Arma 3 Alpha and developments

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

Final warning note:

Personal insults and or attacks are really unnecessary and therefore unwelcome in our community.

Ehhh, that is a common saying in IT and surely not "a personal insult/attack" of any sort.
It simply points out that in most of IT related problems, the problem is the user because he doesn't know what he's doing - yet conveniently blames the system or a software, see my 2011 example.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Nippelspanner

Ehhh, that is a common saying in IT and surely not "a personal insult/attack" of any sort.
It simply points out that in most of IT related problems, the problem is the user because he doesn't know what he's doing - yet conveniently blames the system or a software, see my 2011 example.

I appreciate the explanation but

This reminds me of this glorious IT-stunt of yours back in 2011, regarding Shogun 2 and blocking that old man's steam via firewall, patronizing the poor chap only due to your paranoid views, because... reasons, I guess.

coupled with

To cut it short: My best guess is, the actual problem is - as usual - in front of the screen.

Has clearly given the post reporter the perception/belief that insult was being conveyed.

I would appreciate it if the tone could be lowered. It also makes my job a little easier.

TIA

This:

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

Has clearly given the post reporter the perception/belief that insult was being conveyed.

Is a dangerous can of worms!
Just because something was reported, doesn't mean it automatically warrants action.
If we all go by what each of us feels... I mean...Jesus, you better lock down the GT area right now, because a lot of reports might be incoming!

Still, I won't debate this further, out of respect for your blood pressure.
Have a good one!

[Dowly]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Can anyone confirm that this is no longer the case and that the whole set of software and DLC workds without automatically setting WU to "on"?

I think we should first get a confirmation of this happening from someone else too who has the DLC. I could not find anyone mention this when I checked.

And if not, can one install a game in Steam without necessarily also installing all its updates and DLCs one has bought? So far I am under the impression that any reinstallation automatically and unavoidably also installs all DLCS one had bought for the game in question.

That's a good question. I know I can uninstall Witcher 3 DLCs by just unticking them:


Whether it works the same in ArmA 3, I have no idea.

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by Nippelspanner

This:

Is a dangerous can of worms!
Just because something was reported, doesn't mean it automatically warrants action.
If we all go by what each of us feels... I mean...Jesus, you better lock down the GT area right now, because a lot of reports might be incoming!

When it gets reported by multiple members... it is usually a problem. Jim's right, there's no doubt that your comments were not very cordial at all. If Skybird or anyone mistrusts MS, that's not a reason to heap scorn on them.

thank you
Neal

[NeonSamurai]

While I agree it would be nigh impossible for Arma to do such a thing, you were pretty rude about it. Would it be right for me to heap scorn and ridicule on you, for your ignorance in a topic that I may have far more knowledge of? Does it make you an idiot for not knowing? And, does it make it better because I used technical jargon to insult you?

I hope your answers to these questions would be no. So maybe be a little more gentle with those who aren't in the know.


Sky are you perchance running windows 10? If so, be advised that that operating system is absolutely notorious for doing exactly what you described, doing it over and over again, despite settings to the contrary. Win 7 & 8 have also been known to rarely do that as well. It's part of the joy Microshaft sends our way.

[Skybird]

My original question is based on simple empirical observations.

1. System carefully installed and sealed off last November. Dual boot, two HD, registry settings in huge umbers to prevent MS background services contacting MS servers - last autumn I got shoved GWX files on my system although my Windows update setting was switched to off, so obviously it has been pushed by Microsoft by using other channels contacting their servers. I use the W7 partition only for launching some games, nothing else - ANYTHING else is done via Linux here. Firewall, AntiVir, MBAM with max sysettings, no Explorer surfing use, and since Explorer is embedded in Windows and Windows uses it for some minor internal work as well - you cannot avoid that - its settings are also set to maximum security, and very restrictive. XP Antispy - works also under W7 - used as an GUI to change several dozen registry settings to seal the system even more. I got it as tight and locked as by my best knowledge I could do. I had some expert help in it as well.

2. Steam and Arma3 did not change that Windows Update was switched off. Then came the APEX Beta - and my GWX scanner immediately rang the alarm bell, Checking the setting, it indeed was all of a sudden "on". I switched it off, and it stayed off. I rebooted, and the alarm cam again and it was on. I examined and tested a bit moire, and finally uninstalled Arma3. WU was off. Rebooted, and it stayed off. Installed Arma3 again and the DLCs - and the alarm came in, and WU was on again. Deinstalled it, this time to stay like that:_ and Windows Update was off, and stayed off.

That are simple observations. No use in arguing with them.

