looking down the barrell of 700 test wickets next match.
What a game!
Konovalov
12-18-06, 02:31 AM
The Ashes are back where they belong. :yep:
Congrats to all the boys.
The script couldn't be written any better for Warne. On 699 test wickets with 1 more wicket needed to make the magical 700 mark, he will get that chance on his homeground at the MCG. 80,000 screaming Victorians will witness a great milestone for the hometown boy.
mr chris
12-18-06, 03:09 AM
Just want to say conragats to the Aussies. Hopefully the next series will be a tighter one. I look forward to the one day series now, hopefully England can try and salvage some sort of pride in the last 2 matches and the one dayers.
Konovalov
12-18-06, 05:41 AM
Hopefully the next series will be a tighter one.
I hope so too. :yep:
I look forward to the one day series now, hopefully England can try and salvage some sort of pride in the last 2 matches and the one dayers.
Again, I also hope that the last two Tests are tight and tough encounters. If there is a Test that I think England can win then it will be at Sydney. It's not all doom and gloom for the Test side. The long term future for England looks good with a young and exciting batting line up that will only get better with experience. They have a world class spinner who should be an integral part of the England team for the next decade. Not to mention they have a world class pace attack when Simon Jones is fit and they have age on their side. So yeah, there are plenty of positives for England. :up:
However, I can't say much though in terms of England's one day team. They are poor and that is being generous. One of their most consistent and best one day players Marcus Trescothick is back in England. Steve Harmison can't bowl for some strange reason with a white ball. The only sides below England in the ICC One Day world rankings are Bangladesh, Zimbabwe, and Kenya. Hardly encouraging for England on the one day front. If England want to be considered the best cricket nation then they will have to seriously address the ills of their one day game. At the moment England are just simply not good enough and lack the disciplines required and skill of one day cricket. :down:
Congratulations to Australia for wining back the ashes.
May as well get it over with, England players don't look like they are up to it and there performance has been like a wet weekend in Manchester.
STEED has a big grin on his face and a smug look. :smug:
England tried to stop the Australian bulldozer with a pea shooter and lost, they could not even defend the ashes if they tried. Hang on they did :damn: the time has come to sack Duncan Fletcher as coach and have two league tables, England top of the second league ahead of the rest of the world and in the first league all on there own and top of the world Australia.
Moving on to the last two games England had better win them or it will be a double blow ending in a white wash. :roll:
England tried to stop the Australian bulldozer with a pea shooter and lost, they could not even defend the ashes if they tried.
Come on , they could do with a bit more support than that. Dismissive generalisations sound great for crowd pleasing, but they don't do justice to the likes of Collingwood, Pietersen, Panesar, Hoggard and various others. The balance between winning and losing is a very fine one and in this case it was badly upset by several factors including some bad selection, muddled preparation, untimely absences and injuries, and a very strong Australian team, on song, and playing in their own back yard.
Talk of “sack Fletcher” doesn’t solve anything either . He is still a very fine coach that England could do well to hang on to. Yes he has made mistakes, particularly with selection ( not his prime role) and arguably the preparation, but he has also had to oversee a damaging succession of disruptions which included the loss of its Ashes winning captain.
Konovalov
12-18-06, 08:51 AM
:yep: Well said Horsa.
I'm waiting for the panick merchants in this country to sound off again on how English cricket is broke and that there needs to be radical changes made to the way the game is run in the UK. Sack the coach, sack the ECB, and on and on and on. There is no need for all the doom and gloom. Horsa has it spot on. I hope that for the sake of English cricket and indeed world cricket, that the powers that be listen to those with the thoughtful, objective, and accurate opinion such as the likes of horsa and not to the panick doom and gloom types that come out of the woodwork when anything goes wrong.
Can you believe that an Australian living in the UK is saying this? :)
England faced the best in the world and they should have put up a better fight but they did not and they paid the price for it. :arrgh!:
By the way, I am not saying sack the team but it's time for them to improve in there training a good start would be are weak tail end get that sorted out.
Can you believe that an Australian living in the UK is saying this?
Sounds like some very deft diplomacy to me . ;)
I hope for your sake the Australian thought police are not monitoring your posts. :D
Actually, now I think about it, one of the lesser known English attributes over the centuries has been the capacity to get other nationals to subtlety do their work for them. Churchill was half American, Wellington was Irish, Waterloo was more a Dutch-Belgian/Prussian affair, Brunel was half French, and the famous archers at Agincourt were Welsh, and lets not even begin talking about the Scots. And if we bring it down to our current topic the most successful member of the England cricket team is Pietersen. There’s no end to it. :hmm:
Konovalov
12-18-06, 09:56 AM
Can you believe that an Australian living in the UK is saying this?
Sounds like some very deft diplomacy to me . ;)
I hope for your sake the Australian thought police are not monitoring your posts. :D
I was taught by Dad to be a modest winner and not a bad looser. Add to that a few years back I was the only Australian standing out like a sore thumb wearing my Wallabies jumper in a local pub that was chock full of England rugby supporters. I remember that wet November morning as I, the lone Aussie, sat amongst dozens of proud and overjoyed England supporters as England defeated the Wallabies thanks to Johnny Wilkinson's magic boot. I will never forget that day as there was respect, kindness, and a great comradery amongst all there that morning. :up:
Oh, Please don't get me started on the party pooper policy of the Cricket Australia/Stadium authorities. It was just pathetic. A smile came to my face when on the first morning of the Perth test I heard that distinctive sound of the English supporter with his trumpet as he sent out the first tune of the morning. Could you imagine all this banning rubbish happening in the Caribbean during the next world cup? No drums, no trumpets, no spectators dancing in the stands? Crazy. :damn:
Konovalov in your sig
The Ashes and the urn are back where they belong.
