Is there a good guide to Firing Solutions anywhere?

[mattlach]

So,


I am new to this, and I am completely lost.


I have read several guides to estimating speeds, and such, but all of them are very short regarding a specific part of the process, or use abbreviations I don't know what they are.


Right now, I have been just eyeballing torpedoes. I have a 30% to 50% hit rate if I get in close, but I'd like to understand the process from start to finish.


You know, understanding how to come up with
1.) speed estimates
2.) range estimates
3.) AOB (whatever that is)
4.) What to do with all of this information.


Is anyone aware of a comprehensive guide like that from start to finish, that assumes no knowledge at all?


Appreciate any suggestions.

[yubba]

Originally Posted by mattlach

So,


I am new to this, and I am completely lost.


I have read several guides to estimating speeds, and such, but all of them are very short regarding a specific part of the process, or use abbreviations I don't know what they are.


Right now, I have been just eyeballing torpedoes. I have a 30% to 50% hit rate if I get in close, but I'd like to understand the process from start to finish.





You know, understanding how to come up with
1.) speed estimates
2.) range estimates
3.) AOB (whatever that is)
4.) What to do with all of this information.


Is anyone aware of a comprehensive guide like that from start to finish, that assumes no knowledge at all?


Appreciate any suggestions.

Welcome aboard ,,, Try using the attack map ,, set your game to manual targeting ,, and have map updates on ,, there is a mod I think called optical correction for 1.4 that gives a better dial to set range farther than 1,200 yards ,, using the attack map ,, you have too have the torpedo computer clicked on and you'll see a x with a line showing your torpedo track the x= where the torpedo will end up. plus there is plenty of tutorials on youtube to help plus many othe ways to set up a torpedo attack. I start tracking at 10,000 yards that gives you plenty of time to make corrections,, It's to bad we can't make corrections from the attack map,, that would be a real game changer.

[KaleunMarco]

Originally Posted by mattlach

So,


I am new to this, and I am completely lost.


I have read several guides to estimating speeds, and such, but all of them are very short regarding a specific part of the process, or use abbreviations I don't know what they are.


Right now, I have been just eyeballing torpedoes. I have a 30% to 50% hit rate if I get in close, but I'd like to understand the process from start to finish.


You know, understanding how to come up with
1.) speed estimates
2.) range estimates
3.) AOB (whatever that is)
4.) What to do with all of this information.


Is anyone aware of a comprehensive guide like that from start to finish, that assumes no knowledge at all?


Appreciate any suggestions.

in addition to yubba's comments above, you can review Rockin Robbins' Skippers Bag of tricks.

you can also review Drebbel's Guides and Training.


you can also set your targeting to automatic and let the crew AI handle the firing solutions until you get your sea legs and become comfortable with crew management, ship handling and approaches, etc.

good luck!

[mattlach]

Thank you for these suggestions.


I found this particular walkthrough very helpful:





I just tried it in a training mission. (the first manual fire training mission in FOTRS)


I thought I did everything right, but for some odd reason my torpedoes all veered off hars left, behind the target instead of leading the target. I am certain I got angle on bow right.


I'm wondering if some of my config changes messed with the direction of the tracking in the targeting computer. (I always play with inverted mouse, so I change d a ton of ups to downs, and vice versa in the config.cfg file, maybe one of them impacted targeting?)


Also, in th evideo he says to use Shift I to identify the target, but this does not work for me in game. I understand the mod moved around some of these things. Does anyone know what the key is for this in the FOTRS mod?



Otherwise I have no idea what happened. Getting too late. Will have to pick it back up tomorrow after the snow cleanup if I have it in me.

Once I have this figured out, I cant help but think that this method is great when you have plenty of time to set up a shot on a lone target. Not so much for on the fly adjustments, or sudden engagements. I wonder what you do then...

[KaleunMarco]

Originally Posted by mattlach

I wonder what you do then...

what do i do...i am The Kaleun. i have trained my fire control crew. that is why i use automatic targeting: i tell them which target to focus on and they execute the firing point procedures, as they have been trained.

