1914: Shells of Fury

[Hitman]

I'm happy to see that you guys have gotten into SOF I bought it some time ago and like it very much, and since I can speak german it has never been a problem for me with the translations.

I tinkered a bit under the game's hood and it is certainly very open. I added a graded reticle to the scope for shooting, but it needs the proper calibration. Manual targeting is possible, but there are three problems:

First, you need a wiz-wheel to calculate torpedo deflection

Second, you can't set two of the historic Gyro Angles used by germans in WW1 (90º and 270º), which limits a lot your shooting tactics :hmm:

Third, there is no accurate bearing indicator on your sub that tells you the bearing you are looking at The horrible submarine silhouette with the yellow field of view and red ball representing the target is unusable, and for accurate torpedo shooting a la WW1 you need precise bearings as there is no TDC and you must aim with the whole sub (Like WW1/2 airplanes)

As for the scope being difficult to bring to bear into the enemy, press the shift key when moving it and it will do it slowly

Aside from that, the game has only a major nit-pick for me, and that's the spotting distance of the enemy. They see your scope and sub too easily! In real life anything above 10.000 metres would mean your sub small silhouette is invisible even at day, and 4000 metres onwards no persicope wake is visible, except in flat calm seas Any ideas where the files for that are located???

P.S: the game is a gold pot for modders....even 3D models for new ships are easy to add according to Seeadler

[CB..]

HI HM...
i can help with the scope being spotted issue ...

there's one file edit method possibility

tho i'll admit to not having treid as yet

but what i do is raise the scope so it just breaks the water...there is a height at which you can see the enemy but the game doesn't register them as being able to see you..ie the red dot on the compass object doesn't appear and the mini map stays clear also...at this stage you can actualy ram the ship and he will not have spotted you..(tho not recomended ..but you see what i mean!)

it makes targeting even more tricky BUT you can pop the scope up briefly to get the map screen contact on view again...and this gives you about a minutes grace after you lower the scope to "stealth" level again...that torpedo "line" on the minimap is my best helper for aiming...(i am it has to said completely bluudy hopeless at it tho lol)

so that's the trick round the scope being spotted...and keeping an eye on the funny red bar object which acts as an indication of how likely you are to spotted..is that bar an realism option? i dunno...:hmm: probably ought to be..i stiil have trouble understanding the german text so am never sure what option does what...i have been trying to turn that damn pop up message thing of.....i fire a torp and it pops up a message asking me if i really ment to fire the torp or not....making aiming EVEM more traumatic as the torp gets lauched only after i press JA on the pop up thin..
can you turn it off.?

ok..the other methodology round the spotting distance is by editing the

StateEngineTemplates.txt (main root folder)

this stores all the various AI instructions the game uses...

here's an example

c:0,1,PlayerNear:g#2
a:1,CreateSimObject:#1
a:1,GoTo:g#2,0,#4
a:2,GoTo:g#3,0,#4
a:3,Ramm:
c:1,2,LastDestinationReached:1500
c:2,1,LastDestinationReached:1500
c:1,3,EnemyVisible:5000
c:2,3,EnemyVisible:5000
c:3,1,-EnemyVisible:6000

i reckon editing the

EnemyVisible:5000

entrys is liable to reap results...tho not neccesarily all the time...as i think the AUTO_SHIPPING has it's own rules not so far found any where..

the auto shipping is the vessels included in the missions regardless of any
ships written into the missions script...

if you open one of the missions scripts (scipts folder)

you will see little tags added to most of the missions

like this

*SDensity1915
*TOstengland
*PKanal
*TKanal

tage one uses the shipdensity.txts in the root folder
TOstengland uses the ships and routes shown in the Tostengland.txt inthe scripts folder

etc etc

these templates (bit like SH2 i suppose?)

are automaticaly loaded

tho how the shipdensity ones work i have no idea as yet...

say do you know the crush depth for the subs...???

that red bar on the depth meter seems widly optomistic !!!!
i can't get to half that depth in the u35 without crushing the hull...

lol...again it's quite a high "realism" rating that in it self...
you have NO idea what your crush depth is at all lol..and once the hull starts to go..(that sub hull meter goes red) even blowing ballast and coming up rapidly doesn't often save you...there's some "roll on" cumalative effect at work ..?

it's quite a nervy experience diving in these subs..!!

H are there any other hot keys like the shift pan option..is there a
"bring view to front"
or set heading to view or any other handy ones??
the game is a bit cluncky and awkward control key wise..a few extra options would help a lot..


yes it is a huge game for modders...got myself an X file importer exporter for 3dsmax and am trying to figure out the correct settings to export with for the game....no luck so far but maybe seeadler has a few tips??
it might even be possible to create 3d interface screens i dunno bowt that tho..

there is a zeppelin in the game got to figure out how to get that going...

cheers HM

i've added a SOF mod section to my site....do you want to put the scope mod you've made on it...it might help my targeting abit!!