On a flight back to England, to be placed back on a shelf in Lord's cricket ground. :smug: :know:
Konovalov
12-18-06, 04:23 PM
Konovalov in your sig
The Ashes and the urn are back where they belong.
On a flight back to England, to be placed back on a shelf in Lord's cricket ground. :smug: :know:
That's no problem for me Steed. :smug: It's just a short 35-45 minute train ride direct into Marlebone station for me followed by a nice little walk to Lord's. Once the little urn returns back to England from it's tour of my home I will be able to pay it a visit whenever I please. :lol:
bookworm_020
12-18-06, 05:05 PM
At least I can face my brother in law at christmas without him gloating at me that England has the ashes (He's a pom). Oh well, there is always next time for the English.
Here is to a good fight by England in the next two matches, and that they can put up a fight.
Konovalov
12-20-06, 06:36 AM
Warnie appears set to retire after the Sydney New Years Test: http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2006/12/20/1166290604407.html
I really thought that he may play on for another year and possibly even play in the next Ashes series in England. But it looks like I am wrong. I'm just grateful for being around to watch one of the greatest if not the best spin bowler in history. Sure he is a flawed and controversial character off the field, but in the application of his art as a leg spin bowler he is a genius without equal. :yep:
I really thought that he may play on for another year and possibly even play in the next Ashes series in England
Mmmmm ... I thought he'd tour once more as well. I suppose thinking about it this is a very good decision. He will know best how his body is reacting to the stresses of top class cricket and may have gauged that all he has to look forward to is the media asking "is Warne past it ?" every time he has a poor return. He's righted the "wrong" of losing the Ashes in 2005. so to speak, and is about to take an all time record of 700 wickets. Why wait for the bad times ?
Ironically, this is probably the best news England have had all tour.
Having said all that I must salute and recognise the truly all time great player that he is.
Konovalov
12-20-06, 06:57 AM
Ironically, this is probably the best news England have had all tour.
It could be better. For example. Ponting could trip over, break his leg and be out for the rest of the Ashes. This appears the only way to stop the guy from averaging 100 and raking in 750 plus runs for the series. :lol: Then again I forgot that there are two other Australian batsmen in Clarke and Hussey (Mr Cricket) that are also averaging over 100 in this series and who in fact are above Ponting. From a statistical standpoint, I don't think I have seen such a lop-sided series. Just look at this: http://uk.cricinfo.com/db/ARCHIVE/2006-07/ENG_IN_AUS/STATS/ENG_IN_AUS_NOV2006-FEB2007_TEST_AVS.html
Ponting is in the form of his life, but he is fallible. Warne is God like. :D
Konovalov
12-20-06, 07:17 AM
Ponting is in the form of his life, but he is fallible. Warne is God like. :D
Yeah, but Warne is fallible with the ladies because he thinks that he is God's gift to them. :lol:
mr chris
12-20-06, 07:18 AM
Yep Warne is god like.:yep: :yep:
But everyone is a bit faillable around the ladies. hehe
It will be a shame when he finaly calls time on his test career.
Yeah, but Warne is fallible with the ladies because he thinks that he is God's gift to them. :lol:
If that's the secret of his success then I hope the England team fornicates with half of Australia :D
( disclaimer : this is irony, and in no way way reflects on the the charming and beautiful wives of all England team members, who I am sure would never remotely consider such a thing ) :D
Shane Warne will be missed by me he was one heck of a great bowler and could do things with the cricket ball that would make your eyes pop out. :o
And Glenn McGrath or so set to retire, well they both done a great job for Australia. I'm sure the Australia will unleash there new secret weapon on us Brits when they come over in 2009. ;)
bookworm_020
12-20-06, 05:20 PM
Ponting is in the form of his life, but he is fallible. Warne is God like. :D
Warne God like????:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
A radio staion asked listeners to suggest which photo of him should be used by Australia post for a commemartive stamp. I wanted to suggest a photo of him in his Y fronts with those two english women, holding a inflatable oversized dong!:o
That sums him up to a tea!!:rock:
mr chris
12-20-06, 05:22 PM
Ponting is in the form of his life, but he is fallible. Warne is God like. :D
Warne God like????:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
A radio staion asked listeners to suggest which photo of him should be used by Australia post for a commemartive stamp. I wanted to suggest a photo of him in his Y fronts with those two english women, holding a inflatable oversized dong!:o
That sums him up to a tea!!:rock:
What a good time guy. You gott slove Warne he rocks and that is coming froma pom:yep: :up:
Warne God like????:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
A radio staion asked listeners to suggest which photo of him should be used by Australia post for a commemartive stamp. I wanted to suggest a photo of him in his Y fronts with those two english women, holding a inflatable oversized dong!:o
That sums him up to a tea!!:rock:
Good to see he's well thought of back in Oz :D
bookworm_020
12-20-06, 07:50 PM
Warne God like????:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
A radio staion asked listeners to suggest which photo of him should be used by Australia post for a commemartive stamp. I wanted to suggest a photo of him in his Y fronts with those two english women, holding a inflatable oversized dong!:o
That sums him up to a tea!!:rock: Good to see he's well thought of back in Oz :D
People respect him as a bowler, no one doubts that! But as a person, everyone sees him as a bit of a sleaze:|\\ (look at the affair and behavour here and overseas). I also don't forget the drug taking inceident as well!:nope:
I have far greater respect for McGrath, HE took time off to help his wife when she came down with brest cancer, and did it again when it reappeared. He has also funraised for brest cancer and been very honest in his dealings with it. He keeps his family life away from the cameras as well.