[mikesn9]

Originally Posted by KaleunMarco

what do i do...i am The Kaleun. i have trained my fire control crew. that is why i use automatic targeting: i tell them which target to focus on and they execute the firing point procedures, as they have been trained.

Amen!
I see it as: I am the Captain, they are the crew. The crew members each have their job. Why should the Captain do their job?

[Mad Mardigan]

Originally Posted by mattlach

Thank you for these suggestions.


I found this particular walkthrough very helpful:





I just tried it in a training mission. (the first manual fire training mission in FOTRS)


I thought I did everything right, but for some odd reason my torpedoes all veered off hard left, behind the target instead of leading the target. I am certain I got angle on bow right.


I'm wondering if some of my config changes messed with the direction of the tracking in the targeting computer. (I always play with inverted mouse, so I change d a ton of ups to downs, and vice versa in the config.cfg file, maybe one of them impacted targeting?)


Also, in the video he says to use Shift I to identify the target, but this does not work for me in game. I understand the mod moved around some of these things. Does anyone know what the key is for this in the FOTRS mod?



Otherwise I have no idea what happened. Getting too late. Will have to pick it back up tomorrow after the snow cleanup if I have it in me.

Once I have this figured out, I cant help but think that this method is great when you have plenty of time to set up a shot on a lone target. Not so much for on the fly adjustments, or sudden engagements. I wonder what you do then...

Ahoy, mattlach...

I wonder what you do then...

As for that, & this is just My own observation & opinion on this here... mind you...

Of it all, You, are the Kaleun or Skipper, if you will... depending on how you are going about a career... with either a U.S. based or a German.. or any other sub based sim here... you, are the big cheese, if you will.

What does that mean...

Well, in as simple lay mans terms as it can be put, you are the ultimate in authority here. You, make the decision on how to handle the orders/objectives given you, accordingly to the (sic) higher ups in sim that you are under. Your mission is, to command the crew & have them, do the job that they too, are trained to do in the operation of the sub. Pure & simple.

You make the decisions on heading based on those orders, how fast to get there & once arriving, god forbid you get sighted or attacked along the way & if either occurs, how to best handle the situation... again, accordingly.

Once on station or patrol area, you decide then, how to best proceed to achieve the objective or mission... if that involves finding & sinking any traffic that comes your way, you decide the best means to do it. Whatever the orders you got where... you make the big decisions.. & is why you're paid the BIG bucks, that go along with being the big cheese... ( a bit of humor there.. it does raise its head at odd times... I do try to have (& keep) a sense of humor. )

I know that some who have put out mods, do so to where setting up the attack is all on you to finagle, & that is all well fine & good.. Myself, personally.. I try to avoid those as much as is possible.

Why you may ask.. well, I follow the principle of why should I be doing more than double duty... that kind of negates the crew & why have them, if you are going to be doing everything yourself...

That said, yeah, I do know that everything is dependent on you having to push buttons, as it were... to assign depth, speed, & all that... but using the auto target system built in, faux processes your crew following your orders. Just as is telling the crew to go such & such speed or to go to such & such depth... or heading.

Now, with all that said (as it were... ) were skippers versed in all the mechanics of each section, up to including knowing how to set up a torp attack... yeah, or else they wouldn't have gotten the nod to take command... they had to know the inner workings of things... as it is, the sim does kind of short cut that process... it is a sim, after all & NOT real life. though, it does it's best to simulate that aspect... & for the most part, does a fair job at it, grant you not a 100% rating. At least, as I see it. Opinions like mpg, will vary...

Any way, that's just My take on it... I do understand those that wish to go the route of setting up an attack from start to finish & in no way, look down on them for that... as I see it, more power to them & a tip of the hat to them for doing so. I respect that...

Any way, all the best to you in this endeavor.

Fair winds, smooth seas & good hunting...

Gute jagd, ihr himmelhunde

M. M.

[Macgregor the Hammer]

Originally Posted by mattlach

So,


I am new to this, and I am completely lost.