It is not uncommon that during installation of software that installation routine may want to contact Microsoft servers to get some MS-related file updates, DirX, VirtualX and whatever there is. I do not know whether Apex Beta did this activation of WU, or whether a function of steam related to the handling of Betas in general may have caused it (there is no other Beta in use over here). But that the use of a Beta and the presence of Apex on my system were linked in time to the activation of Windows updates, is undeniable fact.

Since Arma3 is gone, the problem did not reappeared again. Arma before that Apex Beta, also was no problem.

And so my question: can anyone offer any information and confirmation on that the final release of Apex-non-Beta-anymore does not do this any longer, or how could I install Arma3 without all the DLCs I bought - I see no option to choose what DLCs to be installed once they got bought?! I will not go with this game if I need to switch off WU manually every time I boot into W7.

[Dowly]

I assume your MS redists are in somewhat updated condition? Steam usually checks for these and updates them if necessary. Has Steam done this when you first start any new game?

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Dowly

I assume your MS redists are in somewhat updated condition? Steam usually checks for these and updates them if necessary. Has Steam done this when you first start any new game?

Latest Steam buys were DLCs for Assetto Corsa and Fallout 4, just weeks ago. Flawless procedures.

Latest game installation was Combat Mission: Shock Force with all addons, just a few days ago. It checked for DirX, Flawless procedure. Cannot say wqhether the DirX was blocked due to my settings or not - point is - the WU settings were not changed by the installer.

As I said earlier, I could imagine that Steam handles "Betas" somewhat differently, due to the often constant updating of Betas required. But if Apex nor got officially released, it is not Beta anymore, does not fall under that regime then.

Problem was not that installation of Apex Beta once may knocked onto Microsoft servers. It did install, and functional, I test-played the island a little bit, for half an hour, it all was there and worked. Problem was that as long as the Apex Beta was present, it reactivated WU again every time I switched it off and rebooted the system in the next day, even when no download of a new Beta was happening.

I probably must simply download all that stuff once again and see how it works. I wanted to avoid the risk of doing that in vein, it costs an awful lot of time, since you cannot trust in simply copying over the game folder from am image - it already could be affected by this problem, if there is some. I also wanted to minimise the risk to my Windows of getting hit by something W10-related when that WU toggle gets activated. I noticed last autumn that MS is incredibly quick on using a hole in defences against W10-related software, open the door just a tiny bit for a second, and they immediately try to squeeze a foot in there.

Again my queston: can ArmA3 be installed in any way without having all bought DLC automatically getting installed as well? If there is such a switch, I am not aware of it.

[NeonSamurai]

Ya so I think I figured out the problem. It wasn't apex that did that, it was GWX+windows. What happened was for some people windows apparently tried (and succeed in many cases) to forcibly install Win 10. The way windows did this was to quietly make the win 10 update a 'recommended update' and then switch windows update to automatic updates. A pile of people and companies got nailed with this little bit of bastardly behaviour. No one is sure exactly how they did this, even a number of IT professionals also got hit with it.

So your rather lucky you caught it and didn't end up with win 10. The fact you were running Arma APEX had nothing to do with it, just a coincidence (a problem with empiricism ).

It really couldn't have been ArmA. To do what your proposing it would have to act like a virus. About the worst Steam could do is install MS redistributables. Now the official MS redistributables would have the ability to change settings, and its possible the problem originated from them.

Anyhow neither Dowly nor myself could find the slightest evidence on the internet, that anyone else had your problem with ARMA.

Also as for windows 10, your safe now as MicroStupid isn't offering it for free, or forcing it on peoples machines.

[Onkel Neal]

Off topic posts removed, and infractions will be served out.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Dowly

That's a good question. I know I can uninstall Witcher 3 DLCs by just unticking them:


Whether it works the same in ArmA 3, I have no idea.

Sorry Dowly, I overlooked your post .....

I have those boxes for some DLCs of games, too, but unticking them does not uninstall the DLCs, just switches them off, but leaves them installed. At least that is how it os over here, just tested with Skyrim, and Cities Skylines.

Maybe I finally should start to play Cities Skyline. Its a year since I bought it in a sale - but never played it. Not once.

[Dowly]

Some might be interested in stuff like this, so might as well post this here.

Last Sunday, Finnish (AFI) and Swedish (SSG, ANROP) played two team v team matches. Both are "milsim" groups, so not just "deathmatch" stuff, 160 players total I believe.

"Tiinusen" from SSG spectated the two missions and streamed the match with English commentary. (Timestamps are in the description)

1st Mission: Finns must capture and hold Silvonik.
2nd Mission: Swedes must capture/destroy an ammunition storage defended by small group of Finns while a Finnish QRF is inbound from South.



The match shows well the big difference you have between teams who play primarily against AI (SWE) and those who play primarily large TvTs (FIN).

It also highlights the vastly different command structure between the two sides. (Click for bigger pic)