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Old 07-25-2007, 08:58 PM   #16
Chock
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I'd suggest a navy-related plane. A flying boat, a torpedo bomber, an F-14. Something like that.
That doesn't rule out the Spitfire then, since you can have the naval Seafire version! Or the bf109K either, since it was intended for the German carrier that never got finished.

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Old 07-25-2007, 09:15 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chock
Quote:
I'd suggest a navy-related plane. A flying boat, a torpedo bomber, an F-14. Something like that.
That doesn't rule out the Spitfire then, since you can have the naval Seafire version! Or the bf109K either, since it was intended for the German carrier that never got finished.

Chock
Nope, The Graf Zeppelin was meant to carry the BF-109T version, not the K.

Quote:
Bf 109K "Kurfürst"


Messerschmitt Bf 109 K-4


Most of the planes of the Bf 109K "Kurfürst" series saw duty. This series was the last evolution of the Bf 109. The K series was a response to the bewildering array of series, models, modification kits and factory conversions for the Bf 109, which made production and maintenance complicated and costly — something Germany could ill-afford late in the war. The RLM ordered Messerschmitt to rationalise production of the Bf 109, consolidating parts, types etc to produce a uniform, standard model with better interchangeability of parts and equipment. This was to have started in the later models of the G series, but things went in quite the opposite direction. The RLM told Messerschmitt, in effect, to try harder, and the K series was born. Work on the new version began in 1943, and the prototype was ready by the autumn of that year. Series production started in August 1944 due to delays with continuous changes and the new DB605D powerplant. Operational service began in October 1944, and large numbers — approximately 200 — were delivered to frontline units by the end of the month. By the end of January 1945, despite continuous heavy fighting, over 300 K-4s — about every 4th 109 — were listed on hand with the 1st line Luftwaffe units.
In the proposed K-6, K-8, K-10 and the K-14 the armament would have seen some changes. They retained the two MG 131 above its engine and added a built-in MK 108 in each wing and a MK 108 engine mounted cannon. The K-14 would have had the special performance DB605L and four bladed propeller.
Only the K-4 saw action in numbers, approximately 1,700 being delivered by factories before the end of hostilities. Some sources point to limited use of the K-14, but the type was never actually built. K-4s with quasi-DB605Ls, a DB605 with the two-stage super-charger but not other improvements, and the standard three-bladed propellors, were assembled. Armament of the K-4 consisted of a 30 mm MK 108 engine-mounted cannon with 65 rounds and two 13 mm MG 131 in the nose with 300 rounds each, and there was the capacity to carry additional equipment such as a droptank, bombs up to 500 kg, underwing 20 mm gondolas or 210 mm rockets (as on the Gustav models); the latter two however were rarely used due to marauding Allied fighters calling for performance.
The Bf 109 K-4 was the fastest 109 of WWII reaching ~715 km/h (445 mph) at 7,500 m altitude; improved propellers were being developed when the war ended which would boost the speed to 727 km/h (452 mph), or even 741 km/h (460 mph). Rate of climb was outstanding, up to 5,800 ft/min at 1.98ata, and 5,500 ft/min at 1.8ata. With such improvements in performance, the Bf 109 remained comparable if not superior to the highest performance Allied or Soviet fighters until the end of the war. However, the deteriorating ability of the thousands of novice Luftwaffe pilots by this stage of the war meant the 109's strengths were of little value against the numerous and well-trained Allied fighter pilots.
and

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Bf 109T "Trägerflugzeug" (carrier aircraft)


