[WIP] IRAI (Intelligent Random AI) - Page 64

PL_Andrev · 10-28-10, 01:05 PM

Played historical mission "Fate of U-110" with:
IRAI.0.28 + FX.0.5 + Env.4.3 + 100% real

Used tactic:
Flank speed + obs periscope at surface all time

The escort ships are not aggressive. Both of them completely do not attack me (especially corvette). One DD "try" to attack but does not try to ramming me (periscope at surface all time) or swim over my position.
DD swims "near me" only / close to me and depth charges give me any damages. Strange thing - DD does not shoot guns to me (to my periscope).

TheDarkWraith · 10-28-10, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antar

Played historical mission "Fate of U-110" with:
IRAI.0.28 + FX.0.5 + Env.4.3 + 100% real

Used tactic:
Flank speed + obs periscope at surface all time

The escort ships are not aggressive. Both of them completely do not attack me (especially corvette). One DD "try" to attack but does not try to ramming me (periscope at surface all time) or swim over my position.
DD swims "near me" only / close to me and depth charges give me any damages. Strange thing - DD does not shoot guns to me (to my periscope).

it's quite possible that we need to tweak the new values included with v0.0.28. Try adjusting these values in \data\Scripts\AI\init.aix:

ShipFatigueSensorReductionCruiseMin = 0.015; # min sensor reduction amount for each tier in cruise
ShipFatigueSensorReductionCruiseMax = 0.03; # max sensor reduction amount for each tier in cruise
ShipFatigueSensorReductionAlertMin = 0.025; # min sensor reduction amount for each tier in alert
ShipFatigueSensorReductionAlertMax = 0.05; # max sensor reduction amount for each tier in alert
ShipFatigueSensorReductionDamagedMin = 0.035; # min sensor reduction amount for each tier in damaged
ShipFatigueSensorReductionDamagedMax = 0.07; # max sensor reduction amount for each tier in damaged
ShipFatigueSensorReductionDamagedAlertMin = 0.045; # min sensor reduction amount for each tier in damaged
ShipFatigueSensorReductionDamagedAlertMax = 0.09; # max sensor reduction amount for each tier in damaged

every time the ship enters into a new fatigue level a random value between xMin and xMax above is subtracted from their sensor effectiveness. Try adjusting the min and max values to smaller values. Once the 4th tier of fatigue is completed the sensor effectiveness is set back to it's full value (new watch crew) until fatigue sets in again.

TheDarkWraith · 10-28-10, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antar

Played historical mission "Fate of U-110" with:
IRAI.0.28 + FX.0.5 + Env.4.3 + 100% real

Used tactic:
Flank speed + obs periscope at surface all time

The escort ships are not aggressive. Both of them completely do not attack me (especially corvette). One DD "try" to attack but does not try to ramming me (periscope at surface all time) or swim over my position.
DD swims "near me" only / close to me and depth charges give me any damages. Strange thing - DD does not shoot guns to me (to my periscope).

rethinking this here: as a submerged sub with periscope up you are classified as an unknown contact to the AI. Now a surface contact (like a ship) can be classified as Unknown by the AI also if it hasn't visually contacted it. So, to be safe, what I did was have the AI go to a position some random distance away from the contact and basically follow it. If they lose contact with you then they will spiral search for you.

Now why they aren't firing guns at your periscope sounds like a game bug. I don't inhibit cannon firing at anytime. The AI is always allowed to fire guns whenever they want.

So this sounds like to me that the game classified your sub as an unknown but it knows you are submerged and thus has inhibited the AI from firing guns at you. It wants the AI to DC you instead.......

I'll make a test version for you here soon to test something for me

flymar · 10-28-10, 02:17 PM

One Tribal did fire on my periscope. 2 DDs were going around me and even get very close to me (periscope view was IN the 3d object) but no ramming damage. Later one of the DDs saw me near the end of his vision range (good weather) and I went for 1 on 1 chicken game, with guns. he lost but my hull went down to 59%. But still I can disappear at 46 meters - first patrol in Mad Sea.

PL_Andrev · 10-28-10, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDarkWraith

So this sounds like to me that the game classified your sub as an unknown but it knows you are submerged and thus has inhibited the AI from firing guns at you. It wants the AI to DC you instead.......

To replace my test: run "Fate of U-110" mission, full ahead with periscope into left DD. It looks like DD avoids my position / my periscope.
Maybe that is OK, but DD should use side's DC putters or torpedoes...

TheDarkWraith · 10-28-10, 11:32 PM

v0.0.29 released. See post #1 for details

PL_Andrev · 10-29-10, 05:17 AM

Tested mission:
Historical mission / The fate of U-110

Installed mods:
IRAI.0.29 (complete) + FX_Update.0.5 + Environmental.4.301

All images are captured with AI sub: Lemp's U-110:

1. Lemp is run with full speed. DDs are detect him (DD changes course) but no update course with current Lemp's position.
1a. Lemp have almost perfect position to shoot. He doesn't shot.

