THE Ultimate Animation of Crew Thread

11-08-10, 08:10 PM

OK.
Let us now get techy on this subject!
First I must state Credits.
Ref, Anvart, DiveingDuck, Thunder, and Skwasjer,
added in nearly everything I know on this subject.

Changeing ALL Crew animations can now be done.

It's a BIG project for those that wish to do it.
S3D can handle the work.
I've tested it and it's totally a done deal to replace MeshAnimation stuff,
as we see fit.

The sky is now the limit Mates!

11-08-10, 08:11 PM

First, copy The Body_01.dat to a safe working space.
then open it with S3D,
From there open the POS_20mmTwin_UFlak.anm file.
Then export the needed MeshAnimationData as a rawchunk.

Name this as you wish and close the file the POS_20mmTwin_UFlak.anm file.
We are done with it for now.

Back to Body_01.dat........
Here's how it looks stock.

Here's how it looks with that RawChunk pasted in!

Now you can export or import MeshAnimations as you wish for the Crew!

Just move the newly imported MA's to the correct files by rawchunk.

If you want textures as I had in a simple avi?
You'll need to add the needed stuff.
I'm not going to teach you that here.
There's plenty of S3D information to teach you how.
Talk to the SH4 Modder Guys if you need help.
They know S3D!

Hans Witteman · 11-08-10, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by privateer

First, copy The Body_01.dat to a safe working

Now you can export or import MeshAnimations as you wish for the Crew!

Just move the newly imported MA's to the correct files by rawchunk.

Hi privateer,

You are giving us here the possibility to eternally mod SH3

Like i said let's make history a very present moment to share

Well done mate keep that energy high

Best regards Hans

11-08-10, 09:57 PM

Hans,

I wish nothing more then to extend this Game as it should be.
What I learn or discover?
I want it passed to others as soon as I can.
I am not an expert with S3D.
I do many things in Hex because I know that way.
S3D will do what we want in a fantastic way.
It just gets takeing use to.

11-08-10, 10:04 PM

Now that you can SEE the Animation running in S3D?
Export it.
You'll need the obj files to copy a better mesh to.
You want a higher mesh body?
Fine! Do it!
BUT!
As Gun Animation moves?
Does your import match?

We can not change Gun Movement!
Your animations MUST match stock movements.

Hans Witteman · 11-09-10, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by privateer

Now that you can SEE the Animation running in S3D?
Export it.
You'll need the obj files to copy a better mesh to.
You want a higher mesh body?
Fine! Do it!
BUT!
As Gun Animation moves?
Does your import match?

We can not change Gun Movement!
Your animations MUST match stock movements.

Hi again my friend,

The gun animation is ok it is only when the crew is manning the C/30 i mean when he point directly at the sky the gun shoulder pad is lower to the pelvis area because of the new gun rotation axis i had to change to fit the correct gun length.

In a word i have to make the crew to bend lower to fit new gun position i will post pictures of it since it worth a thousand words

I can still live with that since i never look at my gunner externally and it is only on full extent rotation i prefer my realistic C/30 with this little annoyance rather then stock flak

Best regards Hans

divingbluefrog · 11-09-10, 04:55 AM

Hi,

It works great with MeshAnimationData. But did you also succeed with MeshAnimationData2?

By the way, I'm struggling for a while now with a correlated problem.
I can't export the mesh Body01 with S3D without loosing a lot of vts. The original mesh has 15206 vts. Roughly, 1751 faces connected to more than 5000 Vts (3 vts by face) and this for the three channels thus the 15000 vts. I suspect this unusual cut-out to be tied to the internal process of MeshAnimationData2.
When opening the obj files, vertices and faces are OK, but I ended up with only 1216 vts for the main and uv2 files and 1285 for the uv3 file.
Of course, reimporting this mesh in Body01.dat goes to a wracked mesh in game.
I've deciphered 90% of the internal structure of the model chunk and until now I've found nothing wrong.
Any hints will be welcome...