A man to respect on many levels!:rock::rock:
Konovalov
12-21-06, 04:41 AM
Warne God like????:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
A radio staion asked listeners to suggest which photo of him should be used by Australia post for a commemartive stamp. I wanted to suggest a photo of him in his Y fronts with those two english women, holding a inflatable oversized dong!:o
That sums him up to a tea!!:rock: Good to see he's well thought of back in Oz :D
People respect him as a bowler, no one doubts that! But as a person, everyone sees him as a bit of a sleaze:|\\ (look at the affair and behavour here and overseas). I also don't forget the drug taking inceident as well!:nope:
I have far greater respect for McGrath, HE took time off to help his wife when she came down with brest cancer, and did it again when it reappeared. He has also funraised for brest cancer and been very honest in his dealings with it. He keeps his family life away from the cameras as well.
A man to respect on many levels!:rock:
Too right. :yep: :yep:
People respect him as a bowler, no one doubts that! But as a person, everyone sees him as a bit of a sleaze:|\\ (look at the affair and behavour here and overseas). I also don't forget the drug taking inceident as well!:nope:
I have far greater respect for McGrath, HE took time off to help his wife when she came down with brest cancer, and did it again when it reappeared. He has also funraised for brest cancer and been very honest in his dealings with it. He keeps his family life away from the cameras as well.
Yep, that's an interesting comparison and there's no contest, :yep: but I think we might be getting our issues crossed here. The original reference to "God like" was a strictly cricketing comparison that refelected his incomparable affect on the psyche of England's batsmen.
On the other hand, I'm sure God would have a thing or two to say about using that comparison for Warne's record in his private life. :D
After the route at Lord's in 2005, I was resigned to England never regaining the Ashes while McGraw and Warne were around ( wrong of course) however, now that they are both retiring it feels like Christmas has come early :rock:
bookworm_020
12-21-06, 04:54 PM
After the route at Lord's in 2005, I was resigned to England never regaining the Ashes while McGraw and Warne were around ( wrong of course) however, now that they are both retiring it feels like Christmas has come early :rock:
Don't worry, by the time the next ashes roll around, there will be some new Aussies to make your cricketing life hell once more!!:up::lol::D
After the route at Lord's in 2005, I was resigned to England never regaining the Ashes while McGraw and Warne were around ( wrong of course) however, now that they are both retiring it feels like Christmas has come early :rock:
Don't worry, by the time the next ashes roll around, there will be some new Aussies to make your cricketing life hell once more!!:up::lol::D
2009 Plan X. ;)
Konovalov
12-22-06, 06:17 AM
My former company director who is a family friend sent me an email joke yesterday from Sydney so I thought that I would share. By the way he was actually born in England up Yorkshire way and emigrated to Australia when very young but you couldn't tell from this:
BILLY'S GAY DANCER DAD
Billy was at school this morning and the teacher asked all the children
what their fathers did for a living. All the typical answers came out,
fireman, policeman, salesman, chippy, captain of industry etc but Billy
was being uncharacteristically quiet and so the teacher asked him about
his father.
"My father is an exotic dancer in a gay club and takes off all his
clothes in front of other men. Sometimes if the offer is really good,
he'll go out with a man, rent a cheap hotel room and let them sleep with
him."
The teacher quickly set the other children some work and took little
Billy
aside to ask him if that was really true.
"No" said Billy, "He plays cricket for England but I was just too
embarrassed to say."
:lol: :lol:
BILLY'S GAY DANCER DAD
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
No wonder the Australian team had to go home through the back door in 2005 .....
Konovalov
12-22-06, 05:08 PM
:lol: :lol:
Well, well, well another batting collapse by England what a surprise not. :damn: I am getting bloody fed up with this batting collapse, get out there and fight to the last man and stopping farting around with batting collapses.
A good start by our bowling but there is a lot of work needed.
Score at the end of day 1 fourth test
England all out for 159
Australia 48-2
Congratulations to Shane Warne for his 700th test wicket. :up:
I'm not sure that the current Australian batting collapse is all that crash hot either. :damn:
Maybe they are all a bit sleepy after celbrating the Ashes win, Christmas and Warnes 700th?
Day 2 go off well with 5-84 for England then it all fell apart due to England's bowling plans were leaked to the press or they just got cocky, Australia is on 372-7. England is behind by 213 runs.
Normal service has been resumed with Australia leading by 151 runs. The Poms looking very wobbly on the 3rd day at 7/109 just after tea. Looking fardward to seeing them knocked out in the last session and a good shot at the Aussies taking a clean sweep of the series 5 nil.
