US Politics Thread 2016-2020

[Skybird]

"The enemy is overwhelming!..................................... .................................................. ..........But I will conquer him!"



by: Stuttman, Der Tagespiegel

[vienna]

This article explains the appointment of the Special Counsel, his purview, and his background information:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...e8c_story.html

It is interesting to note the Deputy Attorney General, Rod J. Rosenstein, acting in place of the recused AG, Jeff Sessions, apparently made the decision on his own and the Trump Administration had no knowledge of the appointment until about 30 minutes before the public announcement. It appears, also, the DOJ, under Rosenstein, is asserting its independence forcefully and publicly...



<O>

[Skybird]

And this article whispers about president Pence.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...t-trump-238525

Question is whether Pence really is that good a choice either. When people start to defame evolution theory on the grounds of religious beliefs, I start to feel a terrible itching in both my brain hemispheres. Not to mention the damage such leadership could mean for the already shaken education sector. He might know better the rules of the game than Trump does, but whether he indeed would play the game for the better, is something I would not be so certain of.

Plus he agreed to work for Trump. Everybody willing to subordinate himself to somebody like Trump, in my book is a burned name, forever.

[Rockstar]

What I find interesting in the WAPO article.

"My decision is not a finding that crimes have been committed or that any prosecution is warranted. I have made no such determination."

The investigation is now official which ought to shut people up for awhile. Anything said hereafter by those not directly involved with the investigation stems from their unqualified imagination.

Except for the political hacks, fanboys and blowhards it should be kinda quite now.

[August]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Everybody willing to subordinate himself to somebody like Trump, in my book is a burned name, forever.

I'm curious, does that hate also extend to the 62 million people who voted to put him in that chair?

[Platapus]

18 USC section 4 addresses Misprision of a felony. In its basic form it establishes a separate felony for someone who does not report a crime they witness. It is rarely prosecuted due to some SCotUS rulings.

The code states.

Whoever, having knowledge of the actual commission of a felony cognizable by a court of the United States, conceals and does not as soon as possible make known the same to some judge or other person in civil or military authority under the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.

What this law attempts to establish is a mandatory duty of a citizen to report a felony. The SCotUS ruled in Marbury v. Brooks, 20 U.S. [7 Wheat.] 556, 5 L. Ed. 522. that while it is desirable for every citizen to have a duty to report felonies, to have a law that punishes a citizen for not reporting a crime is unreasonable.

Because of this case and other cases, almost all of the states have abandoned their misprision laws and those few states that still have them rarely prosecute for them. The reason is that the SCotUS ruled that in order for the federal government to successfully prosecute someone for Misprision of a Felony, the government must prove all of the following elements of the crime.


(1) another person actually committed a felony;
(2) the defendant knew that the felony was committed;
(3) the defendant did not notify any law enforcement or judicial officer;
(4) the defendant took affirmative steps to conceal the felony.


It is the last element that is the tricky part. It is not enough that a person knows of a felony but that they take affirmative steps to conceal the felony. Affirmative steps do not include passively not reporting it.

So can Comey's actions quality for Misprision? Lets re-examine the elements of the crime.


1. another person actually committed a felony

a. We don't know if Trump actually committed a felony. Lacking that Comey can't have committed Misprison. Misprison is usually a later charge after the felon is brought to trial. It is tough to start with Misprison.

b. If we think that Comey did commit Misprision then we also must think that Trump is guilty of committing the felony. You can't have Comey guilty without having Trump guilty.

2. the defendant knew that the felony was committed

a. The felony of obstructing justice may not have been committed when Trump asked (in an official manner) Comey to stop the investigation. Just the asking, even in an official manner may have been a weak case to make.

b. But after Comey was fired in a manner that Comey may reasonably expect to be because of his non acceptance of the asking; that may have been when the felony was egregiously committed. Asking someone to stop an investigation is wrong, firing them because they refuse is really wrong.