Philipp_Thomsen · 11-09-10, 11:19 AM

Maybe now the crew will react to tense depth charging in a more realistic way, other then bend their knees and look around slowly.

Is it possible to make the crews run from one end to the other of the uboat? Would be cool to simulate crew running to the bow when crash diving.

Hans Witteman · 11-09-10, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by divingbluefrog

Hi,

It works great with MeshAnimationData. But did you also succeed with MeshAnimationData2?

By the way, I'm struggling for a while now with a correlated problem.
I can't export the mesh Body01 with S3D without loosing a lot of vts. The original mesh has 15206 vts. Roughly, 1751 faces connected to more than 5000 Vts (3 vts by face) and this for the three channels thus the 15000 vts. I suspect this unusual cut-out to be tied to the internal process of MeshAnimationData2.
When opening the obj files, vertices and faces are OK, but I ended up with only 1216 vts for the main and uv2 files and 1285 for the uv3 file.
Of course, reimporting this mesh in Body01.dat goes to a wracked mesh in game.
I've deciphered 90% of the internal structure of the model chunk and until now I've found nothing wrong.
Any hints will be welcome...

Hi divingbluefrog,

I would like to know what is the difference between the two MeshAnimationData and MeshAnimationData02?

Best regards Hans

divingbluefrog · 11-09-10, 02:04 PM

Hi Hans,

Well, it's near to the 1 million $ question...
MeshAnimationData2 is the type of animations used mainly by the crew, as on the coning tower during watch.
You can find them for example in POSW.anm. I'm able to import them in a .dat file and they indeed show in S3D. That's how I found that the first in the previous file was the one that is called when a watchman fines tune his binoculars. But once imported, I get the associated wracked mesh, thefore my question to Privateer.
I've finished with the structure of the model chunk, and there is something disturbing with the way it handles the uv3 vts.

Alex · 11-09-10, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by privateer

Changeing ALL Crew animations can now be done.

Doing the spadework on a new project once again !

Modders got the help needed, now let's see what they're going to come up with.

11-09-10, 06:11 PM

@divingbluefrog,

I'll be looking closer at all the animation stuff as we go along.
As soon as I have a solid answer on anything, I'll post it here.

I mostly wanted to get people started on this as the more people
working with it?
The faster we make headway.

Hans Witteman · 11-10-10, 02:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by divingbluefrog

Hi Hans,

Well, it's near to the 1 million $ question...
MeshAnimationData2 is the type of animations used mainly by the crew, as on the coning tower during watch.
You can find them for example in POSW.anm. I'm able to import them in a .dat file and they indeed show in S3D. That's how I found that the first in the previous file was the one that is called when a watchman fines tune his binoculars. But once imported, I get the associated wracked mesh, thefore my question to Privateer.
I've finished with the structure of the model chunk, and there is something disturbing with the way it handles the uv3 vts.

Hi again divingbluefrog,

Yes i understand some controllers are still to identify correctly, what baffling me is that even if i pull one single vertices on any body or head we got the same wacky mesh in game, normally since i was teaching animation and morphing then changing one vertex won't screw the animation if the amount of vertices remain unchanged.

So my guess so far would be that a kind of a shell exist in an ACT file that identify the mesh integrity so finding that shell trigger could lead to success. In a word we need to find a way to lure the game engine to identify our new mesh as the original one.

Let's team on this and i am convinced we will succeed, for the moment i am pretty busy finishing my own mod and it is a hell of a task for single man but the minute i will have spare time i will focus on crew animation i would love to be able to do it because i can animate anything professionally i am in the field since the early beginning under DOS.

