[TEC] The "Thats just crazy talk" wish list & questions!

[divemonkie]

Hr's behind the wheel leave me thinking about what might be possible.

so thinking about the flak guns I started asking myself what lines of code tell the deck guns what to shoot at? Range, Target ship, target deck, target waterline,,,

If that string of commands is found in the 1024ini could it be copied pasted onto the end of the flak guns commands? Allowing us to order flak guns to target surface ships, target command deck, target weapons,,,,If not than would it be possible to simply treat flak guns as another deck gun? You might lose target aircraft this way but I dive and run away 98% of the time anyway.
would be devastating to open up all guns on a surface contact.

Next on my list is SH3 Commander. As I understand it you can add files to SH3cmder, Skins for ships, audio files for gramophone, text files for messages.
What other files will SH3 read from cmder dates folder? would it read a mission file? LND file or SCR file? RND files. I'm not sure of what use this could be but lets say if a single mission file could be MISSION COMPLETE after reaching a waypoint than dropping spies or retrieving spies, might be possible. If LND files could have changing more diverse environments at ports ships docked, coming and going instead of the same old ships docked and the same old ships on and endless loop.

Anyway, just spitballing ideas seeing if anything sticks.

[U301]

These seem good idea's to me!
KUrtz

[TheNiebuhr]

You wont find the code you want in the .ini file, because it's a property of the gun itself. You must modify the .dat.

[divemonkie]

So you think it might actually be possible? I was afraid it would require some of that hex edit vodo dark magic some of you do.

Here's another one I was thinking about the other day.

I loaded up sh4 last week for the upteenth time. Good graphics smooth play but I still cant get into it like sh3. I would find a Pacific mod in sh3 more interesting to play than playing sh4! How crazy is that?

[TheNiebuhr]

Not that difficult to do. Edit the .dat with Silent 3ditor (skwas). Brief summary: aside from models and textures, .dat also contains the gun logic.
There's the gun controller that specifies the gun's behavior. In particular whether it's DG or AA. In order to make a dual purpose cannon, use both.


So if you were to turn a ship-only gun into dual purpose, you would add another controller for AA, set it up and create a dedicated anti-aircraft round, because HE and AP would be braindead. Define the ammo count in the .ini (dont remember right now) and if everything is done properly, your crew would automatically use the deck gun against planes.

[divemonkie]

Originally Posted by TheNiebuhr

Not that difficult to do. Edit the .dat with Silent 3ditor (skwas). Brief summary: aside from models and textures, .dat also contains the gun logic.
There's the gun controller that specifies the gun's behavior. In particular whether it's DG or AA. In order to make a dual purpose cannon, use both.


So if you were to turn a ship-only gun into dual purpose, you would add another controller for AA, set it up and create a dedicated anti-aircraft round, because HE and AP would be braindead. Define the ammo count in the .ini (dont remember right now) and if everything is done properly, your crew would automatically use the deck gun against planes.

Thanks TheNiebuhr
I did a little digging last night but not sure what I was looking for.
I'd thought about using the deck gun as AA as well but figurd the lack of elevation would make it ineffective.

Not looking to creat UberBoat just think the use of flak guns on merchants would be a nice bonus.

It might even be a little too effective might have to lower damege of guns for game balence.

Guessing it'll take some ini file edits as well to add the extra camands for flak? Target surface or target ships.

Anyway. Thanks for putting me on the right path. I'll do some more digging tonight on break.

[Mad Mardigan]

Originally Posted by divemonkie

Thanks TheNiebuhr
I did a little digging last night but not sure what I was looking for.
I'd thought about using the deck gun as AA as well but figurd the lack of elevation would make it ineffective.

Not looking to creat UberBoat just think the use of flak guns on merchants would be a nice bonus.

It might even be a little too effective might have to lower damege of guns for game balence.

Guessing it'll take some ini file edits as well to add the extra camands for flak? Target surface or target ships.

Anyway. Thanks for putting me on the right path. I'll do some more digging tonight on break.

Ahoy, divemonkie...

it isn't that deck guns weren't used as anti air defense... as they were, until the lack of elevation as you mentioned, came into play then defense air wise, fell solely to the flak guns.

Iirc, the kriegsmarine, did also use deck guns, as well as flak, but as the war progressed & air defenses, got better at ASW as well as better armed (see radar & leigh lights, as well as better depth charge drop tactics which also applied to bomb drops...) well... deck guns, as well as flak was starting to be seen as futile & it was useless for a uboat to stay surfaced & duke it out with aircraft. Think it was towards the end of '43, maybe very early on '44... that flak was starting to be removed from uboats, as well as anti air deck gun ammo not being supplied to the uboats. It may have been even earlier on than the end of '43... will have to do some digging about on that... but suffice it to say.. it was decided that fighting it out with aircraft was basic suicide.. & discretion was the better part of valor when it came to it. Better to dive & try to live to fight another day.

