Strike on North Korea - Page 75

Rockstar · 05-01-18, 02:30 PM

lol mention leaving Europe/NATO and everyone gets their panties in a bunch over that idea. But but but Russia! Putin! The Evil Empire! They'll get us if you leave. The U.S. accounts for almost half of the world’s military expenditures and provides defense guarantees to prosperous, populous allies throughout Asia and Europe. Wandering the globe attempting to create democracy and stability out of nothing. At the same time we're propping up dictatorships in the Persian Gulf and Central Asia.

Maybe it is time to let others take care of themselves. Maybe instead of being in everyone else's business we should start acting as a true Great Power. Rather than seeking to control everything and manipulate everyone overseas, we should go home and get on with life. Put a red box on the front door that says 'Break Glass in Case of Emergency"

Better yet. A sign that says:

Jimbuna · 05-01-18, 05:25 PM

So....a return to isalationism?

August · 05-01-18, 05:52 PM

Don't worry guys the Democrats got this!

em2nought · 05-01-18, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

Don't worry guys the Democrats got this!

Anything to make Trump look bad, who cares about the consequences.

How about instead of calling it a return to Isolationism (which I don't recall ever having hurt us) we call it a return to "Speak softly, and carry a big stick."

vienna · 05-01-18, 06:13 PM

Unmitigated bull. The website shown it the upper right-hand corner of the picture is that of a news parody site, a source of genuine fake news. So, either you are being sarcastic, ironic, or perhaps you have been duped...

Technically, the premise given in the phony picture is valid. Trump cannot, on his own, end the Korean War. There are several parties who are signatories to the Korean Armistice Agreement (there is not actual "peace treaty", yet) and all must give their 'OK' to any final treaty, so Trump could not act unilaterally and declare peace; additionally, any peace treaty must be ratified by 2/3rds of the US Senate and any effort to circumvent that Constitutional provision would be, in fact, un-Constitutional, and, perhaps, an impeachable offense...

Long story short: unless there is a very sudden ramping up in governmental speed by all parties involved, it is going to be a long time before a final treaty is completed...

...certainly past the time of Trump's impeachment...

<O>

Skybird · 05-01-18, 06:18 PM

Economically, isolationism does nto work well in a world where the US depends absolutely on foreign investors buyin g US bonds, where the dollar and other Fiat currecny regimes rule and are seen as vital of not getting their masks teared down, and globalised production chains and globalised economy. Also, much of America'S power is soft power, and an important share of that spoft power comes in form of IT dominance - which again works and unfolds globally only.

Military isolationism is linked to these economic interests, they need to be militarily defended.

The US imports more than it exports I think, like almost every major empire before, the centre is ever increasing its dependency not only on the controlled periphery, but even on that what lies behind that periphery, and the economical influx from there.

If isolation is America'S option, it cannot just move to, it needs preparation by redesigning the whole economical structure of the US. And that will take more time than just one or two legislation periods. It can be done, I think. But not as easily and quickly as many think, or the staff in the Donaldinarium desires. Plus it leaves the stage to hostile factions like China, Russia, the Islamic world - and the US it will be prone to them growing strong.

Its not as if the others stop pushing just because America maybe chooses to stop wanting to contain them. History teaches that empires cannot afford to not react to challenges on their peripheral borders or their central cultural, economical, social structures. Where they do, they start to decline, and finally fall apart.

vienna · 05-01-18, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by em2nought

...

How about instead of calling it a return to Isolationism (which I don't recall ever having hurt us) we call it a return to "Speak softly, and carry a big stick."