2. Lemp is surfacing (why?), but after first hits he goes into deep. DD should know his real position and probably course...

3. But they looking for him at his first position when he was detected previously!

It looks that enemy sub is detected at point XY, and all escort ships are looking for him near XY point, with ignoring / no reaction with other (or this same) contact.

DavyJonesFootlocker · 10-29-10, 06:23 AM

I also notice if you surface the DDs won't shoot at you unless you shoot first.

PL_Andrev · 10-29-10, 07:25 AM

Checked the escort ships in this mission: all competent with defensive tactics.

With IRAI.0.29 the attacking DD (A&B) does not attack my sub by "ramming my periscope and dropping DC into this position".
When he was on my back, he still avoids my position (keep parallel course to me) and drops DC. Very stupid.

About shooting: A&B class in this mission is very passive with shooting to my ships. Only Flower class corvette is active with good degree.

In this mission are two german subs and three escort ships.
When "attacking" DD is sunk, other (second DD) does not go to my position to attack me.

PL_Andrev · 10-29-10, 02:06 PM

Small update (still Fate of U-110):

With mods FX.0.5 + Env.4.301 + IRAI.0.29 I was one time "correctly" attacked by corvette only, which detect me and attack with enter directly over me. But it happens after few circles and her searching position (no contact by X time or no new waypoints).

TheDarkWraith · 10-29-10, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antar

Small update (still Fate of U-110):

With mods FX.0.5 + Env.4.301 + IRAI.0.29 I was one time "correctly" attacked by corvette only, which detect me and attack with enter directly over me. But it happens after few circles and her searching position (no contact by X time or no new waypoints).

this is good

The changes I made in v0.0.29 are working then

Reece · 10-29-10, 07:41 PM

I think the main problem is getting the mods in the correct order, this is where a super mod would be great or a list of recommended mods in the correct order,

however since there are so many it would be a daunting if not impossible task.

who's mod do you favor over another!!

W_clear · 10-29-10, 09:48 PM

Hi Mr TDW

I have tested your IRAI.0.29

AI still does not solve the problem, see screenshot，Destroyer still can't found the submarine , 5 minutes later, DD is still not found the submarine。At that time the submarine is underwater 40M. Speed of 4 knots。

Original SH5 AI will soon find submarines, you want to AI become weak? Or want to change the hardware?At least your IRAI's AI weaker .

Zedi · 10-30-10, 01:03 AM

TDW, can you please list the load order for your mods combined with Enviro mod? I'm interested in the load order for IRAI, FX with UHS fix and Enviro Mod. I have the feeling that I miss a lot of things that these mods had to offer just because they are not compatible with each other :|

PL_Andrev · 10-30-10, 02:01 AM

Its looks now like:
1. sub is detected with XY1 position and DD try to investigate this point
2. sub is detected with XY2 position but DD are still investigating previous point

Maybe the better tactics is:
1. sub is detected with XY1 position and DD1 try to investigate this point
2. new sub contact is detected closer than 3km from XY1 - DD1 delete last tactics and try to attack new contact
3. new sub contact is detected farther than 3km from XY1 (at XY2) - DD1 is looking for sub in last position, new contact at XY2 is investigating with DD2
This tactics can be useful with mulisub detections (f.e. Fate of U-110)

Note1:
At SH4 after contact detecting the DDs are looking for sub by zig-zaging to check bigger area than by straight course, and avoid possible torpedoes.

Note2:
If DD is detecting the sub with visual sensors (on surface / periscope on surface) is better to use maximum speed to catch the target before sub change highly depth and position. Now the maximum speed for DD is limited to 14kt.
In last test DD try to attack me by pursuing my sub when I was submerged (my speed 7.5kt, DD's: 14) and it takes many many time (I could change highly my depth).
___________________________

Could you describe differences between level of escort
and between aggressive and defensive tactics?

10-28-10, 01:05 PM	#946
PL_Andrev Grey Wolf Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 994 Downloads: 91 Uploads: 0	Played historical mission "Fate of U-110" with: IRAI.0.28 + FX.0.5 + Env.4.3 + 100% real Used tactic: Flank speed + obs periscope at surface all time The escort ships are not aggressive. Both of them completely do not attack me (especially corvette). One DD "try" to attack but does not try to ramming me (periscope at surface all time) or swim over my position. DD swims "near me" only / close to me and depth charges give me any damages. Strange thing - DD does not shoot guns to me (to my periscope). __________________

10-29-10, 05:17 AM	#952
PL_Andrev Grey Wolf Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 994 Downloads: 91 Uploads: 0	Tested mission: Historical mission / The fate of U-110 Installed mods: IRAI.0.29 (complete) + FX_Update.0.5 + Environmental.4.301 All images are captured with AI sub: Lemp's U-110: 1. Lemp is run with full speed. DDs are detect him (DD changes course) but no update course with current Lemp's position. 1a. Lemp have almost perfect position to shoot. He doesn't shot. 2. Lemp is surfacing (why?), but after first hits he goes into deep. DD should know his real position and probably course... 3. But they looking for him at his first position when he was detected previously! It looks that enemy sub is detected at point XY, and all escort ships are looking for him near XY point, with ignoring / no reaction with other (or this same) contact. __________________ Last edited by PL_Andrev; 10-29-10 at 07:28 AM.

