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Old 06-29-21, 03:49 PM   #691
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As you noted, the President cannot pardon state crimes Markus. Chauvin was convicted by the state of Minnesota for manslaughter, not the federal government. Now he also faces charges by the Feds in connection. If he is found guilty then it is theoretically possible for a future president to pardon those convictions.

The only way he gets out of his 22 year sentence is to get a court to overturn the state conviction. That is probably more possible than a presidential pardon.
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Old 11-16-21, 08:03 AM   #692
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Looks like the Kyle trial is coming to an end

https://news.yahoo.com/explainer-why...195605080.html

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On its face, convicting Rittenhouse on that count looked like a legal slam dunk. No one contested that he was 17 the night of the protest in August 2020. Bystander and surveillance video clearly shows him walking around with the rifle strapped to his chest before the shootings, using the gun to shoot and kill Joseph Rosenbaum and Anthony Huber and wound Gaige Grosskreutz.

But Rittenhouse's attorneys seized on a subsection of the Wisconsin law that states the ban on minors possessing dangerous weapons applies to minors armed with rifles or shotguns only if those weapons are short-barreled. The language stems from a bill that then-Republican Gov. Tommy Thompson signed in 1991. Lawmakers across the country were trying to find ways to curb gang violence around that time. Kenosha defense attorney Michael Cicchini said the law was likely intended to prevent youths from carrying sawed-off shotguns.

Rittenhouse's AR-15-style rifle was not short-barreled.
Personally, I'm hoping for a not guilty verdict.
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Old 11-16-21, 08:43 AM   #693
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I don't see what they can convict him of but I do understand they plan to tell the jury they can find him guilty of some so far unspecified "lesser charges".

I also think the feds might go after the kid too.
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Old 11-16-21, 08:57 AM   #694
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I've been following this matter with great interest, having on a few occasions found myself in similar situations working Federal security and Airbase police work, where bystanders, seeing my predicament, ran to detain the berserk person(s) threatening me and saved me potential paperwork & lawsuits etc. Other than being young, dumb, and in the wrong place at the wrong time, the 17 year old Rittenhouse had an inalienable right to defend himself in all 3 shootings. 1:The obviously deranged gun grabber died with muzzle soot on his hands. One simply never gives up a firearm; unless ordered by a peace officer! 2: The actual hit with the skateboard to the head /neck is a lethal attack at the level of deterrence by deadly force. A similar head-strike is prohibited in trained baton use; and 3: the wounded EMT, brandishing his own firearm, was a professional who should have known better...the more so as 16 other gun shots (ie: discharge of weapon within city limits??!!)emanating from his faction on videos only reflected the chaos "in the moment". Basically the Kenosha affair was two not-so-well ordered militias, tacitly condoned by overworked police, becoming a vigilante mob; singling out an over armed dolt police cadet?? for self-defense would be a travesty of equal justice for all. Moreover the facts coming out during the trial that the prosecution should have known beforehand, point up the poorness of the state's case in this knee-jerk showtrial.
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Old 11-16-21, 12:34 PM   #695
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I think the kid had every right to defend himself. But I also think he is 100% responsible for putting himself in that situation. He could have stayed at home, but he chose not to. I wouldn't be totally opposed to finding him guilty of a lesser crime such as illegally carrying a firearm.
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Old 11-16-21, 01:26 PM   #696
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean C
I wouldn't be totally opposed to finding him guilty of a lesser crime such as illegally carrying a firearm.
Precisely! and, as in olden daze, the judge could suspend all charges in lieu of his joining the military, preferably the Army or the Marines....God knows he can certainly shoot straight! and knows when to start buggin' out too!
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Old 11-16-21, 02:06 PM   #697
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Except that the judge has already ruled that he wasn't illegally possessing the firearm.
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Old 11-16-21, 05:57 PM   #698
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I know; but the kid needs to go where they keep an eye on him till he reaches 30. Where were the parents; not monitoring their 17 yr. old offspring trotting off to riots, mayhem and civil unrest with an AR-15!!?? The kid may O.J. the criminal beef but there's still the civil suits coming up; marionetted by circumcised $hyster$ as bad as the prosecutor...and mommy and daddy are liable. I recommended the USAF Academy to my rambunctious erstwhile nephew some 40 years ago...he just made Brigadier General; likewise I kept pressing my youngest brother into the Navy when he wouldn't stay in school; he did 20 years incl. reserves and left as a petty officer after helmsmanning the USS Little Rock and San Bernadino...and has a retirement! I may thus be considered to have smattering of whereof I speak on child development...plus in police cadet Rittenhouse's case, I think his PD career aspirations are over with!??
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Old 11-16-21, 07:55 PM   #699
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And the jury recessed. Poso reported that a US Marshal has confirmed that it is 10 not guiltys with 2 holding out only because they are fearful of mob retaliation and doxxing by the media. The judge should just declare mistrial with prejudice due to jury tampering as a result.
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Old 11-16-21, 08:13 PM   #700
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aktungbby View Post
I know; but the kid needs to go where they keep an eye on him till he reaches 30. Where were the parents; not monitoring their 17 yr. old offspring trotting off to riots, mayhem and civil unrest with an AR-15!!?? The kid may O.J. the criminal beef but there's still the civil suits coming up; marionetted by circumcised $hyster$ as bad as the prosecutor...and mommy and daddy are liable. I recommended the USAF Academy to my rambunctious erstwhile nephew some 40 years ago...he just made Brigadier General; likewise I kept pressing my youngest brother into the Navy when he wouldn't stay in school; he did 20 years incl. reserves and left as a petty officer after helmsmanning the USS Little Rock and San Bernadino...and has a retirement! I may thus be considered to have smattering of whereof I speak on child development...plus in police cadet Rittenhouse's case, I think his PD career aspirations are over with!??



