[REL] Realistic Sinking Physics - Page 23

WernerSobe · 08-09-07, 12:07 AM

lol ok ive got a fix you wont believe.

I thought the last chance would be to use the backup files and see if that still happens with unmodded compartment layout and same compartment parameters. Guess what? It did not happen. So the problem was in compartment layout and i started looking at the diferences.

The first thing that jumped in my eyes was that fuel bunkers in original files are very small (smaller then lifeboats). Ive found it odd and increased their dimentions to a more realistic size. So now ive changed the fuel bunkers in my layouts back to original "small" size. The problem disappeared...

It realy doesnt make sence but it works.

Another interestning find. Ive been also looking into ship files from 1.1 to find out what they have changed and why and i remembered seing bigger fuel bunkers. I wondered why they have changed their size to some unrealistic value. Now i know hehe. Looks like Ubi have been working on that problem too and that was their fix. Maybe its a serious problem and that was the easiest way to fix it i dont know. The game seems to crush only those compartments that are bigger then lifeboats :-). Anyway i know how to fix it for my ships that matters...

tater · 08-09-07, 12:08 AM

I'm one who thinks the big explosion is pretty ugly. I guess that's why the small craft explode as well?

tater

WernerSobe · 08-09-07, 12:16 AM

hm i havent been looking into small crafts. Do they?

well the explosion effect can be easily changed for every single ship. Or could be completely removed for small ships like pt boats.

tater · 08-09-07, 12:24 AM

I was looking at fishing boats, etc. Sink a fishing boat and it looks like it's an ammo ship, lol.

BTW, there are some smaller ships worth looking into as well, some not japanese in the stock game but none the less very useful.

The trawler (and armed trawler). The tug, the NF_boat, and the fishing boats.

The sampans and junks also blow up. It seems like those would be the least likely do do so in the entire game. The catch on fire from AP hits, too.

WernerSobe · 08-09-07, 12:29 AM

well sofar ive been ignoring ships that are smaller then small old split merchant. I thought it was a waste of time because youre basicly trying to sink bigger stuff then sampans. Actualy i never sink them.

I always tried to avoid them because tweaking them would endanger the balance for small merchants since they were partly using same parameters. Of course now i could separate the parameters but thats to much work to be honest just for the sampan. Maybe in future release but for now i need to finish the merchants and all the warships. Thats realy lots of work. One ship takes me up to 6 hours.

tater · 08-09-07, 12:33 AM

Gotcha. Makes sense.

I guess I could go the "old" RSP way and up their hitpoints and force them to sink by flooding. Might be better than the Nth round making them explode when the hitpoints are zero.

switch.dota · 08-09-07, 01:22 AM

Please leave the sampans alone. They are about the only boat you can sink with AA fire. And the only reason i ever use my AA ammo

tater · 08-09-07, 01:39 AM

They'd still sink, it's just absurd that they explode.

Leaving them wallowing or burning is perfectly fine. Read real reports, and they decided that the best thing was bombs. First they made molotov cocktails, then they got real charges, it was easier than using the deck gun.

tater

switch.dota · 08-09-07, 01:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tater

They'd still sink, it's just absurd that they explode.

Leaving them wallowing or burning is perfectly fine. Read real reports, and they decided that the best thing was bombs. First they made molotov cocktails, then they got real charges, it was easier than using the deck gun.

tater

In-game, 20mm fire is unlikely to cause REAL damage to sampans & fishing boats. Also, ingame we have no grenade launchers.

billko · 08-09-07, 07:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WernerSobe

<snip>Thats realy lots of work. One ship takes me up to 6 hours.

Is that it? Just six hours? Where's your sense of dedication to the project???Grrr... Just kidding!

As far as I'm concerned, I'm nominating you for Medal of Honor!

Bill

tater · 08-09-07, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by switch.dota

Quote:

Originally Posted by tater

They'd still sink, it's just absurd that they explode.

Leaving them wallowing or burning is perfectly fine. Read real reports, and they decided that the best thing was bombs. First they made molotov cocktails, then they got real charges, it was easier than using the deck gun.

tater

In-game, 20mm fire is unlikely to cause REAL damage to sampans & fishing boats. Also, ingame we have no grenade launchers.

20mm in game can sink a SUB.

Regardless, if the armor value is low, it will make holes, and water will come in.

switch.dota · 08-09-07, 08:11 AM

Well TM 1.4 20mm fire from merchants don't seem to do anything to my little Salmon class. I surfaced inbetween 3 merchants and ate 20mm rounds for 6 hrs till the last merchant sunk.

tater · 08-09-07, 08:14 AM

It takes a lot, but it happens. I have been testing the 20mm vs subs lately. It happens very fast with double and triple 25mm mounts, but you need to be hit quite a bit.

