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Old 04-27-2019, 12:09 AM   #1
The Kraken Wakes
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Default spawning

Hi Everyone,
could some kind person help me with a couple of small questions about the ME.
1. When I add a new naval base, I would like to have the blue anchor that the other bases have, but mine doesn't have it. I can refit, but no anchor on map.
2.
I set up a mission where when the sink tonnage objective was completed, it was meant to spawn another instance of the original convoy. But it didn't.
So how do I get spawn to work ? I am trying to produce a conveyor belt of torpedo fodder.

Thanks for any help
T K W
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Old 04-27-2019, 09:37 AM   #2
propbeanie
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For #2 question, you have to be far enough away from the spawn point for a group to generate. Basically, to be "safe", you would want to be about 40nm away from the spawn location. If you are after torpedo fodder, don't use a regular Group or Unit, but use the Random Generated Group (RGG) instead. Here is a screen shot, zoomed-in on an RGG. Now, you'll not get both of those windows to open together - that is a "double-exposure" for illustration purposes only... tic:



You right-click on the screen where you want the group to "spawn" into the game, and choose the "Add Random Generated Group" menu item. From that, you'll get a naming dialog box, where you name the group. If it's the only one you're going to have, keep it the same. If you're going to add more, then you'll have to change the names since the game can't do duplicates. You can also choose whether it will be an Air Group, Land Group, or Naval Group (the default). After that, the "Define Group Contents" dialog pops up (though there's no name on it). That is the dialog box in the lower right of the pic above. Choose the country and type of ship from the list, and click on the "Add Entry" button (you can also choose how many - "Units No", the spawn probability, and the crew rating setting). If you make a mistake, no big deal, just highlight the unit in the left window, and make a new selection in the right window, then click the left window again, and it will change to the new choice. When you add a DD or similar to the group, there is the tick box choice for "Position as escort" that becomes active, so that it can either patrol out front or the sides, or be a part of the group. When part of the group, the DD for some reason become dumber than a box of rocks. Don't forget to set the "Leader Entry" at the bottom right, since it determines how your group reacts to enemy submarine activity, and also choose how many columns of ships you want. The "Formation spacing" is really important. With the big ships, you will want at least 800 meters between them, else the group will have trouble maintaining "convoy formation", because their "collision avoidance" routine kicks in. When you're finished with adding the vessels (or airplanes, if you chose an Air Group), click on the "Accept" button, and you're back at the full ME screen.

If you select the RGG and then right-click on it, you'll get a menu up. This time, choose "Group Properties", and you'll get that dialog that's toward the left in the pic above. From it, you can choose the group's initial speed, which will be limited by the slowest vessel in the group you built. If you later add or alter vessels in the group, you will want to double-check that "Speed (Max)" value, and be certain your WayPoints don't exceed that, else you'll have issues with the group performing as expected. Anyway, you will want to pay attention to the "Max group instances created", which defaults to 10,000 and the "Max number of units in RGG". If you've only got 6 vessels in the group, set that number to "6", naturally. If you're going to shoot at say six groups, but it might take a bit to get to the location where you ambush is to take place, allow for that and limit the number of groups that generate. However, neither of these are absolutely necessary with what you're doing, and could be left at their default values.

The "Entry Date" and "Time", and the "Exit Date" and "Time" are somewhat important. You don't want to miss the action, nor get there before it starts. Your "Human controlled" submarine has to enter the scenario on the same date that the mis file is built for, but the other assets are not restricted to that, so if you don't find what you expect, be sure and check these dates / times.

The part you are most interested in, and why you would want to use an RGG instead of a regular group or unit, is because of the "Repeat interval (hours)", and the "Group spawn probability (%)" boxes. The default for Repeat interval is 24 (hours), so once a day. You can set that to "1" hour if so desired. However, be certain to give yourself enough time between attacks to get re-set. The "percentage" can be from 0% (never spawns) to 100% (always spawns), and any whole number in between that. When you think you are finished, click the "Accept" button and you're back at the full ME screen. Set your waypoints for the routing, and "Save" the scenario.

After you're set, you could open the mis file in a text editor, of which Notepad++ is the easiest to use. You'll find your group listed as "[RndGroup X], with the "X" representing the number of it in the mis file listing. Below that "Header" is "GroupName=..." which is the name you gave the group. The reason I mention using a text file here is that you can increase the time when your group will spawn. Scroll down until you find your particular group. Then look for the two lines "DelayMin=XX" (default value is "60", for 60 minutes, or one hour). Make that value "DelayMin=1", which means that the game delays the spawn of your group for one minute. The line below that is "DelayMinInterv=XXXX" (default value for that is 1440, or 24 hours). That line is the same as the "Repeat interval" box in the Group Properties screen, but here it's in minutes, so if you so desire, set it to "DelayMinInterv=1", and then your group spawns in two minutes, instead of the 25 hours of the "default" setting of the Properties window - but it kicks a new one out every minute. You might not want that. Just remember that whatever interval you set the RGG to, is how long it will take to generate the first, such that a 60 minute DelayMinInterv for one hour, will have the RGG start spawning one hour (and one minute) after the scenario begins... One thing to remember about doing this, is that if you do further edits in the ME, it will re-set some of the text values back to their "default" values, and you're none the wiser, until the group doesn't spawn as you expect. Big thing to remember, is that your submarine cannot be inside the "spawning radius" of the group, which means at least the distance to the horizon, plus some, so I usually go for a minimum of 30 nautical miles, but prefer further, hence my mention of 40nm above.

