Here we go again-Ukraine once again pt2

[Jimbuna]

No surprises there then.

Russian President Vladimir Putin has told Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi that he will not attend the G20 Summit in Delhi next month.

India is hosting this year's summit, which will be held in the capital Delhi from 9-10 September.

Mr Putin rang Mr Modi and told him that Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov would attend the summit on his behalf.

The two leaders also discussed several "regional and global issues of mutual concern", India said in a statement.

A Russian government spokesperson had said last week that Mr Putin would not attend the summit as he had a "busy schedule".

The G20 includes the world's 19 wealthiest countries plus the European Union. India currently holds the G20 presidency, which rotates annually between members.

Russia's invasion of Ukraine is expected to be a talking point at the summit in Delhi, where world leaders including US President Joe Biden and UK Prime Minister Rishi Sunak will be present.

Last week, Mr Putin attended the Brics summit - Brics is an acronym for Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa - held in Johannesburg by video link to avoid the risk of possible arrest by the International Criminal Court (ICC). The ICC has issued a warrant for Mr Putin's arrest, accusing him of war crimes in Ukraine.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-66603137

[Jimbuna]

[Jimbuna]

[Skybird]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-66621724


Russia adapts.

Ukraine, which enjoyed an advantage in weaponised drones at the beginning of the conflict, is increasingly being challenged by advances in Russian drone tactics and technology. Russia now has drones which hunt in pairs, using laser targeting to hit their mark - an advance that many Ukrainian commanders along the front say is costing lives.

[Jimbuna]

Putin isn't having it all his own way though.

Russia is jailing thousands of soldiers refusing to return to the frontline in Ukraine, showing the "poor state of morale" among those fighting in the "special military operation".

In the latest update from the British Ministry of Defence, they reported on two Russian soldiers who were sentenced to at least two years in prison each for "refusing to obey orders" concerning their return to Ukraine.

More than 100,000 Russians have died fighting in Ukraine, with a further 180,000 wounded, and those figures are likely to rise as Ukraine's counter offensive continues.

Express.co.uk reported this morning (August 30) that Vladimir Putin
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world...666837f1&ei=29

[Skybird]

This is a special day - I have something positive to say It seems confirmed that Ukraine has reached - and breached - the third main defence line. In past weeks there were at least twice reports that claimed that they had reached the main defence line, and the news in the folliwing days was not repeated and just collapsed. But this time it seems to be true.


[Tagesspiegel] According to consistent reports on X (formerly Twitter), Ukrainian troops have reached the Russian "Surovikin Line" for the first time. The fortification stretches along the entire front and is the third and most heavily fortified Russian defensive line.

Near the village of Verbove, Ukrainian troops are reported to have already overcome the first tank barriers of the line and reached the foothills of the village.

The village is located a few kilometers southeast of Robotyne, whose capture Kiev announced on Monday after days of heavy fighting.

Various military experts cite geolocated video footage as evidence of the local breakthrough. So far, these cannot be independently verified.

In any case, the breakthrough through the Russian lines at Robotyne and beyond is likely to be the most extensive of the counteroffensive to date. It is likely to be carried primarily by Ukraine's 82nd Air Assault Brigade. It is considered an elite unit and is equipped with, among other things, British Challenger main battle tanks and German Marder vehicles.

Over the weekend, however, there were already reports that Russia, for its part, had moved elite troops into the region to stabilize the front line.


The Surovikin Line was laid out over a period of months while Russia was preparing for the Ukrainian counteroffensive. It is named after the former Russian commander-in-chief, who has since been deposed and fallen from grace.

It stretches for more than 800 kilometers along the entire front. It is fortified with minefields, tank trenches and so-called dragon's teeth, which serve as tank barriers.

-----------


There are further extensive defences protecting Tokmak and Melitopol, however, its not as if now they march through. Also, the Russians will try to counterattack and seal the breach ASAP. But hope is sown that this will fail.



Finally - this could be what we have waited and hoped (or not dared to hope) for! What counts now most is to keep spreading chaos and to keep them running. And thats not a no-brainer.

