Here we go again-Ukraine once again

[Rockstar]

Its too bad people thought war was somehow a better alternative to peaceful relations with Russia.


That the lemmings were told to believe peaceful solutions are considered collusion. Lol



Now as warships approach the Black Sea and we've just been accused of being an adversary. Do any of the party lemmings have an idea what to do next? Any idea as to WHY were doing this? Im only asking because the now silent majority here insisted upon it happening by voting for it and I was hoping they might break their silence and enlighten us.

[Catfish]

You could add a few carriers, you have enough of them.
Only to properly de-escalate the situation

I may be critical of Russia, but all this is getting ridculous.

[mapuc]

I thought that USAN already had some warship in that area.

Seem to recall some incident. Maybe it's from somewhere else.

I can't speak for others than myself.

I deeply hope they will find a peaceful solution. I DON'T like war.
Especially a war who most likely will turn from conventional to Nuke

Markus

[Rockstar]

Well, in my opinion, with the exception of El Whacko, all of us has been through this before. Its all going to boil down to who can remain on alert status the longest before they run out of money to maintain their position.

Neither the U.S. the Brits or NATO has any intention to be the first to pull the trigger. Like I said before, we won the cold war because capitalism works and we were able to outspend our opponent. I'd bet big money that old cold war strategy is our current strategy in Ukraine too.

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

Well, in my opinion, with the exception of El Whacko, all of us has been through this before. Its all going to boil down to who can remain on alert status the longest before they run out of money to maintain their position.

Neither the U.S. the Brits or NATO has any intention to be the first to pull the trigger. Like I said before, we won the cold war because capitalism works and we were able to outspend our opponent. I'd bet big money that old cold war strategy is our current strategy in Ukraine too.

We all have our beliefs and political standpoint.

I chose to believe what Rockstar wrote-because it would mean peace instead of war and I like that.

Markus

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by mapuc

We all have our beliefs and political standpoint.

I chose to believe what Rockstar wrote-because it would mean peace instead of war and I like that.

Markus

Sure we may have absolutely no intention to be first to pull the trigger. Still, it is a very dangerous game we are playing. There is going to come a time when Putin must make a choice to either fish or cut bait. I think its at that point things have the greatest chance of going hot, time will tell. Or his troops walk because the Russian economy can't pay them.

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

Sure we may have absolutely no intention to be first to pull the trigger. Still, it is a very dangerous game we are playing. There is going to come a time when Putin must make a choice to either fish or cut bait. I think its at that point things have the greatest chance of going hot, time will tell. Or his troops walk because the Russian economy can't pay them.

On that I'm sure-NATO will not be the first to pull the trigger-what my concern is that when Putin have given his generals order to invade Donbass region NATO will response and be third part pulling the trigger.

The second part to pull will be the Ukrainian defence forces. They could also be them who makes the first step-a preemptive strike.

Markus

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by mapuc

On that I'm sure-NATO will not be the first to pull the trigger-what my concern is that when Putin have given his generals order to invade Donbass region NATO will response and be third part pulling the trigger.

The second part to pull will be the Ukrainian defence forces. They could also be them who makes the first step-a preemptive strike.

Markus

I wouldn't worry too much about those Ukrop. I seriously doubt they could fight their way out of wet paper sack. Russian forces would steam roll right over them and they know it.


Its a waiting game and the biggest economy wins. But dont underestimate those Russians. They been playing this game as long as we have, Im sure they still have a few cards to play which could allow them to get their way without firing a shot too.

[Skybird]

You underestimate the Ukrainians. They are veterans now, they got trainign by US trainers, and modern aTGMs. As I linked to a report from 2015, US army soldiers fidn thatz they take lessons formt he Ukrainians, for the reaosn fo nthat past wars of the US were no wars against an enemy the likes of the Russians. Major parts of the ground troops do not know by experience how it is to be at the recieving end of modern precision fire and artillery strikes, nor are they used to expect that the enemy can get that close to them to attack themselves with tanks and missiles. Rebellious shepards and unmotivated Arab troops without high tech equipment and proper training and with old weapons, being reported and attacked early by air force and artillery and drones, is one thing. A Russian doctrine-trained mechanised combat force with battle experience and modern equipment and a steamnrollign artillery and missile firepower- that is quite anotzer thing. And such an enemy the US never has had.



The problem of the Ukrianian groudn forces is not so much experience, of that they probably have more than the Americans (or who else has fought the Russians in the past six years...?). But its logistics, and numbers.



The russians tolerated the dloeivery of modern rifles and ATGMs to the ukraine in recent years. But there is a trigger point beyiond which they will not tolerate it anymore - when it becomes too dangerous for them. At that point they will do what everybody would do: they will strike.



Biden'ÄS offering of a summit, imo is a msitake. It signals weakness and lacking detemrination. It does not matter if that is what Biden is indeed, or not, its completely irrelevant. Its what his gesture will be interpreted as. And the interpretation will be: weakness, and lacking determination.

[Skybird]

Beyond all this theoretical talking, one scenario should be taken as absolutely possible as well: that what looks like war preparations, indeed is what it looks like: preparations for wanted war. Maybe meant that serious that the Russians do not even try to hide them anymore, like they hid the annexing of the Crimean in 2014.

It could very well be that they are serious again, like in 2014. One should not be too surprised, if the Russian troops amassed suddenly indeed move into the Donbass.

[Rockstar]

From what I've read Ukraine is still a somewhat politically and ethnically divided nation. They're still trying to sort themselves out since the breakup of club soviet. I think its why NATO was never that eager to offer membership. Though the Ukraine soldier may have the will to fight and fight well. I dont think their government no matter how well intentioned has the parts, equipment, C3I, to keep them in a fight against what I think is a far superior force for very long. Then again, I could be wrong too.

[mapuc]

Here is why I fear Putin gives the order

The conversation came after Western nations and transatlantic military alliance NATO voiced concern over Russian troop movements near the eastern Donbass region where Ukrainian troops are in conflict with Russian-backed forces.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKBN2BP14C

And USA will not support Ukraine behind the curtain, but this time openly and even send troops to Ukraine.

Markus

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by Skybird

You underestimate the Ukrainians. They are veterans now, they got trainign by US trainers,

I don't know what good US trainers will do the Ukranian military. The US only knows how to fight third world countries that can't really fight back. That, and ensuring >>>DIVERSITY<<< within the ranks. So, if the Russians are extremely afraid of women and transgender soldiers...well, maybe it will work.

[les green01]

what we got with biden made a mess of the border,falls down on stairs,forget names,forget what he talking about,trying to change the bill of rights he makes larry,moe and curry look good just the idea of him or harris mucking around europe agianst russia damn scary

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

From what I've read Ukraine is still a somewhat politically and ethnically divided nation. They're still trying to sort themselves out since the breakup of club soviet. I think its why NATO was never that eager to offer membership. Though the Ukraine soldier may have the will to fight and fight well. I dont think their government no matter how well intentioned has the parts, equipment, C3I, to keep them in a fight against what I think is a far superior force for very long. Then again, I could be wrong too.

Put this way, I agree.