[REL] Real Fleet Boat 2.0

[Randomizer]

So what file(s) need to be changed so that there is no hydrophone detection when surfaced. This is a feature of FOTRS-U that I would really prefer not to have.

I looked at the ...\USSubParts\Sensors_sub_US.sim and this looks like a good possibility for editing but am unsure of what values need to be changed to eliminate sonar detection's when surfaced.

Thanks in advance for any help.

-C

[Michael Wood]

Originally Posted by Randomizer

So what file(s) need to be changed so that there is no hydrophone detection when surfaced. This is a feature of FOTRS-U that I would really prefer not to have.

I looked at the ...\USSubParts\Sensors_sub_US.sim and this looks like a good possibility for editing but am unsure of what values need to be changed to eliminate sonar detection's when surfaced.

Thanks in advance for any help.

-C

Been trying to reason with the folks over on the FOTRS Ultimate forum. They do not seem open to such.

[Randomizer]

I have no idea why having omniscient surface hydrophones seem so popular in the RFB/FORTUS and TMO communities but it is what it is.

Using SH3-Editor have examined some of the sensor files and may have a rough solution.

Comparing the Operation Monsun Sensors.dat file found in
folder (...OM\Data\Library\Sensors.dat) with that in FOTRS-U (FOTRS\Data\Library\USSubParts\Sensors_Sub_US.sim) shows different values for maximum sensor height.

For OM, which does not have the hydrophone operate on the surface, the sensor height is -7 or -6.

For FOTRS-U the figure of merit is -2 and in some Hydrophone entries the value is zero.

Have tinkered enough to make some semi-educated guesses:

The value appears to represents depth in metres above which the sensor is inactive but a low value probably is negated by the model's draft when surfaced. The evidence for this is that the larger negative values are present in the U-Boat sensors and the U-Boat hydrophones do not work when the sub is on the surface as the value is >= the surface draft. The lower values on the Fleet Boats indicate that the sensors will still be active when the boat is operating on the surface.

Checking the sensors.dat file in the Soviet Waterways mod shows that the values there are -8 and hydrophones are inactive on the surface using that Mod.

I do intend to test this as soon as time allows but am concerned about the possibilities for unintended consequences that changing the sensor MaxHeight values may have in the simulation as a whole.

Any, that's what I have right now.

-C

[propbeanie]

Adjusting the AI - cliff notes version

[Randomizer]

Did the edits in the Sensors_Sub_US.sim changing all of the existing MaxHeight values for hydrophones and sonars to -8.0 and set up the new files in JSGME format. Activating them appears to have eliminated the surface hydrophone effects in both FOTRS-U and TMO/RSRD.

HOWEVER!

Although this small fix seems to work it has not been extensively tested. I tried it both with a new career and existing careers and the latter opened and saved without issue after activating the fix. The values in the relevant file in RFB 2.0 are -6.0 for all hydrophones/sonar which would seem to be why they do not detect when the boat is surfaced in that Mod.

I cannot upload here and am not prepared to sign up with a file-sharing site just to do so but anybody who can open SH3-Editor can make the appropriate edits as described above. Normal caveats for modding any program apply.

Good Hunting.

-C

[Michael Wood]

Originally Posted by Randomizer

Did the edits in the Sensors_Sub_US.sim changing all of the existing MaxHeight values for hydrophones and sonars to -8.0 and set up the new files in JSGME format. Activating them appears to have eliminated the surface hydrophone effects in both FOTRS-U and TMO/RSRD.

HOWEVER!

Although this small fix seems to work it has not been extensively tested. I tried it both with a new career and existing careers and the latter opened and saved without issue after activating the fix. The values in the relevant file in RFB 2.0 are -6.0 for all hydrophones/sonar which would seem to be why they do not detect when the boat is surfaced in that Mod.

I cannot upload here and am not prepared to sign up with a file-sharing site just to do so but anybody who can open SH3-Editor can make the appropriate edits as described above. Normal caveats for modding any program apply.

Good Hunting.

-C

Great! If the powers who be allow testing of this simple fix, they could offer it as as an option. propbeanie? How about it?

[Michael Wood]

Originally Posted by Randomizer

Did the edits in the Sensors_Sub_US.sim changing all of the existing MaxHeight values for hydrophones and sonars to -8.0 and set up the new files in JSGME format. Activating them appears to have eliminated the surface hydrophone effects in both FOTRS-U and TMO/RSRD.

HOWEVER!

Although this small fix seems to work it has not been extensively tested. I tried it both with a new career and existing careers and the latter opened and saved without issue after activating the fix. The values in the relevant file in RFB 2.0 are -6.0 for all hydrophones/sonar which would seem to be why they do not detect when the boat is surfaced in that Mod.

I cannot upload here and am not prepared to sign up with a file-sharing site just to do so but anybody who can open SH3-Editor can make the appropriate edits as described above. Normal caveats for modding any program apply.

Good Hunting.

-C

On a hunch, I replaced the FOTRS "Sensors_Sub_US.sim" file with the one from RFB and it worked just fine. Everything functioned, hydrophone sound underwater was same and no hydrophone sounds on surface in a Porpoise class boat.

[Randomizer]

Swapping out the RFB file is certainly a solution but doing so sacrifices any sensor edits or unique settings developed by the FOTRS-U team if any are actually included. Particularly as using SH3-Editor to implement the necessary edits is both simple and completely painless.

