GR2 Editor/Viewer/Extractor/Importer - Page 157

TheDarkWraith · 03-12-14, 12:21 PM

Changing a mesh's bone binding does not change it's (mesh) name or vice versa. Names were defined by the original exporter and the app is only doing what the pointers inside the GR2 file are telling it to do.

I would suggest giving everything new unique names so you 'override' what the original exporter assigned to everything. Doing that will then have things making 'sense' to you.

Targor Avelany · 03-12-14, 12:40 PM

Thank you TDW. I'll try this today and let you know.

TheDarkWraith · 03-12-14, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Targor Avelany

Thank you TDW. I'll try this today and let you know.

How did you make out

Targor Avelany · 03-13-14, 11:17 AM

Not sure. I don't know where is the link between bones/meshes is. I assumed that it was done through binding, but now I don't know.

You can test the same thing on the chrysler building gr2.

If I rename a bone - the mesh's name will change and vice versa. That is without moving meshes bindings.

If I just change the names of all the meshes the first time I open the file with GR2 Editor - the corresponding bone names will be adjusted automatically. And vice versa. Always.

I guess what I'm wondering is this: if meshes and particular bones linked in a way that we still do not know, what is the purpose of bone binding?

Another question I have is what are those types of bones. If you open the chrysler building gr2 you will see that the there are two collision bones: one in root and another attached to the first one (hierarchy wise). Two of them have a very different set of settings and properties.

TheDarkWraith · 03-13-14, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Targor Avelany

Not sure. I don't know where is the link between bones/meshes is. I assumed that it was done through binding, but now I don't know.

You can test the same thing on the chrysler building gr2.

If I rename a bone - the mesh's name will change and vice versa. That is without moving meshes bindings.

If I just change the names of all the meshes the first time I open the file with GR2 Editor - the corresponding bone names will be adjusted automatically. And vice versa. Always.

I guess what I'm wondering is this: if meshes and particular bones linked in a way that we still do not know, what is the purpose of bone binding?

Another question I have is what are those types of bones. If you open the chrysler building gr2 you will see that the there are two collision bones: one in root and another attached to the first one (hierarchy wise). Two of them have a very different set of settings and properties.

The link between bones and meshes (a mesh's bone bindings) is for where the bounding box is located on the mesh. The position of the bone(s) it's bound to determines where all the bounding boxes reside in 3D space.

If you rename a bone and a mesh's name also changes that means they have the same string pointer. Maybe I didn't provide a way to override the same string pointer

If so that would be why you can't provide unique names to everything you're wanting.

Targor Avelany · 03-13-14, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDarkWraith

The link between bones and meshes (a mesh's bone bindings) is for where the bounding box is located on the mesh. The position of the bone(s) it's bound to determines where all the bounding boxes reside in 3D space.

If you rename a bone and a mesh's name also changes that means they have the same string pointer. Maybe I didn't provide a way to override the same string pointer

If so that would be why you can't provide unique names to everything you're wanting.

Now that actually makes a lot of sence. I really appreciate the explanation, it helps greatly. So, if I don't need the bounding box to act anywhere, I can have the actual meshes bound to the root bone by default withot having to figure out a separate bone for them?

And my last question from my previous post. I know it is possibly something simple, but I would appreciate some help with understanding it.

gap · 03-13-14, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Targor Avelany

If I rename a bone - the mesh's name will change and vice versa.

Yep, this also happened to me while renaming pantelleria.GR2's bones. This had never happened before (when I was working on other GR2 files) but I thought that it was a new GR2 Editor feature rather than a particularity of that file

Quote:

Originally Posted by Targor Avelany

Another question I have is what are those types of bones. If you open the chrysler building gr2 you will see that the there are two collision bones: one in root and another attached to the first one (hierarchy wise). Two of them have a very different set of settings and properties.

Noticed the same in pantelleria.GR2

I retained the last bone as "collision bone" and set it as a child of main model's bone, but just in case I didn't remove the old parent bone (though it is now unused).

Targor Avelany · 03-13-14, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap

Yep, this also happened to me while renaming pantelleria.GR2's bones. This had never happened before (when I was working on other GR2 files) but I thought that it was a new GR2 Editor feature rather than a particularity of that file

Noticed the same in pantelleria.GR2

I retained the last bone as "collision bone" and set it as a child of main model's bone, but just in case I didn't remove the old parent bone (though it is now unused).

That might explain my many issues with collision for the MK17 mine model that I have had. To be honest, the real reason I want to understand this is if there are different types of bones and I will work on IX model I want to know what should go where, in simple words. Which bones I should clone for which purposes.

gap · 03-13-14, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Targor Avelany

That might explain my many issues with collision for the MK17 mine model that I have had.

Which stock GR2 file have you used as template for your mine unit?
After importing the new meshes, have you checked that their bounding box is centered around the model? The other day I and TDW were speculating if this wasn't the cause of your problems with collision detection

Targor Avelany · 03-13-14, 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap

Which stock GR2 file have you used as template for your mine unit?
After importing the new meshes, have you checked that their bounding box is centered around the model? The other day I and TDW were speculating if this wasn't the cause of your problems with collision detection

chrysler_building.gr2

And yes, I have checked the bounding boxes and spheres.

