US Politics Thread 2016-2020

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Mr Quatro

Pre-data before the flood, the earthquakes and the fires ... California needs America, Californian street people need America, Californian veterans need America.

Heck we all need America to be on the same wave length

And there is the rub. This great melting pot of a country has many wave lengths as a result of many cultures. In the past, immigrants came to America to seek the American dream. I think many still do. But there are also many that have a different dream. Unity is an archaic word with no meaning any longer.

[August]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

And there is the rub. This great melting pot of a country has many wave lengths as a result of many cultures. In the past, immigrants came to America to seek the American dream. I think many still do. But there are also many that have a different dream. Unity is an archaic word with no meaning any longer.

I think the ease of modern communications has a lot to do with that.

It maintains ties with the old country that would have withered and broken far more quickly in earlier times. Back in the day immigrants were far more isolated from their home countries than they are now. Sure they could write snail mail letters to family and friends back home (assuming both sides could read and write) but that cost money and could take weeks to get a response.

Nowadays they just pick up their cell phone and they could be just down the street rather than on a different continent.

This coupled with the ease of modern transportation that turns a several week long arduous journey into a few hour long airplane ride and it's pretty clear that while the melting pot has not gone away completely yet it's temperature has been brought way down and I believe it will take increasingly longer for it to work it's magic.

[Skybird]

Bernie sanders was briefed a month ago on Russia meddling with the American campaign circus again, trying to make Sanders the candiate and by that helping Trump for another term. The goal is clear: to increase the division in the Polarised States of America and by that pushing civil society further off balance, and securing a retard at the helm of the ship so that the US does not seriously get in Russia'sstrategic ways, and alienates itself ever further from Europe, leaving the latter isolated and weak on any real military relevance.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/21/u...rs-russia.html

https://www.washingtonpost.com/gdpr-...a77_story.html

[August]

Are these the same anonymous intelligence officials that claimed Saddam had WMD?

[u crank]

Originally Posted by Skybird

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/21/u...rs-russia.html

First Jake Tapper, Now Catherine Herridge Further Discredits NY Times’ Story About Russia Trying to Help Trump in 2020

Even CNN’s Jake Tapper called it out in his reporting, citing a national security official source who he knew and trusted.

Now CBS’ Catherine Herridge is debunking the report as well with her source. Herridge’s source said there was nothing to back up the claim, “briefers had none to offer.”

https://www.redstate.com/nick-arama/...trump-in-2020/

[August]

The biggest damage the Russians can do to an American political candidate is to let it be thought that they might prefer them over their opposition. They are quite aware that their endorsement is toxic and that's why I think they are so clumsy about their meddling. A bunch of Twitter and Facebook accounts? Please. I would expect something far more sophisticated and effective from KGB Putin and company.

As for the Intelligence professional community I'm thinking that they need a serious purge. First off 17 agencies are way too many. Secondly they are becoming increasingly statist in their belief that they should be the ones in charge, not the elected officials they report to. That sentiment needs to be stamped out. The Intelligence Professional Community does not and should never be allowed to dictate policy.

[Hawk66]

@August It was not just an "anonymous source" about WMD in Iraq. Government services and that includes the intelligence services as well are not immun against the wishes of the administration in rule. A very good example for this is the Able Archer crisis 1983, where the Soviet intelligence services really thought NATO would prepare a first atomic strike against their country.
And I guess who questions that the Bush administration "asked" the intellgence services to give them all possible "proofs" to justify the invasion into Iraq.
I do not think anybody thinks here the Trump administration asks the intelligence service for proof of the intervention of Russia in elections...

I hope you do not really question that Russia tries to manipulate elections in the West else I do not know how many proofs you need...starting with 2016 in your country, going to Brexit and also in my country. It is an open secret that Russia supports the very right and left wing of parties in Germany to destabilize it. Even the foreign secreatary of Russia took part at least once in the game, to fuel resintements against immigrants in Germany by publicly spreading fake news , with the goal of destabilizing and getting rid of chanellor Merkel in the long term, the prime target of the right wing and Russia.

