Hacked Emails Show Climate Science Ridden with Rancor - Page 27

nikimcbee · 01-10-10, 11:53 PM

An official nikimcbee prediction:

Just wait Neal, 10 years from now we'll be skiing at your house for the next subsim meeting! Chateau Stevens: Houston's finest ski resort.

Skybird · 01-11-10, 12:45 AM

Mojib Latif is no unknown to German TV viewers, he is a scientist who can be seen quite frequently on TV. What he indeed is warning of since years, and I saw him saying that repeatedly on TV, is that these MDOs exist, and could file a certain ammount of temperature events on earth. But Latif at the same time says that the effect they cause is not a general drop or climb of temperatures in both the warm and cold seasons of the year, but probably makes the weather extremes within a season more excessive - the winters become colder and the summers become warmer, much like more and more it is assumed for the medieval "cooloig and warming age" that saw no real drop or climb in yearly mean temperatures, but a widening of the gap between the summers and winter temperatures, which is not reflected by yearly means. Latif said that MDOs could cause winter and summer being further apart in temperatures, and still the general temperature over the years in a climb. Latif also warns, and has warned again last year repeatedly, that his measures of glaciers and artic ice show both shrinking, and at a surprisingly much faster rate than was assumed just short time earlier, a finding that other researchers have confirmed over the last year.

Regarding the way he gets quoted in that article, that pretty much gives me the impression that they have taken him out of context, or distorted what he says. If he really would have meant it the way he is quoted, then he would have made a U-turn just within the past couple of weeks - because I saw him once again on TV just short time before christmas, must have been late Novembre or early Decembre, on a local station like SWR or so, and then he gave a very different assessement on global warming than how he is quoted in the article now. at best he agrees with MDOs eventually having a certain "taming" effect, a braking effect on global warming: it still takes place, but happens a bit slower. Nevertheless, and there he leaves no doubt, the trend is: upwards.

I like Latif on TV, because he talks calm and straight and direct and does no verbal pirouettes and politics stuff. I think he knows his matter.

http://www.wetter.info/wetter-aktuel...-sein/17865696
Septembre 2009

01-11-10, 02:53 AM

Sorry folks. I believe what my body tells me first and foremost.

I neither see, nor feel, any evidence of Global Warming.

Skybird · 01-11-10, 03:46 AM

You are no scientific criterion. That I can't see Japan from Germany does not mean it is not there. Maybe I just have to move a bit in order to see it.

The data and observation results indicating and concluding on global warming taking place, are OVERWHELMING. I leave it to you to learn a bit on it. Regarding your body, only your brain is needed for data processing, memory storage and adding one and one together, the rest of your body - is no argument regarding Global Warming.

http://www.grist.org/article/series/skeptics/

01-11-10, 04:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

You are no scientific criterion. That I can't see Japan from Germany does not mean it is not there. Maybe I just have to move a bit in order to see it.

The data and observation results indicating and concluding on global warming taking place, are OVERWHELMING. I leave it to you to learn a bit on it. Regarding your body, only your brain is needed for data processing, memory storage and adding one and one together, the rest of your body - is no argument regarding Global Warming.

http://www.grist.org/article/series/skeptics/

Actualy, whether I buy into Global Warming or not, does not make much difference as it is secondary (and if true is submersive) to the primary problem, which is over-population.
Until the primary problem is corrected, by man or nature, the secondary problem is immaterial.

Skybird · 01-11-10, 05:26 AM

We are too many, yes, my talk. Nevertheless, symptomatic problems documenting that are not really immaterial, but real. And that the planet will look different anyway in 400,000 years, does not help that the life at present nevertheless is confronted with like it is now and the flux it is in, and which is much faster than it normally/naturally would be the case. And "life" - includes us, as well as other species who have the same right to live on this planet like we do. We may be the dominant species on this planet, but I do no longer think of us as in terms of "the most precious" species. If we would not be there, our non-existence would be a benefit for all others species, a benefit that by scale and quality only compares to a killer-meteorite not impacting on Earth, but passing it.

01-11-10, 05:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

And "life" - includes us, as well as other species who have the same right to live on this planet like we do. We may be the dominant species on this planet, but I do no longer think of us as in terms of "the most precious" species.

This has always been my perception. We (people) are no more than a part of nature.
There never has been, and never will be, "a most precious" species. Everything is interdependent to some extent or another.

For men to think they can completely dominate Nature, as opposed to accepting their role as a part of Nature, is a big mistake that can, and has had, severe consequenses.

Life is much easier for one who learns to work with Nature, as opposed to one who is determined to fight or exploit Nature.

Skybird · 01-11-10, 05:56 AM

Indeed.

CaptainHaplo · 01-11-10, 07:08 AM

Skybird - the one problem is that the "overwhelming" data is all originally sourced from the CRU - which then provided its "manipulated" data to various other institutions, along with the UN. It is this data that has been accepted as the foundation of GW.

The facts are that the CRU destroyed original data, and refused to let other scientists verify their models. With bad data, no matter how good the intent - other scientists were going to come up with the same answer.

Stop using this "overwhelming" data arguement until the data that overwhelms is not manipulated. Right now, everything points to GW being a huge hoax,

Skybird · 01-11-10, 07:27 AM

No it is not only the CRU, but the NASA and other institutions operating independent from both as well.

Regarding the accusations of CRU, or this silly email blow-up, I would not believe anything the way sceptics try to claim it.

http://www.grist.org/article/series/skeptics/

TDK1044 · 01-11-10, 07:38 AM

Such a polarizing issue, it's a waste of time discussing it. No opinions are going to be changed on either side. Both sides will keep posting links of articles from alleged experts, and both sides will continue to cherry pick the data in order to make their case.