One thing I noticed is that if you bind a mesh to an incorrect bone or somehow bugger up a bone when you changing it's name (most of the time happened in older versions), the mesh would completely disappear and not show with the bone in Goblin Editor. I have multiple examples of tested gr2 files where the bones/meshes just vanished into the air. But are still visible and accessable, most of the time, in GR2 file.

I'm going to play more with the newest version and see what I can figure out over the weekend. My schedule is still pretty crazy, but I miss this way too much.

gap · 03-13-14, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Targor Avelany

chrysler_building.gr2

And yes, I have checked the bounding boxes and spheres.

One thing I noticed is that if you bind a mesh to an incorrect bone or somehow bugger up a bone when you changing it's name (most of the time happened in older versions), the mesh would completely disappear and not show with the bone in Goblin Editor. I have multiple examples of tested gr2 files where the bones/meshes just vanished into the air. But are still visible and accessable, most of the time, in GR2 file.

The "location" GR2 files that we are currently experimenting with, have some crazy transform data position offsets applied to their bones and to the model itself. You should zero those offsets before importing the new meshes, or any sort of weird things can happen to mesh and/or bounding boxe's positions: if one of those elements is rendered far away from the scene center, you will likely think that it has disappeared, whereas it is still there but hidden from your view.
Old GR2 Editor versions were unable to edit model's transform data (only bone's transform data was editable), but this has changed with one of the most recent versions of TDW's program

Targor Avelany · 03-13-14, 12:52 PM

thank you, gap

This opens up a lot of fun options

gap · 03-16-14, 08:41 PM

@ TDW

Hi TDW, I want to edit Room_CR.GR2.
On opening it, GR2 editor throws the following message:

********* Pointer to TrackGroups was not found for Animation in pointers *********

The above error doesn't seem a fatal one though, as GR2 Editor keeps loading the file, and the file validator doesn't report anything wrong (no broken chains, file not "possibly corrupt").
Question: is is safe to keep editing the file and saving the changes?

Targor Avelany · 03-17-14, 10:40 AM

Well, same story as before: I cannot get the collision working. I don't remember if I sent files to you, gap, but I'm going to send it when I get home today. Maybe you will be able to figure it out. I will try and find another base mesh to use and see if it will work out.

gap · 03-18-14, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Targor Avelany

Well, same story as before: I cannot get the collision working. I don't remember if I sent files to you, gap, but I'm going to send it when I get home today. Maybe you will be able to figure it out. I will try and find another base mesh to use and see if it will work out.

Hi Targor,
sorry for the belated answer

You never sent me your files. I am going to change continent again in lesser than two weeks, but if you send your mine model my way, I will be glad to have a look into it.
But don't forget to send it to TDW and privateer as well: four brains are better than two.

03-16-14, 08:41 PM	#2353
gap Navy Seal Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: CJ8937 Posts: 8,214 Downloads: 793 Uploads: 10	@ TDW Hi TDW, I want to edit Room_CR.GR2. On opening it, GR2 editor throws the following message: ******* Pointer to TrackGroups was not found for Animation in pointers ******* The above error doesn't seem a fatal one though, as GR2 Editor keeps loading the file, and the file validator doesn't report anything wrong (no broken chains, file not "possibly corrupt"). Question: is is safe to keep editing the file and saving the changes? __________________ _____________________ \|May the Force be with you!\| ...\/

03-12-14, 12:21 PM	#2341
TheDarkWraith Black Magic Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 11,962 Downloads: 147 Uploads: 5	Changing a mesh's bone binding does not change it's (mesh) name or vice versa. Names were defined by the original exporter and the app is only doing what the pointers inside the GR2 file are telling it to do. I would suggest giving everything new unique names so you 'override' what the original exporter assigned to everything. Doing that will then have things making 'sense' to you.

03-12-14, 12:40 PM	#2342
Targor Avelany Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada Posts: 1,183 Downloads: 225 Uploads: 0	Thank you TDW. I'll try this today and let you know.

03-13-14, 11:17 AM	#2344
Targor Avelany Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada Posts: 1,183 Downloads: 225 Uploads: 0	Not sure. I don't know where is the link between bones/meshes is. I assumed that it was done through binding, but now I don't know. You can test the same thing on the chrysler building gr2. If I rename a bone - the mesh's name will change and vice versa. That is without moving meshes bindings. If I just change the names of all the meshes the first time I open the file with GR2 Editor - the corresponding bone names will be adjusted automatically. And vice versa. Always. I guess what I'm wondering is this: if meshes and particular bones linked in a way that we still do not know, what is the purpose of bone binding? Another question I have is what are those types of bones. If you open the chrysler building gr2 you will see that the there are two collision bones: one in root and another attached to the first one (hierarchy wise). Two of them have a very different set of settings and properties.

03-13-14, 12:52 PM	#2352
Targor Avelany Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada Posts: 1,183 Downloads: 225 Uploads: 0	thank you, gap This opens up a lot of fun options

03-17-14, 10:40 AM	#2354
Targor Avelany Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada Posts: 1,183 Downloads: 225 Uploads: 0	Well, same story as before: I cannot get the collision working. I don't remember if I sent files to you, gap, but I'm going to send it when I get home today. Maybe you will be able to figure it out. I will try and find another base mesh to use and see if it will work out.