There are disadvantages to RGG. Number one, you cannot control very easily how the group is arranged. There are a few tricks to that (their "order" in the "Define Group Contents" dialog), but for the most part, it is difficult at best to control. Also, unlike a regular Group or Unit, you cannot use the "Time" function on an RGG, and have the computer tell you when a group or unit will show up at any given place along its route, which is so nice to have with the regular groups and units. A little "trick" around that is to use a regular unit and either copy the RGG's waypoints to it (text editor), or build a similar route for it, then use the "Time" on the regular unit, and you get a rough idea on your RGG. However, regular groups or units cannot "repeat spawn". They are one-time-only generating.

For the NavalBase, which country is your submarine, and which country is the NavalBase you added? That makes a difference. Also, in order to be able to "dock" at a NavalBase, it has to be defined as a NavalBase in the Flotillas.upc file as such. Then you can transfer (or assign your boat) to it, and dock there. Also, which version of SH4 do you have? Some of the older versions (v1.3??) did not have full-functionality of certain aspects of the game...
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Last edited by propbeanie; 04-27-2019 at 09:46 AM. Reason: One minute, one hour - who cares??... lol
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Old 04-27-2019, 12:23 PM   #3
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I have a sh3_missioneditor_v17.pdf file dated 2013 which also applies to SH4, but the only link I can find (http://nordfront.org/xvii-downloads/...editor_v17.pdf) is 404.
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Old 04-27-2019, 12:48 PM   #4
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I'm currently working on a mod (update to Gone Asiatic) using randomly generated groups and looping paths to make the encounters less predictable. so I have the PDF file open right now. Here's an excerpt;

7.6 Spawning units in response to events
Sometimes it is nice to have units spawn into the mission during the mission as a result of an event that has occurred. For example, perhaps the players are stalking a lone merchant and only when the merchant has been sunk, does the Royal Navy send any ships to help look for the U-boat. Here’s an example of how to do this.

• Place two units with waypoints – let’s say a Small Merchant and a Tribal-Class Destroyer.
• Now go to the “Mission  Triggers” menu and add a trigger (for example, call it “Ship Sunk”). Set the Trigger Type to “Unit Destroyed” and the Instance Name to “Small Merchant#1”. Click “Accept”.
• Now go to the “Mission  Events” menu and add a new event (for example, call it, “Reinforcements”). Set the Event Type to “Update Instance”, the
Instance Name to “Tribal Class#1” and click on the Spawn checkbox.
• Now add a trigger, by clicking on the “Add Trigger” button and selecting the “Ship Sunk” trigger you just created. Now select “Accept” and save the mission.

Note that the reinforcement unit must not enter the game immediately. So edit its Unit Properties and set its Game Entry date/time to something in the future compared to the mission. So, for example, if the mission date is 15-Sep-1940, set the entry date of the Tribal Class to 15-Oct-1940. The spawn event is just a way of bringing the unit in early.

Note that you cannot spawn in a unit earlier that the earliest game entry date for it. So, you could get a Tribal Class destroyer in 1940, but not a JC Butler class, which didn’t exist until later in the war.

Note also that units will not spawn in within visual range of the U-boat. So ensure that the Tribal Class in the above example starts at least 20 km away from the action. Use way points to bring it close to the U-boat. If you want a fast response, you need to use a fast destroyer and set its initial speed high (and slow it down, once it gets into the area where it is meant to search).

There are lots of ways of spawning new units, depending on the players satisfying events. However note that in multiplayer mission, it only needs one player to trigger an event to spawn the given unit into the game.
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Old 04-27-2019, 06:28 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sniper297 View Post
I have a sh3_missioneditor_v17.pdf file dated 2013 which also applies to SH4, but the only link I can find (http://nordfront.org/xvii-downloads/...editor_v17.pdf) is 404.
I forgot about that one, Sniper297, but try this link for now: MissionEditorManual.7z. That link will go "dead" when I can get it moved to a more permanent home. You should find the pdf you're looking for inside the zip...
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Old 04-27-2019, 07:14 PM   #6
The Kraken Wakes
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Hey,
just to say thanks for the support and the ME manual. I will have great fun with this. I wish there was a way to do something you guys, but you are so far ahead of me I don't know when that will be.
However, have you updated your soundtracks in the gramophone folder ?
I fed it some mp3 and it worked.
Klaus Doldinger Das Boot, obviously, and some Wagner, but give some of Ron Goodwin's stuff a listen, he was in the RAF. Here are some links







and send some elite crew torpedo bombers in against a Kongo to this one...

Last edited by The Kraken Wakes; 04-27-2019 at 07:19 PM. Reason: bad links
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Old 04-27-2019, 07:35 PM   #7
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Ahh yesh... the Mosquito... the flying PT boat, make of plywood, but a really cool and versatile airplane.

"Payback" is for you to help someone else. Easy-peasy!
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