Getting the SU-24s to Engage

SeaQueen · 11-27-05, 05:38 PM

I've even tried a script to force it. Frequently they get close enough to shoot their missiles, but they never do. What's going on? Is there a way to make them more aggressive?

FERdeBOER · 11-28-05, 07:39 AM

If you tell me what kind of situation are you planning I can "reproduce" it and try to see what happen and how to resolve it.

I mean, are you trying to attack a ship, a terrain building...?

FERdeBOER · 11-28-05, 08:21 AM

I made some small tests.

A formation of 3 SU24 with a transit tactic. No scripts.
Two "enemys", one ship and one 10 story building from another side.

The SUs attacked both of them, with the weapon loadout on "ASUW" (more aggresive against the ship) and also with "strike".

So my question is: have you the 1.03beta patch? Seems that the patch solves all those AI inactivity.

SeaQueen · 11-28-05, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FERdeBOER

I made some small tests.

A formation of 3 SU24 with a transit tactic. No scripts.
Two "enemys", one ship and one 10 story building from another side.

The SUs attacked both of them, with the weapon loadout on "ASUW" (more aggresive against the ship) and also with "strike".

So my question is: have you the 1.03beta patch? Seems that the patch solves all those AI inactivity.

Huuum... I'll have to try that.

SeaQueen · 11-28-05, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FERdeBOER

So my question is: have you the 1.03beta patch? Seems that the patch solves all those AI inactivity.

Tried the new patch, that didn't work although they were a little bit more aggressive. They didn't run so far after getting shot at.

Their target was an ESG consisting of a 2 DDGs, 2 FFGs, a CG, an LHD and two LPDs. I'm beginning to think that the problem is a tactical one, and that I need to have the SU-24s engage as a divided force instead of as a single group in hopes that one of them will manage to get close enough to engage one of the high value units (the gators).

LuftWolf · 11-28-05, 10:32 PM

There seems to be some kind of coded hardcap on the number of missiles that any one side can fire at a target.

You may have some luck putting them all on different sides that have an alliance in the editor.

That's part of the trick to getting SSGN's to engage effectively when there are more than one of them.

FERdeBOER · 11-29-05, 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeaQueen

Tried the new patch, that didn't work although they were a little bit more aggressive. They didn't run so far after getting shot at.

Yes, On my tests the SUs aproached a lot before shooting.
As the test were with objetives with no defense systems, I did not noticed that

I will try now with a convoy as you describe.

Quote:

I'm beginning to think that the problem is a tactical one, and that I need to have the SU-24s engage as a divided force instead of as a single group in hopes that one of them will manage to get close enough to engage one of the high value units (the gators)

Yes, maybe you need to use a different tactic to penetrate the escorts. :hmm:

When I try more things I will tell you.

SeaQueen · 11-29-05, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Yes, On my tests the SUs aproached a lot before shooting.
As the test were with objetives with no defense systems, I did not noticed that

What is that? It ought to be just, "I see 'em, I shoot 'em, I go home," for aircraft.

Quote:

When I try more things I will tell you.

Thanks. My imagination is shot on this one.

SeaQueen · 11-29-05, 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LuftWolf

You may have some luck putting them all on different sides that have an alliance in the editor.

I tried that actually after reading your thread. I think the problem with fighters is less that they won't shoot enough, it's that they noodle around a lot before shooting. By that time, the ships have already fired a salvo of a dozen or so missiles, scattering the force and destroying it's effectiveness.

FERdeBOER · 11-29-05, 07:27 AM

Well, after a few tries, I can say that, if you put Backfires instead SU24, they shoot from a very far distance (more than 30miles) and when all missiles are expended (4 each plane?), they return to base.

If you set the altitude of the SU24 very low, close to the sea, they can get closer to the objetive without being shooted, but not enought to shoot.

My next tries will be with various SU24 groups from different sides.

FERdeBOER · 11-29-05, 08:16 AM

Hmmm, tried with various groups attacking at same time (same side and different allied sides), with SU33, F18, F15... and the Backfires are the only ones who makes sinks.

You put a great barrier with those escorts

One time a SU33 get closer, really close... 2 miles! and didn't attack.

In my opinion you have two options: simulate the attack with a damage script, or use backfires. :hmm:

MaHuJa · 11-29-05, 10:27 AM

Only damage script I ever noticed was the ability to put the players systems out of commision.

But maybe you can have a script using the engage command? How does that work?

Mau · 11-29-05, 03:49 PM

Then there is something wrong!!!

I don`t want to have a script to simulate an attack

Did we disregard the ``Above Water Warfare`` aspect and just looked at the ASW aspect with ``Dangerous Water`` or what?

