Wuhan virus 2020

[Rufus Shinra]

Originally Posted by STEED

Well said catfish, you have won a free trip to my local supermarket and feel free to let these selfish swines know their actions are stupid and feeding the fear machine.

I'd love to do that, but all the grocery stores I walked by on my way to the restaurants (three in this street) are fully-stocked. Want me to take pictures on my way back?

Fear and panic are not inevitable.

[Catfish]

How it all starts: Panic buys – herd mentality:

New risks like Corona make people insecure.
Instead relying on facts, they observe the behaviour of others.
Because they think that other people know more than themselves.
Which leads to irrational behaviour, like panic buying.
The media are fueling this heard behaviour.
Voilà, unnecessary panic.

But here's a business idea..

[Rufus Shinra]

Originally Posted by Catfish

How it all starts: Panic buys – herd mentality:

New risks like Corona make people insecure.
Instead relying on facts, they observe the behaviour of others.
Because they think that other people know more than themselves.
Which leads to irrational behaviour, like panic buying.
The media are fueling this heard behaviour.
Voilà, unnecessary panic.

But here's a business idea..

That's when good leadership and non-partisanship can help a lot, as well as responsible media. One of the newspapers I follow keeps an entire section about debunking rumours with clear sources and analysis, while most of the political parties, even the nationalist and the communist ones, are acting rationally over this.

It also helps, I guess, that it would be particularly shameful to our elders if we acted like lemmings when they faced much harsher restrictions and kept going. I see it happening in England:

1990: 'What did you do during the rationing, grandpa?' 'I volunteered for the civil defence and met your grandmother.'

2050: 'What did you do during the epidemic, old man?' 'I got enough toilet paper to not buy anymore until the 2040s.'

Not exactly the Finest Hour, now, is it?

[mapuc]

In this time of crisis the true nature of some comes forth.

A big majority is of good nature, while the rest is of bad nature.

Markus

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Catfish

How it all starts: Panic buys – herd mentality:

New risks like Corona make people insecure.
Instead relying on facts, they observe the behaviour of others.
Because they think that other people know more than themselves.
Which leads to irrational behaviour, like panic buying.
The media are fueling this heard behaviour.
Voilà, unnecessary panic.

Sigh.


Pay attention to this instead, from 00:11:20 or 00:12:00 to around 00:29:00







In principle he explains psychological mechanisms that are known since longer, he just is not as wordview-biased as you are with your Stammtisch-explanation right out of the PC-box.



I again remind of that the terminology of "hamstern" (hoarding), the Germn term, comes from the propaganda textbook of the Nazis who by that wanted to publicly defame people of whom they claimed that by their intention to prepare independently from the regime's propanda of that all is well and under control, expressed an attitude of lackign trust in and disloyalty to the regime. Yopu do not need to hoard indeed if you think all is well and the regime wills olve issues. Total dependency and helplessness is thwe result. And of course the lacking ability to help yourself, if need ever arises.



Wanting to get prepared is natural, reasonable, and a good idea. Even many animals prepare for tougher times that come in the future. The modenr eocnomy chains are hyper-.sensible to diusroutions: in resource deliveries for production, expertise of personnel, increasingly IT and communicaiton networks, intercontinental communicaiton networks and also stocklamnrkets anbd theiur effect on real economic contexts. It is very, very easy to disrupt these complex, sensible networks. And then logistics have a very big problem, and production comes into troubled waters.



The only -the ONLY - hilarious factor in the events at supermarkets in recent day,s is the timing of people. They launch for preparation while the desaster is already upon them. They have had years of time to instead get their preparations ahead in time, relaxed, piece by piece, over a logner time. Thats how I did it: over years, growing the effort with my growing financial abilities. You do such a projeciton according to what yiou can afford, right? Its the timing that can be laughed about in present events - not that people feel the need for wanting to get some reserves. You do not expect to be involved in a car accident just because you fantasy the seat belts when you start driving in a car. Ypou just activate an additonal safety - because the future is unpredictable and thus: uncertain.



And always keep one thing on mind. Givenrments maybe tell you their is sufficient suplies and that ther eis nki hoarding, because they want to prevent hoarding since reserves are limited. For exmapel they kept on tellign people that all kind of face masks, short in supply everyhwere, do not provide any proteciton w hile by now we know that even the weakest facemask by now at leats priovied a little bit of protection, with respiratory masks of FFP3 stanbdard providing the best. Short time after they kept on preaching that to the oublic her ein germany - stocks in masks got confiscated and exports to outside Germany got stopped.



Seeing what people are buying, leaves me scrathcign my head ssometimes, however, so timing is not the only funny thing there, but also what goods people consider to be good reserves. But that does not excuse to ridicule the intention itself to have reserves.

[Rufus Shinra]

Originally Posted by mapuc

In this time of crisis the true nature of some comes forth.

A big majority is of good nature, while the rest is of bad nature.

