Video emerges of Minneapolis police killing a citizen - - Riots

[Jeff-Groves]

DAMN IT!
Now I need to build another hide!


But I do fall under this...
(3) enhanced body armor that was lawfully possessed by any person at any time before the date this section takes effect.

Also. One can buy all the Type II they want.
Which is easy to upgrade to Type III or Type IV given the Type II you have.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal

The daft incident in Bristol with the Edward Colston statue and a few more like the example above fails to recognise the historical context. In Bristol we have a statue of a famous city father who did much good work for the community that was destroyed due to his record as a slave trader. His trade - amongst others - was to transport slaves during a period when slavery was legal and when it was a world wide institution. Incidentally who sold the slaves to be transported? Black slavers did. I say this not because I do not abhor the trade that was slavery but simply to note that we are looking at things from a 20th Century context and then applying our current value system to a period that was totally different. Also where does this end? I have read that some of these protestors now want to remove Nelson from his column because at one point he was known to have supported the slave trade. - Well of course he did because in 17th and 18th Century Britain it was rare to find someone - regardless of class who did not. So stop trying to eradicate a history simply because it does not follow our current moral view point. We have a history where lessons can be learned from a history that we can both dislike and be proud of but do not let us destroy it or try to eradicate it. Finally, as far as the slave trade was concerned lets not forget that there was at least as many black slavers as there were white slavers so it is far to simplistic to paint this as a question of white against black.

[Tchocky]

I don't know, Jim.

I'm fairly sure there were plenty of people at the time who considered slavery to be wrong "in the context of the time".

In fact we know there were.

This guy bought and sold them.

Doesn't say that on his statue, though.

I wonder why.

[Cybermat47]

Originally Posted by Tchocky

I don't know, Jim.

I'm fairly sure there were plenty of people at the time who considered slavery to be wrong "in the context of the time".

In fact we know there were.

This guy bought and sold them.

Doesn't say that on his statue, though.

I wonder why.

Yeah, they should at least put on the statue that he sold slaves. It’s pretty revisionist not to.

[Jimbuna]

The point I'm trying to make is there was right and wrong on both sides back in the day and to put it as simplistically as black versus white today is not fully correct.

[Commander Wallace]

I was working on something with the television on and caught an interview with various Police chiefs and authorities around the U.S on I believe, CNN. It seems the 4 officers indicted in the murder of George Floyd are not presenting a united front. Quite the contrary, Former officers Kiernan Lane, Alexander Kueng have placed the blame on Derek Chauvin while Tou Thao has been cooperating with authorities before he was indicted. I seriously doubt this will help as with video evidence, they hardly need the cooperation of the other 3.

Apparently, the other 3 and their attorney's feel it's in their best interest to throw " Chauvin under the bus. " The attorney's for Kiernan Lane, Alexander Kueng have said their clients were rookies and deferred to Chauvin, their training officer. I don't blame defense attorneys from grasping at straws but i think they will find, " that dog won't hunt. " regarding this argument. Apparently these officers and their attorney's don't understand that the standard of what any reasonable officer would do in their place. It hardly takes 4 men to hold down an already restrained man and their arguments in court will have a very uphill battle.

The Police Chiefs all said in unison if officers don't know right from wrong, they shouldn't be police officers. Chauvin is all of 150lbs and 5'10. If the other officers involved are that much of a coward to be afraid of Chauvin, what might they do against more physically imposing people ?


https://abcnews.go.com/US/officers-c...ry?id=71066710


In Minneapolis, efforts are underway to abolish the police force there and to do something about it's union as well. The idea is to move them in social work. I think this is one of the most stupid ideas I have ever heard of. Efforts are underway in other parts of the country to defund police agencies as well. Gun shops owners report people are buying firearms in such numbers as there are shortages in various models.


https://thefederalist.com/2020/06/05...ce-department/


I thought this might be as good a time as any to ask our Subsim members what ideas they might have of any reorganization. This would include our members from other countries and to see what works in their respective countries. I will list some possibilities.

1) an oversight board would have to be put into places around the country where people's legitimate complaints are heard. Obviously, the police can't be trusted to do their own investigations as the complaints against Chavin before the death of Floyd, has shown. These boards would need to at the local and regional levels. If People's civil rights have been violated, refer the evidence over to the federal Govt. for prosecution. There would also have to be oversight of the boards themselves with the appropriate checks and balances for obvious reasons.


2) Video camera's worn by the police or in their cars would have to run continuously. Any efforts to disable them by officers would automatically result in criminal charges being filed . Further, make it a crime for officers to take recording devices from citizens or to order them to turn them off. It makes good sense for anyone with recording devices in their cars, phones, etc to have the recorded videos uploaded to a cloud server so any officer seizing a recording device can't erase or destroy film footage.

3) Scotus would have to revoke privileges enjoyed by officers and public officials regarding immunity from their criminal actions. This decision is criminal in itself and needs to be removed, post haste. This would include allowing police to seize money from it's citizens under the asset forfeiture law. It's essentially a license for police officers to steal your money and or property without anything in the way of due process. It's also behind the " policing for profit " tactics officers utilize now.

4) Initiate websites and federal and local registries of those officers with criminal complaints against them. This would have to include impartial investigation NOT to be done by their respective departments of internal affairs units.

5) demilitarize police forces, banning surplus military equipment transfers to police forces on a local level as they can't be trusted to use them. If special situations arise, units like SWAT can then be utilized with the proper training in the use of tactics and specialized military grade weapons.

6) Scrutiny as to the soundness of using former military members as police officers. This would also include an enhanced battery of mental fitness tests for anyone aspiring to the police academy. Police officers from a military background tend to view their own citizens as the enemy and the public by and large feel the same way about their respective police forces. It won't end well for the police forces if this practice continues.