[Hitman]

but what i do is raise the scope so it just breaks the water...there is a height at which you can see the enemy but the game doesn't register them as being able to see you..ie the red dot on the compass object doesn't appear and the mini map stays clear also...at this stage you can actualy ram the ship and he will not have spotted you..(tho not recomended ..but you see what i mean!)

Ahhh I had noticed those two different stituations, but had no idea in one of them you would not get detected :hmm:

ok..the other methodology round the spotting distance is by editing the

StateEngineTemplates.txt (main root folder)

this stores all the various AI instructions the game uses...

here's an example

c:0,1,PlayerNear:g#2
a:1,CreateSimObject:#1
a:1,GoTo:g#2,0,#4
a:2,GoTo:g#3,0,#4
a:3,Ramm:
c:1,2,LastDestinationReached:1500
c:2,1,LastDestinationReached:1500
c:1,3,EnemyVisible:5000
c:2,3,EnemyVisible:5000
c:3,1,-EnemyVisible:6000

i reckon editing the

EnemyVisible:5000

entrys is liable to reap results...tho not neccesarily all the time...as i think the AUTO_SHIPPING has it's own rules not so far found any where..

Coool now I know where it is

say do you know the crush depth for the subs...???

that red bar on the depth meter seems widly optomistic !!!!
i can't get to half that depth in the u35 without crushing the hull...

No, I also experimented the surprise crush but looking at historic figures it seems that design depth was 50 metres, though some dived to 90 and even 100 metres without crushing :hmm:

i've added a SOF mod section to my site....do you want to put the scope mod you've made on it...it might help my targeting abit!!

The scale is not yet calibrated correctly and as such serves not very much. However, I will try to find time to do it properly

In itself, shooting without manual TDC is very easy as long as you stay at right angles to your target's course...All you need to know is the target speed and course, get on a 90º course to it yourself and calculate from the speed of the target and the torpedo speed how muany degrees before the enemy crosses your bow you must shoot. An example:

Your course: 0º (North) Your chosen torpedo speed: 35 knots

Target course: 270 º (West) Target speed: 8 knots

You see the target currently at 45º to your right. When do you fire?

Easy: You must fire at the moment when the torpedo and target will take the same time to arrive at the same point, and you can calculate that with the Law of Sines, or, more easily, let a slide ruler calculate that for you. We align the 90º mark in the Sine scale with our Torpedo Speed (35 in the normal metric scale) and opposite the speed of the target in the metric scale (8) we read in the Sine scale 13,5º

So, you would turn your scope towards the target exactly 13,5 degrees from your bow (That's why I need badly an accurate bearing read in the scope) and when it crosses your scope crosshari you would shoot. Torpedo and target would then meet exactly in front of your bow

If you are interested in knowing a bit more about that all, get the tutorial I wrote for the S-Boats: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=120095

It's authentic WW1 method of shooting and trust me, it gets addictive

[CB..]

cheers HM

seems to me for the accurate scope markings what you need to know is perhaps..the exact angle of view allowed by the scope...

it's what i sometimes used to do in SH2...get the right distance away from a target so that with the scope pointing dead ahead....(is there a centre view or view to heading keyboard short cut?)

and fire the torp the second the bow of the ship comes into the view

only worked at close range tho...i'm afraid i have enought trouble counting my toes ..so slide rule calculation ..well the ship would have reached port by the time i had it worked out ..


i reckon the crush depth thing is pretty much spot on then with 50 metres ..or some form of damage is begun at that depth which grows more irretrievable as the seconds tick by if you don't come up abit quickly..


any more keyboard shortcuts ??

that shift pan option is gem...not mentioned in the manual at all...more please!

how the heck do i turn of the pop up "are you sure you want to launch a torpedo" message...
it's maddening..

[Hitman]

seems to me for the accurate scope markings what you need to know is perhaps..the exact angle of view allowed by the scope...

Yes, more or less so

It's just a matter of creating a mission where a target of known heigth and length is placed at exactly 1000 metres, take a screenshot and see how many pixels it extends horizontally and vertically. The rest is very easy, as it only requires subdividing the vision area in the regular divisions that fit best (1 degree per mark, 0.25, degree per mark or whatever)

only worked at close range tho...i'm afraid i have enought trouble counting my toes ..so slide rule calculation ..well the ship would have reached port by the time i had it worked out ..