I have read several guides to estimating speeds, and such, but all of them are very short regarding a specific part of the process, or use abbreviations I don't know what they are.


Right now, I have been just eyeballing torpedoes. I have a 30% to 50% hit rate if I get in close, but I'd like to understand the process from start to finish.


You know, understanding how to come up with
1.) speed estimates
2.) range estimates
3.) AOB (whatever that is)
4.) What to do with all of this information.


Is anyone aware of a comprehensive guide like that from start to finish, that assumes no knowledge at all?


Appreciate any suggestions.

There's quite a number of good Youtubes which cover the basics. Take a look at Werner Sobe, RockinRobbins, Colonel Sanders Lite, Gutted, Bstanko6 are excellent starting points. There are a number of really good books: Thunder Below by E. Flucky, Clear the Bridge by R. O'Kane, Undersea Warrior, 'Mush' Morton's bio.

I have been studying this document for some time:

http://archive.hnsa.org/doc/attack/index.htm#chap07

This is the Fleet Boat Captain's How To. It all depends on how deep you want to get (no pun intended.

Good Luck

[Front Runner]

When you are sending the range and bearing info to the TDC, you HAVE to DOUBLE-CLICK it in order to get the TDC to update the information on the left side of the screen.
I just default to double-clicking all the information: speed, AOB, range. If you are using the position keeper, the order is this...
You must have the target locked in periscope or TBT view.

1. Identify the target and upload the information to the TDC using the check mark from the Recognition Manual ship ID page. This sends target name and marked reference height to the TDC for Range Stadimeter use.

2. Start the Position Keeper.

3. Estimate Range. Use the stadimeter. Make sure you have sent the information up from the Recognition Manual target ship ID page for the particular ship you are targeting/ranging. If you change targets, go back to the Recognition Manual, tab to the new target ship page, resend the info to TDC, check the range and double click to update TDC.

4. Estimate AOB. If you know your targets course your TDC will display the known target course upon setting the correct AOB.

5. Estimate Target Course and Speed.

6. Set up Torpedoes. If using Slow Speed (dual speed torps), you have to click High Speed and then Low Speed in order to get the TDC to update properly. If you're using Low Speed and do not do this, your solution will be way off. Check your Attack Map to see how this affects your calculated torpedo track.

7. Don't forget to Open Torpedo Tubes.

8. Repeat 3 thru 5 as many times as it takes to get a good solution. Check Attack Map to see what it's telling you.

9. Do this quickly. Make a Final adjustment to AOB and SPEED if necessary. Take a FINAL Bearing and Range, double click on the send range and bearing button on the right hand TDC and shoot.

Practice setting up the above parameters. Practice setting up shots on friendly ships without shooting. Check your Attack Map to see if you're accurate.

Alternatively, if you are using Dick O'Kane method, range is not a factor. You NEED to know Target COURSE and Target SPEED. Set up for a 90 degree (or 45 degree) Zero Gyro angle shot and when the target crosses the bearing line, shoot.
Do NOT use the Position Keeper!

For instance, this is for a 90 degree Zero gyro angle approach, you have a target approaching from right to left at 8 knots. You are going to use the Mark 14 Torpedo at high speed (46 knots). Set your periscope up at 10 degrees relative bearing. Leave it there (for now). Set your target speed to 8 knots. Set your AOB to Port 80 degrees (10 degrees less than 90). Set your range to the MAXIMUM that your range dial will allow, 1000 yards will do. Range doesn't matter. Don't forget to double click Send Range & Bearing. Check your Attack Map, you should see the Torp Track extend straight out from your boat. Change your Torpedo Speed to LOW and see how that affects your Torp Track, it will move to the left somewhat. Change Torp Speed back to high and go back to Periscope.

Once you've set up your shot, you can sweep your periscope or use the other periscope or TBT if you're surfaced to see and track the target until her bow crosses 10 degrees relative bearing, then shoot 1 torp every 5 seconds.

Torpedo Impact!