None the less, in RL small craft were sometimes surprisingly hard to sink. I for one don't like console game mode where you put a couple rounds in it and it blows up like an ammo ship. YMMV.

Bill Nichols · 08-09-07, 10:29 AM

1 torp and the Large European Liner is immediately reported as going down. Is that the intended behavior with this mod?

WernerSobe · 08-09-07, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Nichols

1 torp and the Large European Liner is immediately reported as going down. Is that the intended behavior with this mod?

youve been lucky

08-09-07, 10:29 AM	#344
Bill Nichols Master of Defense Join Date: Mar 2000 Posts: 1,502 Downloads: 125 Uploads: 0	1 torp and the Large European Liner is immediately reported as going down. Is that the intended behavior with this mod? __________________ My Dangerous Waters website:

08-09-07, 12:07 AM	#331
WernerSobe Commodore Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 625 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	lol ok ive got a fix you wont believe. I thought the last chance would be to use the backup files and see if that still happens with unmodded compartment layout and same compartment parameters. Guess what? It did not happen. So the problem was in compartment layout and i started looking at the diferences. The first thing that jumped in my eyes was that fuel bunkers in original files are very small (smaller then lifeboats). Ive found it odd and increased their dimentions to a more realistic size. So now ive changed the fuel bunkers in my layouts back to original "small" size. The problem disappeared... It realy doesnt make sence but it works. Another interestning find. Ive been also looking into ship files from 1.1 to find out what they have changed and why and i remembered seing bigger fuel bunkers. I wondered why they have changed their size to some unrealistic value. Now i know hehe. Looks like Ubi have been working on that problem too and that was their fix. Maybe its a serious problem and that was the easiest way to fix it i dont know. The game seems to crush only those compartments that are bigger then lifeboats :-). Anyway i know how to fix it for my ships that matters...

08-09-07, 12:08 AM	#332
tater Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New Mexico, USA Posts: 9,023 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 2	I'm one who thinks the big explosion is pretty ugly. I guess that's why the small craft explode as well? tater

08-09-07, 12:16 AM	#333
WernerSobe Commodore Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 625 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	hm i havent been looking into small crafts. Do they? well the explosion effect can be easily changed for every single ship. Or could be completely removed for small ships like pt boats.

08-09-07, 12:24 AM	#334
tater Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New Mexico, USA Posts: 9,023 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 2	I was looking at fishing boats, etc. Sink a fishing boat and it looks like it's an ammo ship, lol. BTW, there are some smaller ships worth looking into as well, some not japanese in the stock game but none the less very useful. The trawler (and armed trawler). The tug, the NF_boat, and the fishing boats. The sampans and junks also blow up. It seems like those would be the least likely do do so in the entire game. The catch on fire from AP hits, too.

08-09-07, 12:29 AM	#335
WernerSobe Commodore Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 625 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	well sofar ive been ignoring ships that are smaller then small old split merchant. I thought it was a waste of time because youre basicly trying to sink bigger stuff then sampans. Actualy i never sink them. I always tried to avoid them because tweaking them would endanger the balance for small merchants since they were partly using same parameters. Of course now i could separate the parameters but thats to much work to be honest just for the sampan. Maybe in future release but for now i need to finish the merchants and all the warships. Thats realy lots of work. One ship takes me up to 6 hours.

08-09-07, 12:33 AM	#336
tater Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New Mexico, USA Posts: 9,023 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 2	Gotcha. Makes sense. I guess I could go the "old" RSP way and up their hitpoints and force them to sink by flooding. Might be better than the Nth round making them explode when the hitpoints are zero.

08-09-07, 01:22 AM	#337
switch.dota Captain Join Date: May 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 492 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Please leave the sampans alone. They are about the only boat you can sink with AA fire. And the only reason i ever use my AA ammo

08-09-07, 01:39 AM	#338
tater Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New Mexico, USA Posts: 9,023 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 2	They'd still sink, it's just absurd that they explode. Leaving them wallowing or burning is perfectly fine. Read real reports, and they decided that the best thing was bombs. First they made molotov cocktails, then they got real charges, it was easier than using the deck gun. tater

08-09-07, 08:11 AM	#342
switch.dota Captain Join Date: May 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 492 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Well TM 1.4 20mm fire from merchants don't seem to do anything to my little Salmon class. I surfaced inbetween 3 merchants and ate 20mm rounds for 6 hrs till the last merchant sunk.

08-09-07, 08:14 AM	#343
tater Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New Mexico, USA Posts: 9,023 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 2	It takes a lot, but it happens. I have been testing the 20mm vs subs lately. It happens very fast with double and triple 25mm mounts, but you need to be hit quite a bit. None the less, in RL small craft were sometimes surprisingly hard to sink. I for one don't like console game mode where you put a couple rounds in it and it blows up like an ammo ship. YMMV.