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Old 11-17-2018, 07:03 AM   #11251
vdr1981
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Interesting facts and propositions indeed Cybermat, thank you. But they will have to wait untill I return home. Then, we can discuss them in more details...

Also , please confirm that you've read my twos version compatibility note.
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Old 11-17-2018, 11:40 AM   #11252
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Hi
I have assumed that "Free Poles, France, etc." are units that continue to fight allies despite the occupation of their countries. It is obvious that I was wrong and have a different meaning. I have to admit that although they play SH5 from 2015, I still find new things for me.
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Old 11-17-2018, 01:08 PM   #11253
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Originally Posted by vdr1981 View Post
I'm glad you like the new update guys.
I won't be able to do any modding for the next two weeks or so and my forum activity will be limited to my phone only but I'll try to leave few posts here and there anyway.
I'll monitor other posts as much as I can of course
so feel free to report any problems with current version which I could try to address in the next update.
The latest updates were all valuable to each other and have made the simulation wonderfully evolved.


This update is really great, so in the past the crew system was still a weak point in SH5. The new changes made by you Vecko are well considered and fit for me to 100%!

What should be the "tune" of the torpedoes in the past, in my opinion a very unrealistic nonsense! The current setting options, with the maintenance options are much more realistic and it just looks good.
I could deliver a lot more examples, in short, I'm excited about the new crewsystem!

All this optimizes the simulation in such a wonderful way that a submarine enthusiast wishes.

Oh, I'm so excited, I got my promotions points in "the New Campaign" and I'm now standing again, East of England during the Happy Times.



Thanks again "BDU" Vecko.

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Old 11-17-2018, 01:16 PM   #11254
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Originally Posted by Cybermat47 View Post
Vecko, just some things to note about the last few campaigns:

Turning Point

- It would be good to have an optional mod that allows us to start this campaign with a VII C, rather than a U-flak. U-flaks were limited to escort and aircraft trap operations in the Bay of Biscay, meaning that they missed out on the climactic convoy battles that are the focus of this campaign. The standard VII C, on the other hand, was the workhorse of these battles.
- All of the U-flaks were VII Cs, converted to U-flaks in France, so it would make more sense for a U-flak campaign to start at a French base, rather than having to transfer there from Kiel.
- - On that note, I think that the front flak gun on the U-flak should be changed to a quad 20mm by default - see the image below.
- As the French base in this campaign is La Pallice, it would make more sense for the flotilla to the the 3rd - the 9th only operated from Brest.



Monsun Gruppe

- The starting boat for this campaign should be the type VII C, not the VII C/41. The first VII C/41, U-292, was only assigned to a combat flotilla in May 1944, while this campaign starts in March 1943.
- This campaign's flotilla should probably be the 12th, which was the only flotilla to send type VII u-boats to Penang.
- - While the 12th was based in Bordeaux, I don't think it's absolutely necessary to make that a new starting base. The 1st patrol can easily be explained as a transfer patrol between the 3rd Flotilla (La Pallice) and the 12th (Penang).

The Final Years

- I've seen Go-229s flying over Wilhelmshaven. In reality this aircraft never saw operational use, only ever existing as a prototype.
- We shouldn't be given orders to patrol the North Atlantic. At the time of the campaign, type VIIs were focusing on the arctic, English channel, and British coast. Starving Britain was no longer an option, all they could do was deprive the invasion forces of supplies.
- I haven't been able to find anything about u-boats sailing from Wilhelmshaven (at least not VII C/41s). I think it would make more sense to have the boat start at Kiel, then be transferred to Bergen during the 1st patrol. See the patrol history of U-1004: https://uboat.net/boats/patrols/u1004.html
- On the topic of bases and flotillas, the flotilla for the campaign should be the 11th. The 9th only ever operated from Brest, and was disbanded in September 1944, soon after the campaign begins. The 11th was active right up until the end of the war.

Hope you find this useful, and I'm happy to help if you want

WOW Cybermat47, very well researched , hope Vecko can change one or the other in the game through it.


