Does depth ping give away my position?

Bl00dCat · 10-16-13, 01:10 PM

I'm playing SH3+GWX campaign, and, due to stock depth map which definitely was made by some Allies or Soviet agent, I have to ping my exact depth under keel very often. This raises a question: can enemy ASW ships actually hear this ping in GWX? Cause some recent game situations make me suspect they can't.

Pisces · 10-16-13, 01:14 PM

This is indeed true. They don't react to it. It's a shame, but the way it is. But you can always do make-believe.

Jimbuna · 10-16-13, 02:06 PM

I've always considered this to be one of the biggest failings in the AI.

jreid666 · 10-16-13, 06:46 PM

I have to say that once in gwx i constantly pinged to try to get an escort to break away from a convoy so i could attack it and it seemed to work. either that or they heard something else in my vicinity

desirableroasted · 10-16-13, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jreid666

I have to say that once in gwx i constantly pinged to try to get an escort to break away from a convoy so i could attack it and it seemed to work. either that or they heard something else in my vicinity

Nope... just happenstance.

I've just accepted it and do not ping if I am in a situation where I could not surface and fire off the deck gun into the sky.

There is a lot in the game that someone put in as a good idea, but that was never followed up on. The helmsman qualification, for example. Does nothing whatsoever.

Oleander · 10-16-13, 08:53 PM

It makes me wonder if someone is able to make it count as a sonar ping without the range estimate since that's essentially what it is.

irish1958 · 10-17-13, 07:50 AM

Sonar is much less effective in shallow water and in areas with ship wreaks and other underwater debris, but the game does not model this. The sonar ping not being heard kind of evens the score.
Later in the war, subs took advantage of this defect in sonar and hunted the British coast in shallow water.
See Stiebler's4A_V16B1_Addon Patch readme for a discussion.

Bl00dCat · 11-01-13, 03:46 PM

So, just to make it completely clear: enemy ships can't hear my ping at all, or they can get alerted by it but can't pinpoint the direction it was coming from, or they don't get alerted but CAN take ping direction if sub is suspected nearby?

Jimbuna · 11-01-13, 04:45 PM

Enemy ships can't hear your active pings.

jonmar · 11-01-13, 05:04 PM

I wish I hadn't read this thread.

Jimbuna · 11-02-13, 04:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jonmar

I wish I hadn't read this thread.

Yeah, a few have said that in the past when little known immersion killers are revealed.

BigWalleye · 11-02-13, 06:23 AM

Robbins said it best: Realism isn't about the settings. It's about how you play the game.

11-02-13, 06:28 AM

- Echolot/sonar ping, gramophone can't be heard by ASW.
- Seafloor sitting can't help to hide yourself from being pinged.
- You can be heard by ASW through the land.
- Dud explosions does no impact on ASW behaviour.
- Impossible to mask engine sound of u-boat underneath a cargo ship.
- ASW has no smoke screen defence mechanism.
- ASW Huff Duff system is not working at all.

flag4 · 11-02-13, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jonmar

I wish I hadn't read this thread.

well. don't then

Leitender · 11-05-13, 03:04 AM

Quote:

stock depth map which definitely was made by some Allies or Soviet agent

Quote:

It's a shame

Quote:

biggest failings

Are you sure that they could? I mean, not theoretically, but in reality? And if so, did they do it? Up to now, I´ve never read anything about ASW units that hear any pings from enemy u-boats. So I don´t believe that they did. Imho with good reason: They already had their own reliable sonar system. Why should the sonar operator waste his time for searching pings if he could get bearing and distance with his own asdic/sonar?

The really great Jerry Proc site

http://jproc.ca/sari/asd_gen.html

tells a lot about asdic, but no word is lost about enemy sonar pings. The only possibility I see is random discovery. But afaik, the german u-boats barely used their horizontal sonar (S-Gerät) because optical information was more precise at that time, and, well, the maps were good enough

so normally there was no need to measure the depth.

Ingame, I Although use the vertical sonar (echolot) very often to get the depth, but always without another ship in sight. Then I plot the depth into my map, so i´m always aware about possible evasion manoeuvres. To be sure about the depth, I use the echolot when crash diving. At that time, the enemy normally knows my positon, so there´s no disadvantage when using it.

10-16-13, 01:10 PM	#1
Bl00dCat Watch Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Russia, just north of Caspian Sea Posts: 17 Downloads: 20 Uploads: 0	Does depth ping give away my position? I'm playing SH3+GWX campaign, and, due to stock depth map which definitely was made by some Allies or Soviet agent, I have to ping my exact depth under keel very often. This raises a question: can enemy ASW ships actually hear this ping in GWX? Cause some recent game situations make me suspect they can't.

10-16-13, 02:06 PM	#3
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 181,180 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	I've always considered this to be one of the biggest failings in the AI. __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!! GWX3.0 Download Page - Donation/instant access to GWX (Help SubSim)

10-17-13, 07:50 AM	#7
irish1958 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Carmel, Indiana Posts: 3,250 Downloads: 320 Uploads: 11	Sonar is much less effective in shallow water and in areas with ship wreaks and other underwater debris, but the game does not model this. The sonar ping not being heard kind of evens the score. Later in the war, subs took advantage of this defect in sonar and hunted the British coast in shallow water. See Stiebler's4A_V16B1_Addon Patch readme for a discussion. __________________ Irish1958

11-01-13, 04:45 PM	#9
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 181,180 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	Enemy ships can't hear your active pings. __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!! GWX3.0 Download Page - Donation/instant access to GWX (Help SubSim)

10-16-13, 01:14 PM	#2
Pisces Silent Hunter Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: AN9771 Posts: 4,892 Downloads: 300 Uploads: 0	This is indeed true. They don't react to it. It's a shame, but the way it is. But you can always do make-believe.

10-16-13, 06:46 PM	#4
jreid666 Helmsman Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: fraserburgh Posts: 104 Downloads: 296 Uploads: 0	I have to say that once in gwx i constantly pinged to try to get an escort to break away from a convoy so i could attack it and it seemed to work. either that or they heard something else in my vicinity

10-16-13, 08:53 PM	#6
Oleander Machinist's Mate Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 126 Downloads: 474 Uploads: 0	It makes me wonder if someone is able to make it count as a sonar ping without the range estimate since that's essentially what it is.

11-01-13, 03:46 PM	#8
Bl00dCat Watch Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Russia, just north of Caspian Sea Posts: 17 Downloads: 20 Uploads: 0	So, just to make it completely clear: enemy ships can't hear my ping at all, or they can get alerted by it but can't pinpoint the direction it was coming from, or they don't get alerted but CAN take ping direction if sub is suspected nearby?

11-01-13, 05:04 PM	#10
jonmar Bosun Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 61 Downloads: 86 Uploads: 0	I wish I hadn't read this thread.

11-02-13, 06:23 AM	#12
BigWalleye Sea Lord Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: On the Eye-lond, mon! Posts: 1,987 Downloads: 465 Uploads: 0	Robbins said it best: Realism isn't about the settings. It's about how you play the game.

11-02-13, 06:28 AM	#13
sailor_X Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	- Echolot/sonar ping, gramophone can't be heard by ASW. - Seafloor sitting can't help to hide yourself from being pinged. - You can be heard by ASW through the land. - Dud explosions does no impact on ASW behaviour. - Impossible to mask engine sound of u-boat underneath a cargo ship. - ASW has no smoke screen defence mechanism. - ASW Huff Duff system is not working at all.