Messerschmitt Bf 109 T-1


Prior to the war the German Navy had become fascinated with the idea of the aircraft carrier. Borrowing ideas from the British and Japanese (mainly the Akagi), they started the construction of the Graf Zeppelin (not to be confused with the airship Graf Zeppelin) as part of the rebuilding of the navy. The air group for the carrier was settled on Messerschmitt Bf 109T fighters and Ju 87T dive bombers. The suffix 'T' denoting carrier, 'Träger', in German use.
Initially ten Bf 109E-3 were ordered to be modified to Bf 109T-0 standard. This included, adding a tail-hook, catapult fittings, structural strengthening, manually folding wings and increased wingspan (to 11.08 m). Also the landing gear track was a little wider. Thus prepared, the Bf 109T probably would have been proven much better for carrier operations than the British Supermarine Seafire, a hardly modified landplane that suffered from a bad accident rate flying from carriers.
Following the flight tests, especially the catapult tests, a series of 70 T-1 with DB601N engine was to be produced at Fieseler in Kassel, but after seven T-1 were built, the carrier project was canceled. The remaining 63 of 70 T-1 were built as T-2 without carrier equipment and some of the T-0 and T-1s may have been "upgraded" to T-2 standard. These planes were assigned to I/JG.77, deployed in Norway. The decision to base them in Norway was made primarily by the conditions on the Norwegian landing strips. These landing strips being both short and subject to frequent, powerful cross-winds. Some time after the unit was ordered to turn over their aircraft to a test unit that was training on the Drontheim-Fjorde strip and received E-3s as replacements. The armament of the Bf 109T consisted of two MG 17 above the engine and one MG FF/M cannon in each wing.
Interest in the Graf Zeppelin returned when the value of aircraft carriers became obvious, and in 1942 the ship was back in the yards for completion. By this time the Bf 109T was hopelessly outdated and a new fighter would be needed. Messerschmitt responded with the updated Me 155A series, but work on the ship was again canceled and the Me 155 was later re-purposed as a high-altitude interceptor.
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Old 07-25-2007, 09:20 PM   #18
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Unfortunately, the T model isn't modeled in IL2.
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Old 07-25-2007, 11:03 PM   #19
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Nope, The Graf Zeppelin was meant to carry the BF-109T version, not the K
Yup, my mistake, it was indeed the T, ought to know that, I've got enough books on the goddam things By the way, the engine-mounted cannon noted in your quote was in fact rarely used, even though many 109s were actually capable of mounting it, because they found that the vibration from it was too great, resulting in damage to the engine, something the French already knew from WW1, when they put a cannon in the same place on a few SPADs. Ironically enough, the Americans also found out a disadvantage of putting a big cannon on an aeroplane too when they first tried it on the A-10, with the gas from the gunsmoke ingesting into the engines when it fired and stalling them, turning the early prototype into a glider! Thus forcing them to put a big fairing on it to dissipate the gas.

Still back on topic, there's nothing stopping the B-25 being a 'Navy' candidate either!

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Old 07-26-2007, 02:24 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Safe-Keeper
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I hope you mean "tests".
:rotfl:

I'd suggest a navy-related plane. A flying boat, a torpedo bomber, an F-14. Something like that.
Now, how the **** are you going to dogfight with those flying pigs?!

Too bad we cant make new roundels. It's a huge job to make skins for pretty much 20% of the aircraft in IL2. Squadron emblems, would be one possibility, but then we should be flying with RAF/Luftwaffe/USAAF etc. markings on.

Spitfire & BF109 can use the same skin for all the variants as there's not too many changes between them.

A radical choice would be to pick one plane to use as the 'official' SubSim plane and skin only that.
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Old 07-31-2007, 11:47 PM   #21
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I'd really like a Sea-fire if you've done one.

The subsim logo would be enough but some customisation ie: Reaves and the RAAF logo on it would be cool.
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Old 08-01-2007, 04:27 AM   #22
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mmm...

Dowly,
is it posible to add an extra country?
and make markings/emblems which are just the logos and URL of subsim

:hmm:
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Old 08-01-2007, 09:47 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by HunterICX
mmm...

Dowly,
is it posible to add an extra country?
and make markings/emblems which are just the logos and URL of subsim

:hmm:
Dont think so. AFAIK, the sounds & skins/emblems/noseart are the only ones that can be modded.
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Old 08-01-2007, 09:59 AM   #24
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Just a wild throw, how about this BF109T scheme? Transfered to all the planes we need?



And Dan, I know you like your Spit skin. If you agree to take a SubSim Skin, it doesnt mean you have to use it all the time (e.g. if we are just dogfighting). But mainly for coop missions/public servers (Yes, I know most of the servers have skin D/L disabled, but once you get the skin from other player, I think it should show even if skin D/L is turned off. The online skins are stored in netCache folder or something like that.).
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Old 08-01-2007, 10:55 AM   #25
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That 109 skin looks good mate. As long as it's dark blue and not the dayglo blue you've been using.

As for the Subsim logo, is white the best colour? Maybe black. Also, if there is no skin warping, put the logo under the cockpit canopy rather than on the tail, that way, if we have to play with correct roundels on public servers, it won't look gay.
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Old 08-01-2007, 11:30 AM   #26
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I like it for the 109.
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Old 08-01-2007, 12:14 PM   #27
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I'm testing it on a Spitfire VIII atm, will post screens in ~15mins or so.
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Old 08-01-2007, 12:27 PM   #28
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So?
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Old 08-01-2007, 01:07 PM   #29
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Oooh that looks good.
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Old 08-01-2007, 01:21 PM   #30
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Agreed, that looks great, I like!
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