Hopefully not

FERdeBOER · 11-29-05, 04:09 PM

Well, in fact the SU24s attack, but they have to be very close to do so. At least for attacking surface ships, when I tried with buildings the attack range was greater, but not much.

But this problem does not happen with Backfires. They attack from long distance.

And ships vs ships or sub vs ship works well too. Long distance attacks with missiles.

But with fighters...

XabbaRus · 11-29-05, 04:30 PM

Well look at the doctrine and the database and see why Backfires attack from farther out then Su-24s?

I bet there is a minimum range.

11-27-05, 05:38 PM	#1
SeaQueen Naval Royalty Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 1,185 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Getting the SU-24s to Engage I've even tried a script to force it. Frequently they get close enough to shoot their missiles, but they never do. What's going on? Is there a way to make them more aggressive?

11-28-05, 07:39 AM	#2
FERdeBOER XO Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Spain Posts: 431 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 1	If you tell me what kind of situation are you planning I can "reproduce" it and try to see what happen and how to resolve it. I mean, are you trying to attack a ship, a terrain building...? __________________ Hay dos tipos de buques: los submarinos... y los blancos. There are two types of ships: the subs... and the targets.

11-28-05, 08:21 AM	#3
FERdeBOER XO Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Spain Posts: 431 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 1	I made some small tests. A formation of 3 SU24 with a transit tactic. No scripts. Two "enemys", one ship and one 10 story building from another side. The SUs attacked both of them, with the weapon loadout on "ASUW" (more aggresive against the ship) and also with "strike". So my question is: have you the 1.03beta patch? Seems that the patch solves all those AI inactivity. __________________ Hay dos tipos de buques: los submarinos... y los blancos. There are two types of ships: the subs... and the targets.

11-28-05, 10:32 PM	#6
LuftWolf Ocean Warrior Join Date: May 2005 Location: Free New York Posts: 3,167 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	There seems to be some kind of coded hardcap on the number of missiles that any one side can fire at a target. You may have some luck putting them all on different sides that have an alliance in the editor. That's part of the trick to getting SSGN's to engage effectively when there are more than one of them. __________________ LW

11-29-05, 07:27 AM	#10
FERdeBOER XO Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Spain Posts: 431 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 1	Well, after a few tries, I can say that, if you put Backfires instead SU24, they shoot from a very far distance (more than 30miles) and when all missiles are expended (4 each plane?), they return to base. If you set the altitude of the SU24 very low, close to the sea, they can get closer to the objetive without being shooted, but not enought to shoot. My next tries will be with various SU24 groups from different sides. __________________ Hay dos tipos de buques: los submarinos... y los blancos. There are two types of ships: the subs... and the targets.

11-29-05, 08:16 AM	#11
FERdeBOER XO Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Spain Posts: 431 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 1	Hmmm, tried with various groups attacking at same time (same side and different allied sides), with SU33, F18, F15... and the Backfires are the only ones who makes sinks. You put a great barrier with those escorts One time a SU33 get closer, really close... 2 miles! and didn't attack. In my opinion you have two options: simulate the attack with a damage script, or use backfires. :hmm: __________________ Hay dos tipos de buques: los submarinos... y los blancos. There are two types of ships: the subs... and the targets.

11-29-05, 10:27 AM	#12
MaHuJa Sonar Guy Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: 59.96156N 11.02255E Posts: 385 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	Only damage script I ever noticed was the ability to put the players systems out of commision. But maybe you can have a script using the engage command? How does that work? __________________ Teaching DW newbies how to climb the food chain.

11-29-05, 03:49 PM	#13
Mau Sonar Guy Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 382 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	Then there is something wrong!!! I don`t want to have a script to simulate an attack Did we disregard the ``Above Water Warfare`` aspect and just looked at the ASW aspect with ``Dangerous Water`` or what? Hopefully not

11-29-05, 04:09 PM	#14
FERdeBOER XO Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Spain Posts: 431 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 1	Well, in fact the SU24s attack, but they have to be very close to do so. At least for attacking surface ships, when I tried with buildings the attack range was greater, but not much. But this problem does not happen with Backfires. They attack from long distance. And ships vs ships or sub vs ship works well too. Long distance attacks with missiles. But with fighters... __________________ Hay dos tipos de buques: los submarinos... y los blancos. There are two types of ships: the subs... and the targets.

11-29-05, 04:30 PM	#15
XabbaRus Navy Seal Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 5,330 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	Well look at the doctrine and the database and see why Backfires attack from farther out then Su-24s? I bet there is a minimum range. __________________