Active sonar is KILLING ME (literally) - how to survive it in this game?

[XanderF]

Basically as above. Playing a bunch of the missions, and it's frustrating as you spawn into the mission and *immediately* are hearing active pings from the enemy. Moments later, torpedoes in the water nearby from missile drops.

It's not...impossible to survive their attack that always starts every encounter, but you sure aren't in a position to return fire with any effect.

Any suggestions?

[CDR DPH]

If you speed across the map using the left mouse button, when you enter combat (visible or invisible targets) the enemy already knows you are there. Try positioning yourself so that the enemy bumps into to you while you are motionless on the map (best) or at the very least when moving using the right mouse button. The very first thing you do when an engagement starts is go ultra quiet. Do not take time to sneeze or go get a cup of coffee, get quiet, and see if you need to move to break detection. Coming to all stop in addition to ultra quiet can further reduce your detectability while you assess the situation.

If you allow aircraft or satellites to pass over your boat when traversing the map, you'll notice the enemy begin to close on your position - they know you are there and are coming to kill you - pinging like mad.

Classify your targets either manually or using the radar or periscope (be quick with these as using them makes it easier to find you). Check the data on the signature page for the contact. Positive numbers mean they can see you. If this is the case, you need to lose their track. Constant pings mean crews are loading weapons soon to be delivered with intent.

Enemies talk to each other. If one knows you are there, they all do. If aircraft locate you, they tell the ships who then tell the subs and vice versa.

When the enemy fires down your bearing, you have lots of time to avoid the torpedo before it goes active, but you must act quickly and decisively. If being shot at, your priority is to avoid the inbound weapons and hide again, not go sailing into the firestorm. Subs will eventually lose against a concerted air/sea attack. Subs have to play the long game if they wish to survive or they fire everything they have and run away as fast as they can to avoid the return fire that is certain to come. Cycle through F3 weapon views. If you see inbound airdropped torpedoes you have minutes not hours to move your sub from where you are to somewhere other than where those torpedoes will enter the water.

There are tactics subs can employ to minimize the danger of return fire when the enemy detects inbound weapons, but those are not what you are referring to in your post.

The single biggest necessity for a sub to survive an engagement is to kill the enemy without them ever knowing for certain exactly where the sub is.

If you are dropped into an engagement and the enemy already knows you are there, you are doing something wrong.

[XanderF]

Interesting - didn't realize that about the map movement making a difference on contact. In-game training sessions didn't cover that part.

It doesn't help a lot with the 'single missions', though - I've come to the conclusion that the 'Against the Odds' mission is basically impossible. LOL

I did try switching over to the 1968 period rather than the mid-80s I was more interested in, and have to say - it's a LOOOOOT easier. I mean, my own weapons are ****e of course, but at least the entire enemy fleet isn't constantly banging away with active sonar immediately and no missile-dropped torpedoes to worry about. It feels a lot easier to watch and manage the enemy sensor strength to get a good approach in '68. (And I guess coming from so much time in WW2 sims, "end around to intercept position and fire wide torpedo spread" is second nature enough that it's easy-mode when you've got a nuc powerplant rather than diesel-electric....)

[CDR DPH]

Escort ships protecting merchants in a convoy are always actively looking for submarines. Just because you can hear (see) their sonar pings does not mean they are getting a return from your sub. The numbers in the signature panel will tell you if active sonar from a particular target is likely to be showing your position.

Active sonar is all about distance, layers and the shadow zone. Passive sonar, is a different beast and is listening for noise that can identified as a target. Usually the passive towed arrays are what find you first with subs. Ships are noisy and easy to find so they aren't so concerned with stealth but are more interested in finding you and preventing you from having the time to target them first.

At least that's the way it's supposed to be. :-)

[XanderF]

I get that, but still...

Tried out the 84 campaign again, today...orders on a surface convoy. Okay, keeping in mind your pointers on the map - got myself in position in front of them, no overflights, slow maneuvering and then stopping...annnnnd...CONTACT! Great!

Mission starts and...I've actually got range on the target! Fantastic! IMMEDIATELY drop to 1 knot to improve solution and reduce detection, pick the closest (looking) contact, it's a Udaloy, and...oh, 10 seconds in and he's already got me at 15 signal strength on his active sonar and....yyyyeah, there's the missile coming at me.



(To be fair, your tip on positioning on the strategic map did help - at least I was able to get a decent long range on the convoy, and even classify the closest contact before it was able to get the missile off, so...a solid 5 seconds more reaction time than I was getting before, but I mean...)

[Aktungbby]

XanderF! after a seven year silent run!