Interestingly, the oft-cited quote by TR is, as so many other 'snippet' quotes, lacking in full context. The TR quote first appeared in a letter sent by TR to Henry L. Sprague, on January 26th 1900. Here is a link about the quote:

http://wist.info/roosevelt-theodore/16285/

Of further interest in the full quote are these admonitions by TR regarding the "Big Stick" and those who would use it:

Quote:

"Right here let me make as vigorous a plea as I know how in favor of saying nothing that we do not mean, and of acting without hesitation up to whatever we say. A good many of you are probably acquainted with the old proverb, 'Speak softly and carry a big stick — you will go far.' If a man continually blusters, if he lacks civility, a big stick will not save him from trouble, and neither will speaking softly avail, if back of the softness there does not lie strength, power. In private life there are few beings more obnoxious than the man who is always loudly boasting, and if the boaster is not prepared to back up his words, his position becomes absolutely contemptible. So it is with the nation. It is both foolish and undignified to indulge in undue self-glorification, and, above all, in loose-tongued denunciation of other peoples. Whenever on any point we come in contact with a foreign power, I hope that we shall always strive to speak courteously and respectfully of that foreign power."

Kinda sounds a bit like he could be referring to our current "Blusterer/Boatser-In-Chief"...

<O>

Jimbuna · 05-09-18, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Three Americans released by North Korea ahead of Trump-Kim talks, US president announces

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-44056972

Most welcome news but not all that surprising when taking the current climate and expected meeting in the near future into account.

Onkel Neal · 05-09-18, 11:06 AM

Break your own news? Is that fake news?

STEED · 05-09-18, 11:16 AM

Quote:

North Korea releases detained Americans ahead of anticipated Trump ...
Reuters UK-2 hours ago
Pompeo in North Korea ahead of Trump-Kim talks
BBC News-13 hours ago
Ahead of Trump-Kim Summit, North Korea Releases 3 American ...
The Diplomat-1 hour ago
North Korea frees 3 American prisoners ahead of a planned Trump ...
In-Depth-Washington Post-3 hours ago
The Latest: Trump 'appreciates' Kim's release of 3 Americans
Live Updating-Kansas City Star-24 minutes ago

Google news search.

vienna · 05-09-18, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal

Break your own news? Is that fake news?

As fake as it gets...

http://breakyourownnews.com/

I hear the Alt-Right and the Trumpers love it...

<O>

Onkel Neal · 05-09-18, 01:05 PM

Well, to be fair, liberals and Dems have CNN, NPR, and the Washington Post

Mr Quatro · 05-09-18, 01:07 PM

I like this goodby

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-n...-idUSKBN1IA08I

Quote:

North Korean official was quoted as saying “You should make care that they do not make the same mistakes again,” and that “This was a hard decision.”

vienna · 05-09-18, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal

Well, to be fair, liberals and Dems have CNN, NPR, and the Washington Post

Oh, you mean the sites that actually have researched reportage?...

Speaking of fake news, did anyone else happen to see the fiasco over the alleged 'official' questions Mueller was supposed to want to ask Trump? After the list was 'leaked' and Trump and his minions expressed their outrage over the "disgraceful" leak, it turned out Trump's own legal team actually leaked the alleged list, and, what's more, the list wasn't even officially from the Mueller team, it was from a list compiled by a member of the Trump legal team who had compiled, based on his 'analysis' of possible questions Mueller might ask Trump. Somehow the Trumpers didn't seem to be in a hurry to clean their own house of leakers or disseminators of actual fake news. I guess that old double standard and blatant hypocrisy of "The Swamp" is alive and well, and thriving, over at the White House...

<O>

Reece · 05-09-18, 07:04 PM

Funny that the three detainees are Kim's!!

05-01-18, 02:30 PM	#1111
Rockstar Rear Admiral Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Zendia Bar & Grill Posts: 11,849 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	lol mention leaving Europe/NATO and everyone gets their panties in a bunch over that idea. But but but Russia! Putin! The Evil Empire! They'll get us if you leave. The U.S. accounts for almost half of the world’s military expenditures and provides defense guarantees to prosperous, populous allies throughout Asia and Europe. Wandering the globe attempting to create democracy and stability out of nothing. At the same time we're propping up dictatorships in the Persian Gulf and Central Asia. Maybe it is time to let others take care of themselves. Maybe instead of being in everyone else's business we should start acting as a true Great Power. Rather than seeking to control everything and manipulate everyone overseas, we should go home and get on with life. Put a red box on the front door that says 'Break Glass in Case of Emergency" Better yet. A sign that says: __________________ Guardian of the honey and nuts Let's assume I'm right, it'll save time.