Don't worry it can be done much easier....just a simple table (That can be added to the scope screen) showing for the possible torpedo speeds in horizontal colums the proper deflection angle in vertical columns and that's all. Precalculated stuff works well here for the typichal 90º shot and it's quick as hell : Check the target speed, consult the table for the torpedo speed you chose and wait until the enemy reaches the proper periscope mark (Thus the division in degrees of the scale). Range is irrelevant in this kind of firing solution

any more keyboard shortcuts ??

that shift pan option is gem...not mentioned in the manual at all...more please!

It is mentioned in page 20 of my manual, though in reference to the binoculars...works also for the scope, though

how the heck do i turn of the pop up "are you sure you want to launch a torpedo" message...
it's maddening..

According to the manual (Page 15, section "Torpedoraum", paragraph nº 4) the pop up appears only when no target is logged at the moment of firing, so as to avoid that you accidentally shoot a torpedo that has not been aimed at anything.

[CB..]

Cheers HM ...the manual is a puzzle to me..can't cope much with german..i found the centre view key tho (5 on the Num keypad)..so that's a start..
i can practice on some slow mechants

i'll practice it up a little tho...you know me i'm more into the process of finding the ships than sinking them really !-
that's what i'm working towards with the campaign....because the dynamic radio messages giving lat long course and speed work very well and accurate..(important !)...they can be used to plot the ship routes on the map slowly allowing you to track them down....that's what gets me going...gradualy bit by bit tracking down a ship by checking the incoming radio messages..plotting them on the map ..then eventualy there it is..."smoke on the horizon" as it were...love that side of things ..

i've sussed that with the campaign missions...nearly all the ships you encounter are more or less thrown at you by the auto shipping set up...(bit like airbase spawned ships in SH2).....and that this is controled by the shipdensity.txt...

if i remove the reference to the shipdensity.txt from the missions files

*SDensity1914
*TOstengland
*PKanal
*TKanal

just leaving the route templates

thus

*TOstengland
*PKanal
*TKanal

then the only shipping that will be encountered in the missions will be properly routed and can be for the most part monitored and reported on by the dynamic radio message function..meaning that your tonnage depends on your tracking the shipping down and a dash of good luck at the same time....kinda like manual ship finding instead of auto ship finding you see what i mean..

to be honest i don't even bother maning the deck gun myself..lol i'm happy watching the crew man the gun and peering at the results thro the binoc's..heck there's some good damage effects in the game...bits exploding and flying off ..

i would like to try a little more torp targeting as i go along tho...as i find the auto "TDC" an absolute pig anyway..can't get a lock on the target from the scope view UNLESS i put the scope up high enough for HIM to see ME as well!!!...catch 22..so i end up manual targeting and almost allways missing!
sounds like that pop up message is here to stay for me...argghh

you can't even just press ENTER to confirm the shooting...you have to mouse click the JA
why didn't they incorporate it into the gameplay with a splash of colour by having a "preparing tube one for firing sir" pop up which you then press "JA" to launch the torp.. i think the pop ups are kinda ok..but they just put them across in such a way as to remind you your playing a a game ..it interupts the immersion..and why not have a POP UP screen of the sub entering port (AOTD style) instead of the strange end mission count down affair..now that's the right place for a decent pop up if ever there was one lol!!

[Chock]

Just a reminder for all of you getting into this game about this I made for it to help anyone struggling with aiming the torpedoes:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...Solution+chart

I did a couple of other mods for it a while ago too, markers on the periscope, that kind of thing, but what I want to know is can anyone figure out how to mod the camera so it can view underwater, as it could on the beta version?

Chock

[CB..]

Many thanks Chock

thanks for the work!! i have been scratching my ead wondering how to incorporate the chart into the scope room view without obscuring anything else and yet having it large enough to be easily read..and aha!! maybe there's a decent use for the "do you wisgh to launch a torp" pop up graphic....an edited version of the chart with just the most common ship speeds would fit nicely onto that image...that way the dang thing would actualy be very usefull!!! (the pop up message i mean) i'll give it a go see if i can comeup with a satisfactory image..do you mind if i post the result here after wards???with the appropiate credits of course..

on the camera thing i'm sure they mentioned or i saw screen shots of an external view ..there are "camera" nodes built into the model files to represent the bridge view and the deck gun MG gun and the up and down scope positions.....the first model file mod i tried was to move the bridge view a little an an experiment...sadly i need to get the exported model file set up correctly..as it became invisable lol..

[Crinius]

Originally Posted by CB..

Cheers HM ...the manual is a puzzle to me..can't cope much with german..i found the centre view key tho (5 on the Num keypad)..so that's a start..
i can practice on some slow mechants

As Iam german I could do a little translation if you wish.

