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Old 06-07-17, 12:13 PM   #121
SquareSteelBar
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TerrainEditor + Tutorial by ref
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Old 06-07-17, 12:24 PM   #122
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Originally Posted by Kendras View Post
Got it

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Originally Posted by Kendras View Post
Now two problems :

- how does it work ?
The package comes with a readme file, but instructions are not too clear, and apparently they only explain how to merge in game a ready-made terrain modification, but not how to create a new one. Probably once the SHIII terrain is excrated using yhe tool, a set of heigth masks is created. From a comment on the download page, I get that this information might be in RAW format. If that was the case, any photo editor capable of importing/exporting from/to the RAW format could be used to edit the heigth information.

Hopefully someone better informed on the topic we are discussing will pop up and he will shed some light

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- what map should we modifiy ? Vanilla or WAC ? ...
Well I would start from the most detailed SHIII terrain available (I don't know which one is the best between WAC and GWX). If I got it right, once the terrain data is extracted and modified, there are two ways it can be released:

- as a package containing only the modified areas, which can be re-merged to any version of the SHIII terrain data using the Extractor/Repacker;

- as a ready-to-use terrain data which can be enabled as normal mod using JSGME

The first method would contain the download size and it would allow more flexibility, because it would let any player free to choose which terrain data (mega mod) he wants to use as base for the merging of our modifications. The con, is that its installation would be a bit trickier.
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Old 06-07-17, 12:42 PM   #123
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ops... while writing my previois reply I had missed SquareSteelBar's link (thank you mate!)

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This version of the download also contains detailed instructions on the SHIII terrain format and on its editing
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Old 06-07-17, 01:58 PM   #124
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SH3 Terrain Editing.pdf : that was the file I needed ! Thank you mate !
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Old 06-07-17, 02:53 PM   #125
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Icon7

Something interesting : http://www.kartengruppe.it/immagini/...0/0088G-SB.jpg (from : http://www.kartengruppe.it/index.php/nordsee-deutsche-admiralitatskarten)

But although the map was printed in 1943, it's based on a 1913 map.

In 1943, the island was bigger, as you can see on this picture :


Last edited by Kendras; 06-07-17 at 03:03 PM.
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Old 06-07-17, 03:32 PM   #126
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In 1943, the island was bigger
Probably because of this : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Hummerschere
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Old 06-07-17, 05:12 PM   #127
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Something interesting : http://www.kartengruppe.it/immagini/...0/0088G-SB.jpg (from : http://www.kartengruppe.it/index.php/nordsee-deutsche-admiralitatskarten)

But although the map was printed in 1943, it's based on a 1913 map.

In 1943, the island was bigger, as you can see on this picture :
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Good findings, thank you for sharing!

I don't know how far the Nazis went with their expansion plan, anyway the sandy beaches of Helgoland and Düne are subject to a strong tidal erosion, and their size and shape might have changed over time. Add to that the fact that after war the Brits tried to sink the main island

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Old 06-07-17, 06:53 PM   #128
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In 1943, the island was bigger, as you can see on this picture :
Comparing your 1943 picture with a 2008 aerial view (taken from Google Earth), it seems that Heligoland has not changed mutch over the last 70 years. Not the same can be said about Düne though

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Old 06-08-17, 04:44 PM   #129
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I have outlined the two islands of Helgoland and Dune on an equirectangular map projection (as the one used in SH games to represent the globe)...



and I have placed them on a 1deg lat/long quadrant of the size used for SHIII terrain masks. This is the result:



The resolution is poor indeed, but those are the limits imposed by the game.
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Old 06-09-17, 07:06 PM   #130
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I have outlined the two islands of Helgoland and Dune on an equirectangular map projection (as the one used in SH games to represent the globe)...




I prefer to have real shape, even if the map is deformed. It's not a problem, as the islands are very small. I will see that point over the week-end. Keep focusing on the lighthouses, I do the map job.
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Old 06-09-17, 07:57 PM   #131
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I prefer to have real shape, even if the map is deformed. It's not a problem, as the islands are very small. I will see that point over the week-end. Keep focusing on the lighthouses, I do the map job.
What do you mean by "real" shape? This is the real shape in the (equirectangular) SHIII world. Do you think that real continents as seen from the space look the same as on a map?

Jokes apart, any other shape would cause a misalignment of the islands relative to the in-game coordinate system both in terms of latitude/longitude and KM quadrant and, due to the small size of the two island and the low resolution of SHIII terrain masks, the difference in terms of "good shape" would be hardly detectable anyway
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Old 06-10-17, 08:53 AM   #132
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Icon12 HELGOLAND PLAN

This is the shape I mean (with the lighthouses' positions) :


Last edited by Kendras; 06-10-17 at 03:02 PM.
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Old 06-10-17, 10:16 AM   #133
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Other pictures of Helgoland :








Last edited by Kendras; 06-10-17 at 10:48 AM.
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Old 06-10-17, 01:47 PM   #134
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This is the shape I mean (with the lighthouses' positions) :
Nice work

...but as I said before, your clean drawing will make little difference once it is scaled down to fit in the small space of SHIII's terrain masks.

In my opinion, having the islands in the right place and with the right size is more important, even though they will look a bit stretched in game. The equirectangular map projection used in game makes it easy to convert from lat/long coordinates to metric offsets relative to the equator/Greenwich meridian: 1° = 120,000 m; 1' = 2,000 m; 1" = 33.33 m; 1 pixel on a terrain mask = 6" = 200 m. As long as the terrain masks are edited correctly, calculating the correct in-game position of lighthouses and other objects relative to each other and to land, will be as easy as doing a simple math based on the lat/long of those objects in real world.

There is more. As you know, many lighthouses have "blind" spots and/or their lights have different colors depending on the angle that they are looked at. Most nautical charts have those angles displayed on map (see map.openseamap.org for example). Supposed that the above can be mimicked in game, we could calculate the correct light angles directly on charts rather than wasting our time with a trial and error approach, but for this method to work we need to place everything at its right place and to work on equirectangular charts. Most nautical charts use a Mercator projection but, for small areas, stretching them to fit an equirectangular projection is quite easy

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Other pictures of Helgoland :
Amazing!

I had no realized how many coastal batteries where located on the island. Maybe we could add them in game
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Old 06-10-17, 02:14 PM   #135
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As long as the terrain masks are edited correctly, calculating the correct in-game position of lighthouses and other objects relative to each other and to land, will be as easy as doing a simple math based on the lat/long of those objects in real world.
It's very easy to get the exact coordinates of a lighthouse with the mission editor.

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There is more. As you know, many lighthouses have "blind" spots and/or their lights have different colors depending on the angle that they are looked at. Most nautical charts have those angles displayed on map (see map.openseamap.org for example). Supposed that the above can be mimicked in game, we could calculate the correct light angles directly on charts rather than wasting our time with a trial and error approach, but for this method to work we need to place everything at its right place and to work on equirectangular charts. Most nautical charts use a Mercator projection but, for small areas, stretching them to fit an equirectangular projection is quite easy
I already though about that question, and I don't see how to do this (halo with different colors depending on the angle). And I don't understand the link between angles on charts, and equirectangular projection.

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I had no realized how many coastal batteries where located on the island. Maybe we could add them in game
I hope so too ! By the way, are you still working on the british coastal defenses ?
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