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07-04-17, 01:56 AM | #1 |
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Only Russian sub that I can play with some confidence is the Sierra (noiselvl 125). The rest are a pain and are very easily detected by nmy escorts and subs.
Only way (imho) to be competetive at a reasonable lvl is to alter the "SelfNoise=" setting inte appropriate vessel .txt file in the D:\Your game installation path\MODS\ColdWatersSovietCampaignRev1.01\ColdWate rs_Data\StreamingAssets\override\vessels For example. Victor III is at SelfNoise=137, Los Angeles is at 115 and Narwhal at 105. Huge difference. I play the Victor III and set SelfNoise to 125 which makes it (according to my skill lvl) competetive enough. Sure, somewhat harder than a fairly modern US sub (since hydrophones etc are worse as well) but that is how I want it. Cheers |
07-04-17, 09:12 AM | #2 |
Seaman
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Hmmm. Let's take a look to the well known picture from Polmar.
According to it Alfa should be roughly equvalent to Permit class in basic noise level (but Alfa is still more noisy when running at 40 knots of course). Also even early Akula is slightly less noisy than the Sturgeon class, which is still in service in 1984. Also I've seen the exact meaning of the Charlie class noise level in the Russian sources. There it's claimed to be equal to 110 Db in the audible part of the sound spectre (at top speed). But this information seems to be doubtful to me. Last edited by Doctor Haider; 07-04-17 at 09:35 AM. |
07-04-17, 09:24 AM | #3 | |
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07-04-17, 09:39 AM | #4 |
Seaman
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07-09-17, 11:48 AM | #5 |
Planesman
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Shouldn't the Charlie classes have anti-ship missiles and a VLS? I'm not seeing missiles for them when loading them out.
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07-12-17, 01:29 PM | #6 |
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it's propaganda.
671rtm MUCH less noisy, a little more than 688. 971 Akula was less noisy then 688 Fl.0 And Skipjack noiselevel was about 150dB according to Tom Stefanick data 1987 ----------- Consider that Americans tend to overstate the secret characteristics and the Russians on the contrary are understated. |
07-12-17, 02:12 PM | #7 |
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Ships don't emit constant levels of sound across their speeds, though, so what does "a Skipjack makes 150 dB of noise" really mean? It's a very simplified graphic, and as the axes don't have units, should be interpreted as such. A graphic like this can't show that diesels are quieter at low speeds but louder at high speeds than a nuke boat.
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07-15-17, 12:58 PM | #8 |
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According to this American chart 1987, the noise level of Skipjack was in the range of 150-172 dB. Permit is from 137 dB. - 133 db. (Later reduced to 129 dB) Old diesel subs (613, 641) from 127 dB (138 full speed). Kilo - 115 dB. Sierra - 115 dB. Alfa full speed - 165 dB (so on 5 knot must 129 db, surprize) In general, it is clear that the developers adhered to this data, but apparently the skipjack came out completely unplayable ------ sorry bad english |
07-16-17, 05:38 AM | #9 | |
Planesman
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I don't know at what speeds the 1987 chart indicates the self noise. Other published work, especially on SSBN tend to predict much lower noise. For example Yankee in 1987 chart is predicted 150 db at speed unknown. Paper below predicts 135-140 at 4kts. On older boats difference in prediction seems larger. Hotel for example in 1987 chart is predicted 160-170 db, paper below predicts 140-145 at 4 kts. https://fas.org/spp/eprint/snf03221.htm
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07-16-17, 07:42 AM | #10 | |
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We need to display the relative noise in the game conventions more correctly This diagram of topics is interesting because it correlates both American and Soviet boats. Whereas in different studies data are usually given either for some or the other, while it is not known in what specific conditions. |
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07-17-17, 04:08 AM | #11 |
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07-12-17, 11:22 AM | #12 | |
Swabbie
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http://imgur.com/a/t6UjU Admittedly I'm unsure when it had it, but given that supposedly the Soviets rarely changed the screws on existing hulls it's possible it had it during 1984. If the game ever adds proper diesel-electric mechanics then we could just add the various holes in the water the Soviets made. :v Also, if or when it's possible to add 3D models, other novelties that could be added would be the Papa class (ancestor to the Alfa, and still the fastest submarine ever built) in the 1968 campaign, and the Mike class (a combat capable technology testbed; kind of a proto-Akula?) in 1984. |
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07-12-17, 12:24 PM | #13 | |
Sonar Guy
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I agree with you that Victor II is probably the Soviet equivalent to the USS Jack, which trialed contra-roatating screws for the USN (somewhat unsuccessfully due to the weight of her direct drive sapping most of the efficiency, but she did keep the setup for her whole service life). Papa would have JUST been launched in December of 68 and had a hell of a test process to go through (didn't commission until December 69). The Papa and the Alfa after it were way more anti-carrier platforms than anything else but I don't think there was a torpedo in existence that could catch the Papa in that time period. Mike, being titanium is sort of a different ball of wax than the Akula and sort of like an Alfa successor in terms of automation and design concepts. Out of all the titanium boats the Mike was the first one that was really stressed for deep diving, and while I don't think she had any problems there, its my understanding the conclusion that was reached was that there wasn't as much value as you would think to diving that deep. I mean it likely could escape some / most / all-non nuclear weapons of the day but it wasn't any more stealthy (hit 3000ft. and then disappear) so basically not worth the trouble vs. how hard it was to construct a boat that could dive that deep.
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07-12-17, 02:23 PM | #14 | |
Swabbie
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Somewhat related: while looking for what sonar the Mike had (Shark Gill, same as the other attack boats of that era), I found this: https://translate.google.com/transla...oruzhenie.html Supposedly, it's the Russian perspective on the effectiveness of their sonars and the acoustic performance of American submarines. Given the Russian interest in selling submarines, take it with a grain of salt, but still interesting. |
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07-12-17, 02:43 PM | #15 | |
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During building "K-278" was testing in depth 1600 meters. Every compatment testing in this depth and after it submarine building. In depth 800 meters and more submarine can not finding anti-submarine sensors so was below few thermal layers. In this depth was not cavitation or other hydrodynamic sounds. Submarine can have full speed without rise sound level. Have superstels speed so have 2 electric motors and can speed 5 knots in electric motors in very large depth. During 1980 years in world was not anti-submarine weapons what can hit "K-278" in open ocean. Soviet torpedo "USET-80" was deep diving in world and have 1000 meters. It was ideal submarine in this time... Last edited by denis_469; 07-12-17 at 03:01 PM. |
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