3. the defendant did not notify any law enforcement or judicial officer;

a. The crime of Misprison is not commonly levied on law enforcement personnel. There is no expectation that a police officer, knowing that a crime may have been committed has a duty to immediately let another police officer know. The fact that a law enforcement officer knows him or herself that a felony has been committed is enough.

b. Comey, being the Director of the FBI, himself would qualify as notifying a law enforcement officer. He is one of the top federal law enforcement officers in the country. In addition Comey did notify other FBI officers of his concerns.


4. the defendant took affirmative steps to conceal the felony.

a. There does not seem to be any evidence that Comey tried to conceal this felony action. If Comey had destroyed his notes or told the other FBI officers to forget what he said, that would be an affirmative action of concealment.


b. With the crime of Misprison of a Felony, the time between knowledge and reporting is not defined. One would have to prove the position that Comey waited an unreasonably long time and it would be up to the courts to decide whether it was reasonable or unreasonable.

Based on this, 18 USC section 4 Misprison of a Felony would be a very hard charge to prove against Comey.

[ikalugin]

Originally Posted by vienna

It's all Greek to me...




<O>

Leader of Israel called Putin. This is circumstancial evidence supporting the hypothesis that Trump disclosed classified information he got from Israel.

Originally Posted by Platapus

lots of law-talk

Are you a lawyer/into law in any way?
Sure sounds like it.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by August

I'm curious, does that hate also extend to the 62 million people who voted to put him in that chair?

It certainly is no compliment for them, to say the least.

Their often existing dissapointment and feeling to be lost behind may be explainable, but it is no excuse to fall for somebody like this. Plus they are often suffering form circumstances that were polticall created by posers the same people have voted for before, in past decades.

Its 62 million arguments in favour of Jason Brannon's latest broadside against having general elections at all.

"The instinct of worship is still so strong upon us that,
having nearly worn out our capacity for treating kings
and such kind of persons as sacred, we are ready to
invest a majority of our own selves with the same kind
of reverence."
Auberon Herbert

^ And that is a very stupid thing to do.

And btw, it is no "hate" for Trump that I feel, even if you claim that. It is utmost contempt. Thats is something very different.

[August]

Originally Posted by Skybird

And btw, it is no "hate" for Trump that I feel, even if you claim that. It is utmost contempt. Thats is something very different.

"Hate" and "utmost contempt" are the same thing Skybird. But then again you knew that...

Originally Posted by August

"Hate" and "utmost contempt" are the same thing Skybird. But then again you knew that...

*sigh*

No, they are absolutely not - unfortunately you don't know that.
Hate is no synonym of contempt, they are related, yes, but not interchangeable and differ in meaning/level of severity indeed.

Originally Posted by Skybird

It certainly is no compliment for them, to say the least.

Their often existing dissapointment and feeling to be lost behind may be explainable, but it is no excuse to fall for somebody like this. Plus they are often suffering form circumstances that were polticall created by posers the same people have voted for before, in past decades.

Its 62 million arguments in favour of Jason Brannon's latest broadside against having general elections at all.

"The instinct of worship is still so strong upon us that,
having nearly worn out our capacity for treating kings
and such kind of persons as sacred, we are ready to
invest a majority of our own selves with the same kind
of reverence."
Auberon Herbert

^ And that is a very stupid thing to do.

And btw, it is no "hate" for Trump that I feel, even if you claim that. It is utmost contempt. Thats is something very different.

Excellent post!

[u crank]

Originally Posted by Skybird

It certainly is no compliment for them, to say the least.

Their often existing disappointment and feeling to be lost behind may be explainable, but it is no excuse to fall for somebody like this.

It was a tough choice. I think that had the other candidate won the level of corruption in Washington DC would have went off the scale.

[Buddahaid]

Originally Posted by u crank

It was a tough choice. I think that had the other candidate won the level of corruption in Washington DC would have went off the scale.

You'd have to invent a new scale to measure the scale of the old scale's scale, I think.

[August]

Originally Posted by Buddahaid

You'd have to invent a new scale to measure the scale of the old scale's scale, I think.

The cost of the blue-chip commission they'd create to study it would be like 3-4 of the old scales just by itself.