Well it's now 2-0 to the Australians they won back the ashes now they have won the series, will it be a 3-0 as they wrap it up with a white wash? The chances look good for Australia. :yep:
PS: There has been no white wash in Australia since 1921, judging the Australian team I think they are about to change that bit of history.
Oh Knickers !!
Just when I thought it was safe to switch on the TV again . :nope:
Oh Knickers !!
Just when I thought it was safe to switch on the TV again . :nope:
Your OK until next Thursday when we do battle for the last time. I suspect the Australian fans will be handing out the white flags to the barney army over there.
Konovalov
12-28-06, 02:57 PM
Happy days boys. :sunny:
I went to bed last night thinking England will put up a fight having bowled Australia out quickly on the third morning. Instead of grafting out the next 2 and a bit sessions they folded and offered up to us the chance of a 5 to nil whitewash in Sydney next week. The only thing worse than the England batting collapse was the aftermatch excuses of coach Duncan Fletcher. Before this test match I had sympathy for England. They had dominated in Adelaide for 4 days and in Perth they showed some fight and ticker. But now I really hope that Australia blows them away in Sydney and then heaps more misery upon them in the one day series.
Happy new year. :D
baggygreen
12-31-06, 01:53 AM
Cant believe i didnt weigh into this thread sooner....
i got tickets to both days 2 and 3 down at the MCG and took the missus down to learn the game as well. Anyways, england were beyond disappointing - and i expected them to perform poorly. It was more than obvious that they didnt care and didnt even bother putting in any effort - i think the team, besides good ol' monty, have pulled a heart-string. He's popular with the crowds down here cos he at least has a go, he puts in and tries - which is more than the rest of the team combined.
I'm reminded of a song i heard some blokes singing to the Barmy Army on day 3.
"you've got the whole world in your team, you've got the whole world in your team.. etc"
and another
"you put your wicketkeeper in,
you put your wicketkeeper out,
you put your wicketkeeper in,
and you change your team about.."
:lol:
I think we need to get rid of this old boy tie network in the selectors to stand any chance of players coming though who did not have private education. Some improvements have been made, after all we are now second in the world rankings but we must improve more or face the situation of slipping back down the table.
I have been hearing from the Australian coach on the radio he and the team feel they have been let down by England's team as they made no real effort to defend the Ashes. And the Australian fans also feel let down by England's poor showing.
I have been hearing from the Australian coach on the radio he and the team feel they have been let down by England's team as they made no real effort to defend the Ashes. And the Australian fans also feel let down by England's poor showing.
Well they couldn't even challenge us to 3 full days of play in the Boxing Day test, the biggest test on the cricketing calendar.
Cricket Australia missed out on alot of money in refunding tickets, and 2 lost days of play.
A strange first day with a delayed start, 4 wickets not very many runs and an early finish due to bad light.
I'll be interested to see if England can stage any sort of revival to at least come away with one win.
Interesting article I read on the weekend saying that England may leave our shores without a win, based on the fact that they are a better test side than a one day side:
http://www.smh.com.au/news/news/england-faces-oneday-woes/2006/12/30/1166895523562.html
Interesting article I read on the weekend saying that England may leave our shores without a win, based on the fact that they are a better test side than a one day side:
http://www.smh.com.au/news/news/england-faces-oneday-woes/2006/12/30/1166895523562.html
This is true, justed checked the rankings
Test Match, England are second in the world.
One day International, England are eighth in the world
So looking forward to the one day games?:D
So looking forward to the one day games?:D
I'm not
White wash here we come.
I am sick of the BBC News crowing on that England is in with a chance to win the game, this is now the second time they have done it and just look at our score for the second innings, 114-5 12 runs ahead of Australia and two days to go. The BBC News are a bunch of plonkers.
Konovalov
01-04-07, 05:59 AM
So looking forward to the one day games?:D
I'm not
And it could be even worse if Flintoff has to go home because of his continued ankle problems. Vaughan to come back for the one day series and captain the side is almost a certainty. :hmm: He has had 3 or 4 innings with the England academy side in Perth and has not made a double figure score. Add to that the fact that in the one day game he has a less than spectatcular average and has as yet not scored an international one day hundred. And England's one day campaign prospects look even worse. Their most consistent one day performer and one of England's best two batsmen, Marcas Trescothick is back in England with a stress related illness that probably has ended his career. Add to that a man who was once the best bowler in the world at the top of the rankings, Steve Harmison who has retired from the one day game because he is scared of the white ball.
England should pull out of the one day comp on humanitarian grounds. :rotfl:
I hope Australia rip the guts out of England in the one day internationals. But of course when the axe falls it will fall on the players and not the old school tie selectors. :nope:
when the axe falls it will fall on the players and not the old school tie selectors. :nope:
Something you've picked up ? Care to expand on that ?
BTW What's the story on Saj Mahmood ? He doesn't seeem to be part of the team and doesn't seem interested.
horsa,
I have always notice the odd player here and there will be dropped from the team and yet the selectors always seem to get away with it. Too be fair to our team, there have been improvements and they need to keep working on those improvements, there must be players out there who are good and have not attended private schools.