The kid needs to be set free as this is a clear case of self defense. As for his right to be there, he had every right as long as this is still a free country.
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Old 11-16-21, 08:16 PM   #701
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3catcircus View Post
And the jury recessed. Poso reported that a US Marshal has confirmed that it is 10 not guiltys with 2 holding out only because they are fearful of mob retaliation and doxxing by the media. The judge should just declare mistrial with prejudice due to jury tampering as a result.

Just what the prosecution wants. If those numbers are true and i have a hard time believing that a US Marshal would throw away his career like that, then hopefully the holdouts will be convinced to do the right thing by the others in the morning.



Meanwhile I just can't understand why the jury is not sequestered.
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Old 11-17-21, 03:04 AM   #702
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So any self-declared private militia can grab their guns, travel to whatever they see fit and have a good time "defending" american values or what they think that is? While they just want some action, but not at home of course. What is the police and any official law enforcement for?

To do private intentional riot tourism with a loaded half-automatic gun seems like a case of intentionally looking for action and trouble.
Walking around privately pointing any gun (no one cares what this gun is or was especially, the case is not about bearing guns and which, but about killing) at people, while no one can know what this person walking around "proud, like a hero out of a western", not belonging to official police force, is doing or about to do.

What about some black 17-year-olds with guns, patrolling the streets in other cities than their own due to their right of free movement, to quench riots, how do (white) people look at that?

Pleading not guilty, not even a hint of self-doubt "I did nothing wrong, i was defending myself"?
If this "poor, harmless kid" gets out free i am sure we will hear of him again, probably after his next provocation.
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Old 11-17-21, 08:26 AM   #703
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Catfish View Post
So any self-declared private militia can grab their guns, travel to whatever they see fit and have a good time "defending" american values or what they think that is? While they just want some action, but not at home of course. What is the police and any official law enforcement for?
If the police cannot protect you, shouldn't you be allowed to protect yourself? I feel stupid just asking that.

Quote:
To do private intentional riot tourism with a loaded half-automatic gun seems like a case of intentionally looking for action and trouble.
Walking around privately pointing any gun at people, while no one can know what this person walking around "proud, like a hero out of a western", not belonging to official police force, is doing or about to do.

I think you are not the only person who objects to people who won't cower down before criminals and mobs by labeling them "cowboys". That seems to be cultural thing with many in Europe. I wonder how many secretly admire the cowboy but for some reasons cannot admit to it.

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What about some black 17-year-olds with guns, patrolling the streets in other cities than their own due to their right of free movement, to quench riots, how do (white) people look at that?
If a mob was attacking a black owned business and the blacks were defending it, pretty sure most people would back that up.

My only criticism of this kid is he's too young to be involved in this kind of situation. Where were his parents? I'm all for defending property against the mob but he should have been studying algebra at home. There aren't enough 30-60 year olds in Wisconsin to handle this?

As for the rioters and mobs, I have no objection to seeing them gunned down.
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Old 11-17-21, 08:56 AM   #704
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Good points, still
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Originally Posted by Onkel Neal View Post
If the police cannot protect you, shouldn't you be allowed to protect yourself? I feel stupid just asking that.
Well of course, when i am threatened myself, or people close to me are. But if some people in far away New York riot and set fire to cars and loot, will you jump in your car with a gun, to patrol the streets there and "help" the police?
It is not about cowering down or criticising cowboys, but as i read in several reports Rittenhouse walked away from the shooting "..proud, like a hero out of a western", and i think this is not appropriate to the situation but rather childish. Well he still is a child, yes, and where were his parents.

B.t.w. I did my own playing and behaving like a "cowboy" when i was a child, no real shooting involved. Mostly ahem, at least not against people.

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As for the rioters and mobs, I have no objection to seeing them gunned down.
No sympathy for them, but gun them down?
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Old 11-17-21, 09:10 AM   #705
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Yeah, I see what you mean. As I said, a 17-year old has no business in that situation. For him, he may have been actually playing cowboy in his head.
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