7) Colleges and trade schools tuition's need to brought under control as well. Their rising tuition rates far outpace inflation. This would give intelligent and well motivated young people a fighting chance to better their lives through education. Our country's survival literally depends on an educated work force and it's just the right thing to do.

Benjamin Carson is a black man. He was also a brilliant Pediatric Neurosurgeon at John's Hopkins and did the first successful Siamese twins separation. Patrick and Benjamin Binder were conjoined twins, joined at the head, born in Germany in early 1987, and separated at Johns Hopkins Hospital on September 7, 1987. Think of how many lives Benjamin Carson has saved and what might have happened if Benjamin had not been able to overcome everything to be the great Physician that he is.


https://www.foxnews.com/health/ben-c...y-30-years-ago

[Mr Quatro]

Your asking us (subsim) for advice?

Simple adjustment Commander Wallace is to give the police more money to weed out the bad cops with better training and more counseling.

The mayor needs to tell the police who to protect ... What are your priorities?

Big business or small business or the public?

More visiable protection day and night.

That man had the cops called on him for passing a phony $20 bill ... give me a break. Didn't they have security camera's ... call the ATF or the Treasury Department

[Commander Wallace]

Originally Posted by Mr Quatro

Your asking us (subsim) for advice?

Simple adjustment Commander Wallace is to give the police more money to weed out the bad cops with better training and more counseling.

The mayor needs to tell the police who to protect ... What are your priorities?

Big business or small business or the public?

More visiable protection day and night.

That man had the cops called on him for passing a phony $20 bill ... give me a break. Didn't they have security camera's ... call the ATF or the Treasury Department

I'm asking for intelligent opinions, not advice. Why not Subsim ? There are some pretty sharp people here. In fact, Did George Floyd know that the alleged Bill was a forgery ? Where did this alleged forged bill go, anyway ? When was the last time you got change and looked to see if your change contained a forged or counterfeit bill ? We all could have unknowingly passed a counterfeit bill. As you said, if the bill was in fact phony, arrest and charge Floyd and allow him dues process to face charges. The state or federal government has the burden of proof in criminal cases

[Aktungbby]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

The point I'm trying to make is there was right and wrong on both sides back in the day and to put it as simplistically as black versus white today is not fully correct.

Originally Posted by jimbuna

I have read that some of these protestors now want to remove Nelson from his column because at one point he was known to have supported the slave trade.Well of course he did because in 17th and 18th Century Britain it was rare to find someone - regardless of class who did not. So stop trying to eradicate a history simply because it does not follow our current moral view point. We have a history where lessons can be learned from a history that we can both dislike and be proud of but do not let us destroy it or try to eradicate it.

Are we talkin' 'bout slaves for sugar for rum ""triangular trade" here BBY?!! THey'll have to remove George Washington for distilling whiskey at Mt Vernon with his less-than-hired help first 'still' made today: https://www.mountvernon.org/the-estate-gardens/distillery/ As for tearing down George's monuments and his picture from the World's almighty dollar bill in the name of political coreectness: ...we'll let God handle that chore!

[Bilge_Rat]

"My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union. I shall do less whenever I shall believe what I am doing hurts the cause, and I shall do more whenever I shall believe doing more will help the cause."

-Abraham Lincoln

what about this guy? that speech seems pretty racist by today's standards.

[Buddahaid]

Today's standards are knee jerk overreaction.

[Cybermat47]

Originally Posted by Buddahaid

Today's standards are knee jerk overreaction.

Knee jerk overreactions are nothing new. There used to be a time when a black person sitting at the front of a bus was scandalous. And IIRC someone got sent to a gulag in Bolshevik Russia for singing I’m Dreaming of a White Christmas during the Civil War.

[Aktungbby]

Originally Posted by Bilge_Rat

what about this guy? that speech seems pretty racist by today's standards.

Then there's this guy who took the 'Big Bang' theory' to it's highest level to eradicate 'the yellow Peril'

According to his own later account, Truman–who was then a judge seeking reelection–paid the KKK’s $10 membership fee on the advice of supporters. Apparently, Truman almost immediately quarreled with the Klan over its vitriolic hatred of Catholics.

his statue in Athens Greece has already been reviled by commie bastards any way>
But here's a monument that really take some rechisellng to eradicate: Stone Mountain Georgia > https://www.kptv.com/u-s-marine-corp...1a585eb4c.html

as of 6/6/2020: The United States Marine Corps has officially banned public displays of the Confederate flag starting immediately.

[Cybermat47]

Originally Posted by Aktungbby

https://www.kptv.com/u-s-marine-corp...1a585eb4c.html

as of 6/6/2020: The United States Marine Corps has officially banned public displays of the Confederate flag starting immediately.

Hey, at least Confederate veterans would be happy that their flag isn’t being appropriated by the “liars, fools, and villains” who swear an oath of allegiance to the USA anymore.

“Registered. That means... swore to be a liar, fool, villain, and [n-word]. Ain’t white anymore. Ain’t honest anymore. Am registered as loyal to the United States, and no honest, honorable, sensible, decent white man can be that.”
- Frank Myers, Confederate cavalryman, writing after swearing an oath of allegiance to the USA postwar

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by Commander Wallace

I'm asking for intelligent opinions, not advice. Why not Subsim ? There are some pretty sharp people here. In fact, Did George Floyd know that the alleged Bill was a forgery ? Where did this alleged forged bill go, anyway ? When was the last time you got change and looked to see if your change contained a forged or counterfeit bill ? We all could have unknowingly passed a counterfeit bill. As you said, if the bill was in fact phony, arrest and charge Floyd and allow him dues process to face charges. The state or federal government has the burden of proof in criminal cases

Very good point. Most people who passed counterfeit currency are not aware of it, it's passed through circulation.