After Action Report: Nelson, Rodney, King George V Vs. Bismarck and Prinz Eugen

Sledgehammer427 · 06-25-09, 03:32 AM

*Surface Warfare Mod Teaser*
The scenario started simply enough, A line of British ships and a line of German ships, both heading east. Spaced by about 5 km. I was in command of the Nelson, mostly along for the ride, but I gave the occaisional directional command to make sure i could bare all my guns.
A cool pic I got of the Nelson.

The Eugen goes down (Goodnight Prinz?)

Bismarck Under Fire

The KGV got the worst of it.

The end of the Bismarck

Tally:
minor/no damage to Nelson & Rodney
King George V out of action, slight list to starboard

Bismarck, Sunk
Prinz Eugen, Sunk, ablaze

ubootcomrade · 06-25-09, 11:07 AM

My want for this mod now borders on that of sexual lust.

ivank · 06-25-09, 12:51 PM

@ UBOOTCOMRADE:

@Shammer427: great pictures

polyfiller · 06-26-09, 06:41 AM

So - Shammer - did the balance of the engagement feel right ? What I mean is did the ships take damage in the way / rate you expected. I guess Rodney & KGV v Bismark & PrinZ would result in PE sunk and probably Bismark (but not until ong after PE) ... also no surpise KGV got mauled - in RLhad Bismark laid any accurate fire at either, there would have been a muach harder fight for the RN ships.

Also did you like the way the ships took damage and sunk ?

Sledgehammer427 · 06-26-09, 10:37 AM

It felt well balanced, but the Bismarck refused to sink!
also, the Nelson (my BB) got nailed a few times with some of the Bismarcks after batteries, but showed no real damage, I figured it shoulda have started a fire or something.
I just put up a good picture of the bow looking like the Bismarck was going under, because it was basically dead and the water was up to the decks, but she wasnt sinking, so I got up close and pulverised her with everythying I had until I ran out of ammo. Still didnt sink. I called it a moral victory

But you should have seen the Bismarck!
the upperworks were covered in shell marks!

eljeffo41 · 06-26-09, 11:12 AM

Actually the Bismark refusing to sink is pretty accurate from a historical standpoint ,didn't a British destroyer finish it with a torpedo attack?

polyfiller · 06-26-09, 11:31 AM

Shammer - I'll take a look at the damage model ....but last time I ran KGV & Rodney v Bismark & PE, Bismark sank quite nicely (took a longtime though).

Sailor Steve · 06-26-09, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eljeffo41

Actually the Bismark refusing to sink is pretty accurate from a historical standpoint ,didn't a British destroyer finish it with a torpedo attack?

That's been a point of discussion for almost 70 years. The British torpedoed her, the Germans scuttled her. The ranking survivor once said "To both of you I say 'Yes, you sank us'".

ivank · 06-26-09, 03:07 PM

We need to add a 3d damage model to those ships

Tomi_099 · 06-30-09, 03:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sledgehammer427

*Surface Warfare Mod Teaser*
The scenario started simply enough, A line of British ships and a line of German ships, both heading east. Spaced by about 5 km. I was in command of the Nelson, mostly along for the ride, but I gave the occaisional directional command to make sure i could bare all my guns.
A cool pic I got of the Nelson.
-----------------

The Eugen goes down (Goodnight Prinz?)

Bismarck Under Fire

The KGV got the worst of it.

The end of the Bismarck

Tally:
minor/no damage to Nelson & Rodney
King George V out of action, slight list to starboard

Bismarck, Sunk
Prinz Eugen, Sunk, ablaze

---------------------

Absolutely great projects!!

iambecomelife · 06-30-09, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eljeffo41

Actually the Bismark refusing to sink is pretty accurate from a historical standpoint ,didn't a British destroyer finish it with a torpedo attack?