Best regards Hans

Anvart · 11-10-10, 04:59 AM

IIRC, MeshAnimationData2 has been conceived for characters...
MeshAnimationData - for other objects...
... the difference is that MeshAnimationData2 has two frames with the number 0 and with the same vertexes coordinates... i think, for the better pairing of sequence of different animations for the characters.
***
Added.
The cause of violations of the mesh during character animation (after export/import of character's model using S3D) is to optimize UV-coordinates (vt), S3D makes it automatically... see:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...&postcount=552
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...&postcount=554

Pak3D does not optimizes UV-coordinates therefore this problem is absent... but there are many other problems...

divingbluefrog · 11-10-10, 05:57 AM

Obviously I'm not as much skilled in animations as you are

but I can deal with basic ones.
There are three points that should light bips on our board.
- First, why put 15000 vt in a mesh if the model only use 4000 of them?
- Second and more disturbing : it seems that MeshAnimationData2 is not fully tied to the model. I made the following test : after having imported the animation in a .dat file and gotten the "classic" behavior, I kept the animation but changed the 3D model to something totally different, the pescarus mesh indeed. And the mesh got animated! It looked like nothing but nonetheless the mesh moved!
That leads me to think that MeshanimationData2 acts perhaps more like a filter for a mesh "prepared" to it.
- Third, MeshAnimationData is called inside a <notset> node but MeshAnimationData2 is called inside a MeshAnimation node. What is the true nature of the MeshAnimation controller?
A lot of questions, so few answers...But as said, we are just at the beginning of the process...

Ironically, animations aren't my main goal. At the end of August, I began a project that I had in mind for a long time. A pause in my current career was the opportunity to start. I didn't know I was opening the Pandora box. From one problem to another, I ended up Hex editing crew meshes...

I don't doubt that your TypeII will match the quality of the torpedo designed for it, so it's worth waiting...

11-08-10, 08:10 PM	#1
Madox58 Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	THE Ultimate Animation of Crew Thread OK. Let us now get techy on this subject! First I must state Credits. Ref, Anvart, DiveingDuck, Thunder, and Skwasjer, added in nearly everything I know on this subject. Changeing ALL Crew animations can now be done. It's a BIG project for those that wish to do it. S3D can handle the work. I've tested it and it's totally a done deal to replace MeshAnimation stuff, as we see fit. The sky is now the limit Mates!

11-08-10, 08:11 PM	#2
Madox58 Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	First, copy The Body_01.dat to a safe working space. then open it with S3D, From there open the POS_20mmTwin_UFlak.anm file. Then export the needed MeshAnimationData as a rawchunk. Name this as you wish and close the file the POS_20mmTwin_UFlak.anm file. We are done with it for now. Back to Body_01.dat........ Here's how it looks stock. Here's how it looks with that RawChunk pasted in! Now you can export or import MeshAnimations as you wish for the Crew! Just move the newly imported MA's to the correct files by rawchunk. If you want textures as I had in a simple avi? You'll need to add the needed stuff. I'm not going to teach you that here. There's plenty of S3D information to teach you how. Talk to the SH4 Modder Guys if you need help. They know S3D! Last edited by Madox58; 11-08-10 at 09:48 PM.

11-09-10, 11:19 AM	#8
Philipp_Thomsen Old Gang Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Drunk at the whorehouse Posts: 2,278 Downloads: 146 Uploads: 0	Maybe now the crew will react to tense depth charging in a more realistic way, other then bend their knees and look around slowly. Is it possible to make the crews run from one end to the other of the uboat? Would be cool to simulate crew running to the bow when crash diving. __________________ To each his own

11-10-10, 04:59 AM	#14
Anvart Admiral Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Russia ® Posts: 2,492 Downloads: 122 Uploads: 1	IIRC, MeshAnimationData2 has been conceived for characters... MeshAnimationData - for other objects... ... the difference is that MeshAnimationData2 has two frames with the number 0 and with the same vertexes coordinates... i think, for the better pairing of sequence of different animations for the characters. *** Added. The cause of violations of the mesh during character animation (after export/import of character's model using S3D) is to optimize UV-coordinates (vt), S3D makes it automatically... see: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...&postcount=552 http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...&postcount=554 Pak3D does not optimizes UV-coordinates therefore this problem is absent... but there are many other problems... __________________ Alex ® Moses said: "Don't create yourself an idol"... Last edited by Anvart; 03-01-12 at 12:37 AM.

