plane crash near Smolensk, Polish president on board

[drtechno]

Originally Posted by Susexx

Russians not monsters and not fanatics

But they USED to be..

And all that in Katyne has been proved by nobody, it only a trump as in politics tricks and no more.

Do not infuriate me. If you don't believe the international community, then how about your own leaders.. YOUR OWN GOVERNMENT HAS ADMITTED TO IT. And then you wonder why the Poles still despise Russians. Its because of garbage like this statement. You probably also don't believe the Russians even invaded Poland in WW2. Thats right, you came to our "rescue".

Not one inhabitant of Leningrad does not feed hostility for Germans though during blockade has died almost 2 million people.

The Germans didn't occupy, control and suppress Leningrad for over 50 years, leaving its economy and infrastructure in a disaster. Why don't you ask the Hungarians how much they love Russians ?? Or do you also not believe the Russians suppressed the 1956 Revolt?

Unbelievable comments.

[jaxa]

Originally Posted by Susexx

Russians not monsters and not fanatics and to us it is sincerely a pity the lost people, even despite the fact that what the president of Poland has been incited against rapprochement with Russia. And all that in Katyne has been proved by nobody, it only a trump as in politics tricks and no more. Not one inhabitant of Leningrad does not feed hostility for Germans though during blockade has died almost 2 million people.

Mourning in Russia on April, 12th 2010

RIP

I don't know what to say after reading these words. In your opinion Polish officers were murdered probably by themselves, or UFO crewmembers or, maybe, by Germans in 1941 as Soviet propaganda said in 1943 when it was discovered. Think more that one time at hour and try to use Google or Wikipedia. I know, you can always say that is Nazi propaganda and Goebbels's work. Polish officers were murdered with no reason, only for Stalin and Beria and other Soviet government criminals wish. Every honest human all over the world knows that was Soviet outrage and that Soviet Union was criminal country and wanted to invade rest of the world.

I didn't know that somebody at this forum can have such opinions like you

PS. I must say that I know some Russians who know many things about Soviet outrages, included Katyń massacre.

[Happy Times]

Originally Posted by jaxa

I don't know what to say after reading these words.

You have to say thank you for liberating you.
And if you will be nice they could shove a gas pipe up your ass, they are that nice.

[Susexx]

Poles despise Russian??? Choose friends more carefully. To me is sad to see that brotherly (even on language) the people remember from all history only Katyn. And that our grandfathers together were at war, these are all have similar forgotten. Or miss on Hitler, likely in Osventsime it was good?
All have suddenly recollected that Russian invaders, only killed all.
In vain you so Slavs...

[Susexx]

Originally Posted by Happy Times

You have to say thank you for liberating you.
And if you will be nice they could shove a gas pipe up your ass, they are that nice.

It is possible without trite humour, the post forces to long.

[aanker]

Condolences to a Nation bereaved.

Re comments from above. Through Subsim I have been exposed to people from many nations. I wish that we could all be friends in real life as we are here. If it is possible here it should be possible in real life.

Art

[Susexx]

It should seems to me that events in Smolensk on the contrary to rally the people of Europe. We fortunately at that time did not live, let past events remain history and no more. After all how many was terrible events in the different countries: revolt , Hiroshima, Vietnam, Afghanistan, Katyn, Woman's Jar, Osventsim. Thank God it now history...

On behalf of all inhabitants of Leningrad I bring condolences to the family of the deads.

[kalaruch]

Im watching the arrival of 34 coffins from Smolensk to Warsaw...
Its overwhelming, because yesterday it was the same, 30 wooden coffins.
My superior chief (viceadmiral A. Karweta), the CINC of the Polish Nav. I saw him a month ago, when he was taking command from Dutch Minesweeper to Polish 7th Minesweeper Div.

PS Susexx - it was Stalin and his goverment, who ordered mass murder of Polish officers in Katyn, just watch the movie "Katyn"... Then post again your thoughts. Its based on true facts!