That said, glad it worked for you and it is great to get confirmation that the fix actually seems to work.

-C

[propbeanie]

Originally Posted by Michael Wood

Great! If the powers who be allow testing of this simple fix, they could offer it as as an option. propbeanie? How about it?

We are still busy trying to figure-out this airplane issue. It is pernicious, and difficult to root-out. s7rikeback has been busy with that, and has encountered other difficulties as well. Then there is the holidays and family time, and I've just returned home, with quite a bit of backed-up "honey-do" work to get through. In the meantime, you guys are more than welcome to do what you will with your computers and the mod, of course, and if anyone can demonstrate "scientific" test results (no hockey stick "loading" of the data allowed). I do remember us testing something similar to this previously, but it seemed to cause an issue elsewhere, having that negative number. A similar technique with the Visual seems OK. I do not recall the detail(s) with the sonar, and would have to try to find my notes. It might have something to do with ships "disappearing" completely from sonar, no matter their speed... - but as I say, I do not remember for certain. Just watch-out for possible unannounced depth charge attacks, or other similar anomalies, and let us know, if you would. An edit such as this will not be in the current version we are working on, without team testing. Thanks for looking into it though fellers!

[von Zelda]

Originally Posted by Michael Wood

On a hunch, I replaced the FOTRS "Sensors_Sub_US.sim" file with the one from RFB and it worked just fine. Everything functioned, hydrophone sound underwater was same and no hydrophone sounds on surface in a Porpoise class boat.

I believe that the Real Fleet Boat v2 patch dated in April 23, 2010 has the latest RFB Sensor_Sub_US.sim file. No sounds or lines on the surface and sounds & lines at radar depth and below.

Tested one sub (Porpoise) on several missions so far and it seems to work well as Mr. Wood previously noted. Thanks for your help, that led me in the right direction = data/library/USSubParts/Sensors_Sub_US.sim Just substitute the FotRS file with the Real Fleet Boat v2 patch's Sensors_Sub_US.sim file and you're good to go.

[Michael Wood]

Originally Posted by Randomizer

Did the edits in the Sensors_Sub_US.sim changing all of the existing MaxHeight values for hydrophones and sonars to -8.0 and set up the new files in JSGME format. Activating them appears to have eliminated the surface hydrophone effects in both FOTRS-U and TMO/RSRD.

HOWEVER!

Although this small fix seems to work it has not been extensively tested. I tried it both with a new career and existing careers and the latter opened and saved without issue after activating the fix. The values in the relevant file in RFB 2.0 are -6.0 for all hydrophones/sonar which would seem to be why they do not detect when the boat is surfaced in that Mod.

I cannot upload here and am not prepared to sign up with a file-sharing site just to do so but anybody who can open SH3-Editor can make the appropriate edits as described above. Normal caveats for modding any program apply.

Good Hunting.

-C

Did some more testing, using the "Sensors_Sub_US.sim" from RFB. Hydrophones do not work on the surface, due to "MaxHeight values for hydrophones and sonars to -8.0" Hurrah!

However, the radar values are also affected in the RFB file. The early SD radar is short ranged, kinda wonky and undependable. I am sure other devices are also affected. So, I would recommend just making the "MaxHeight" change you recommended and not using the RFB file. Otherwise, you are sorta' playing RFB.

[propbeanie]

If we get this airplane issue fixed shortly and get the next version out, we'll get into doing an add-in for you guys to test the sonar.

[Michael Wood]

Originally Posted by propbeanie

If we get this airplane issue fixed shortly and get the next version out, we'll get into doing an add-in for you guys to test the sonar.

I haven't seen a Japanese airplane in FOTRS, as I always sail submerged within 500 miles of a major airfield, in daylight, as per instructions.

When new build ready, I will try sailing around on the surface in daylight, near Tokyo and see what happens.

[propbeanie]

That's what gets me about the game, in that it cannot give you an after-action report or endorsement from "the boss". If such was the case, your orders would still stand on paper, but you would be encouraged, maybe even dressed-down if you did not run mostly on the surface after your first patrols... - Mayhaps a message or two for the next round of patrols is in order... how to do it though?... At this time though Michael Ward, the airplanes are not very "efficient" in their "visual" acumen, and we are thinking this is where the problem lies with some of them in FotRSU. More in that thread now.

[Luno]

Good afternoon Skippers,


I just wanted to give a big thanks and shout out to the devs who made this mod. I am currently playing with SH4 1.5 and RFB 2.0 and it is awesome! I have a few questions:

I took a look at the April 2010 patch and it looks like it offers some important fixes. However, I do not understand the reasoning behind some of the changes.


1) For instance, in RFB 2.0, The binos have a crosshair with lines for calculating distance. This is more historically accurate than the stadimeter split-image we get in the TBT. The stadimeter was used in periscopes only, as I understand.

In the April 2010 patch, this was reverted back to some stock format with lines that don't seem to mean anything.

What would be the best way to go about messing with this again so I can use realistic distance measurements in the binos and TBT?


2) The Earth's diameter was increased to increase viewing distance (reduce earth's curvature). How is this like to play with? This seems like a pretty extreme way to address the problem of the watch crew calling out visual contacts before the player. Is this also why sub ranges were increased?


Hope everyone has a great day!