Strike on North Korea

[Delgard]

I mentioned a buffer zone and I don't think it will get much investment other than for military use. Ports and airfields will, though.

[vienna]

China has shown it really doesn't like to annex already existing nations (unlike Russia in Georgia, the Ukraine, etc.); if anything, they seem to favor creating outposts as a means to exert and support territorial claims as they do by creating artificial Chinese national islands in the China Seas. However, China has made one significant military foray into another nation:

Sino-Vietnamese War --

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Vietnamese_War

This slapdown of Vietnam in 1979 by China , or as Chinese Vice-premier Deng Xiaoping put it, "The little child is getting naughty, it's time he get spanked", was not only a sharp message to the Vietnamese government, but also a rebuke to the Soviet Union's attempts to exert influence in SE Asia. This is interesting given the seeming coziness Russia is currently expressing towards NK...





<O>

[Mr Quatro]

Sounds like war drums, uh? Perhaps a major build up of our fleet off shore, perhaps an Ohio class submarine SSGN: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cruise_missile_submarine

(the U.S. Navy modified the four oldest Ohio-class submarines: USS Ohio, Michigan, Florida, and Georgia into SSGNs. The conversion was achieved by installing vertical launching systems (VLS) in a multiple all-up-round canister (MAC) configuration in 22 of the 24 missile tubes, replacing one Trident missile with 7 smaller Tomahawk cruise missiles. The 2 remaining tubes were converted to lockout chambers for use by special forces personnel. This gave each converted submarine the capability to carry up to 154 Tomahawks.)

Perhaps B-1 bombers converted to drop mines, perhaps US Army and US Air Force ready to drop paratroopers behind enemies lines, perhaps Seal team with diversions for NK to follow up on, perhaps shock and awe, perhaps air burst EMP weapons, perhaps rocket man targeted with an insider knowing where he is at all times sending out a signal.

Perhaps all of the above and even more without using nuclear weapons to stop NK from being a threat anymore.

I don't like President Trumps little crooked smile with the words, "Wait and see" "You'll find out".

If this goes wrong it could be the end of Donald Trump ... Why would NK give up and face defeat without striking back ... war has it's consequences.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ets/743135001/

WASHINGTON — President Trump tweeted new storm warnings Saturday, this time aimed at North Korea.

In a pair of late-afternoon tweets, Trump wrote that negotiations with the truculent, isolated nation had backfired, "makings (sic) fools of U.S. negotiators. Sorry, but only one thing will work!"

He didn't make clear what that "one thing" is but has been hinting for several days that the time for diplomacy has passed, leaving a military strike as the most likely option. On Friday, the morning after he met with the nation's top military commanders, Trump spoke in cryptic terms about the "calm before the storm." When asked to clarify, Trump said: "You'll find out."

[Jimbuna]

I doubt the peace will last up to xmas.

[vienna]

Originally Posted by Mr Quatro

Sounds like war drums, uh? Perhaps a major build up of our fleet off shore, perhaps an Ohio class submarine SSGN: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cruise_missile_submarine

(the U.S. Navy modified the four oldest Ohio-class submarines: USS Ohio, Michigan, Florida, and Georgia into SSGNs. The conversion was achieved by installing vertical launching systems (VLS) in a multiple all-up-round canister (MAC) configuration in 22 of the 24 missile tubes, replacing one Trident missile with 7 smaller Tomahawk cruise missiles. The 2 remaining tubes were converted to lockout chambers for use by special forces personnel. This gave each converted submarine the capability to carry up to 154 Tomahawks.)

Perhaps B-1 bombers converted to drop mines, perhaps US Army and US Air Force ready to drop paratroopers behind enemies lines, perhaps Seal team with diversions for NK to follow up on, perhaps shock and awe, perhaps air burst EMP weapons, perhaps rocket man targeted with an insider knowing where he is at all times sending out a signal.

Perhaps all of the above and even more without using nuclear weapons to stop NK from being a threat anymore.

I don't like President Trumps little crooked smile with the words, "Wait and see" "You'll find out".

If this goes wrong it could be the end of Donald Trump ... Why would NK give up and face defeat without striking back ... war has it's consequences.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ets/743135001/

Trump has been long playing both ends of any issue; for instance, with DACA: to the Trumpettes he's been mouthing the 'hard line', while, to the DACA people he's been saying everything's gonna work out fine for them and he's put Congress squarely in the middle; and, regardless with what happens, Trump is setting himself up to appear as the "hero:

1) If Congress does pass a law extending and/or expanding DACA, Trump will be able to say to his Trumpettes "Well, I tried to end DACA, but Congress wouldn't let me" and to the DACA people he will say "I told you it would work out"...

2) If Congress doesn't pass a law extending and/or expanding DACA, Trump will be able to say to his Trumpettes "I delivered on my promise and ended DACA" and to the DACA people he will say "Well, I tried to save DACA, but Congress wouldn't act on it"...

Either way, he'll claim credit for whatever outcome and try to pass himself off as "presidential"...

...and now he's doing the same thing with his "little crooked smile with the words, "Wait and see" "You'll find out": if there is a military action against NK, he'll sit there and say "I told you so", making his Trumpettes happy and, if a diplomatic solution is found, he will also sit there and say "I told you so" making the rest of the electorate happy; by being cryptic, he sets him self up to "win", no matter what the result and you can rest assured, he'll be front and center to give himself credit even if he ultimately had no hand in either solution and, by waffling, displayed no real substantive, definitive leadership...