10-29-10, 06:23 AM	#953
DavyJonesFootlocker The Old Man Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Stink Drunk in Trinidad Posts: 1,572 Downloads: 138 Uploads: 0	I also notice if you surface the DDs won't shoot at you unless you shoot first. __________________ "Silence means death. Stand on your feet. Inner fear your worst enemy."- Sepultura. My Silent Hunter 5 mantra is this......"Torpedo missed, sir!" A P-400 is a P-40 with a Zero after it. A proud member of the Wikipedia Haters Club

10-29-10, 07:25 AM	#954
PL_Andrev Grey Wolf Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 994 Downloads: 91 Uploads: 0	Checked the escort ships in this mission: all competent with defensive tactics. With IRAI.0.29 the attacking DD (A&B) does not attack my sub by "ramming my periscope and dropping DC into this position". When he was on my back, he still avoids my position (keep parallel course to me) and drops DC. Very stupid. About shooting: A&B class in this mission is very passive with shooting to my ships. Only Flower class corvette is active with good degree. In this mission are two german subs and three escort ships. When "attacking" DD is sunk, other (second DD) does not go to my position to attack me. __________________

10-29-10, 02:06 PM	#955
PL_Andrev Grey Wolf Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 994 Downloads: 91 Uploads: 0	Small update (still Fate of U-110): With mods FX.0.5 + Env.4.301 + IRAI.0.29 I was one time "correctly" attacked by corvette only, which detect me and attack with enter directly over me. But it happens after few circles and her searching position (no contact by X time or no new waypoints). __________________

10-28-10, 02:17 PM	#949
flymar Loader Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 86 Downloads: 42 Uploads: 0	One Tribal did fire on my periscope. 2 DDs were going around me and even get very close to me (periscope view was IN the 3d object) but no ramming damage. Later one of the DDs saw me near the end of his vision range (good weather) and I went for 1 on 1 chicken game, with guns. he lost but my hull went down to 59%. But still I can disappear at 46 meters - first patrol in Mad Sea.

10-28-10, 11:32 PM	#951
TheDarkWraith Black Magic Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 11,962 Downloads: 147 Uploads: 5	v0.0.29 released. See post #1 for details

10-29-10, 07:41 PM	#957
Reece CINC Pacific Fleet Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Down Under Posts: 33,526 Downloads: 171 Uploads: 0	I think the main problem is getting the mods in the correct order, this is where a super mod would be great or a list of recommended mods in the correct order, however since there are so many it would be a daunting if not impossible task. who's mod do you favor over another!! __________________ *Sub captains go down with their ship!*

10-29-10, 09:48 PM	#958
W_clear Ace of the Deep Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,142 Downloads: 111 Uploads: 0	Hi Mr TDW I have tested your IRAI.0.29 AI still does not solve the problem, see screenshot，Destroyer still can't found the submarine , 5 minutes later, DD is still not found the submarine。At that time the submarine is underwater 40M. Speed of 4 knots。 Original SH5 AI will soon find submarines, you want to AI become weak? Or want to change the hardware?At least your IRAI's AI weaker .

10-30-10, 01:03 AM	#959
Zedi Sea Lord Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 1,845 Downloads: 184 Uploads: 2	TDW, can you please list the load order for your mods combined with Enviro mod? I'm interested in the load order for IRAI, FX with UHS fix and Enviro Mod. I have the feeling that I miss a lot of things that these mods had to offer just because they are not compatible with each other :\|

10-30-10, 02:01 AM	#960
PL_Andrev Grey Wolf Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 994 Downloads: 91 Uploads: 0	Its looks now like: 1. sub is detected with XY1 position and DD try to investigate this point 2. sub is detected with XY2 position but DD are still investigating previous point Maybe the better tactics is: 1. sub is detected with XY1 position and DD1 try to investigate this point 2. new sub contact is detected closer than 3km from XY1 - DD1 delete last tactics and try to attack new contact 3. new sub contact is detected farther than 3km from XY1 (at XY2) - DD1 is looking for sub in last position, new contact at XY2 is investigating with DD2 This tactics can be useful with mulisub detections (f.e. Fate of U-110) Note1: At SH4 after contact detecting the DDs are looking for sub by zig-zaging to check bigger area than by straight course, and avoid possible torpedoes. Note2: If DD is detecting the sub with visual sensors (on surface / periscope on surface) is better to use maximum speed to catch the target before sub change highly depth and position. Now the maximum speed for DD is limited to 14kt. In last test DD try to attack me by pursuing my sub when I was submerged (my speed 7.5kt, DD's: 14) and it takes many many time (I could change highly my depth). ___________________________ Could you describe differences between level of escort and between aggressive and defensive tactics? __________________