UK Politics Thread

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Brace yourself - Corbyn's coming: get your sit-out box now!


https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-leeds-46814527


Well, today I have not much to say on all this, for the fifth of six builds in the Early Access program for Assetto Corsa Competizione is coming this evening, giving me access to the track of Zolder and the Jaguar GT3 car, which i have never driven before in any sim. Since Jaguar is not British anymore since 2008, Brexit debates cannot compete with the importance of this release, I admit.

Reminds me of the same scaremongering that took place as the millenium approached.

[Jimbuna]

Meeting the other party leaders is all well and good but I seriously doubt there will be any agreement everyone can sign off on.

Corbyn? Simply too embarrassing to talk about but he now finds himself stuck between a rock and a hard place so absolutely no sympathy there.

There is no Commons majority for any outcome so I'm sticking with my gut instinct that the UK will remain in the EU.

With todays announcement that Hitachi are about to halt work on the UK nuclear plant at Wylfa Newydd doesn't help either.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46900918

[STEED]

Mad Dog Jezzer laid his RED LINES down last night which MayBot could not agree to so he naffed off home for a cry. Today the Mad Dog is calling for a general election and making his big promises vote for me and it will be a new golden age...SOD OFF. The times I hear that rubbish from all of you lot makes me laugh.

[Jimbuna]

An interesting opinion from another forum I frequent.

A second referendum with a vote to leave would finish things for good, but ain't going to happen.

People should be in no doubt that the other EU members, on a geopolitical level, don't like or care about us as a people, they just like our net contribution to their funds. There should have been no doubt from the beginning that we were going to get any kind of helpful Brexit deal- which might encourage others to follow our lead. If we leave and stop paying in, it means that the rest have either to pay in more to cover the loss, or make cutbacks- from their viewpoint detestable options that they're all spitting tacks about. None of them give 2 figs about UK jobs or our economic prospects, and if we chicken out now and go crawling back, the EU will rightly recognize that we are weak, spineless and all talk but no trousers. It will be an absolute charter to allow the EU to bully us about at make decisions that could be contrary to UK interests, because they will know without any doubt that whatever they do, however corrupt and wasteful the EU gets, we will stay as a member, put up with things and support their decisions with our on going membership and funding, no matter what.

We have no choice but to leave now. A couple of years ago we challenged them to a game of chicken, they have fought back hard as you would expect, and we have to keep our nerve to win at whatever cost as the alternative- giving in- will be even worse.

When we leave, at the very least it will force the rest to re-examine how the whole shoddy EU outfit is managed in the future.

[Catfish]

^ lol of course. It is all the fault of the EU.
"People should be in no doubt that the other EU members [...] don't like or care about us as a people, they just like our net contribution to their funds."
Oh, perfectly clear. "We" don't like you, only your money. If it helps you keep thinking that.


https://www.ft.com/content/202a60c0-...d-09f7778e7377

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-br...-idUKKCN1M60P4

[STEED]

^^I can not see us leaving without a deal in place as MayBot needs to get trade deals on WTO rules and as it stands for example..You get a new job but you have not got your P60 tax form you are placed on emergency tax until you hand over the P60. And without those deals in place we are going to get screwed for years while all this is sorted out.

Her deal gave the EU all what they wanted and scraps for us no wonder it was rejected in that landslide vote. May as well stay in and man up, make it tough on the EU sod all their fines and any regulations that will do us no good. It's time to be the bad ass country that takes no brown stuff from them.

[Jimbuna]

Always interesting to learn of both sides of the debate...just a pity the politicians can't do likewise.

[Catfish]

It seems there is more hysteria than logical thinking, and a general greed for personal political advantages. The few reports i saw live from the House of Commons in our News made me sad, but of course they probably only broadcasted the most chaotic scenes.

Originally Posted by STEED

[...]
Her deal gave the EU all what they wanted and scraps for us no wonder it was rejected in that landslide vote. May as well stay in and man up, make it tough on the EU sod all their fines and any regulations that will do us no good. It's time to be the bad ass country that takes no brown stuff from them.