Reference materials...
https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/sho...d.php?t=223251

Practice. Also watch Colonel Sanders Lite "Convoy College" series and take notes...

[Macgregor the Hammer]

This is a good starting point. Capnscurvy's High Realism Tutorial:

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/dow...do=file&id=907

[Joe S]

May I offer a few suggestions?

I play with only a few mods, mainly sound and some graphics. I play map contacts on, because in a real submarine the Captain has a tracking party that maintains a manual plot, so the map contacts "ON" feature simulates the work of the tracking party. If you play with map contacts off its a little more work for you but it can be done.
With map contacts on, speed is the ONLY critical data you have to collect. Angle on bow is not that important if you get into a proper firing position to begin with, with your own course perpendicular to the target's track or course and between 500-1,500 yards from the target's track.

If you have the speed accurately estimated and in proper firing position range is completely irrelevant.

I suggest you print a copy of the target book to make it easier to find what you want. I then put together a sheet with the profile of each type of target and the AVERAGE mast height for each. For example, the average mast height for a Japanese destroyer is 69'. If there are notable exceptions I make a note of it. For example, the average mast height for a Japanese Battleship is 164' but the Kongo and Yamato have mast height of 140. That way, if I know the target is a destroyer I use the average mas theight and do not have to worry about finding the exact class of destroyer. For a Large Tanker, the average mast height is 98'. Medium freighter 78' and so on.
Using the map, draw a line representing the target's track (course). Maneuver your boat to a position ahead of the target and about 500-1,500 yards from the target's track. Mark an X on the current location of the target( at the tip of the bow)
Lower the scope. Wait at least three minutes. Raise the scope while looking at the map. as soon as the target's icon shows up on the map mark another x where it is and lower the scope. Measure the distance travelled and calculate the speed, then enter the speed in the TDC. I have a chart prepared for this purpose. for example, a target that travels 236 yards in one minute is moving at 7 knots. Enter the target speed in the TDC. Since you are already at approx a 90 angle to the target's track, set the angle on bow as best you can and enter the data. If you are off by a little bit it wont matter.
Depending on how much time you have, check the target speed a few times and make sure it has not changed course, keeping the scope up only long enough to allow the must current target position to show up on the map When the bearing on the target gets close to 0 degrees, (almost right in front of you) say at 340 degrees moving from left to right, or at 20 deg moving from right to left, make a final check with the scope. Mark the bearing with the TDC, set and enter the range, then down scope. Go to the TDC view and check to see of the tdc is correctly tracking the proper target, then fire your torpedoes.
A trick that you can use is to calculate how much lead you need to hit a target with the torpedo speed you are using. Once you figure that out, you can use the same amount of lead, in degrees, no matter what the range, as long as you are 90- degrees to the target's course. I have not used that method in a long time and I cant find the chart right now but it works. Not as much fun as doing it the long way.
I hope this helps!
Good Luck,
Joe S
Joe S is offline

[KineticDiplomat]

http://www.couscouscrabcakes.com/okane.html

That’s a 90 degree off calculator, but simple division makes using it for 30/45/60 shots easy as well. If you want to feel more authentic, you can print your own firing table.

Honestly, I prefer attacking from a frontal 45, but often end up with a 90 if I have to end run a target.

Anyhow, set up your offset, and judge target speed (or take a good guess if you’re lying doggo at a crawl and getting slow or medium calls).

Punch your torpedoes in for 0 degrees and max range, then be sure to run them shallow, slow, and contact.

Swing the wire to your offset angle (so a 16 degree from the left means 344).

Set the AOB for as if the target will continue on its course versus your offset (you can either plot this or do some quick math) and send to TDC.

Lie in wait until you’re pretty sure you’ll have eyes on when the scope pops up. Since you should be crawling the boat (real stationary subs sink) you might need to give yourself some runway.

Wait for your target to cross the wire, and give it a shot a 3/4 and 1/4, or by thirds for a three fish spread.

Down scope, time to leave unless it’s a solo. Listen for boom.