11-08-10, 09:57 PM	#4
Madox58 Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Hans, I wish nothing more then to extend this Game as it should be. What I learn or discover? I want it passed to others as soon as I can. I am not an expert with S3D. I do many things in Hex because I know that way. S3D will do what we want in a fantastic way. It just gets takeing use to.

11-08-10, 10:04 PM	#5
Madox58 Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Now that you can SEE the Animation running in S3D? Export it. You'll need the obj files to copy a better mesh to. You want a higher mesh body? Fine! Do it! BUT! As Gun Animation moves? Does your import match? We can not change Gun Movement! Your animations MUST match stock movements.

11-09-10, 04:55 AM	#7
divingbluefrog Medic Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 164 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 1	Hi, It works great with MeshAnimationData. But did you also succeed with MeshAnimationData2? By the way, I'm struggling for a while now with a correlated problem. I can't export the mesh Body01 with S3D without loosing a lot of vts. The original mesh has 15206 vts. Roughly, 1751 faces connected to more than 5000 Vts (3 vts by face) and this for the three channels thus the 15000 vts. I suspect this unusual cut-out to be tied to the internal process of MeshAnimationData2. When opening the obj files, vertices and faces are OK, but I ended up with only 1216 vts for the main and uv2 files and 1285 for the uv3 file. Of course, reimporting this mesh in Body01.dat goes to a wracked mesh in game. I've deciphered 90% of the internal structure of the model chunk and until now I've found nothing wrong. Any hints will be welcome...

11-09-10, 02:04 PM	#10
divingbluefrog Medic Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 164 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 1	Hi Hans, Well, it's near to the 1 million $ question... MeshAnimationData2 is the type of animations used mainly by the crew, as on the coning tower during watch. You can find them for example in POSW.anm. I'm able to import them in a .dat file and they indeed show in S3D. That's how I found that the first in the previous file was the one that is called when a watchman fines tune his binoculars. But once imported, I get the associated wracked mesh, thefore my question to Privateer. I've finished with the structure of the model chunk, and there is something disturbing with the way it handles the uv3 vts.

11-09-10, 06:11 PM	#12
Madox58 Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	@divingbluefrog, I'll be looking closer at all the animation stuff as we go along. As soon as I have a solid answer on anything, I'll post it here. I mostly wanted to get people started on this as the more people working with it? The faster we make headway.

11-10-10, 05:57 AM	#15
divingbluefrog Medic Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 164 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 1	Obviously I'm not as much skilled in animations as you are but I can deal with basic ones. There are three points that should light bips on our board. - First, why put 15000 vt in a mesh if the model only use 4000 of them? - Second and more disturbing : it seems that MeshAnimationData2 is not fully tied to the model. I made the following test : after having imported the animation in a .dat file and gotten the "classic" behavior, I kept the animation but changed the 3D model to something totally different, the pescarus mesh indeed. And the mesh got animated! It looked like nothing but nonetheless the mesh moved! That leads me to think that MeshanimationData2 acts perhaps more like a filter for a mesh "prepared" to it. - Third, MeshAnimationData is called inside a <notset> node but MeshAnimationData2 is called inside a MeshAnimation node. What is the true nature of the MeshAnimation controller? A lot of questions, so few answers...But as said, we are just at the beginning of the process... Ironically, animations aren't my main goal. At the end of August, I began a project that I had in mind for a long time. A pause in my current career was the opportunity to start. I didn't know I was opening the Pandora box. From one problem to another, I ended up Hex editing crew meshes... I don't doubt that your TypeII will match the quality of the torpedo designed for it, so it's worth waiting...