Mk16 Torpedo - Pattern Running?

jenrick · 06-16-17, 02:10 PM

So I'm finding a few references to the MK16 have the capability of pattern running. This would add a whole new level of usefulness to it. Where I've seen it listed on line, they refer to an article in the Naval Institute Proceedings journal. I have yet to locate a source other then that, but I'll continue to look.

A) Is it possible to add this feature to CW if it's verified?
B) Does anyone happen to have an account with the Naval Institute, that can look it up? I have a link to the article I believe this info is sourced from, I can PM to anyone with an account.

Thanks,

-Jenrick

Julhelm · 06-16-17, 02:33 PM

If we can know the patterns, it could probably be added.

jenrick · 06-17-17, 11:55 AM

TL/DR: Certain mods of the MK16 could be set to do a circle run at the completion of their run out.

After doing a bunch of research I have learned:

A) Everyone and there brother has a rip-off wikipedia site that is useless
B) For a weapon that was in inventory for 30+ years there is surprisingly little information out there about it.

The most authoritative source I have located so far:

US NAVY TORPEDOES - Part Three: WW II devlopment (sic) of conventional torpedoes 1940-1946 by Frederick J Milford

Reproduced with permission from the January 1997 issue of THE SUBMARINE REVIEW, a quarterly publication of the Naval Submarine League, P.O. Box 1146, Annandale, VA 2200 (retrieved from http://www.reocities.com/pentagon/1592/ustorp3.htm)

"For completeness, we now briefly consider pattern running. The concept is to program a torpedo to make a straight run to a target rich area, for example, the middle of a convoy, and then execute a pattern hoping to hit a target. This is obviously distinct from homing although some homing torpedoes have been programmed to run a straight course and then execute a search pattern for the purpose of acquiring a target on which to home. The pattern running concept has some instinctive appeal in that it would appear to improve the probability of hitting some target. This appeal was enough to induce the German navy to mount two programs FAT and LUT13. The US Navy included pattern running in the Mk.36 and Mk.42 development programs, but neither of these entered service. Some Mods. of the Mk.16 were equipped with pattern running controls which caused the torpedo to run in circles of 300 yard radius after a straight run of preset length. Pattern running mechanisms in the days of electromechanical, as opposed to electronic, controls involved complex arrays of cams, gears and levers that were difficult and expensive to design and build. Furthermore pattern running seems to be much less effective than instincts would predict. Roessler sums up the situation in very few words "This appears unprofitable.""

I'm going to experiment with simply copying over the attack settings from a MK48, to give it the option for straight and circle running. Based on some back of the envelope math the 20 degree turn angle out to work about half the listed 300 yd turning radius. We'll see how it works.

I'll continue to do some more research to see what else I can find out.

-Jenrick

06-16-17, 02:10 PM	#1
jenrick Bosun Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 64 Downloads: 28 Uploads: 0	Mk16 Torpedo - Pattern Running? So I'm finding a few references to the MK16 have the capability of pattern running. This would add a whole new level of usefulness to it. Where I've seen it listed on line, they refer to an article in the Naval Institute Proceedings journal. I have yet to locate a source other then that, but I'll continue to look. A) Is it possible to add this feature to CW if it's verified? B) Does anyone happen to have an account with the Naval Institute, that can look it up? I have a link to the article I believe this info is sourced from, I can PM to anyone with an account. Thanks, -Jenrick

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06-16-17, 02:33 PM	#2
Julhelm Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Icy North Posts: 690 Downloads: 189 Uploads: 0	If we can know the patterns, it could probably be added.

06-17-17, 11:55 AM	#3
jenrick Bosun Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 64 Downloads: 28 Uploads: 0	TL/DR: Certain mods of the MK16 could be set to do a circle run at the completion of their run out. After doing a bunch of research I have learned: A) Everyone and there brother has a rip-off wikipedia site that is useless B) For a weapon that was in inventory for 30+ years there is surprisingly little information out there about it. The most authoritative source I have located so far: US NAVY TORPEDOES - Part Three: WW II devlopment (sic) of conventional torpedoes 1940-1946 by Frederick J Milford Reproduced with permission from the January 1997 issue of THE SUBMARINE REVIEW, a quarterly publication of the Naval Submarine League, P.O. Box 1146, Annandale, VA 2200 (retrieved from http://www.reocities.com/pentagon/1592/ustorp3.htm) "For completeness, we now briefly consider pattern running. The concept is to program a torpedo to make a straight run to a target rich area, for example, the middle of a convoy, and then execute a pattern hoping to hit a target. This is obviously distinct from homing although some homing torpedoes have been programmed to run a straight course and then execute a search pattern for the purpose of acquiring a target on which to home. The pattern running concept has some instinctive appeal in that it would appear to improve the probability of hitting some target. This appeal was enough to induce the German navy to mount two programs FAT and LUT13. The US Navy included pattern running in the Mk.36 and Mk.42 development programs, but neither of these entered service. Some Mods. of the Mk.16 were equipped with pattern running controls which caused the torpedo to run in circles of 300 yard radius after a straight run of preset length. Pattern running mechanisms in the days of electromechanical, as opposed to electronic, controls involved complex arrays of cams, gears and levers that were difficult and expensive to design and build. Furthermore pattern running seems to be much less effective than instincts would predict. Roessler sums up the situation in very few words "This appears unprofitable."" I'm going to experiment with simply copying over the attack settings from a MK48, to give it the option for straight and circle running. Based on some back of the envelope math the 20 degree turn angle out to work about half the listed 300 yd turning radius. We'll see how it works. I'll continue to do some more research to see what else I can find out. -Jenrick