It's about time the selectors woke up and moved on with the times, Yes it's true teams do have there up's and downs just look at South Africa and the West Indies they were 2nd and 3rd in the world and now you where they are, and yet in time they will pick up again and our selectors must make a note of this. I don't want to see England back down in it's usual spot of 7th in the world, I want want them up there in 2nd place and go out attacking and never give up even when the odds look bleak.
badhat17
01-04-07, 10:53 AM
Steed,
I don't know where you have got this old school tie nonsense from. As far as I know only three current England players attended public schools. If the standard of coaching at the state school I attended was anything to go by then having so many as eight state school educated players in the team is nothing short of a miracle.
The selectors can only pick the best from what is available, if those players are not good enough then they will get beaten by a better team. Australia are a better team.
I must admit it does sound like there’s a bit of stereotyping going on here. I’ve not done any research into the team’s educational background but I don’t get the feeling that the private schools are over-represented these days. I thought it was only certain Australians who still had this notion that the England team are a bunch of arrogant toffs who needed taking down a peg or two. Even someone like Mike Atherton, who was educated privately at Manchester Grammar School can hardly be said to be “privileged” in the sense that you seem to imply.
Ironically the English cricket team did better in the days when it WAS all amateur toffs. ( come back Douglas Jardine, where are you ?) I have to agree with Badhat about the chances of a cricketer developing from a state school background. Even when I was at school, many moons ago, cricket coaching was a joke - something that happened with the geography teacher for a couple of weeks between the bad weather early in the summer when everything was cancelled, and the school exams when everything stopped. Since my time things have only got worse. Politics have fostered a culture of non-competitiveness and many state schools have been forced to sell off many of their playing fields.
As to the current method of selection for the Ashes tour, David Graveney went on record recently as saying it was in the hands of Fletcher and Flintoff with “advice” from a management group of senior players. The only selector who is not a player is Fletcher himself. Whatever we may say about Fletcher and his decisions he is a professional man without any hint of school tie privilege. If the old school tie network was working Fletcher would never have got the job in the first place - he's Zimbabwean
Konovalov
01-04-07, 02:02 PM
Stereotype plain and simple.
The old school tie is still in the world of the selectors, yes it's true to say over the last two or three years there has been improvements to breakaway from that old out date thinking.
By moving forward we are now number two in the world, the England team still has two major problems the batting collapse and when they fall behind they seem to put up little of a fight. Look at how positive Australia are, the times we have had them on the ropes granted not many the result they fight back and we must adopt this thinking.
mr chris
01-04-07, 03:41 PM
The problem is that in Austrailia Sport is a massive thing from a early age and in schools. It is pushed to the forfront. There national sporting psyche is winning is everything and second place is not good enough and everything is geared towards this view. From as soon as you can pick up a cricket bat or play with a rugby ball you are told that winning is all. Trust me it works how long have the aussies had the best team in the world in cricket? How long have they been in the top teams in the world in both codes at rugby? The same is true of Swimming the list just goes on. The fact is that untill the powers that be in the UK start to inforce the same psyche we will be nothing but also rans. The Uk has become the home of the beautiful losser and untill the whole nation alters there thinking it will never get better.
The problem is that in Austrailia Sport is a massive thing from a early age and in schools. It is pushed to the forfront. There national sporting psyche is winning is everything and second place is not good enough and everything is geared towards this view. From as soon as you can pick up a cricket bat or play with a rugby ball you are told that winning is all. Trust me it works how long have the aussies had the best team in the world in cricket? How long have they been in the top teams in the world in both codes at rugby? The same is true of Swimming the list just goes on. The fact is that untill the powers that be in the UK start to inforce the same psyche we will be nothing but also rans. The Uk has become the home of the beautiful losser and untill the whole nation alters there thinking it will never get better.
That's hitting the nail on the head. :yep: :D
WHITEWASH!!!
That wraps it up for the Ashes. Will England rebound in the one day series or have they had the stuffing knowcked out of them for that as well?
I think Mr Chris has hit the nail on the head particularly in terms of the psyche of the Asutralian Cricket team. They have refused to be put into a losing position by the English and appear to have had enough talent at the right time to combat anything the poms have thrown at them.
Konovalov
01-05-07, 08:10 AM
Will England rebound in the one day series
No chance given past one day form and their pathetic ICC ranking.
Yes the knives are out on England and here's a small selection I have heard.
They should all hand back there MBE's
Sack the whole team and fined them
Sack the team and selectors
English cricket is dead
Don't come home you scumI don't agree with any of those remarks and I have heard some which were dreadful. :nope:
Well Done Australia you are the greatest team ever. :up:
mr chris
01-05-07, 08:53 AM
The is only one man who can save english cricket in my view. This man is the only one brave enough to make the hard choices that lay ahead. He is never afraid to speak his mind. This man is Beefy Botham.
I for one would move heaven and earth to get this man in the Setup it is are only chance, to get back to past glorys. He is a man in my opinon that does not live on past sucesses that the team do at the moment he is a guy that sees the big picture. He in my view is are only hope.:up:
The is only one man who can save english cricket in my view. This man is the only one brave enough to make the hard choices that lay ahead. He is never afraid to speak his mind. This man is Beefy Botham.
Good point there, we do need a man who is not afraid to speak out and get the job done. :yep:
Will England rebound in the one day series or have they had the stuffing knowcked out of them for that as well?
They had the stuffing knocked out of them on the final day of the Adelaide Test. There comes a point when a blow is so sickeningly final no amount of heroic talk of bouncing back, pride and "we must be positive" will have any real effect.