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Old 11-17-2018, 06:06 PM   #11255
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hey everybody i star the next patrol after updating to 2.29 ( thanks again for a super update and great work Vecko . now when i'm at the team overview and i want to click on the picture of my sound guy the game crashes . do You have any ideas what can i do because i want to update and
award the guy
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Old 11-18-2018, 12:41 AM   #11256
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vdr1981 View Post
Also , please confirm that you've read my twos version compatibility note.
Yep, the description has been updated.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lestart44 View Post
hey everybody i star the next patrol after updating to 2.29 ( thanks again for a super update and great work Vecko . now when i'm at the team overview and i want to click on the picture of my sound guy the game crashes . do You have any ideas what can i do because i want to update and
award the guy
Have you started a new career?
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Old 11-18-2018, 07:04 AM   #11257
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Congrats about the latest version. I'm so glad the installer now includes everything of everything, this keeps getting better!

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Old 11-18-2018, 07:10 AM   #11258
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Some more notes, this time in regards to the first two campaigns.

Coastal Waters

- The opening mission against the Polish Navy at Danzig, while fun, is inaccurate. No u-boats were involved in the attack. They had been sent out to the Atlantic, to be ready to attack British shipping. Therefore, it would be more accurate for the player to start at their German base, with Atlantic patrol missions available from the beginning.
- - But again, the Polish missions are fun. Perhaps the more accurate starting situation can be an optional mod?
- As the player is in the 2nd Flotilla, the only German bass they operate from should be Wilhelmshaven. The 2nd Flotilla was only based in Kiel for a few weeks in September 1936.
- Currently, the VII A only has the early war tower, with the flak gun on the deck. However, at some point (probably the winter of 39-40, like the VII Bs), this tower was changed to the enlarged type seen on the VII B and similar to that of the VII C. I’m not sure if it’s possible to make this an option for the VII A, though.


The Happy Times

- The player is again in the 2nd Flotilla in this campaign, and so the transfer of bases from Wilhelmshaven to Lorient needs no changing. However, the 2nd Flotilla never operated the type VII B (the default for this campaign). All the VII Bs at the time, including the famous U-47, U-48, U-99, and U-100, were in the 7th Flotilla. To be historically accurate, then, the player should be in the 7th Flotilla and start in Kiel, then transfer to St Nazaire.
- - However, if the player keeps their VII A from Coastal Waters, then they should still be in the 2nd Flotilla for this campaign, as no VII As were in the 7th. Another optional mod, perhaps?

I hope I’m not coming across as demanding, just want to help you make SH5 with TWoS the best it can possibly be.
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Old 11-18-2018, 11:16 AM   #11259
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i have done now a complete reinstallation and the same problem . anybody has a advice ?













Quote:
Originally Posted by Lestart44 View Post
hey everybody i star the next patrol after updating to 2.29 ( thanks again for a super update and great work Vecko . now when i'm at the team overview and i want to click on the picture of my sound guy the game crashes . do You have any ideas what can i do because i want to update and
award the guy
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Old 11-18-2018, 12:11 PM   #11260
vdr1981
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Originally Posted by Lestart44 View Post
i have done now a complete reinstallation and the same problem . anybody has a advice ?
Where did you download the update? Post a link...
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Old 11-18-2018, 02:40 PM   #11261
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i'm sorry that was my fault i didint read that it is not savegame compatible. sorry very much. now i have to start new my captain look book of 2 year goes to trash

Last edited by Lestart44; 11-18-2018 at 03:17 PM.
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Old 11-18-2018, 07:45 PM   #11262
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Default WOS Update

re; update 2.29 . Some sensible changes much appreciated
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Old 11-19-2018, 03:49 AM   #11263
vdr1981
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cybermat47 View Post
Yep, the description has been updated.
Any specific reason why do you still keep your mod for free torpedo preheating up?
Also, keep in mind that your addon mods will most probably become incompatible with almost every new TWoS update,so please make sure to update them accordingly.
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Old 11-19-2018, 12:27 PM   #11264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muckenberg View Post
Hello
I started a new career in "Happy Times" after updating and became a strange thing. During the attack on the convoy I sank the Greek tanker and the game recognized him as hostile. When I looked at the map, Greece is still neutral, with the exception of Crete. it is hostile here. I will have to look when the British have landed in Crete.
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I'm sure Gap can give you excellent explanation what "free nations" actually are and why they are there , if you contact him...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cybermat47 View Post
I believe the reason is that you don’t gain renown for sinking neutral ships, while Greek ships were being sunk quite often in real life by the u-boats before Greece was bought into the war. That neutral tonnage still counted towards decorations for the captains and crews.

So the “free Greece” solution allows you to be properly recognised for destroying Greek tonnage in British convoys while keeping “proper” Greece neutral.
Vdr1981 and Cybermat47 are absolutely correct in stating that the Greek ships we see in convoys even before Italy and Germany declared war on Greece, are from the "free greek" roster, i.e. a "fake nation", whose vessels sail under the Greek ensign, which is set as our enemy throughout the war.

