A Bunch of Young Lawyers are Suing Their Law Schools Because They Don't Have Jobs

[CaptainHaplo]

A number of schools are being sued for the same type of thing. A friend of mine is on the hook for student loans for her brother - he went to culinary school, and hasn't found work yet.

What makes it so bad is that not only is it hurting him financially - its now affecting her. Because she has been harmed directly due to the fraudulent employment data presented, she may be due relief - which in this case is simply being removed from liability for the loan. Its something I am helping her explore.

[Penguin]

First, I find an education system which is solely based on money sick. Giving false hope to students to lure them into your school is a result of this. You can't run an education facility like you'd run a factory.

Second: what is with the individuals own decisions? Is it to much for a 20something person to inform oneself about job prospects in the field you work and in the region you want to live? Hell, they spend 150grand for their education, but can't spend a day at the chamber of commerce, local businesses or maybe only in the web to get informations how the reality looks like...

That being said, long-term projection are always hard to make, especially if you ask economic "experts". Then there is alos the infamous hog circle you have to consider.

Sueing someone for your own mistakes is sadly a common sport. Hell, I could be rich by now if I had sued the shop in the US were I accidently rammed a clothes hanger into my belly while jumping up to grab a hoodie which was too high for me. Well, I refuse to make money from my own stupidity.

Anyway: the best of luck for you JSL - my rant is not meant against you, but against the "blame anyone else but myself"-mentality which is too common nowadays and which those law grads from Brooklyn clearly seem to have.

[nikimcbee]

Welcome to the real world!
On a side note, of coarse they'd sue, they're just using their degree.

[soopaman2]

Can I sue Warren Buffet for being poor?

Now suing big firms over the economic meltdown...Oh wait...

I'm sorry. I expect now that corps are people, they can be treated as such. I can't wait until Texas executes one. Sorry to insult the conservatives, and the job creators.

About time frivolous lawsuits was put to good use.

[GoldenRivet]

I think some folks misunderstand

They are not suing the college because they are unemployed.

They are suing the college because it used falsified data to increase enrollment numbers into a high cost degree program.

Ultimately, this no doubt influenced some of these people to enroll in the degree program as opposed to following some other field of study.

not having a job isnt so much the point...

false advertising is the point.

If you attended a school and majored in nursing because the school advertised 98% job placement, and you spent gobs of money getting your education only to find out that the school had falsified their job placement numbers - and that in reality only 58% of graduates found employment after graduation. would you not be a tad pissed at the falsification?

would these people gather any more sympathy if they had been of some other profession?

what if they had been minorities entering some basic business management major. and the school had said that 98% of their business management majors find jobs after graduation only to later realize that - oops - its actually 20-30% less than that number we advertised.

I dunno... i think they have a case if they can prove the numbers were intentionally altered - I've seen this kind of crap at 3 schools and there needs to be more "truth in advertising" if you ask me.

[the_tyrant]

You know, after thinking about it, employment numbers are a horrible way for potential students to decide on what to major in

after all, the data you see now is from at least 1-2 years ago, add in the 4 years for an undergrad degree, that means that there will be 5 years in between.

A lot can change in 5 years

They are suing the college because it used falsified data to increase enrollment numbers into a high cost degree program.

It wasn't falsified though was it, slightly misleading maybe but thats the nature of advertising, for potential lawyers they should have read the small print and footnotes and small print on smallprint on footnotes of small print.
After all taking on a $150k debt isn't something you should do without looking at all the details.
The details specify that the % is only % according to some big deductions on incomplete figures and then some further juggling of numbers, placements are only placements and not job specific, employers are only employers it doesn't specify that people are working at the screen actors guild as lawyers and not as teaboy, it even specifies that the guided salary is only a rough guide with lots of variables and can't be taken as an actual measure.