Hey - credit where due! (Just kidding.) It was the "HMS Dorsetshire", a cruiser, that sank the wreck (assuming it wasn't the scuttling charges).

mickeyg · 03-01-10, 08:44 PM

I have been a keen follower of naval warfare for about 45 years , coming from a naval and shipbuilding background , my father and Gt G/father were in the merchant service and my mother and G/F from her side worked at Vickers Armstrong in WW2 and my Gt/G/F on my mothers side , made the 16" guns on the HMS Nelson ( well his team ) , All I have done is read books .
Through all the forums and hypothesis I have read over the decades about the KM, IJN and the RN , is that after the Washington Treaty on Battleship size , The Germans and the Japanese decided they would not comply and built Super-dreadnoughts , while the Brits worked within the confines of this treaty , So basically the KM and the IJN cheated , pure and simple , like a motor race where in say the 2 litre class , someone enters a 3 litre car and hopes to win , without being found out !
Despite all of the Axis forces huge ships they still lost and got a hiding into the bargain , The Bismarck was no great advancement in design , 44 minutes after the engagement with Rodney and KGV , she was finished . The PoW was still active after her encounter with Bismarck as Bismarck`s shells were no match for her armour and although hit 7 times was really no worse for wear, whereas Bismarck hit 3 times by PoW had to find a port as she was taking on water , It doesnt matter about "the Bismarcks " armour belt not being pierced etc , She was out of the the fight in 44 mins and she sank ,end of story , she go hit 400 times , no Armour is going to save you .
Reports of sailors noting that Bismarcks Armour was in tact are pure fantasy , imagine 16" shells being fired at you at point blank range , are you going to check the armour belt before you abandon ship !
KVG was the best class of battleship in WW2 , there was 5 built, the deck armour was good as was the side , The Scharnhorst couldn't land a direct hit on DoY and an 11" shell would`nt have been much of a concern to her , Graf Spee cound`nt knock out 3 small criusers in the early days of the war so the 11" gun was no better than a 6" against an amoured Battleship .RN wins KM loses . Simple .

kms bismarck · 08-11-16, 05:09 AM

How could you sail the Nelson... Could you send me a link? Becouse I would really love to sail that ship!

06-25-09, 03:32 AM	#1
Sledgehammer427 PacWagon Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Drinking coffee and staring at trees in Massachusetts Posts: 2,901 Downloads: 280 Uploads: 0	After Action Report: Nelson, Rodney, King George V Vs. Bismarck and Prinz Eugen Surface Warfare Mod Teaser The scenario started simply enough, A line of British ships and a line of German ships, both heading east. Spaced by about 5 km. I was in command of the Nelson, mostly along for the ride, but I gave the occaisional directional command to make sure i could bare all my guns. A cool pic I got of the Nelson. The Eugen goes down (Goodnight Prinz?) Bismarck Under Fire The KGV got the worst of it. The end of the Bismarck Tally: minor/no damage to Nelson & Rodney King George V out of action, slight list to starboard Bismarck, Sunk Prinz Eugen, Sunk, ablaze __________________ Cold Waters Voice Crew - Fire Control Officer Cmdr O. Myers - C/O USS Nautilus (SS-168) 114,000 tons sunk - 4 Spec Ops completed V-boat Nutcase - Need supplies? Japanese garrison on a small island in the way? Just give us a call! D4C!

06-25-09, 11:07 AM	#2
ubootcomrade Planesman Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 194 Downloads: 27 Uploads: 0	My want for this mod now borders on that of sexual lust. __________________ Oh dear, I appear to have defecated on your doorstep.

06-25-09, 12:51 PM	#3
ivank The Old Man Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Huntington, Long Island, New York Posts: 1,426 Downloads: 284 Uploads: 0	@ UBOOTCOMRADE: @Shammer427: great pictures __________________ Head of The Surface Warfare Super-Mod Team Leutnant z. S. David U. Ziegler U-105 IXB On Patrol 1

06-26-09, 10:37 AM	#5
Sledgehammer427 PacWagon Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Drinking coffee and staring at trees in Massachusetts Posts: 2,901 Downloads: 280 Uploads: 0	It felt well balanced, but the Bismarck refused to sink! also, the Nelson (my BB) got nailed a few times with some of the Bismarcks after batteries, but showed no real damage, I figured it shoulda have started a fire or something. I just put up a good picture of the bow looking like the Bismarck was going under, because it was basically dead and the water was up to the decks, but she wasnt sinking, so I got up close and pulverised her with everythying I had until I ran out of ammo. Still didnt sink. I called it a moral victory But you should have seen the Bismarck! the upperworks were covered in shell marks! __________________ Cold Waters Voice Crew - Fire Control Officer Cmdr O. Myers - C/O USS Nautilus (SS-168) 114,000 tons sunk - 4 Spec Ops completed V-boat Nutcase - Need supplies? Japanese garrison on a small island in the way? Just give us a call! D4C!

