The split-away crumbs of the hijacked swastika thread

[Skybird]

We had the following court sentence yesterday: a man who was selling flags, shirts and buttons with swastikas being shattered by fists, giant rocks or shoes or that were crossed out, sometimes even had text saying some anti-fascist sloagns, effectively expressing anti-fascism by that, has been found guilty to violate the law that prohibit the display of the swastika in Germany, due to the terrible historical context in whcih it was abused. He was sentenced to paying around 3000 euro, and all his stocks are gone.

Some people are angry about that. I can understand them. such buttons had been around since my school days in the eighties. FIFA had the very same symbol (a swastika in a red circle, being crossed out by a red bar) at the entrances of the footbal stadiums in Germany. Showing you anti-fascist attiude by wearing such things now brings you in danger of being arrested and brought to court.

State attorney said it is about preventing the playing-down of the terirble historical events that took place under the Nazi swastika, so that the memory of these croimes does not become an object of marginalization and profanisation when it is used undiscriminately, by habit, and so the context gets forgotten and ignored until it is some fresh idea of young fashion, an acessoir to be considered as being "hip" at a party, and people no longer associating what the Nazi swastika actually was meaning for so many victims. - I can understand that as well.

concerning the use of the swastika in games and excusing that by "historical realism" and correctness, that is nonsens, because define the correctness and realsim of a histiral sim not by paint, but by functionality (of vehicle model'S behavior, for example), and the ideological and informational context in which the action of the game in question is embedded. IL2 in Germany comes with deactivated swastika. The realism and correctness of the sim does not suffer a bit from that. It does not win anything when activating that symbol (via in Germany forbidden cheat). Someone who wishes so much to fight in a uniform or vehicle of the Nazis, with original Nazi symbol, really should ask himself if he is not illustrating exactly that kind of profanisation and ignorration of historcial contexts of what the Nazis did the state attorney said he wants to prevent. a camouflage pattern that matches history is one thing, and may fulfill a certain function on the sim. the swastika is not, it's only tasteless eye-candy. 58 million dead are too terrible as that one should easily turn symbols of that slaughtering into acessoires of lifestyle today. that the symbol orginally had a different meaning and was hijacked by the Nazis,like the SS-rune, does not change that now it is linked to certain historical events as well. And that should not be forgotten, or played own.

So, I personally would be satisfied with a more consistent interpretation of the laws. What is forbidden for the salesman on the street - cannot be allowed for FIFA.

[Deputy]

Originally Posted by kiwi_2005

When you defend your own country its a good enough reason to die for it.

BTW...the purpose of war is to make the OTHER guy "die for his country".

I find it interesting that so many of these outspoken individuals that have made literally HUNDREDS if not THOUSANDS of posts on this forum, haven't taken the time to post ANYTHING about themselves. One of the first things I did when I signed up here was to give some background information about myself. All I see from others are a few tidbits about where they live. How about posting your AGE and OCCUPATION in there. So that I can tell if I'm talking with a bunch of high school kids or mature adults?

Immacolata: So people living under a Communist regime are doing so under their own free will? Is that for all the freedoms and rights they are guaranteed under that Communist regime? Kinda makes me wonder why the Germans in East Germany were so happy to tear down that wall. I will tell you right now...if a serious enough event happens to the US or Israel, look for mushroom clouds to start appearing in Iran or Syria or wherever that event originates from. And don't think for a minute that NATO wouldn't have used tactical nukes in Europe if the Soviets rolled into your area.
You need to lookup tactical nukes. They are used in the BATTLEFIELD, not on cities like STRATEGIC nukes. A few tactical nukes along the border of North-South Vietnam would have stopped the swarm of invaders in their tracks, along with making that border unuseable for may years to come. Most likely it would have sent the Communist rats scurrying for the peace table as fast as they could run.