In the past, Allied convoys that we see in game featured a mix of Allied and neutral ships. This was in accordance with historical records indeed. Nonetheless, gamewise, the practice of creating "mixed" convoys is undesiderable for at least two reasons:
  1. as noted before by Cybermat47, neutral vessels in allied convoys were considered valid targets by the Germans, but their sinking in game is not followed by the awarding of the usual renown points (actually, there should be a penalty instead); there are ways to change that, but then the player would be awarded rewnown points even for the sinking of "real" neutral ships outside convoys.

  2. neutral ships in convoys react differently than enemy ones when the convoy is attacked. Mixing them in one convoy often results in collisions and messy AI behaviours because of the different evasive maneuvers put in place.

Creating "free" copies of some nations was the easiest workaround to obviate the above problems while still keeping realistical convoy compositions. More in general, those "free nations" are also useful for representing:
a) neutrality patrols and convoy escorts accomplished by US warships and aicraft, before the Americans entered war

b) those neutral merchants that, early in the war, contravened one or more of the German prize rules, and for that reason were considered valid targets even though they were not sailing in convoys:
  • armed merchant ships or unarmed ships that posed any sort of threat (e.g. by sending S.O.S. messages on being stopped for inspection by German U-boats);
  • merchant ships that were caught in British waters in the act of smuggling goods to/from the UK;
  • merchant ships that did not sport obvious national markings (i.e. national ensign and/or neutrality markings on their hulls);
  • merchant ships that sailed unlit at night;
  • zig-zagging ships, or ships that put in place other evasive maneuvers

c) ships that kept sailing on the Allied side, despite their nation being conquered by the Germans and becoming a Nazi puppet state (Free France being a good example of that, the only "Free" nation also featured in vanilla game btw).
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Last edited by gap; 11-19-2018 at 05:36 PM. Reason: added point c)
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Old 11-19-2018, 01:45 PM   #11265
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cybermat47 View Post
Vecko, just some things to note about the last few campaigns...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cybermat47 View Post
Some more notes, this time in regards to the first two campaigns...
Interesting notes Cybermat47!

I love your attention to historical realism and I like seeing that I am not the only history fanatic here. Since I took part in the development of the Baltic Operations campaign by providing Trevally with the results of my historical research, I think I can answer your remarks on it.

To start off, this campaign was not present in stock game. As you probably remember, in its stead there was a quite meagre and poorly designed tutorial taking place in the middle of the Baltic Sea during the first hours of the invasion of Poland. I think it was my idea replacing it with a proper campaign, starting a few days earlier in Memel. The idea originated from the "discovery" that three Type VII-A U-boats assigned to the 2nd U-Flotille (U-31, U-32 and U-35) started their first patrols in active service from Memel, departing from there on 27 August and docking at Wilhelmshaven (U-31) and Kiel (U-32 and U-35) between the 1st and the 2nd day of September after a short stay in the Danzig Bay. I think I have read somewhere (though I cannot remember the source) that their order was to intercept and follow, unseen, the Polish warships escaping to England on the eve of the Polish invasion; their patrol was obviously uneventful though, as the Peking Plan had taken place a few days earlier, unbeknownst to the German intelligence. Taking the cue from the episode above, my initial idea (further elaborated by Trevally) was for us to be instructed by B.d.U. to station in the Danzig Bay and intercept/shadow/report any Polish warship outbound from there.

Further inspiration came fro Operation Rurka (a failed attempt to mine the entrances to the Danzig Bay, during which the Polish minelayer ORP Gryf was bombed by German Stuka's) and from the subsequent Battle of Danzig Bay. Indeed, no U-boat actually took part in any of those actions, but I and Trevally thought it fit to force history a bit and to let the player starting his career with a short and not too demanding prelude with many scripted and "cinematic" events before the more challenging campaigns that take place in the North Sea and in the Atlantic. Since Vecko has removed tonnage requirements from SH5, I think nothing prevents the player from ignoring orders and heading directly for Kiel, in time for starting the ramaining objectives of "Coastal Waters" directly from there beginning from September 1st. All is needed not to wait too long in bunker, is this little utility by Trevally: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/down...o=file&id=3388

I think that's all for now. More general remarks by me in the next days
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Last edited by gap; 11-19-2018 at 05:59 PM.
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