The is only one man who can save english cricket in my view. This man is the only one brave enough to make the hard choices that lay ahead. He is never afraid to speak his mind. This man is Beefy Botham.
My personal choice would be Nasser Hussain :hmm:
Mr Chris :The problem is that in Austrailia Sport is a massive thing from a early age and in schools. It is pushed to the forfront. There national sporting psyche is winning is everything and second place is not good enough ......... BadHat17 : If the standard of coaching at the state school I attended was anything to go by then having so many as eight state school educated players in the team is nothing short of a miracle
Heads, Australia win ... Tails, England lose.
Here’s a bit of cheap and cheerful hindsight
Australia would have won this series no matter what had happened differently. They are simply a much better team
The margin of victory was made greater by England’s unavoidable bad luck in losing several key players since 2005, consequently losing the winning habit, and some dodgy policy and selection decisions.
Before the series Australia were already beating everybody by a street, and England were already inconsistently lurching between poor and merely goodish.
English cricket is not dead, most of the England team are not spineless wonders and it is not the end of civilisation as we know it. They were just monumentally second best
badhat17
01-05-07, 06:26 PM
My personal choice would be Nasser Hussain :hmm:
Interesting pick. He certainly talks the talk, but could he walk the walk ?
I have been impressed with what DF has achieved with England, he has dragged us up from the depths to respectability. Maybe he has taken the team as far as he can and perhaps the set up has become jaded but I would not like to think we are about to throw away the baby along with the bathwater. However decision time is looming as Fletchers contract expires after the world cup if I am not mistaken.
To reach the level Australia compete at would require changes that are beyond the control of the ECB. Cricket is not the nations first sport by any measure and has to play second or perhaps even third fiddle to Football and Rugby. Where are the best English Cricketers you ask ? Playing Football mostly is the answer. While an average soccer player can pick up a six figure salary without that much drama, a county cricketer will often have to find a second income if he wants to bring home the national average.
At school level the game was allmost non existent twenty years ago and without school support then you can guess the result, well you don't have to guess actualy because it's all too visible now. Local clubs can only do so much, if the kids are not interested then they will not aproach the clubs at an age early enough to make a real difference.
My school had acres of beautifuly manicured playing fields including two cricket pitches one of which was up to county standard due to the fact that a council gardening works depot was situated right alongside the field. We also had an outdoors nets area. In five years I played one game on each of the two pitches and used the nets once. I should also point out that one of those games I played in involved me sat down on the grass for over an hour doing nothing more than watch my teams openers slay the other sides bowling to all parts of the field until I had the temerity to suggest to the teacher that perhaps we ( the batting side ) could make better use of this time by wandering over to the nets and having a session there while this went on. I don't know what happened in that match after that as I had earned myself a trip to see the headmaster. In the other match I took part in I at least got the chance to bat but never did field as the games were so badly organised. During the single net session there was never any such thing as coaching, we just did our own thing rightly or wrongly.
A few years after I left that school it was closed to no great suprise and the buildings were bulldozed while the playing fields went to seed. Twenty years later there has still been no development on the site, it is now pasture for a few horses.
My yeargroup from the village I lived in were unusualy passionate about cricket and the park saw a constant stream of ad hoc games progress until it came to our attention that the village actualy possessed a cricket club all of its own. The friendly bunch of old duffers who ran it were amazed as over a period of a few weeks about twenty lads turned up asking to join and were positively overjoyed when they discovered most of us could actualy play ! From struggling to field a single team one minute they found themselves with tricky selection problems the next as they struggled to decide who would be left out even with a second eleven joining the local leagues. Times were good and promotion followed promotion until that magical magical season when the village had their very own team competing in the Derbyshire Premier League. Success lifted the profile of the club considerably and consequently a higher standard of player became available, we even had an Aussie one season who could play allright but his drinking prowess was somewhat dissapointing.:D
And then the rain came.
The club played on a ground provided by a local company, it was supposed to be their sports ground but they had no organised teams so it was ours to use along with a local pubs sunday Football mob. The chairman of the local company had founded the village team years before and was quite a player himself. He was Cricket mad and quite a gent, was chairman of Derbyshire County Cricket Club for a few years which was how we came to be in possession of the most impressive scoreboard you would ever be likely to see on a village club ground as we inherited the old one from DCCC when they decided to have a new one. In the clubhouse/pavillion/old railway carriage hung a wonderfull photograph of the scoreboard showing us three hundred something for two after 40 overs, most of that score contributed by that dear old chap. Sadly by the mid 80s he was in declining health, along with that of his company, and then came the bombshell, Ken had died.
His children took the decision to sell the company along with the sportsground to property developers and we were out. We soldiered on for a few more years playing at a crabby place in another village a few miles away but it was hopeless as the players quickly drifted away. We did get a result with the old railway carriage though, turned out to be something rare and special so that was sold off for a remarkable sum considering it looked like firewood to me.
Both of these events conspired to rob our community of their Cricket facilities and I don't see them getting replaced any time soon. This story is not unique as you will hear similiar sorry tales up and down the country, sportsgrounds continue to be prime targets for greedy developers.
Despite all this England still manage to compete with the other test playing nations. Don't forget that in Pakistan and India the game is huge and India have an enormous player pool to draw from, Pakistan only a fraction the size of India but still more than double that of England. Children in India do not dream of being the next Beckham, they dream of Sachin. Nobody in Pakistan wishes to follow in the footsteps of Rooney, they are running in with Shoaib. These are fundamental problems that the ECB has to contend with and in my book they a doing allright.