Rest in peace, our beloved countrymen

[Susexx]

Whether instead of equally Stalin or Hitler it has made all? Same death and murder. If think that history unilateral that you very much are mistaken. Here an example from the Soviet-Polish war 1919-1921, about it why that of films do not remove:

Execution by Poles of mission of the Russian Red Cross became on January, 2nd, 1919 the first documentary use of weapons against citizens, this act has been made, most likely, by groups of the Polish Self-defence as the regular Polish army yet has not left limits of Poland. In March, 1919 after employment by the Polish army of Pinsk the Polish commandant has ordered to shoot 40 Jews who have gathered for a prayer who have accepted for meeting of Bolsheviks. The part of the personnel of hospital has been shot also. in April of the same year capture by Poles of Vilnius was accompanied by mass punishments over captured Red Army men, Jews and the people sympathising the Soviet power . Approach of the Polish armies in Ukraine in the spring of 1920 was accompanied by the Jewish pogroms and mass executions: in Exactly Poles have shot more than 3 thousand civilians, in a place Tetiev is killed about 4 thousand Jews, for resistance at foodstuffs requisitions villages Ivanovtsy, the Heap, by Sobachi, Jablunovka, New Rowing, Melnichi, Kirillovka and др are completely burnt, their inhabitants are shot.

War without blood does not happen.

[jaxa]

Yeah, I was waiting for similar words - don't remember about Russian POWs killed by Polish during Polish-Soviet War 1919-1921. It's main counter-argument of Soviet and some Russian propaganda when we try to talk about Katyń massacre. It's as same true as talking about Polish officers in Katyń killed by Germans. But Katyń isn't only one massacre made by Soviets in Poland. Grodno 1939, Lvov 1941, Augustów 1944, Vilnus 1944 etc. - civilians, partisans, Polish soldiers. I hope it will be conciliation between our nations, but one condition is strongly neccessary - to plead guilty. Your President Miedwiediew said it was Stalin's decision.
Did you see "Katyń" movie on Russiya or Kultura tv? What do you think about this story?

[Susexx]

Originally Posted by jaxa

Yeah, I was waiting for similar words - don't remember about Russian POWs killed by Polish during Polish-Soviet War 1919-1921. It's main counter-argument of Soviet and some Russian propaganda when we try to talk about Katyń massacre. It's as same true as talking about Polish officers in Katyń killed by Germans. But Katyń isn't only one massacre made by Soviets in Poland. Grodno 1939, Lvov 1941, Augustów 1944, Vilnus 1944 etc. - civilians, partisans, Polish soldiers. I hope it will be conciliation between our nations, but one condition is strongly neccessary - to plead guilty. Your President Miedwiediew said it was Stalin's decision.
Did you see "Katyń" movie on Russiya or Kultura tv? What do you think about this story?

Give, my friend we will simply keep silent... About the dead speak or it is good or anything. We do not need to stir the past, time has judged and has punished criminals.

Let's simply keep silent....

[kalaruch]

Bolshevik and soviet propaganda messed everything up.
Sussex, my dear friend, please pray for those who died for their motherland.

I dont want to dispute about 1919-1920 and 1939-1940, but 1919 and 1939 were the years of Bolshevik/Soviet aggression on II RP.

I would like to end this thread, and try to concentrate at Smolensk tragedy.
Youre right,

time has judged and has punished criminals

. Let historians dig in the past....

[Susexx]

Smolensk, Russia-April 12, 2010: This is a satellite image of the crash site of a TU-154 outside of Smolensk, Russia in which President Lech Kaczynski of Poland and members of the political and military leadership were killed/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/digital...ry/4515204703/

[jaxa]

It was too foggy for landing, no INS and too low altitude. One hour later I saw sun and blue sky over crash site
Looking at this photo - where is proper runway?

[Jimbuna]

It looks like slightly north east