All this BS about the US being butchers for using STRATEGIC nukes in Japan makes me laugh. I didn't see any of YOUR countries volunteering to help invade Japan. It would have been "okay" for you guys if the US lost thousands of troops invading Japan, but it's not okay to bomb Japan to the peace table. We had a strategic advantage with the possession of the A-Bomb. We used it. We would have been stupid NOT to have used it. All this "honorable" crapola about fighting a war is just plain ridiculous. We are not WW1 fighter pilots any more. There is NO honor in warfare. There is just DEATH. The more death you wreak on the enemy, the quicker he sues for peace. It's the fact that a nuclear confrontation would mean all the civilians and politicians and other "innocents" would DIE that kept the Soviet Union and the US from all-out war. But that has changed with the Islamic Jihadists. They WANT to die. I guess virgins are at a premium in Islamic countries, because that is the big promise they are given for "heaven".
As far as nukes in the Middle East...it is the next most likely location where they will go off. I would bet on it. Israel already has them. And I don't think they will be used just on the battlefield. Iran is not interested in killing enemy troops. They weren't aiming at troops with those former Soviet rockets they were launching at Israel. Use of WMDs by any warring faction will almost guarantee the use of the same or worse back.

BTW...Afghanisatn is on OUR side now. Don't go running off willy-nilly nuking folks unless they are your enemy. :rotfl:

Dep

[Perilscope]

Originally Posted by Deputy

One of the first things I did when I signed up here was to give some background information about myself.

Where, I can't find anything?

Originally Posted by Deputy

How about posting your AGE and OCCUPATION in there. So that I can tell if I'm talking with a bunch of high school kids or mature adults?

For that, trust me, you will know soon enough who's under age and who's not, and I am not talking about age, about mentality.
However, some young folks here are far more educated and have a better philosophy of life than some grown-ups, but very few.

[August]

Originally Posted by Perilscope

For that, trust me, you will know soon enough who's under age and who's not, and I am not talking about age, about mentality.

[/quote]

I agree. Posting age and occupation proves nothing. I could easily make a post claiming I am 175 years old and the King of England but that wouldn't make it true.

[Sir Big Jugs]

Originally Posted by August

I am 175 years old and the King of England

Nice to meet you. I am 79 years old and the Pope of the Catholic Church.

[Deputy]

Originally Posted by Perilscope

Where, I can't find anything?

For that, trust me, you will know soon enough who's under age and who's not, and I am not talking about age, about mentality.
However, some young folks here are far more educated and have a better philosophy of life than some grown-ups, but very few.

Subim forums class 101. Click on "Deputy" in the left column where one of my posts is. You will find my DOB, where I am located, and age. Seems like some young folks are pretty inexperienced at using internet forums as well as "worldly affairs".
I am already finding out from various posts the maturity level of some of the forum members. Just wondering why they feel the need to hide it. How a teenager who has only experieced a very few short years of life can have a "better philosophy" is beyond me.

Dep

[Deputy]

Originally Posted by August

I agree. Posting age and occupation proves nothing. I could easily make a post claiming I am 175 years old and the King of England but that wouldn't make it true.[/quote]

So are you 175 and the King of England? :rotfl:
If everyone posting on here is concealing information from the outset, than how can ANY post be taken seriously and any poster be believed?
As Perilscope said...I will be able to recognize who is mature and who isn't by what they post. At least posting your age would give you an excuse for an immature/inexperienced post. Of course, if you ARE 175, you have already figured this out.

Dep

[Deputy]

Originally Posted by Brewster Pilot

Nice to meet you. I am 79 years old and the Pope of the Catholic Church.

I like your attitude about Islam. Don't apologize to them for telling the truth.
But I'm surprised the Pope plays SH3. Do you also have the swastika flag on your U-Boats?

Dep

[Perilscope]

Originally Posted by Deputy

Subim forums class 101. Click on "Deputy" in the left column where one of my posts is. You will find my DOB, where I am located, and age.