<O>

[Platapus]

I am not sure that Trump has ever experienced harsh consequences about his actions. Foreign Relations is not one area where one can just declare bankruptcy and take a business "mulligan".

There are no do-overs and no save games one can just reload.
I have a real fear that Trump is willing to start a war just to get the boost of being a "war" president like it did for Bush.

It is all about the ratings for our reality TV president.

[vienna]

The GW Bush Trump analogy is a valid point; both came from privileged, wealthy backgrounds, both had daddy's money to help bail them out of their difficulties, both were involved in a series of failed or failing business activities, both were less than stellar students, one, GWB, had a questionable and, by most accounts, unfinished military stint in an Air Guard unit the Guard itself self-described as a haven for the wealthy and influential to evade the regular draft and possible deployment to Vietnam, and the other, Trump, used his family connections to finagle a draft deferment for a 'sore foot' to evade service, and both never really worked a real job or real wages in their lives. Say what you will about Bill Clinton and Obama, they were both men who came from humble backgrounds and, by their own academic efforts, were able to be successful; and you can add to the mix Ronald Regan, who also came from humble beginnings and worked hard to achieve his goals. With both Bushes, and now Trump, there is we have had a sporadic run of Presidents from wealth who have or are being proven as being much less than effective at the task of President than those who did not come from privilege...

NB: I am not including GHW Bush in my critique of GWB and DT and their lack of or lacking in military service: GHW Bush served honorably and bravely and deserves proper respect for his service...





<O>

[Oberon]

That's my concern too Platapus, hopefully he's not stupid enough to fire the first shot though, since China has already declared its intent to intervene if the DPRK is attacked. I expect the goal is to try and provoke the DPRK into firing first, thus giving the US the cassus belli to execute its war plan.

It'll be the first direct war between nuclear armed powers, unless you count the 1999 Kargil war between India and Pakistan which was more a series of skirmishes than a direct conflict unlike the previous 1971 war. There'll be a lot of data to be gathered about the effect of a nuclear exchange on the climate as well as the local populace.

[Aktungbby]

Originally Posted by mapuc

Can we expect something soon ?

Originally Posted by Oberon

Unpredictability is the best solution to a situation with high tension.... hopefully he's not stupid enough to fire the first shot though, since China has already declared its intent to intervene if the DPRK is attacked. I expect the goal is to try and provoke the DPRK into firing first, thus giving the US the cassus belli to execute its war plan.

meets as I enjoy the ride in (suddenly) sunny Napa...

[Oberon]

It's ok, Aktung, you've got a fridge nearby, haven't you?




I'm sorry, that was in bad taste...I shouldn't have posted from that film.

[mapuc]

Oberon wrote

since China has already declared its intent to intervene if the DPRK is attacked

Have read and heard this several times.

What if USA/Trump gave something to China, so they, so to say close their eyes for USA conduct a bombing campaign against NK
(I know USA/NATO did this before the first Iraq war started-China would have put a VETO, but they put down their voting instead)

If USA got the back free and can conduct a strike on NK everyone may think, KJU got a smack on his fingers. This is what he need and he will understand he have done something wrong and now all will be normal again

Nothing could be more wrong.
NK/KJU may pull back and stay calm for month, then when we less expect it, NK conduct a massiv artillery attack or similar on SK or a missile attack on JP.

Can't say if he's going to attack right after and if he's going to use nuke.

The possibility is high.

Markus

[Mr Quatro]

Maybe this is why Trump has a smirk on his face when he said, "Wait and see" He has GB on his side to take on NK. Seems that tomorrow is make or break for the Rocket Man.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/britain-a...031737564.html

Britain 'draws up battle plan for war with North Korea'

Britain is reportedly preparing for the possibility of war breaking out with North Korea as concerns rise that another provocative missile test could trigger a military response by the US.

North Korea is being closely watched amid fears it could launch another long-range missile test on Tuesday to mark the anniversary of the founding of its ruling party.

Bellicose rhetoric from Donald Trump has heightened tensions in the region in recent months, prompting British officials to draw up military plans for a response to a break out of hostilities, it was reported.

Among the plans disclosed by the Daily Mail is the deployment of the Navy's newest aircraft carrier, HMS Queen Elizabeth, before it has undergone flight trials.

[Oberon]

Of course the loyal dog must follow the orders of its master.

[Rockstar]

Even in the late nineties it was widely known the North in all likelihood could not wage a major conflict let alone defeat its southern neighbor. Times have changed in North Korea its people have changed their attitudes have changed. Maybe the time is ripe to put the pressure on to help motivate the general population. Maybe it is time we see their self proclaimed god-man to step down and be tried for most heinous crimes against humanity.

One of my colleagues once said, “I am hungry. I think the government shouldn’t neglect hungry soldiers like this because when people are starving to death, you never know where they would point their guns.” I, who had been raised by a most patriotic father, was shocked to hear this comment, implying the possibility of rebellion. But it was I who was different from others.

This story captures reality of commando units in North Korea. Nowadays, commando units are filled with children of poor families who have no other choice but to go there. There’s no special pride or sense of duty that their seniors once had. However, even the soldiers in lead elite troops who still get some rations have changed. In the past, soldiers in lead elite troops were ready to commit suicide for the government and the general. Nowadays, going back home alive is their one and only mission.

Even an old dog can sense weakness and take advantage of it

[Catfish]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

[...]
Even an old dog can sense weakness and take advantage of it

And there i was, thinking O. meant England

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