I for one am looking forward to the West Indies tour this summer, bring it on !
An interesting and sad read. It has an all too familiar ring to it. You're right about development. In the little Yorkshire town down the road from where I live is a huge new Tesco complex - you've guessed it ... built over a beautiful little cricket ground. :-?
I hope this is making the Aussies cry a bit ;)
Yes the knives are out on England and here's a small selection I have heard.
They should all hand back there MBE's
...
They really shouldn't have been awarded them in the first place for winning one measly test series.
Talk about overdone.
JScones
01-06-07, 03:25 AM
Yes the knives are out on England and here's a small selection I have heard.
They should all hand back there MBE's
...
They really shouldn't have been awarded them in the first place for winning one measly test series.
Talk about overdone.
Yes, (and only half serious here) if a guy can get an MBE for playing one test and scoring a measly 17 runs in two innings (justified by "well, he 'supported' Pieterson" :roll:), I want to know where Australia's KNIGHTHOODS are!!! :rotfl:
After all, same Queen. ;) Surely she's not playing favourites??? :hmm:
Personally, I think England has a reasonable foundation with which to work. They simply need a strategist - or at least an adaptable tactician - to lead them on the field. That is, someone that demonstrates flexibility and can adapt to changing game situations, rather than stubbornly following the same plans, hour after hour, day after day, game after game.
Sacking Flintoff as captain is the best thing England can do - let him focus on his batting. Doing both is obviously too much for him and he seems to naturally struggle with being innovative.
Dunno what England can do about the tail end batting though - what was the average combined total for the last five wickets per innings? 35 runs or something? :hmm:
EDIT: Leaked English bowling plans for anyone that hasn't seen them... http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/cricket/england/6211691.stm And finally, the thief exposed... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlb_R2HHrO4/ (http://www.cricket.mailliw.com/archives/2006/12/27/englands-leaked-plans-thief-exposed/) :rotfl:
Well I be, after are whitewash we are still second in the world. :huh:
Test teams' rankings: Jan 8th 2007
1. Australia 135
2. England 114
3. Pakistan 112
4. India 107
5. Sri Lanka 102
6. South Africa 98
7. New Zealand 93
8. West Indies 72
9. Zimbabwe 28
10. Bangladesh 2
Konovalov
01-09-07, 04:40 AM
That table seems to reflect the current state of Test match cricket. It is Australia then the rest but I expect Australia to come back towards the pack some way.
At the moment in the 20/20 one day match Australia won the toss and batted. After 14.2 overs Australia are 5 for 155. Can they make the 200 plus mark? :D
Konovalov
01-09-07, 06:49 AM
At the moment in the 20/20 one day match Australia won the toss and batted. After 14.2 overs Australia are 5 for 155. Can they make the 200 plus mark? :D
Silly me. Of course they made 200. 221 to be precise for just the loss of 5 wickets. England in reply could only muster a pathetic and limp 144 for 9 and in the last 7 overs Australia dropped a couple of dolly catches and missed a easy stumping as if they couldn't care knowing they had the game won only half way into Englands innings. What a sorry and sad state of affairs for team England. Thankfully Australia batted first so the crowd got some entertainment. :-?
I've just worked out why England have picked a 100 year old wicket keeper for this match and the one day series. It is all about protecting the young guys from mental scarring at the hands of the Aussies. Paul (retirement home) Nixon is expendable and a human shield. :lol: :lol:
20/20 cricket is a joke, I hate it because the whole aspect of it is so crass. To sum up cheap and nasty. :down:
Konovalov
01-09-07, 09:35 AM
20/20 cricket is a joke, I hate it because the whole aspect of it is so crass. To sum up cheap and nasty. :down:
I have to disagree. Despite the fact that Test Match cricket is my favourite form of the game and I try to watch every session of every five days I really think that 20/20 has something to offer for both players and spectators.
A couple of years ago I went to see a game of 20/20 between Surrey and Middlesex at Lord's. The entertainment value was great and you got to see the whole game in 3.5 hours which is really handy for workers who can finnish at 5 or 5:30pm and then get down to the ground. As for the players it allows fielders to improve their ground fielding and throwing. Bowlers learn how to bowl at the death with yorkers and variation.
Finally if the concept brings more people to cricket that otherwise would never have considered it then that is a good thing. :up:
20/20 mickey mouse cricket. :rotfl:
bookworm_020
01-09-07, 07:44 PM
You wouldn't say that if England won it!!
Twenty20 sucks.
It is a pure gimmick.
As seen by the nicknames, instead of actual names on the Aussie jerseys and in the telecast graphics. And also by NSW playing Rugby league legend Andrew Johns in it's 20/20 team.
And we all have the English counties to thank for it.
snowsub
01-09-07, 10:17 PM
Twenty20 cricket may be a gimmick at the moment, but I can see the day when it's taken more seriously, not compared to ODI's and tests, but as a stand-alone event (especially for TV) it's got a lot going for it.
But they're going to have to keep separate the stats of the players from it (twenty20) and "proper" international cricket.