If you look at statistics of how the UK economy fared since joining back then, how can anyone dispute that?

May reportedly secures 'secret' Brexit [...] killing the Irish backstop problem:

May reportedly secures 'secret' Brexit concessions to keep whole of UK in a customs union — killing the Irish backstop problem


"While some of Prime Minister Theresa May’s critics have denounced her draft Brexit deal with the European Union as betrayal of Britain’s interests, the European Union has also given ground in the unprecedented negotiations":

Where the EU has made concessions in Brexit talks


What do brexiters expect when leaving the club, keeping all advantages while rejecting any obligation or responsibilty? Again, if you look at statistics of how the UK economy fared since joining back then how can anyone dispute that?
Border control alright, but all those bloody foreigners are then invading England via Ireland instead of Dover, and this fixes the problem? Do you think real criminals like those clans arrive via boat, as fugitives?

I guess the word for those real successful terrorists and criminals is "Invisibles", meaning they have the english citizenship and are free to move anyway. I know MI5 or whoever already targets those, but this has nothing to do with Farage's fear mongering of foreigners stealing, taking away jobs and raping innocent minors 24 hours a day.

[Skybird]

All this reminds me of a story once told by Paul Watzlawick, a famous psychologist and communication theoretician.

Illustrating how strongly people and even animals base their daily behaviour and acting routines on habits and beliefs, he told of a man writing him he had a dog, and every morning the following happens in the house: the dog had formed a love for - milk. And every morning his master went to the kitchen and the dog followed him but raced to the garden to fulfill his daily morning toilet routine at the tree, then returning enthusiastically to the kitchen and slobberng the milk that his master meanwhile had placed on the floor.

One morning, the milk was all out, and the dog returned from the garden toilet and then stood bewildered before the empty bowl. What you think the dog did?

It raced back to the garden and raised a leg at the tree (although in vain), and returned to the kitchen, assuming that now all things should be right and milk should be there. And it did it again, and then again.

Politicians are so disconnected from reality that they cannot imagine that their usual ceremonies and magical routines of endless babbling and doing backdoor deals and trades under the hand one day could not make things run in the usual fashion they got used to expect when doing the game right. And I do not even talk of Black Swan events. May reminds me of that dog that stands perplexed at the empty bowl and runs back and forth between that tree and the kitchen.

Either this outcome was her plan, as I still assume, to let the political caste get away with not being held responsible when cancelling brexit and ignoring the referendum, or she is an incredibly stupid woman. Which maybe she is additionally to the first possibility, I don't know.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Catfish

May reportedly secures 'secret' Brexit concessions to keep whole of UK in a customs union — killing the Irish backstop problem

Where the EU has made concessions in Brexit talks

Aren't both those articles a little old?

[Catfish]

^ November 2018. Were there major changes in the 'deal' since then?

It was all negotiated, and i guess no one here nor in the UK has any idea why the majority did not support this deal. Apart from gut feelings and some trying to gain personal political advantages, selling themselves as the saviours of THE UK and brexit.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Catfish

^ November 2018. Were there major changes in the 'deal' since then?

My apologies, I initially thought you were revealing some sudden groundbreaking news.

[Catfish]

^ Which is what i do not understand, it was all laid out months ago. Maybe May had a communications problem? No, i do not mean this as a joke.

@Skybird what you refer to is the cargo cult? Whatever, a lot of deals are being prepared behind closed doors indeed, like it or not.

[Catfish]

Some commenting opinionated voices from Germany, for a change:
(Google translate, sometimes very badly..)

https://translate.google.com/transla...inien-ueberall

[Jimbuna]

May must inform the Commons on Monday in person or via a letter if she prefers, what her next plan is and the vote on said plan will take place on 29th January.

Not much time to formulate a plan byut sufficient to negotiate it.

Hopefully all sides will come up with something that can be moved forward on.