Though, as it went, more than 3/4 of the uboat arm of the navy, didn't make it back home... a clearly devastating attrition rate.

Any way, hope this helps...

M. M.

[divemonkie]

Originally Posted by Mad Mardigan

Ahoy, divemonkie...

it isn't that deck guns weren't used as anti air defense... as they were, until the lack of elevation as you mentioned, came into play then defense air wise, fell solely to the flak guns.

Iirc, the kriegsmarine, did also use deck guns, as well as flak, but as the war progressed & air defenses, got better at ASW as well as better armed (see radar & leigh lights, as well as better depth charge drop tactics which also applied to bomb drops...) well... deck guns, as well as flak was starting to be seen as futile & it was useless for a uboat to stay surfaced 7 duke it out with aircraft. Think it was towards the end of '43, maybe very early on '44... that flak was starting to be removed from uboats, as well as anti air deck gun ammo not being supplied to the uboats. It may have been even earlier on than the end of '43... will have to do some digging about on that... but suffice it to say.. it was decided that fighting it out with aircraft was basic suicide.. & discretion was the better part of valor when it came to it. Better to dive & try to live to fight another day.

Though, as it went, more than 3/4 of the uboat arm of the navy, didn't make it back home... a clearly devastating attrition rate.

Any way, hope this helps...

M. M.

It definitely helps.
Than I see no reason not have both, at range against low flying torpedo bombers might just be the shot that save our boats...and would look really cool doing it. I've a lot to figure out, still not sure how to edit dat. file or witch one I'm looking for. opened several Gun dat. but haven't found anything that looks like duel use edit. Have a little time this weekend to dig through em some more. also need to spend some time reading up on s3d and 1024 ini.

I'm guessing I've stared right at it but as in all things Me it's always the hard way!

[Mad Mardigan]

Originally Posted by divemonkie

It definitely helps.
Than I see no reason not have both, at range against low flying torpedo bombers might just be the shot that save our boats...and would look really cool doing it. I've a lot to figure out, still not sure how to edit dat. file or witch one I'm looking for. opened several Gun dat. but haven't found anything that looks like duel use edit. Have a little time this weekend to dig through em some more. also need to spend some time reading up on s3d and 1024 ini.

I'm guessing I've stared right at it but as in all things Me it's always the hard way!

Oh yeah, by the way... 1 other thing I also.. iirc, on deck guns.. not long after flak was started to be removed, I believe that deck guns also saw a staged removal as well.. as it was looked at as being also too risky to be surfaced to try & finish off a wounded duck ship.

Any way, all the best to you on this side project.. I look forward to it as an add in to add more realism to SH3.

M.M.

[divemonkie]

Originally Posted by Mad Mardigan

Oh yeah, by the way... 1 other thing I also.. iirc, on deck guns.. not long after flak was started to be removed, I believe that deck guns also saw a staged removal as well.. as it was looked at as being also too risky to be surfaced to try & finish off a wounded duck ship.

Any way, all the best to you on this side project.. I look forward to it as an add in to add more realism to SH3.

M.M.

Don't run out of O2 waiting on me. I've no clue what I'm doing.

removing deck guns always bothered me. I get why but I'd be hard pressed to give up a weapon! Even one that put me and my crew at risk. External stores I might give up. It must have been hell being depth charged all the time knowing thousands of pounds of explosive where attached to your boat...right there sitting over your head.

I think they had better odds on the Eastern Front.

[Aktungbby]

TheNiebuhr!

[Mad Mardigan]

Originally Posted by divemonkie

Don't run out of O2 waiting on me. I've no clue what I'm doing.

removing deck guns always bothered me. I get why but I'd be hard pressed to give up a weapon! Even one that put me and my crew at risk. External stores I might give up. It must have been hell being depth charged all the time knowing thousands of pounds of explosive where attached to your boat...right there sitting over your head.

I think they had better odds on the Eastern Front.

Ahoy, divemonkie...

Heh... I won't... but, to be frank about it, can handle small editing, like notepad edits... anything beyond that, I prefer letting others who know more about that do so... that you are comfortable with that, I have a lot of respect for.. & that goes to others who do modding, as well.

Having dinked about with very early on, back in the dino days of coding, & well understand the pleasures & headaches of poking about with coding.

I know, it isn't exactly the same, nowadays.. but the headaches are just as valid & relevant just the same... 1 misstep, 1 symbol, number... a space where it shouldn't be... any lil' error... & you're pulling out your hair trying to figure out where the mistake was made.... sometimes finding it, sometimes not.. & other times, no matter what you do.. things don't go as they were envisioned.

So, as I said... I have a very healthy dose of respect for modders.

Besides, I'm retired.. so I got nothin' but time...

So... No rush, divemonkie... I wish ya, all the best in investigating this.

M. M.