Markus

Indeed. We'll face it as a society, not as individuals.

In other news, all non-essential shops will close now in France, leaving only food, fuel, banks, drugstores, etc., open. Considering how full the food stores were yesterday and today and how all parties, unions and the like are working together on this while the media are remaining calm, I believe people will behave normally rather than becoming panicking lemmings.

Spain has started two weeks of home isolation, TLDR you can't leave your home except to buy food or go to work if remote working is impossible.

Good luck and make it a moment of pride for future Danes.

[u crank]

Well it has come to our little island. A woman in her 50's who had just returned from a cruise has tested positive.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/princ...d-19-1.5498094

[Catfish]

^ but... has it three layers
.. the picture is not too good ... you won't fool the children of the resolution...

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by Catfish

Excactly. I would call them unprepared ones hoarders. They are those who are responsible for any supply shortfall now. If anyone sticked to normal buying behaviour there would be no probem.

Stores are just not prepared for the run on certain products, but i may say that our local store owners, selling more than ever, are not discontent with the situation.
And monday morning the shelves will be magically filled again.

Yep. pretty sure that will be the case. And if you can't find hand sanitize right now, there are excellent substitutes.


Price $11.99 - 1.75L



Preppers are prepared.

Originally Posted by Aktungbby

@ BUDDABBY; YOU'RE DEAD-ON ABOUT NEAL'S CONTAINER ABODE....

Lol, you know me well, my friend.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal

Yep. pretty sure that will be the case. And if you can't find hand sanitize right now, there are excellent substitutes.


Price $4.95 - 2.25L



Preppers are prepared.

Sorry, no. For alcohol killing this type of Virus, it needs a concentration of 60% (and 66%) in case of isopropyl alcohol (or ethanole). Minimum. 40, 45, 50 vol% are not enough. The virus just consumes your Schnaps and says Thanks.

Ginger, onion and garlic also do not work, while I am at it. Neither do hot sauces.


Late last week I asked in three pharmacies, just for curiosity, for ethanole or isopropyle alcohol, since the WHO reminded of their old recipe to create your own hand desinfectant from alcohol, glycerine, and water. It was out in all three.


Interestingly, until yesterday you could still get surface cleaner with desinfectant and virus-killing formula in almost every supermarket an drugstore over here, and they still get replenished on the shelves. People seem to overlook something there. And yes, surface clenaers make a lot of sense: housedoor grips, door grips, light switches, mouse, TV pilot,. keyboard, pins on zippers of your clothing, grips of your bags and business suitcases, surfces of smartphones and tablets. Makes an awsoime lot fo senbse to clean these daily in these times. The virus lives for three days on plastic anbd steel surfaces. THREE DAYS.

[Onkel Neal]

You taking the fun out everything!

I don't know jack about booze, is there something stronger?

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal

You taking the fun out everything!

Sure. I'm German.

I don't know jack about booze, is there something stronger?

Rum.

More precisely, what in German is called "Stroh Rum" (is that called "navy strength rum" in English, maybe?). It has 40 and 60%. I think there is even a variant with 80%. Tastes awful, and makes a strogn headache, I do not recommend it and I do not like it. Only as an arome in chocolade and "Rumkugeln". German bakers make them, putting all dough rests of the day together, mixing them with sugar, cacao, rum, some oil, water, arome and chocolade, and selling them as a cake-kind of thing. I love them. They are a calorie nightmare, however.





When do I use Rum?

Make a strong coffee. Put a slider ( athin ruler of metal?) onto the cup, load it with a few sugar cubes. Spill Rum over it, until the cubes thoroughly soaks with rum, then light a match and it will set the rum ablaze. Its flambé, so to speak. This works only with Rum that has at least 60%, else it does not burn. Burn until he sugar is molten. When the fire is gone, whipped cream on top of it, ready. Its good, really! Used a lot In Friesland and the Hanseatic area over here. At least in the past.

The Spanish have a variant of this, using Espresso, I think. Always wanted to try it, always forgot. And I prefer Irish coffee anyway (coffeee, Irish whiskey, whipped cream, sugar).

[Catfish]

@Skybird i do not see anything of what you wrote to do with what i wrote.

"Prepping" is sure something to stay "secure", but if confronted with a real emergency you will realize your preparations were too few maybe. No one prepares to live "independent" for say three years.

But "prepping" is certainly alright, i did not criticize it. I do not hate preppers nor am i qualified to do so. In a way we are also prepared.
If the ugly brown stuff really its the fan what are you to do without electricity or water in the long run? You have a well with a hand-pump in the garden. You have a generator, fine. But no fuel/gas after some time. No reloading batteries.
Ok you have a canola-run heat and power plant and connections to your neighbouing farmers for getting oil, maybe you can hold out a little longer if they do not take you out first. But then: Piston rings. Bearings. Seals. All depends on an intact infrastructre in the long run.