I think that is the key difference during the cold war and now. In Europe and in the US regardless if you were a (moderate) lefty or righty and regardless of the (strong) different political views both sides had - we all shared a common set of values and would have never tolerated that those thing happened without strong consequences.

Unfortunately we have lost the compass...on both sides of the Atlantic. I guess with the death of Senator McCain the most prominent fighter for those values also died....

[u crank]

There is a great irony here. Russians meddling in U.S. elections is constantly being aided by leaks in the American intellegence community. Those leaks always go to left wing news media outlets (latest were to NYT and Washington Post) and they always are politically motivated. There is no attempt to hide this and it should be seen for what it is. The people who are doing this have zero interest in the security of American elections. They should be exposed.

[Catfish]

"Those leaks always go to left wing news media outlets." Says Fox News? Would they publish it and if it hit them in the face? Fox does not publish "news", it takes them from others and then adjusts them to their agenda.
Fox: No, Trump’s not angry. Yes, Trump’s angry. And it’s your fault for talking about it.
Fox News has responded to the news with a series of commentary that resembles the stages of grief: denial, then anger — plus some psychological projection — and no sign of acceptance. Don' let reality interfere with my opinion.

NSA reports that Russia is meddling with elections again, then:
"The day after the briefing was given, President Trump abruptly replaced his acting Director of National Intelligence Joseph Maguire, as a direct response to the briefing. The Post is less clear on the contents of the briefing, but the Times reports from five different sources that the briefing primarily concerned active Russian threats to election security."

Don't anger the elephant.
But there's a bright side, Germany gets rid of Grenell

[August]

Originally Posted by Catfish

"Those leaks always go to left wing news media outlets." Says Fox News? Would they publish it and if it hit them in the face?

You're claiming that Fox is ignoring leaks sent to them by the Intelligence Community? So you're trying to meddle in our politics again. How come your meddling is always left wing? Oh that's right, like the these anonymous Deep State criminals you have a political axe to grind.

[Catfish]

Wait, don't turn this around again.

u crank wrote that only left wing media get the information about leaks.
I said Fox would ignore it anyway.
And the anonymous deep state trying to harm Trump, isn't that a left conspiracy?

[August]

Originally Posted by Catfish

Wait, don't turn this around again.

u crank wrote that only left wing media get the information about leaks.
I said Fox would ignore it anyway.

Well it seems to me that he is right. These leaks are never designed to help the President which is why they always given to the leftist media who the leakers know will take whatever they say as fact without question. On the other hand Fox talks about these leaks every time just as soon as they crop up (albeit more critically) so your claim they ignore them is simply wrong.

And the anonymous deep state trying to harm Trump, isn't that a left conspiracy?

The deep state isn't right or left. It is all about them increasing their control over the nation. They are happy to espouse any cause, right or left, that helps them achieve this objective and they are quite willing to try and take down any politician like Trump that opposes them.

[Mr Quatro]

Liberal and left wingers take note that this is exactly what Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren and the followers of other liberal democrats want from free college tuitions, to free borders to free health care to smaller military to fill in the blanks ______________.

They want us to share in their suffering and put up an umbrella for all

When it works in Cuba let me know

[u crank]

Originally Posted by Catfish

NSA reports that Russia is meddling with elections again, ...

This whole thing is becoming a joke and the person who is laughing his head off is Putin. First off you have the American intelligence agencies full of Obama holdovers and proud Resistance types. Second you have a very compliant left wing news media full of gulible hall monitor types who all hate Trump. "What to do" says Putin? Oh I know, lets let these intelligence agencies believe that we are going to interfere in the 2020 election. Not hard to do. These people feed their opposites false information all the time. Then the Resistance/neverTrumpers leak that to the easily excited types at CNN who never check sources and presto....everyone is running around with their hair on fire and Putin is smoking a cigar and sipping his vodka.

That rational clear thinking people can't see this is a mystery to me.

[Dowly]

Originally Posted by u crank

That rational clear thinking people can't see this is a mystery to me.

Rational clear thinking people see that it has been proven multiple times that Russia sought to influence voters in 2016 elections and from that it is not a great leap of faith to believe that they would do it again. After all, if there's one country where creating division and spreading false information via social media works it's the US.