06-26-09, 11:12 AM	#6
eljeffo41 Seaman Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Las Vegas,Nevada Posts: 36 Downloads: 318 Uploads: 0	Actually the Bismark refusing to sink is pretty accurate from a historical standpoint ,didn't a British destroyer finish it with a torpedo attack? __________________ The man at the wheel was taught to feel contempt for the wildest blow. It often appeared when the weather had cleared he'd been in his bunk below!

06-26-09, 06:41 AM	#4
polyfiller Weps Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 356 Downloads: 40 Uploads: 0	So - Shammer - did the balance of the engagement feel right ? What I mean is did the ships take damage in the way / rate you expected. I guess Rodney & KGV v Bismark & PrinZ would result in PE sunk and probably Bismark (but not until ong after PE) ... also no surpise KGV got mauled - in RLhad Bismark laid any accurate fire at either, there would have been a muach harder fight for the RN ships. Also did you like the way the ships took damage and sunk ?

06-26-09, 11:31 AM	#7
polyfiller Weps Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 356 Downloads: 40 Uploads: 0	Shammer - I'll take a look at the damage model ....but last time I ran KGV & Rodney v Bismark & PE, Bismark sank quite nicely (took a longtime though).

06-26-09, 03:07 PM	#9
ivank The Old Man Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Huntington, Long Island, New York Posts: 1,426 Downloads: 284 Uploads: 0	We need to add a 3d damage model to those ships __________________ Head of The Surface Warfare Super-Mod Team Leutnant z. S. David U. Ziegler U-105 IXB On Patrol 1

03-01-10, 08:44 PM	#12
mickeyg Bilge Rat Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 1 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Bismarck and Tirpitz I have been a keen follower of naval warfare for about 45 years , coming from a naval and shipbuilding background , my father and Gt G/father were in the merchant service and my mother and G/F from her side worked at Vickers Armstrong in WW2 and my Gt/G/F on my mothers side , made the 16" guns on the HMS Nelson ( well his team ) , All I have done is read books . Through all the forums and hypothesis I have read over the decades about the KM, IJN and the RN , is that after the Washington Treaty on Battleship size , The Germans and the Japanese decided they would not comply and built Super-dreadnoughts , while the Brits worked within the confines of this treaty , So basically the KM and the IJN cheated , pure and simple , like a motor race where in say the 2 litre class , someone enters a 3 litre car and hopes to win , without being found out ! Despite all of the Axis forces huge ships they still lost and got a hiding into the bargain , The Bismarck was no great advancement in design , 44 minutes after the engagement with Rodney and KGV , she was finished . The PoW was still active after her encounter with Bismarck as Bismarck`s shells were no match for her armour and although hit 7 times was really no worse for wear, whereas Bismarck hit 3 times by PoW had to find a port as she was taking on water , It doesnt matter about "the Bismarcks " armour belt not being pierced etc , She was out of the the fight in 44 mins and she sank ,end of story , she go hit 400 times , no Armour is going to save you . Reports of sailors noting that Bismarcks Armour was in tact are pure fantasy , imagine 16" shells being fired at you at point blank range , are you going to check the armour belt before you abandon ship ! KVG was the best class of battleship in WW2 , there was 5 built, the deck armour was good as was the side , The Scharnhorst couldn't land a direct hit on DoY and an 11" shell would`nt have been much of a concern to her , Graf Spee cound`nt knock out 3 small criusers in the early days of the war so the 11" gun was no better than a 6" against an amoured Battleship .RN wins KM loses . Simple .

08-11-16, 05:09 AM	#13
kms bismarck Swabbie Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 13 Downloads: 125 Uploads: 0	Sail the Nelson? How could you sail the Nelson... Could you send me a link? Becouse I would really love to sail that ship!