[mapuc]

Dargo and Catfish posted an article in which it was said that Ukraine didn't have to go all the way to Melitopol
7-10 km was more than enough-'cause then they can hit the Russian supply lines near and around Melitopol.

However if they got the Ruskies on the run, they should keep on going forward, as long as the logistic can keep up.

Markus

[mapuc]

Markus

[Dargo]

Originally Posted by mapuc

Dargo and Catfish posted an article in which it was said that Ukraine didn't have to go all the way to Melitopol
7-10 km was more than enough-'cause then they can hit the Russian supply lines near and around Melitopol.

However if they got the Ruskies on the run, they should keep on going forward, as long as the logistic can keep up.

Markus

I think they will go forward after they consolidated this area, they do not have to take all those fortified city's (Russian occupation “authorities” reportedly began leaving the city of Tokmak.) kettle them supply wise and starve the Russians in it from their ammo will do the job. Don't know how the fortification is behind this line (Surovikin line), but time is coming for the leopards and other tanks in combo with attrition to destroy Russian supply.

[Jimbuna]

Believers in Russian conspiracy theories think President Vladimir Putin has someone else on his short-term hit list - a former leader of the country’s air force.

Knewz.com is learning Sergey Surovikin ironically lost his job on the day Wagner Group leader Yevgeny Prigozhin lost his life.

Britain’s Daily Star tabloid reports Surovikin officially has been on a leave of absence. He has not been seen in public since the Wagner Group revolt in late June.

Then Surovikin was fired as a military Commander-in-Chief Wednesday, August 23. Reuters reports head of staff Viktor Afzalov replaced him.

A Daily Star headline said without attribution that Putin has “already identified” the next potential opponent to die. But Kremlin aides say it’s an “absolute lie” to think Putin ordered Prigozhin’s death.

Yet one Putin supporter actually hinted at Suovikin’s death on Russian television.

"I'll say even more, although God forbid, is for Surovikin to die of a heart attack,” Vladimir Solovyov said.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world...ee12c16a&ei=11

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by mapuc

Dargo and Catfish posted an article in which it was said that Ukraine didn't have to go all the way to Melitopol
7-10 km was more than enough-'cause then they can hit the Russian supply lines near and around Melitopol.

However if they got the Ruskies on the run, they should keep on going forward, as long as the logistic can keep up.

Markus

Yes, I mentioned it, too. I meant mainly the railraid that goes parrallel to the coast but a couple of kilometers inside the country, away from the coast. I said it would be enough if they approach far enough to have that in range of their tube artillery. Railroad is king of logistics.

But the closer to the coast they get the deeper they can also fire into Crimea. Melitopol is not directly at the coast, btw. But if you control Melitopol you have sort of strategic dominance over the whole region, form the coast in the south deep into the country in the north. It can block every Russian movement, like it now blocks Ukrainian movement. Its also better to defend against a Russian counterattack. Defenders in urban areas ave better chances thna defender sin the open land.

Melitopol is protected by itsd own surrounding grid of defence, trenches and positions, like is Tokmak before. I assume the Ukrainians must take Tokmak, cannot bypass it, and even if they could, they would then have it in their rear, which is a risk. I assume Tokmak is the next objective.

Colonel Reisner would remind of that a breakthrough on the operational level only then is an operational breakthrough, when through the breach a deep and swift continuing advance deep into the free space behind the breach takes place, with a continous stream of own troops slipping in through that breach and widening it both in depth and width. They are not yet this far. Lets wait and see what they make of it. Things must move fats now, making hay while the sun still shines. They ahve all their reservesd enegage dnoiw, and fight woith theior storngets brigade. If the Russians co´nsoldiate the front and can gring things to a crawl again, then this probably means the end of the drive towards the coat, Melitopol, and the railway for this year. One canntio swithc on and off monetum at will in war. One needs to gain it, and if one has it then one must make best and longest lasting use of it. There is no pause-button in the construction.