[CB..]

many thanks Crinius

one thing i'm wondering about is the little ship marker on the map screen

described on page18 of the manual as schiffverkehr anzeigen

what does it say that it's for?? i can't figure out what it does and it seems important!


hope Chock doesn't mind but there's my attempt to incorporate his excelent torp calculations onto the pop up screen




the message white text gets in the way a little and it no doubt gets seen at other times on the map screen etc (tho that may not be a bad thing?)

but it might be a way of doing it..:hmm:

the above image is correctly named and in the right format to drop straight into the game

goes in textures/menu screens (make a bak up of the original first of course)

[horsa]

Would this help ...

CB – English version of manual can be downloaded from my site here -

http://www.amberphotography.co.uk/navalsite/Downloads/ShellsofFury/Manual 1914-Shells of fury.pdf

Been following the excitement generated by this thread and decided to purchase the English download version from Strategy First. Everything sweet – no FPS problems and of course English translations.

I was always put off by the lack of interest shown in the game. I reasoned if Subsim was a a fan site for subsimmers then it spoke volumes for SOF if it couldn’t muster much attention. I knew it wasn’t SH3/4 ( small team, budget production etc ) but the negative reactions suggested it was also a poor game.

So I’ve got to say I was very pleasantly surprised …… this game is fun. No point in reviewing in detail cos you’ve pretty much done that already and my own experience and impressions are very similar to yours .

I’d like to highlight a few personal things ….

For me it’s :-

1. Curiously quite atmospheric. Its graphics are …. well …. idiosyncratic to say the least … but despite its “comic book” feel I do get a feeling of being in a WWI setting.

2. It’s worth its money for its history value. You’re right CB about SH3/4 and tonnage. SOF does let you know what it was like when submarines were submersible novelties and commercial raiding from beneath the waves was not the automatic choice of operation.

3. It has a strong feel of “ its all down to what the eye can see”. HM will know what I’m talking about here because we spent two years on a WW1 project where this sort of thing was discussed in some length …

4. It makes a stab at sea spray over the bow and fog banks …. Water and mist everywhere …. good murky North Sea stuff ….

I hope you can all keep the ball rolling with this one and look forward to all the mods and improvements you guys are working on …. As you say it’s highly moddable

[Crinius]

Originally Posted by CB..

many thanks Crinius

one thing i'm wondering about is the little ship marker on the map screen

described on page18 of the manual as schiffverkehr anzeigen

what does it say that it's for?? i can't figure out what it does and it seems important!

Schiffsverkehr anzeigen means Display Shiptraffic. According to the manual it should show you the areas where you could expect a much higher shiptraffic.

[CB..]

excellent stuff Horsa many many thanks....sya you couldn't do me an enourmous favour and zip up the SCRIPTS folder and let me down load it...i'm hoping some of the information regarding how the game manages the missions scripting may also be in english so i can get a clearer picture of what is doung what and how regarding missions structure and functionabilyt etc..check it first tho and if the texts are in german then it;s ok they haven't translated that deeply..


yes indeed!!!
i think folks here are very "used" to seeing things done in subsims in a certain way....and SOF just kinda does things in the opposite fashion!

the lack of active sonar in WW1 throws the gameplay into a different universe than WW2 sims..leaving dedicated WW2 simmers wondering what on earth might be the point of the game,,?

the 2d screens and relatively poor sea animation as stock

all this serves to distract potentail players from what is in actaul fact a top rank submarine simulation...it has plenty of features that SH3/4 can only dream of regarding sub physics....the lack of any automatic "scope depth" is absolutely huge...i love the fact that if you park on the bottom (obviuosly in very shallow water)...you cannot start the engines UNTILL you raise the boat off the sea floor..
the damage incurred as you go deeper is dynamic incremental and cascading....in this game if you hear the hull creak sounds they really mean something not just ear candy or atmosphere etc..
you have no way of knowing your maximum safe diving depth...or as i say what is the best depth for raising the scope...you set scope depth by hand..and it changes with the waves and sea state

the world map really is the world map and it is possible to travel all the way to the USA (afaik) and back as with the other sims...going to have do some research on ww1 sub operations as the stock campaign doesn't really exploit this capability much...

it offers a whole world of stuff...yesterday i watched the scharnhorst battling it out with three english destroyers and a cruiser...quite a battle!

so it does surface ship to ship engagements as well...

it's a balls out serious susbsim..with a sense of humour and a whole world of charm

[CB..]

Originally Posted by Crinius

Schiffsverkehr anzeigen means Display Shiptraffic. According to the manual it should show you the areas where you could expect a much higher shiptraffic.

cheers Crinius!
that's an intrigueing feature...many thanks will have to look into it..

[horsa]

Scripts are in english

http://www.amberphotography.co.uk/navalsite/Downloads/ShellsofFury/scripts.zip

Pity there are no ports. :hmm: