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Old 02-26-21, 11:47 PM   #31
Aktungbby
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one other factor: most of the VIC's were built and saw Navy service from 1944 to 1946. The Uboat menace was considerably altered past 1943. Additionally the total depth of the smaller vessel is shown as 9 ft. In examining the photos, hull freeboard is approx 6 ft, leaving a draft of 3 feet...hardly a suitable shot for an expensive Nazi 'eel' late in the war. In looking at at uboat sinkings by ship class and type, no VIC's are shown. The best defense for a puffer was literally its designation:...being Inshore. Sometimes too inshore; several puffers are depicted "on the rocks" of the English shoreline.
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Old 02-27-21, 03:41 PM   #32
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Wow, thank you for your many answers guys, I didn't hope to get that much attention!

For the moment my generic model will represent private-owned puffers. Though built to a similar design, VIC's had some peculiar features, most notably the open wheel. I have found detailed plans for those boats, so they might be the subject of a future mod.

With your suggestions in mind, I have come to the following conclusions:

- Most boats will feature the typical black top/red keel hull paint scheme, with deck and superstructure painted in lighter color and funnel sporting a variety of color combinations, as used by some real ship-owners. Later on, some boats might get an overall grey repaint, but that will be more an exception than the rule.

- Being limited to inshore navigation, most boats won't fly any national ensign. Exceptionally, some boats will sail under the union jack, in which case the flag will be hoisted from a flagstaff at the stern.

- Alternatively to the Red Ensign, or in addition to it, a few boats might fly a mast-top house flag.

- Some rare boats will hoist a jib sail on their forestay

- Early in campaign, a few boats will feature navigation lights and/or illuminated portholes, but soon they will be darkened like te rest of British shipping.

Talking about damage, I won't add any 3D internal compartments, but the following parts will break apart if collided by gun shells or bombs: mast, lifeboat, cargo hold cover, funnel, part of the wheelhouse, propeller, rudder

I have recently finished the UV unwrapping of the model and I am currently working on the ambient occlusion map. The next step will be creating some good diffuse, specular and normal maps.

Stay tuned for screenshots in the next days.
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Old 02-27-21, 04:12 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by gap View Post
Wow, thank you for your many answers guys, I didn't hope to get that much attention!

For the moment my generic model will represent private-owned puffers. Though built to a similar design, VIC's had some peculiar features, most notably the open wheel. I have found detailed plans for those boats, so they might be the subject of a future mod.

With your suggestions in mind, I have come to the following conclusions:

- Most boats will feature the typical black top/red keel hull paint scheme, with deck and superstructure painted in lighter color and funnel sporting a variety of color combinations, as used by some real ship-owners. Later on, some boats might get an overall grey repaint, but that will be more an exception than the rule.

- Being limited to inshore navigation, most boats won't fly any national ensign. Exceptionally, some boats will sail under the union jack, in which case the flag will be hoisted from a flagstaff at the stern.

- Alternatively to the Red Ensign, or in addition to it, a few boats might fly a mast-top house flag.

- Some rare boats will hoist a jib sail on their forestay

- Early in campaign, a few boats will feature navigation lights and/or illuminated portholes, but soon they will be darkened like te rest of British shipping.

Talking about damage, I won't add any 3D internal compartments, but the following parts will break apart if collided by gun shells or bombs: mast, lifeboat, cargo hold cover, funnel, part of the wheelhouse, propeller, rudder

I have recently finished the UV unwrapping of the model and I am currently working on the ambient occlusion map. The next step will be creating some good diffuse, specular and normal maps.

Stay tuned for screenshots in the next days.
Cool ! Will you also add an ambiant occlusion map ? If you don't see any objection, I would like to convert your ship to SH3 once finished.
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Old 02-27-21, 05:10 PM   #34
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Cool ! Will you also add an ambiant occlusion map ? If you don't see any objection, I would like to convert your ship to SH3 once finished.
Yes, I am working on it. It is a bit tricky because with so many destroyable parts, I can't bake it at once (otherwise when those parts are destroyed we would still see their baked shadow).

No problem for SHIII conversion, it is my understanding that SHIII has only a limited support of AO maps. A possible solutution could be taking only the AO UV projection, and blending AO and diffuse maps in one texture
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Old 02-27-21, 05:19 PM   #35
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For SH3? Any AO mapping for a Unit that small is WAY over kill.
I'd bake the shadows to the diffuse texture like stock is done and call it good for SH3.
Other wise your just putting lip stick on a Pig!
That has two effects.
It's still a Pig but now the Pig runs slower.
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Old 02-27-21, 06:44 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by gap View Post
Yes, I am working on it. It is a bit tricky because with so many destroyable parts, I can't bake it at once (otherwise when those parts are destroyed we would still see their baked shadow)
One cheap solution is to bake it at once and then "hand-paint" holes/damage/debris on parts of AO texture that are hidden under destroyable parts
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Old 02-27-21, 06:52 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Jeff-Groves View Post
For SH3? Any AO mapping for a Unit that small is WAY over kill.
I'd bake the shadows to the diffuse texture like stock is done and call it good for SH3.
Other wise your just putting lip stick on a Pig!
That has two effects.
It's still a Pig but now the Pig runs slower.
Good point which might apply to SH5 as well as SHIII

The AO map I am baking is rather large, 2048 x 2048 pixels. I would like the texture to be large enough that boat's name painted on the hull sides can be read. I will check if this level of quality can be attained by blending diffuse and texture maps on the same texture, as you are suggesting, rather than having them mapped on two sets of UV maps, and then I will evaluate which method is lesser expensive in terms of memory usage

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One cheap solution is to bake it at once and then "hand-paint" holes/damage/debris on parts of AO texture that are hidden under destroyable parts
Yes, I am doing that too. but there are times that the occluded parts require a more accurate work than what one you can do manually. A trick I am using to spare time, is scaling down the UV projections of parts already baked but included in the AO-baking template because on the shadows they cast of parts which still require their AO baked. This way they will be used for light occlusion simulation, but the shadow rendering will be much faster.
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Last edited by gap; 02-27-21 at 09:25 PM.
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Old 02-27-21, 07:54 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by gap View Post
Good point which might apply to SH5 as well as SHIII
It is always going to be a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.

Today we may do a mod to save on resources?
Next year that is not an issue and We catch flak!

Do what you feel comfortable with at this time.
Damn the torpedoes! Full speed ahead!!!!!!
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Old 02-28-21, 06:54 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by Jeff-Groves View Post
It is always going to be a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.

Today we may do a mod to save on resources?
Next year that is not an issue and We catch flak!

Do what you feel comfortable with at this time.
Damn the torpedoes! Full speed ahead!!!!!!
That's so true Jeff, it is always a matter of compromises.

On one end there is our curiosity of doing new things and our pride to attain an above-average level of detail, even though not many might notice it; on the other end there are our limits of modders and the ever-changing hardware limitations.

Finding the optimal balance among the two extremes is a struggle, and what might be a good compromise today, might not be not so good tomorrow. In case of doubts (and in this field doubts are a common event), my rule of thumbs is: we are always in time to remove a given feature, to simplify a 3D model, to scrap a secondary UV map, or to rescale a texture; the opposite not always apply. Sure, in the process we will have lost hard disc space and a lot of time, but we will have gained experience.

This is my first sea unit modelled from scratch; I have a lot of experience to gain from it, and I am glad to do it having the suggestions of other community members in mind
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Old 02-28-21, 07:27 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff-Groves View Post
For SH3? Any AO mapping for a Unit that small is WAY over kill.
I'd bake the shadows to the diffuse texture like stock is done and call it good for SH3.
Other wise your just putting lip stick on a Pig!
That has two effects.
It's still a Pig but now the Pig runs slower.


Quote:
Originally Posted by gap View Post
This is my first sea unit modelled from scratch; I have a lot of experience to gain from it, and I am glad to do it having the suggestions of other community members in mind
Good luck !
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Old 02-28-21, 11:15 AM   #41
gap
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Good luck !
Thank you mate
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Old 03-01-21, 10:36 AM   #42
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If only I had that image enhancing program from Blade Runner movie...
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Old 03-02-21, 05:00 AM   #43
gap
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If only I had that image enhancing program from Blade Runner movie...
lol

I thought that boat was already in your own collection of 3D models.
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Old 03-02-21, 05:55 AM   #44
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lol

I thought that boat was already in your own collection of 3D models.
I started (but never finished) modeling Earl Thorfinn (a sister ship to Earl Sigurd), but I was basing it on general arrangement plan only (which is why I never finished - hull shape came out weird). The one Aktungbby linked has hull lines...
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Old 03-02-21, 06:53 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by kapuhy View Post
I started (but never finished) modeling Earl Thorfinn (a sister ship to Earl Sigurd), but I was basing it on general arrangement plan only (which is why I never finished - hull shape came out weird). The one Aktungbby linked has hull lines...
Sorry kapuhy,

I switched to "Blade Runner's image enhancing program mode", but this is the best I could do with that poor base:

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