Do you have a gun? Can you shoot game? How much ammo? Do you have potatoes or noodles (lmao) for more than six months? Enough salt and sugar? If you live in a city you are screwed anyway. From looting to burglary at your home, you will be shot in the rural areas if you flee and want to live there.
What i absolutely dislike is hoarding now, because it would be too late anyway, and will never get as bad as i described above.

Why should there be a shortage of just of all toilet paper? When you can survicve for two weeks with one package, why should you buy ten now, if you can buy one in two weeks? Is there nothing more important?
Buying ten packages of toilet paper will of course deplete any store of whatever they ordered, when everyone does it.
And so it is with all other goods. Normal support and maintenance will always be possible. But if all suddenly discover they have to hoard now and in a second.. forget it.

[Catfish]

Originally Posted by Skybird

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Ok. Ich streiche die Segel

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Catfish

@Skybird i do not see anything of what you wrote to do with what i wrote.

"Prepping" is sure something to stay "secure", but if confronted with a real emergency you will realize your preparations were too few maybe. No one prepares to live "independent" for say three years.

But "prepping" is certainly alright, i did not criticize it. I do not hate preppers nor am i qualified to do so. In a way we are also prepared.
If the ugly brown stuff really its the fan what are you to do without electricity or water in the long run? You have a well with a hand-pump in the garden. You have a generator, fine. But no fuel/gas after some time. No reloading batteries.
Ok you have a canola-run heat and power plant and connections to your neighbouing farmers for getting oil, maybe you can hold out a little longer if they do not take you out first. But then: Piston rings. Bearings. Seals. All depends on an intact infrastructre in the long run.

Do you have a gun? Can you shoot game? How much ammo? Do you have potatoes or noodles (lmao) for more than six months? Enough salt and sugar? If you live in a city you are screwed anyway. From looting to burglary at your home, you will be shot in the rural areas if you flee and want to live there.
What i absolutely dislike is hoarding now, because it would be too late anyway, and will never get as bad as i described above.

Why should there be a shortage of just of all toilet paper? When you can survicve for two weeks with one package, why should you buy ten now, if you can buy one in two weeks? Is there nothing more important?
Buying ten packages of toilet paper will of course deplete any store of whatever they ordered, when everyone does it.
And so it is with all other goods. Normal support and maintenance will always be possible. But if all suddenly discover they have to hoard now and in a second.. forget it.

In the prepper thread I said long etime ago already that prepping never is about staying put for all eternity. You can only prepare for a reasonable esimation, or a guess, regarding the time. Thats what the Bundesregierung does when they recommend every German to have reserves in his household for up to 10-14 days. An old recomemndaiton from the time sof the cold war, btw. I could afford, by money and space, to do some more, and also add some equipment they have not listed, and can stay autark for 6 weeks with cold start, 8-10 weeks or a bit more if I rationise from beginning on and consume a bit less per day, that includes a scenario with no water supply via pipes. If the water keeps coming, even a bit longer. But from some time on, life like that is no more - fun...

Its about bridging a timeout until relief efforts reach your region, or you get evacuated, or move out yourself, or things normalise.

From some time on, when the crisis is no crisis anymore but the new state of things and normality, prepping must turn into bugging out, and stationary strategy must turn into a strategy of mobility. we are talking about real desperate scenarios here, however, and honestyl said, I feel too old already as if I would want to seriously care for this. Of course, EVERY prepper'S preparations can get overwhelmed if thigns turn too bad and for too long. But that you may crash into another car at a speed where a seat belt would not save you anyway, does not mean you stop using it when you begin your drive. Your houisedoor, no matte rhow good it is, can be broken open with time, effort an dtools, this does not mean you no longer lock it. You may get killed tomorrow, and still sign an insurrance for something today, right?

Its about improving chances, shfiting them in your favour a bit, increasing the degrees of freedoms you cna enjoy, its about probabilities and maximising the number of your options. Its not about becoming the master of time and all universe, that is impossible. When crisis comes, you either make it through it this way, or you don't. In case of the first, your method worked, in case of the latter it apparently worked not. It is not about Walking-Dead-scnearios, that is nonsense. Personally, I do not wish to surrive a nculear war, not even if surviving it completely heathy myself.

And one day, we all leave the stage anyway. No drama. Just using the time that we have and not throwing it absolutely thanklessly away. A bit of fighting for your life is what you owe to yourself.

Just staying passively put and demanding the state to wipe my butt or expecting foreigners to care for my interests: these are the two worst plans one can have. But they are tempting and look comfortable to many, since they must not do anything themselves: preparing, for example. They put all the responsibility for their lives onto others. Parasites.

And you certainly have no options to help others (if you want that), if you are not even prepared to support yourself. Want to rescue a drowingin man? Make sure you can swim yourself before you jump into the water. Else try to be as less a burden to others, as you can. Dont stand in the way.