05-01-18, 05:25 PM	#1112
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 181,284 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	So....a return to isalationism? __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!! GWX3.0 Download Page - Donation/instant access to GWX (Help SubSim)

05-01-18, 05:52 PM	#1113
August Wayfaring Stranger Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 22,674 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Don't worry guys the Democrats got this! __________________ Flanked by life and the funeral pyre. Putting on a show for you to see.

05-01-18, 06:13 PM	#1115
vienna Navy Seal Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Anywhere but the here & now... Posts: 7,507 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	Unmitigated bull. The website shown it the upper right-hand corner of the picture is that of a news parody site, a source of genuine fake news. So, either you are being sarcastic, ironic, or perhaps you have been duped... Technically, the premise given in the phony picture is valid. Trump cannot, on his own, end the Korean War. There are several parties who are signatories to the Korean Armistice Agreement (there is not actual "peace treaty", yet) and all must give their 'OK' to any final treaty, so Trump could not act unilaterally and declare peace; additionally, any peace treaty must be ratified by 2/3rds of the US Senate and any effort to circumvent that Constitutional provision would be, in fact, un-Constitutional, and, perhaps, an impeachable offense... Long story short: unless there is a very sudden ramping up in governmental speed by all parties involved, it is going to be a long time before a final treaty is completed... ...certainly past the time of Trump's impeachment... <O> __________________ __________________________________________________ __ Last edited by vienna; 05-01-18 at 06:32 PM.

05-01-18, 06:18 PM	#1116
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 40,517 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	Economically, isolationism does nto work well in a world where the US depends absolutely on foreign investors buyin g US bonds, where the dollar and other Fiat currecny regimes rule and are seen as vital of not getting their masks teared down, and globalised production chains and globalised economy. Also, much of America'S power is soft power, and an important share of that spoft power comes in form of IT dominance - which again works and unfolds globally only. Military isolationism is linked to these economic interests, they need to be militarily defended. The US imports more than it exports I think, like almost every major empire before, the centre is ever increasing its dependency not only on the controlled periphery, but even on that what lies behind that periphery, and the economical influx from there. If isolation is America'S option, it cannot just move to, it needs preparation by redesigning the whole economical structure of the US. And that will take more time than just one or two legislation periods. It can be done, I think. But not as easily and quickly as many think, or the staff in the Donaldinarium desires. Plus it leaves the stage to hostile factions like China, Russia, the Islamic world - and the US it will be prone to them growing strong. Its not as if the others stop pushing just because America maybe chooses to stop wanting to contain them. History teaches that empires cannot afford to not react to challenges on their peripheral borders or their central cultural, economical, social structures. Where they do, they start to decline, and finally fall apart. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

05-09-18, 11:06 AM	#1119
Onkel Neal Born to Run Silent Join Date: Jan 1997 Location: Cougar Trap, Texas Posts: 21,289 Downloads: 534 Uploads: 224	Break your own news? Is that fake news? __________________ SUBSIM - 26 Years on the Web

05-09-18, 01:05 PM	#1122
Onkel Neal Born to Run Silent Join Date: Jan 1997 Location: Cougar Trap, Texas Posts: 21,289 Downloads: 534 Uploads: 224	Well, to be fair, liberals and Dems have CNN, NPR, and the Washington Post __________________ SUBSIM - 26 Years on the Web

05-09-18, 07:04 PM	#1125
Reece CINC Pacific Fleet Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Down Under Posts: 32,767 Downloads: 171 Uploads: 0	Funny that the three detainees are Kim's!! __________________ *Sub captains go down with their ship!*