TLAMs very unreliable - most just slide along ground

[bottomcrawler]

Patched to 1.04, with the LwAmi 3.09 mod. No other mods installed.

I'm trying to finish the final mission of the stock campaign, and all goes smoothly until I have to kill the Chinese base with TLAMs. I've saved a game right before launch (all hatches open, in position, just the targeting left to do), and I've reloaded it probably 30-40 times by now, and the maximum amount of damage I've been able to do is about 30-40 % on the southernmost building, 10-20 % on the middle one, and no damage at all on the northernmost site (not a single hit recorded in several dozen launches!).
After the first few attempts, I turned on "Show truth" to really make sure the targeting was spot on.

Most of the TLAMs either hit the ground with no effect or hit the ground and slide along it for a good few hundred yards and just stop. It looks like the missiles hit a second layer below ground level, and slide between the two layers. Once they stop sliding, their viewpoint remains until I select something else, even though the weapon object itself disappears.

The hit rate is probably 1 in 5, or worse. And by hit rate, I mean the ones that actually explode. Sadly, even a direct hit with an explosion doesn't mean there is damage to the structure. That rate is even lower.

I've set up custom missions to test this in more detail, and TLAM performance is really extremely poor. I've found that I need to reposition the targeting marker to get the coordinates to change from zeroes in grey to actual numbers in green (a bug?), but doing so doesn't affect hit rate or damage done once they do explode.

Is this a known bug (either in stock DW or the LwAmi mod), or something more "local" (as in a preference file that needs trashing)?

Please, help me if you can!

[Robsoie]

By any chances, is there one or more SAM defense base somewhere around ?
They can shot down missiles from your sub before they reach their targets.
Either try to destroy some of those bases by launching several missiles on them, hoping one will get through, or plan the missiles waypoint to move far from the possible SAM reach.

[Dr.Sid]

This exactly was discussed short time ago. However at the moment I don't see how to look at older threads

Edit: found it: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=160189 .. but as I look at it, they don't seem to come to any conclusion anyway.
You have to select longer time range in the combo down on the page.

[bottomcrawler]

Thanks! I've searched plenty, but none of the keyword combinations I used seemed to be in that thread.

I'm somewhat happy to see that it wasn't just me, but still sad that there doesn't seem to be a decent solution to the problem.

[Molon Labe]

this might actually be a different problem. Or maybe it's the same. Hard to say for sure.

What's going on in this mission is the missiles are being shutdown for hitting the water. BUT, in some cases, DW can treat missiles striking on land as if they've hit water, if its close enough to the coast. In other words, TLAMs suck on the coast. It doesn't help that the target is actually on the water.

I'm going to see if I can find a way to hit this thing by playing around a little. So far setting it to hit 500yd inland isn't working, but maybe if I alter the flight path a bit...

I might have to seriously consider giving the TLAMs an upgrade to TACTOMs for 3.10. That might be a solution to this problem---to allow the weapon to home in on coastal objects the same way it would for a ship (which would also give the weapon some ASUW capability as well)

Originally Posted by bottomcrawler

Thanks! I've searched plenty, but none of the keyword combinations I used seemed to be in that thread.

I'm somewhat happy to see that it wasn't just me, but still sad that there doesn't seem to be a decent solution to the problem.

It is a stock a brutal mistake of the engine of game.

In RA mod the attempt is made to minimize this bug.

We have refused any base principles which used SCS in the doctrines.

Also have constructed the new algorithm doctrines for -RA- addon.

Now, any of mod (Lwami or Alfa Tau Mod) which is under construction on the basis of the stupid reserved algorithm from SCS - will have the same bug (However as well as many others the same bugs).

Get -RA- v 1.1 - and you will not receive inconvenience from these bugs.

I think, for the informed people already it is clear that LWAMI or AT3 he is simply dead - he corpse ... :-)

[Molon Labe]

OK...

I've had some success by placing the final waypoint on the land directly next to the target AND adjusting the other waypoints so that the missile approaches from overland (in this case, from the north).

Good enough to complete the mission? Probably not. The damage per hit is only around 10% and it looks like the triggers are set up to require all 3 buildings to be destroyed. I think you can get one.

As mentioned in the other post with the airport, the way to go might be to scale down the damage needed to about 25%.

[goldorak]

Originally Posted by -GrayOwl-

Get -RA- v 1.1 - and you will not receive inconvenience from these bugs.

I think, for the informed people already it is clear that LWAMI or AT3 he is simply dead - he corpse ... :-)

RA 1.1 is still not available.
On the other hand, AT3 yeah seems to be dead and its a pity because some years ago they were planning big features for the 3.2 version.
In any case some of those big features have been implemented finally in RA (working DSRV ) so its no big deal in the end.
Most old timers, really don't know about AT3 or RA, and prefer Lwami because it was the first mod to come out for DW and the database is open so anybody can peek, change values and so on.

Originally Posted by goldorak

RA 1.1 is still not available.
On the other hand, AT3 yeah seems to be dead and its a pity because some years ago they were planning big features for the 3.2 version.
In any case some of those big features have been implemented finally in RA (working DSRV ) so its no big deal in the end.
Most old timers, really don't know about AT3 or RA, and prefer Lwami because it was the first mod to come out for DW and the database is open so anybody can peek, change values and so on.

On a secret I can to you speak - generally, the interfaces for ALFA TAU 3 were made by me, (offsets located øò DLL's - are described for Aaken) in exchange for 3D of model KA-27, TU-142 Udaloy.
And even AT3 would be inaccessible without our help. :-)
We love DW.....

[goldorak]

Originally Posted by -GrayOwl-

On a secret I can to you speak - generally, the interfaces for ALFA TAU 3 were made by me, (offsets located øò DLL's - are described for Aaken) in exchange for 3D of model KA-27, TU-142 Udaloy.
And even AT3 would be inaccessible without our help. :-)
We love DW.....

you had your hands everywhere.
Well its not a surprise since you have quite a talent for "hacking" the files.

Originally Posted by goldorak

you had your hands everywhere.
Well its not a surprise since you have quite a talent for "hacking" the files.

No, it is simple we have the large desire to make game better, than she is.
Experience - are all.

[dd149]

We can't thank enough the modders who make such incredible improvements to the original game (which was very much left alone and bugged by sonalysts). In France the community is eagerly awaiting 1.1. too.
Cheers GrayOwl, U and the RA team made DW the Falcon 4 of Submarine sims, still alive, and still better and better. Спасибо

[krashkart]

Did something change with DW? I don't recall ever having problems with TLAMs as have been described here. Odd.

[Dr.Sid]

They generally work. It's only problem in this mission. First the terrain is quite complex around the target. Then the target requires a lot of damage and there is little room for error.
I remember having the problem when playing the campaign for the first time, with DW 1.0.

Btw. I'm not sure .. but isn't US fleet around in this mission ? I remember in some mission it was very helpful to promote the target to link, and friendly ships sent their TLAMs too. Or was it different mission ?

[Molon Labe]

There might be a US fleet, but if there is it is hundreds of miles to the south. Which still might be close enough for a TLAM.

I don't think it's just this mission. The first DW mission I ever created, Taiwan ARG Escort, I must have run dozens of times as a test mission... and the success of the TLAMs fired at the coastal missile batteries is only about 50%...some of them just fail to explode.