Originally Posted by Dargo

I think they will go forward after they consolidated this area, they do not have to take all those fortified city's (Russian occupation “authorities” reportedly began leaving the city of Tokmak.) kettle them supply wise and starve the Russians in it from their ammo will do the job. Don't know how the fortification is behind this line (Surovikin line), but time is coming for the leopards and other tanks in combo with attrition to destroy Russian supply.

The 82nd is equipped not with Leopards but Challenegers. Very slow - but very heavily protected. Also German Marders. I repeatedly red and heard they absolutely love the "outdated" Marder. For an IFV it is said to be very well protected too.


And the psycho war, yes, I tend to forget and ignore what that will do on the Russians. if true what you say and Russian officials already run from Tokmak, then yes - chances look good for Ukraine to strike deep beyond that.

EU purchases of Russian LNG up 40% compared to pre-war-levels. Translates into direct European payments into Russia's war treasury. Over 5 billions per year. The eU has bought 52% of all total Russian exports. The whole scheme of sanction and enmergy system change in Euzrope - is just a showact that doe snothng, but is more expensive than things were before. All fake things shining.

https://www.euronews.com/my-europe/2...ew-study-finds

[mapuc]

Saw this in the news yesterday, made me wonder what will happen to our aid to Ukraine if it turn out to be true

It's a spy thriller that has the potential to change the course of international politics: A year ago, a secret commando blew up the Nord Stream pipelines in the Baltic Sea. Since then, investigators have been searching for the perpetrators. The leads they have found are extremely politically sensitive.

https://www.spiegel.de/international...4-942d4a665778

Markus

[Catfish]

Originally Posted by Gorpet

How so? We may find out that NATO is no longer needed.

Right now during the invasion this is a dumb thing to say. If Putin has reached any goal it is to unite the world against him and more countries becoming NATO members. Surely because "Nato is not longer needed"
Or do you mean NATO is not needed in or for the US of A? Maybe in Trump's mind.

.NATO was defensive so megamind. Why are all these countries now wanting to join an organization and become an Aggressor against Russia.

"Become an aggressor against Russia", so you 'd say the US became an aggressor against Hitler in WW2. Fine.

And i must say right now i didn't even get a free Soviet Combat helmet.From the Afghan war.The American citizen didn't get any booty in their hands at all.No free gas,no free lands We got nothing but our son's who fought,they came home, Broken and **** on

Well I do not know much about the Afghan war, only that all wars, conquests or tried invasions for this land have failed since millenia.
Soldiers tend to die or come home broken and disillusionized, or sick. This is the outcome of all wars, won or lost.

So Catfish i can only assume that your either to old to fight and die? Or you need the young to die so you can live in Utopia over there west of the Sierra Mountains.

What the hell? When a country is unrightfully attacked my sympathy is for the attacked, is this hard to understand? So you say a country defending itself against Putin and being helped is an aggressor?
I am not too old to fight and die, I do not see an end of the war, not in Ukraine and not wherever Russia wants to try next. Belarus and Poland anyone? We have already mobilised and received equipment but I hope it will not be needed.

[August]

I thought this was pretty good:

[tonschk]

Friday, August 25, 2023
“Ukraine has already lost 400,000 men on the battlefield” - former Pentagon adviser

http://infobrics.org/post/39192



Ahmed Adel, Cairo-based geopolitics and political economy researcher

Douglas Macgregor, a retired colonel of the United States Army and a political analyst, told Tucker Carlson in an interview on his program on the social media network X, formerly known as Twitter, that Ukraine has already lost 400,000 soldiers in its war with Russia. His revelation comes as the New York Times reported that Ukraine’s counteroffensive is struggling because some of Kiev’s best troops are “in the wrong places.”

“I think all of the lies that have been told for more than a year and a half about “the Ukrainians are winning”, “Ukrainian causes just”, “the Russians are evil”, “the Russians are incompetent” - all of that is collapsing. And it's collapsing because what’s happening on the battlefield is horrific,” Macgregor told Carlson.

In this sense, the former adviser to the Department of Defense during the Presidency of Donald Trump affirmed that Ukraine had lost 400,000 men during the conflict with Russia.