I can also see it being more interesting to non-cricketing nations than say trying to sway them with a 5 day test match that ends in a draw :lol:
baggygreen
01-10-07, 01:17 AM
Whether or not you're in the camp of it improving players skills or worsening them, you cant argue that its entertaining.
NSW vs QLD in the 20/20 up at the Gabba the other day drew in more people to spectate than the entire sheffield shield comp to date! Last night was a sellout at the SCG as well.
Bottom line is that it suits people today, you can go watch an entire game in a few hours, plenty of big 6s and whatnot to keep em happy, and more to the point - while the crowds are happy, the administrators are happy, because you get more money that way!
You wouldn't say that if England won it!!
I will. :yep: :know:
baggygreen
01-10-07, 05:17 AM
thats ok bookworm, we wont have to test out steeds 'staunchness' for a while yet, i think its gonna take some time before england win anyting!
20/20 may be all right for the 16 year olds who want to get in to cricket but for first class cricket it's a no, no in my book. Give me test and one day international any day of the week, nearly forgot the world cup as well.
baggygreen
01-10-07, 07:14 AM
Thing is tho steed, watching the crowd at the SCG it was such a massive mix! personally i like one dayers the most, but i do think the game has stumbled onto a good thing - provided official stats etc are kept seperate
Konovalov
01-12-07, 04:41 AM
Could the news possibly get any worse for England on this tour of Australia? Of course it can. It has just been reported that Kevin Pieterson has been ruled out now for the entire of the one day series having suffered a broken rib during Englands innings in the first one day match at the MCG this afternoon.
Pieterson gave England a respectable score of 8 for 242 off it's allocation of 50 overs. Unfortunately for England the other bad news is that Australia are showing England how one day cricket is played. Currently the Aussies are placed in a dominant position at 2 for 170 after 30 overs. They are in cruise control now with only 70 required from 20 overs still with 8 wickets in hand. This game is well and truly over. The only question is if we can score the winning runs within 40 overs to attain the bonus point. :hmm:
England are wimps, if an Australian broke a couple of ribs he would still play on. :rotfl:
PS: We lost the first one day international what a surprise, not. :doh:
bookworm_020
01-14-07, 06:28 PM
I'm sure the rest of the English players are looking for ways to get injured, so they can go home at get some sympathy when they arrive.
Hope Pieterson is better soon. At least there would be a greater chance of England winning a match (most likely against the Kiwi's)
Konovalov
01-16-07, 08:58 AM
Finally over night England won a game on the tour of Australia and no surprise that it came against the Kiwis down in Tassie. Congratulations England. :lol:
And we go on to play Australia in the final. :damn:
Doesn't all this suggest that England are not THAT bad, and it's been the ferocious skill and application of Australia that's demolished them.
Konovalov
01-16-07, 11:42 AM
England are that bad when it comes to the one-day form of the game. While I am of the opinion that there is no need to panick with the Test team it is not the same with the one-day side. The statistics and hotch potch England selection policy are shocking as evidenced by the following:
The 30 players in England's provisional squad have scored 12 one-day international centuries between them, and that includes Vikram Solanki, who scored two and has long since been jettisoned. Australia, India, New Zealand, South Africa, Sri Lanka and West Indies have all at least one current batsman who has made more one-day hundreds off his own bat than England's entire squad.
Of its past 23 internationals, excluding one against Ireland and a rained-off "no result" against Pakistan, it has won five and lost 18.
In its past 23 games, England has been bowled out 13 times, and has bowled out the opposition three times.
In its past 23 internationals, England has reached 250 a lame seven times which by todays standards is well below par. 10 or 15 years ago that would have been seen as a good score but not today. By the way, Trescothick was the only guy to score a century during this 23 game period and his career seems over now thanks to illness.
During the same period of 23 matches where only one English batsmen managed a hundred the opposition teams managed 12 of them.
Looking at the batting further we can see that in the past 23 internationals England's batsmen have scored 507 fours, the opposition 556 fours; while England has hit 37 sixes and the opposition 58. The most recent England batsman to hit a six, apart from Pietersen, was Chris Read last September, eight internationals ago.
I would applaud Duncan Fletcher and the selectors for the progress made in Test cricket. But quite frankly it is just not good enough for a country that has been playing one day cricket since the early sixties to be so bad at the game. The only two teams below England in the ICC one-day rankings are Bangladesh, Zimbabwe, and Kenya.
England are that bad when it comes to the one-day form of the game.
Indeed they are .
When you add that they have just been demoralised by one of the most severe kickings in history, it is all the more remarkable to get this result in the form of the game they are demonstrably bad at.
bookworm_020
01-16-07, 05:05 PM
I predicted that they would win against New Zealand! If you think England has a problem getting kids playing cricket instead of football, try getting them away from rugby union in NZ!
Konovalov
01-16-07, 05:21 PM
If you think England has a problem getting kids playing cricket instead of football, try getting them away from rugby union in NZ!
And sheep. :lol:
I see we lost against Australia yet again. :lol:
Konovalov
01-19-07, 08:09 AM
I see we lost against Australia yet again. :lol:
Yes, but the bowling was much better this time. Despite the fact that we got a bonus boint for winning by such a margin, in no way was the win convincing. England can draw some strong positives from the game. :yep:
WHAT DID YOU SAY!!!! :o
Is this the begining of the turn around and the rebuilding of England, come 2009 we are going to thrash the Australians with a greater white wash. :hmm:
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