Read credible information from both sides of the argument and form your own opinion.

AVGWarhawk · 01-11-10, 08:59 AM

Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr..... .....................I'm cold!

SteamWake · 01-11-10, 10:13 AM

Hrm I thought this thread had died....or froze to death

Onkel Neal · 01-11-10, 10:34 AM

Hey, at least I recycled

01-10-10, 11:53 PM	#391
nikimcbee Fleet Admiral Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Patroling the Slot. Posts: 17,952 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	An official nikimcbee prediction: Just wait Neal, 10 years from now we'll be skiing at your house for the next subsim meeting! Chateau Stevens: Houston's finest ski resort. __________________

01-11-10, 12:45 AM	#392
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,619 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Mojib Latif is no unknown to German TV viewers, he is a scientist who can be seen quite frequently on TV. What he indeed is warning of since years, and I saw him saying that repeatedly on TV, is that these MDOs exist, and could file a certain ammount of temperature events on earth. But Latif at the same time says that the effect they cause is not a general drop or climb of temperatures in both the warm and cold seasons of the year, but probably makes the weather extremes within a season more excessive - the winters become colder and the summers become warmer, much like more and more it is assumed for the medieval "cooloig and warming age" that saw no real drop or climb in yearly mean temperatures, but a widening of the gap between the summers and winter temperatures, which is not reflected by yearly means. Latif said that MDOs could cause winter and summer being further apart in temperatures, and still the general temperature over the years in a climb. Latif also warns, and has warned again last year repeatedly, that his measures of glaciers and artic ice show both shrinking, and at a surprisingly much faster rate than was assumed just short time earlier, a finding that other researchers have confirmed over the last year. Regarding the way he gets quoted in that article, that pretty much gives me the impression that they have taken him out of context, or distorted what he says. If he really would have meant it the way he is quoted, then he would have made a U-turn just within the past couple of weeks - because I saw him once again on TV just short time before christmas, must have been late Novembre or early Decembre, on a local station like SWR or so, and then he gave a very different assessement on global warming than how he is quoted in the article now. at best he agrees with MDOs eventually having a certain "taming" effect, a braking effect on global warming: it still takes place, but happens a bit slower. Nevertheless, and there he leaves no doubt, the trend is: upwards. I like Latif on TV, because he talks calm and straight and direct and does no verbal pirouettes and politics stuff. I think he knows his matter. http://www.wetter.info/wetter-aktuel...-sein/17865696 Septembre 2009 __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert. Last edited by Skybird; 01-11-10 at 12:58 AM.

01-11-10, 03:46 AM	#394
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,619 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	You are no scientific criterion. That I can't see Japan from Germany does not mean it is not there. Maybe I just have to move a bit in order to see it. The data and observation results indicating and concluding on global warming taking place, are *OVERWHELMING. I leave it to you to learn a bit on it. Regarding your body, only your brain is needed for data processing, memory storage and adding one and one together, the rest of your body - is no argument regarding Global Warming. http://www.grist.org/article/series/skeptics/ __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.*

01-11-10, 05:26 AM	#396
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,619 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	We are too many, yes, my talk. Nevertheless, symptomatic problems documenting that are not really immaterial, but real. And that the planet will look different anyway in 400,000 years, does not help that the life at present nevertheless is confronted with like it is now and the flux it is in, and which is much faster than it normally/naturally would be the case. And "life" - includes us, as well as other species who have the same right to live on this planet like we do. We may be the dominant species on this planet, but I do no longer think of us as in terms of "the most precious" species. If we would not be there, our non-existence would be a benefit for all others species, a benefit that by scale and quality only compares to a killer-meteorite not impacting on Earth, but passing it. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

01-11-10, 05:56 AM	#398
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,619 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Indeed. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

01-11-10, 02:53 AM	#393
Snestorm Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Sorry folks. I believe what my body tells me first and foremost. I neither see, nor feel, any evidence of Global Warming.

01-11-10, 07:08 AM	#399
CaptainHaplo Silent Hunter Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 4,404 Downloads: 29 Uploads: 0	Skybird - the one problem is that the "overwhelming" data is all originally sourced from the CRU - which then provided its "manipulated" data to various other institutions, along with the UN. It is this data that has been accepted as the foundation of GW. The facts are that the CRU destroyed original data, and refused to let other scientists verify their models. With bad data, no matter how good the intent - other scientists were going to come up with the same answer. Stop using this "overwhelming" data arguement until the data that overwhelms is not manipulated. Right now, everything points to GW being a huge hoax, __________________ Good Hunting! Captain Haplo

01-11-10, 07:27 AM	#400
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,619 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	No it is not only the CRU, but the NASA and other institutions operating independent from both as well. Regarding the accusations of CRU, or this silly email blow-up, I would not believe anything the way sceptics try to claim it. http://www.grist.org/article/series/skeptics/ __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

01-11-10, 07:38 AM	#401
TDK1044 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Georgia, USA Posts: 2,674 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	Such a polarizing issue, it's a waste of time discussing it. No opinions are going to be changed on either side. Both sides will keep posting links of articles from alleged experts, and both sides will continue to cherry pick the data in order to make their case. Read credible information from both sides of the argument and form your own opinion.

01-11-10, 08:59 AM	#402
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,256 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr..... .....................I'm cold! __________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

01-11-10, 10:13 AM	#403
SteamWake Rear Admiral Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,224 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	Hrm I thought this thread had died....or froze to death __________________ Follow the progress of Mr. Mulligan : http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=147648

01-11-10, 10:34 AM	#404
Onkel Neal Born to Run Silent Join Date: Jan 1997 Location: Cougar Trap, Texas Posts: 21,385 Downloads: 541 Uploads: 224	Hey, at least I recycled __________________ SUBSIM - 26 Years on the Web