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Old 04-03-11, 08:54 PM   #1
Loud_Silence
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Default A P-51 overtook my Me-262 WHAT?!?!

In real life, the Me-262 was pretty much untouchable in the sky. It was 100 Kph faster than the fastest propeller driven airplanes. Only a few were shot down shile airborne. The best way to get rid off them was by shooting them down when they were taking off or landing or by destroying them while on the ground.

In Il-2 1946, flying the Me-262 against an allied bomber formation, I get my ass handed to P-51Ds. They climb faster than me, accelerate faster than me, turn faster than me...

And the most hilarious part is that they can overtake me!!! Even though IL-2 Compare states that the Me-262's top speed is about 200 Kph faster than the P-51D's.
Those speeds, however, are only, and theoretically, reached with the engines working at 100% power, which is unsustainable.
In the Me-262, the engines can work at 80% undefinitely (or at least for a time longer than my longest flight on the 262).
At 90% they can work for about 10 to 15 minutes before overheating.
But at 95-100%, they can only work for a maximum of 5 minutes before overheating.
To worsen things, the AI has the mysterious ability to operate it's engines at full power for extended periods of time without overheating them.

With all this, the enemy P-51s can fast enough to close in on me, take a few long shots and damage my fragile engines, forcing me to bail out.

And if I get a P-51 on my six at close range, I can consider myself shot down, because they can catch up with me on dives, climbs, turns.... there's no escape.
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Old 04-03-11, 09:05 PM   #2
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IL-2's AI is notorious for cheating, especially when it is set to Veteren and Ace; it's faster, does not suffer blackouts and doesn't stall, for example. It sort of makes up for this in its inability to hit anything actively trying to avoid being shot, but it's still bloody annoying.

As for the Me 262's engines overheating, you can actually keep them running on full power if you maintain high velocity, at over about 400-500km/h they should run just fine.
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Old 04-04-11, 09:23 AM   #3
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The magic word is speed. You have to keep it at 500+km/h to have a chance in the 262. Below that the engines will overheat at 100%. Don't do wild manoeuvres, keep your speed up and you will outrun and outclimb everyone with ease. Forget about dogfighting, you're flying a bomberkiller (although a certain person in Berlin disagreed with that and classified it as a bomber...) that wasn't meant to take on fighters.
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Old 04-04-11, 09:44 AM   #4
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I did what you said about going faster than 500 kph, and it works! I can fly with my engines at full power all the time without any problems. But it takes a while to accelerate past 500 kph, and as soon as my speed drops below 500 the engines overheat. Where did you learn that? Piston engines also do that (never overheating past a certain speed)?

The problem is that it's a bit tricky to keep high speed while climbing, and during combats I have to stick to the horizontal. After some bad planned climbs, I lost too much speed, and before I could get past 500 kph the P-51 managed to shot one of my engines, and down I went.

And finally, 4.10's new pilot hypervulnerability makes horizontal passes against bombers a bit suicide...
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Old 04-04-11, 10:35 AM   #5
Fincuan
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The 262 is really the ultimate boom and zoom aircraft in the sense that it doesn't like steep turns or climbs at all and its acceleration is crap. You need to keep everything smooth and gradual, like in a P-38 against Japs, and always watch your speed. If speed looks like it's dropping too low your only choice should be to disengage and not try to squeeze in that last extra burst.
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Old 04-04-11, 12:05 PM   #6
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It could be worse. You could be flying the European Air War version of it where you could barely touch the trigger before being greeted with the "Cannon jammed" message.
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Old 04-04-11, 01:49 PM   #7
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Hey, Fincuan is back! I think I haven't seen you in months.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loud_Silence View Post
I did what you said about going faster than 500 kph, and it works! I can fly with my engines at full power all the time without any problems. But it takes a while to accelerate past 500 kph, and as soon as my speed drops below 500 the engines overheat. Where did you learn that? Piston engines also do that (never overheating past a certain speed)?
.
The airspeed determines the engine's cooling. The faster you go the more air flows through the turbines and can cool it. The same works for most piston aircraft as well. As long as you go fast you'll hardly have overheating, if you start to dogfight however this might look quite differently. It's actually a good advice to always keep the radiators fully open to keep the engine as cool as possible and only close them in emergency situations when you need that last bis of speed.
Oh and with the 262 you don't need to raise the nose that much to climb. Establish a steady climb at around 550km/h. You'll notice that you won't raise your nose high, yet you'll climb with more than 20m/s because of your great speed.
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Old 03-26-12, 01:53 PM   #8
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I Agree, the ME262 in the IL-2 Sturmovik(1946) game is far under powered. Aproriot cruzing speed is good around 55-65% power, And I also agree that the all around best combat power setting is around 80%. However I have successfully combatted my three brothers in the ME262 running around 92% power. i find that this is the "Sweet Spot". Ithe ME262 you usually have a superior turn radius. Keep your plane level or in a down ward descent during combat and you shouldnt have a problem. as for the AI supremacy.... theres not much you can do.... Ive seen a ME262 run in a 20 degree incline away from me at full boosters for 30min with out over heating.... i was flying the same plane. However this could be a difference in his fuel mixtures. He could be running a 120% fuel mixture where i have to run the preset mixture. Find yourself in a losing situation. i find the best way to survive is to tuck and run. The ME262 is a metal plane which means that its heavy, use that to your advantage, dive and keep engines controlled, slowly drop your power keep you speed during you descent around 900 Kph, Most prop planes will loose control surfaces at that speed. OH and a ME262 going 900Kph WILL climb 3km at a 90degree from ground level..... ive done it.

OH and the ME262s and the BF109(ME109) in RedTails were severely under shown... when the German Ace went head to head in the last battle with the P51 and they both hit each other multiple times..... yeah, if the American pilot had really been hit 4-5 times by the 262's 20mm cannons he would be a very small puddle leaking through the floor..... just saying...
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Old 03-26-12, 02:00 PM   #9
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Does this thread count for the necro game?

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=193765

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Old 03-26-12, 02:26 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mookiemookie View Post
Does this thread count for the necro game?
I think so, however I'm sure there are older threads than this around.

Welcome aboard, Quinch001

Oh, and I think the Red Tails movie, if it's the one I'm thinking of, is in another thread where the 'manoeuvring' was criticised
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