Dud Torpedo Percent

[desirableroasted]

Originally Posted by danexpat

Is 6% dud rate the consensus among experienced players?

This is actually a very useful thread, because, as far as I can see, there is little more than anecdotal claims on the subject of torpedo reliability.

I assume "dud" means a perfectly aimed torpedo, in other words, failure on the torp's part, not mine.

If so, then 6% sounds right for magnetics in GWX, at least until 1941, when it seems to improve. And it is always premature detonation.

However, I use magnetics only when the distance/sea state permits to avoid premature detonations (for example, in rough seas, I use mag only at 1000 meters or less). If I used them in all situations, the premature detonation rate would certainly be higher in 39-40.

As you can see, I don't know (and don't want to know) whether GWX rolls the dice on a magnetic at launch or does so at intervals or there is a condition that set the premature detonation.

With an impact shot, I have never, to my knowledge, had a dud. Or at least nothing that could not be plausibly ascribed to sea state (my depth is correct, but the bow rose just before impact, etc) or being "made" by the target.

[danexpat]

Originally Posted by desirableroasted

This is actually a very useful thread, because, as far as I can see, there is little more than anecdotal claims on the subject of torpedo reliability. I assume "dud" means a perfectly aimed torpedo, in other words, failure on the torp's part, not mine. If so, then 6% sounds right for magnetics in GWX, at least until 1941, when it seems to improve. And it is always premature detonation.

I would be fine with 6% for impact torpedoes but estimates of magnetic pistol (both G7a and G7e) premature detonation I've read put pre-Norway failure rate at 20% - 40%. I always home in on "data" that looks suspiciously anecdotal too!

Originally Posted by desirableroasted

As you can see, I don't know (and don't want to know) whether GWX rolls the dice on a magnetic at launch or does so at intervals or there is a condition that set the premature detonation.

I agree with you. Having a sense of playing Russian roulette with magnetic settings -- but without knowing the true odds -- adds to the gameplay experience for me also. So I want to know whether it is within historical parameters but also don't want to know.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by danexpat

So I want to know whether it is within historical parameters but also don't want to know.

Then I ain't gonna tell yas

[desirableroasted]

Originally Posted by jimbuna

Then I ain't gonna tell yas

But I do want to know this....

Are "duds" modeled for impact pistols? Because, as I have said, I cannot recall ever having a "dud" impact-pistoled torpedo. Yes, I have had failures, but (since I do use external cam) I know they are always due to environment or a mistake in my firing solution.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by desirableroasted

But I do want to know this....

Are "duds" modeled for impact pistols? Because, as I have said, I cannot recall ever having a "dud" impact-pistoled torpedo. Yes, I have had failures, but (since I do use external cam) I know they are always due to environment or a mistake in my firing solution.

If my memory serves me correctly and to the best of my knowledge and understanding (not a bad potential disclaimer that LOL).....'duds' are modeled across the board regardless of what they are set to detonation wise.

[LeChuck]

all i know is i'm sick of watching fish clank off hull.

[iambecomelife]

Originally Posted by desirableroasted

But I do want to know this....

Are "duds" modeled for impact pistols? Because, as I have said, I cannot recall ever having a "dud" impact-pistoled torpedo. Yes, I have had failures, but (since I do use external cam) I know they are always due to environment or a mistake in my firing solution.

No; unlike in SHIV, the only dud torpedoes in SHIII are premature explosions and hits that strike the hull at too shallow an angle. This is one of the major faults with SHIII's portrayal of ordnance.

[maillemaker]

You can get dud hits for bad angles. But the angle can happen in two ways. Either your angle to the ship's heading is to far from 90, or you hit too low on the ships hull, hitting where it curves.

Duds for magnetics are from premature explosions, which nearly always happen at 1000m or more.

Steve

[Missing Name]

Duds are frustrating.

But it's more frustrating if it's your fault, such as accidentally setting a torp to impact only and watch as it passes exactly 1 meter below the hull...

[desirableroasted]

Originally Posted by maillemaker

Duds for magnetics are from premature explosions, which nearly always happen at 1000m or more.

Steve

That is, if they are going to premature, it is usually on a 1000m+ run.

[Osmium Steele]

Originally Posted by desirableroasted

But I do want to know this....

Are "duds" modeled for impact pistols? Because, as I have said, I cannot recall ever having a "dud" impact-pistoled torpedo.

Until last night, I would have agreed with you.

While raiding Dunkirk, an auxiliary cruiser and LST were moored outside the break water. I lined up at 87 deg AOB on the stationary cruiser. The AOB on the LST was not optimal due to its odd angle pierside. Light mist and 6 knot winds, so sea state not an issue.

The only time I ever used magnetics in a port raid, they all failed, which I half expected as many large ships barely clear the bottom when pierside.

I set all 4 fish to impact and 2 meter depth. Fired tube 2 at the LST, and a salvo of tubes 1, 3, and 4 at the cruiser.

I lowered the scope, and beat feet outta there, watching the fish run in on the TDC. The first fish to reach the cruiser, aimed dead center, bounced off the hull, the remaining fish, each at slightly higher and lower angles, detonated.

This should be simple enough, though tedious, to test.

A line of targets at 2000m, 90 AOB. Fire a full salvo, reload. Fire stern tube/s while reloading bow tubes. Record the results. Reload the mission when you run out of ammo.

What would be a reasonable sample size? 1000 shots?

[Arsenius]

So, in GWX3 gold i've had half of my torpedoes dud in march of 1940 is something normal?

from the duds half dont detonated and the other half passed below the target even with right depth settings

[Fifi]

Originally Posted by Arsenius

So, in GWX3 gold i've had half of my torpedoes dud in march of 1940 is something normal?

from the duds half dont detonated and the other half passed below the target even with right depth settings

If you are using Hsie patch, and have torpedo fix activated, you can adjust the % of duds in Hsie.ini file (section torpedo fix) to your liking.
Perso i have reduced hsie settings, because i also found way too much bad torpedoes (even setting them to the correct depth).
Playing type II with only 5 torps, and get all 5 bad is a bit too much to my taste.

[Anvar1061]

Originally Posted by Arsenius

So, in GWX3 gold i've had half of my torpedoes dud in march of 1940 is something normal?

from the duds half dont detonated and the other half passed below the target even with right depth settings

This simulates a real "torpedo crisis". This has been the case historically.

[Fifi]

Originally Posted by Anvar1061

This simulates a real "torpedo crisis". This has been the case historically.

Yes, but...in the torpedo crisis, i don’t believe absolutely all the torp were crap.
Problem with this fix is random is taken in account, and random can be really bad.