Oh, the information in the profile, pretty bleak, I thought you posted in here:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=87423
I looked all over for your post in there but I didn't see it, that's why I asked where?
Now I understand, you entered that info in your profile only, sorry, my mistake, won't happen again.

Originally Posted by Deputy

Seems like some young folks are pretty inexperienced at using internet forums as well as "worldly affairs".

Nah! inexperienced at using internet forums I am not, I actually hack them!
Moreover, I need to inform you that in the world of webmasters, "hack" does not mean "break in" illegally, but simply modify on behalf of my clients who install forum software.

Originally Posted by Deputy

...Just wondering why they feel the need to hide it. How a teenager who has only experieced a very few short years of life can have a "better philosophy" is beyond me.

Since the quote "better philosophy" was initially made by me, I have to respond.
If you don't remember my previous post, here is the part in question:

Originally Posted by Perilscope

However, some young folks here are far more educated and have a better philosophy of life than some grown-ups, but very few.

As you can read, I said "some young folks", it doesn't mean "all" young folks are more educated and have better philosophy. Just some.


And now, since you posted this next comment, quoted below:

Originally Posted by Deputy

How a teenager who has only experieced a very few short years of life can have a "better philosophy" is beyond me.

I have to say that nowhere I said teenager. And even if I would have said teenager, yes, some teenagers with only 19 years on this planet could have better philosophy. Moreover, I really don't know why you think age is so important. I am 30 years old and I would prefer to have conversation with my sons and daughter before many adults around here.

[Takeda Shingen]

Can it be that we are all sitting and waiting for the next punch to be thrown? Then let it be so: Bring forth the brave political gladius bearers! Where are Yahoshua and his popcorn?

[August]

Originally Posted by Deputy

If everyone posting on here is concealing information from the outset, than how can ANY post be taken seriously and any poster be believed?
As Perilscope said...I will be able to recognize who is mature and who isn't by what they post. At least posting your age would give you an excuse for an immature/inexperienced post. Of course, if you ARE 175, you have already figured this out.

Dep

I may not be 175 but i am old enough to recognize that it's smart to take anything you read, especially on an internet forum with a large grain of salt.

[The Noob]

If you would know how much i love such Semi-Flamewars! It's even more interesting then playing games, actually.

[Deputy]

And now, since you posted this next comment, quoted below:

Originally Posted by Deputy

How a teenager who has only experieced a very few short years of life can have a "better philosophy" is beyond me.

I have to say that nowhere I said teenager. And even if I would have said teenager, yes, some teenagers with only 19 years on this planet could have better philosophy. Moreover, I really don't know why you think age is so important. I am 30 years old and I would prefer to have conversation with my sons and daughter before many adults around here.[/quote]

Actually, you didn't say teenager and I was being generous with ranking them as being that old. They could be YOUNGER than that too
And I have also seen the comment that "some young folks here are far more educated and have a better philosophy of life than some grown-ups" posted often before when someone brings up the age/experience question. I don't buy it. If that were the case we'd be allowing them to vote and hold political positions.
Posting age and employment information may not "prove anything", but I find that those that don't I take less seriously than those that do. But that's just me. :p

Dep

[bradclark1]

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

Can it be that we are all sitting and waiting for the next punch to be thrown? Then let it be so: Bring forth the brave political gladius bearers! Where are Yahoshua and his popcorn?

Why don't you go do some cycling instead of posting your same crap all the time?

[ASWnut101]

Originally Posted by Deputy

I will tell you right now...if a serious enough event happens to the US or Israel, look for mushroom clouds to start appearing in Iran or Syria or wherever that event originates from. And don't think for a minute that NATO wouldn't have used tactical nukes in Europe if the Soviets rolled into your area.....


.....As far as nukes in the Middle East...it is the next most likely location where they will go off. I would bet on it.

And I wouldn't have one problem with it. I'm in agreement with nearly everything Dep. has to say.