So that looks like the fraud one is out the window, it also suggest negligent misrepresentation by the school is out the window as its more like negligently taking on a debt as a student without reading the blurb.

there needs to be more "truth in advertising" if you ask me.

advertising is all about telling people what they want to hear.
If they read 88%* and don't read the * and the ## and the *~*%, and somehow think 88% become lawyers within 9 months of graduation with a wage of $160k at Pfizer then they are proving the old line about there being one born every minute.

[Stealhead]

Originally Posted by the_tyrant

You know, after thinking about it, employment numbers are a horrible way for potential students to decide on what to major in

after all, the data you see now is from at least 1-2 years ago, add in the 4 years for an undergrad degree, that means that there will be 5 years in between.

A lot can change in 5 years

That would be about right the data is about 4 or 5 years old by time it gets published.Another thing I dislike are those Department of Labor stats on different fields they are very misleading because they measure everyone employed in the US in that field it is all averaged the demand for a job might be high and one state and very low in another and the pay is averaged out so it is misleading as well.

[GoldenRivet]

as the saying goes... nobody has the crystal ball.

You have to go and make the best possible decision with the information at hand.

If the information is as accurate and as up to date as possible... thats the best you can do.

if the information has been twisted around to suit the needs of the person selling you the goods... you're being had.

[soopaman2]

This will create a precedance for all the lazy "political science" and "cultural studies" (women, African American American Indian classes) to sue, because they took courses with no real substance to society.

Kinda like lawyers?

Whenever lawyers get involved with anything they are always the winner. Even if they lose, they still get paid. Judges still get paid, so guess who loses?

I feel zero pity, though I do find it amusing to see the potential 1% claw at the real 1%.

Maybe they will off each other, and higher education can mean more than a piece of paper, and a guaranteed job because you had the finances to pay.

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

would these people gather any more sympathy if they had been of some other profession?

No

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

if the information has been twisted around to suit the needs of the person selling you the goods... you're being had.

If you get your informations about a product solely from the seller you're not being had but being stupid.

[soopaman2]

Originally Posted by Penguin

If you get your informations about a product solely from the seller you're not being had but being stupid.

At the same time, should there not be some kind of honesty in advertising?

There used to be, when I was a kid. Now the news itself spews bullcrap.

There is no more honesty, just tell them what they want to hear until you have the money. Then shrug and play stupid afterwards.

Maybe, I am changed on this. Perhaps America itself, from Wall Street, down to people who signed "liars loans" to be held accountable.

That means everyone from the welfare defrauder, to the economy wrecking bankers.

Accountability.

When I was a young man, I hit a guy in his face with a beer pitcher.
He grabbed my soon to be wifes bosom, yet I still went to jail for a few days.

I was held accountable, as I should have been.

I am simply waiting for such justice for everyone else, perhaps this is the start. Academia has been getting away with this crap for years.

Most have raised rates during the recession, even as students are having tough times finding jobs afterwards. The schools do not care. Most of their money comes from guaranteed loans. The schools are paid, it is the student who is saddled with the debt.

Better you than me, now get out from front of my Mazerati, you turd!

We got ours, screw you kid. I hope you like flipping burgers with that law degree.

[MH]

Originally Posted by soopaman2

At the same time, should there not be some kind of honesty in advertising?
.

I can agree to that....but as a American who lives in the nest of hardcore capitalism and consumer economy you should know better than that...

Suing for false advertising is OK..why not...on another hand it is stupid to take career decisions based on them.
Finishing some school may not make one a good lawyer so should one be able to sue the establishment for being inadequate too?

OHHH but they promised me job

At the same time, should there not be some kind of honesty in advertising?

There used to be, when I was a kid. Now the news itself spews bullcrap.

Rose tinted glasses.
Advertising is advertising and the news has always had plenty of bullcrap.

When I was a young man, I hit a guy in his face with a beer pitcher.

A rose tinted glass?

[Torplexed]

Originally Posted by soopaman2

At the same time, should there not be some kind of honesty in advertising?

There used to be, when I was a kid.

Seriously?





When I took advertising in college they said our job was to make the product, "the hero", no matter how odious we thought the product was. That's always been advertising in a nutshell.